Apple to Let EU Users Set New Defaults for Multiple Apps, Delete App Store, Photos, Messages and More

[delsoul]

That law is actually not written for end users in mind. It's called a Digital MARKETS Act for a reason. The intention is to level the playground for businesses.

So, essentially, when other businesses can’t compete they just lobby the EU to bring down the competition. Amazing.

 

[surferfb]

App
Tim needs to grow some thicker skin if he is afraid of people blaming him for poor battery life.

I don't think Tim cares about people blaming him. I do think he cares about his user's privacy and satisfaction with their devices, both of which are negatively impacted by this decision. All this is going to do is 1) confuse non-technical users and 2) give Chrome a bigger market share on iOS at the expense of Safari - ironically making EU customers' privacy worse than if things had been left as is.

Why on earth the EU thinks that a platform with less than 30% marketshare shouldn't be able to set its browser as default without telling every user "YOU CAN CHANGE YOUR DEFAULT", I don't know. Especially when that default is ALREADY allowed to be changed in Settings. And we all know it will soon be every default app, "Which App Store do you want to set as default"? Which Camera App? Which Photos App?" etc. etc. etc.

 

[davide_eu]

Delete the App Store? Is that a joke? With Apple's current restrictions, you wouldn't be able to get any relevant apps at all.

No, you use an MDM and removing the App Store allows you to reduce the attack surface.

 

[Sophisticatednut]

The initiative was triggered by the EU being upset about not having any major consumer tech companies, because they don't realize their regulations are what stifles innovation in the EU.

Case in point, we're all stuck with USB-C now for all eternity because even though it was clear Apple was moving in that direction, they weren't moving fast enough for the EU, and now USB-C is mandated and it's not going to be worth developing a better alternative. Thank god they at least waited until after micro-usb went away.

No we aren’t stuck with usb-c, the commission have the power to appoint new and superior technology as the standard, and this is with the help of the industry leaders such as Apple and Samsung et

 

[davide_eu]

I don't think Tim cares about people blaming him. I do think he cares about his user's privacy and satisfaction with their devices, both of which are negatively impacted by this decision. All this is going to do is 1) confuse non-technical users and 2) give Chrome a bigger market share on iOS at the expense of Safari - ironically making EU customers' privacy worse than if things had been left as is.

Why on earth the EU thinks that a platform with less than 30% marketshare shouldn't be able to set its browser as default without telling every user "YOU CAN CHANGE YOUR DEFAULT", I don't know. Especially when that default is ALREADY allowed to be changed in Settings. And we all know it will soon be every default app, "Which App Store do you want to set as default"? Which Camera App? Which Photos App?" etc. etc. etc.

It's called freedom.

 

[davide_eu]

Most likely it's just going to delete the Photo's "App" but all APIs will still remain on the system.

API that can be used by another application.

 

[mrat93]

Which is why we’re still using VGA and USB-A cables. LOL

Sure the EU will update the rules as time goes on, but only AFTER something becomes a standard. Problem is how does a new idea take root? Sure a company could develop a new protocol, but because they have to still include the mandated USB C if forces design choices on the product which may hinder performance etc.

Sorry, did you have a counterpoint?

 

[BaldiMac]

No we aren’t stuck with usb-c, the commission have the power to appoint new and superior technology as the standard, and this is with the help of the industry leaders such as Apple and Samsung et

That seems like a fantasy to me. Where does a new connector come from without investment? If Samsung comes up with a new and superior technology, does the EU force everyone to license it from Samsung?!? Hah!

We're left to rely on the USB consortium. And development by committee overseen by politicians isn't something with track record for greatness.

 

[surferfb]

No we aren’t stuck with usb-c, the commission have the power to appoint new and superior technology as the standard, and this is with the help of the industry leaders such as Apple and Samsung et

But why on Earth would Apple or Samsung or whoever invest significant money into developing a new standard when they don't know whether or not EU would approve it?

 

[Volk.JP]

I’m curious how many mobile users in the EU, where Apple does not dominate the market, will now go deliberately buy an iPhone with the intention of ignoring Apple’s “it just works right out the box” philosophy, and spend all this effort to configure their iPhone to have the Android experience.

I’ve bought an iPhone because of the OS and the hardware and not because of the walled garden they have.
For example, I will happily delete massaging app that I never used, select different password manager to the one I use but continue to use Safari and Photos apps.

Glad that the EU pushes apple to finally make iOS more like macOS.

 

[loopy123]

Most likely it's just going to delete the Photo's "App" but all APIs will still remain on the system.

To have , for example, Google Photos, to behave identically as if native Photos was installed is likely to be a huge engineering effort for both Google and Apple. Apps at the moment call an API, sure, but Google will have to implement that API, and Apple will have to deal with issues arising from incompatibility because Google Photos may implement things differently to Photos.

 

[iOS Geek]

It's called freedom.

Freedom through government mandate isn't really "freedom". "Freedom" and forced action through "mandates" don't really go together.

 

[loopy123]

But why on Earth would Apple or Samsung or whoever invest significant money into developing a new standard when they don't know whether or not EU would approve it?

if we had done what the EU said back then we would all have micro-USB connectors. Thank god Apple held the line until USB-C became ubiquitous.

 

[Macusercom]

I assume many here are US-based. In the US you always propagate freedom and yet most judge the EU for supporting user's rights and freedom. It specifically does not affect users outside of the EU and even if so, you have the CHOICE. Stick with Apple's own apps so nothing changes? Easy. Want to go another route? Now it is POSSIBLE.

The DMA tries to stop monopolies. Yes, you have the choice between iOS and Android but what if Android now goes the same route as iOS? Now what, what is your choice then?

If you had the choice of an old serviceable Ford truck or an Tesla-only certified repair center wouldn't it be a good idea to force Tesla to open up their services so you can choose? That ultimately leads to competition and benefits everyone.

Now imagine a world where Windows is locked down and bulged up with Microsoft apps you must use because you can't change that. Imagine being locked into their Microsoft Store because it is the only place to install apps. Imagine Teams is the sole way of communicating because Microsoft doesn't allow WhatsApp or Signal to exist. Edge is not a browser, it is the only browser. Now people start begging Microsoft to please leave their Windows locked because the EU forces them to allow Firefox or Chrome. Wouldn't that be hilarious?

The EU doesn't ban Safari or iMessage. It makes them a choice you can or cannot make

 

[iOS Geek]

So, essentially, when other businesses can’t compete they just lobby the EU to bring down the competition. Amazing.

Pretty much. I guess I'll give Contacos credit for saying what the DMA actually is, instead of being like the other pro-EU/pro-DMA users here who are trying to spin this glaring example of government overreach as a "win for consumers" and mocking anyone who said otherwise.

 

[ProbablyDylan]

But why on Earth would Apple or Samsung or whoever invest significant money into developing a new standard when they don't know whether or not EU would approve it?

Isn't Apple the odd one out developing their proprietary connectors? Seeing as everyone else either participates in the USB-IF or uses their standards. Now that I think about it, even Apple has one of their own on the board.

 

[iOS Geek]

1. They were not headed in that direction already. They basically confirmed in an interview “we’ll have to comply”

2. USB-C can handle 10 gbps transfer speeds and 240W charging, and it’s reversible. There is no need for a new standard cable ever. But even if there was, do you really think that the EU would be like, “no, we refuse this new, better technology for eternity?” Get real.

"No need for a new standard cable ever". You do realize technological advances are pretty much a certainty as time goes on, right? Some day, something better than USB-C will come around. And governments are notorious for moving glacial slow. Get real.

 

[iOS Geek]

I didn't used to think the way I do now. I used to think that Apple had the right to dictate much about iPhones.

But over the last few years, I've steadily become more and more annoyed at their actions and attitude, which I believe are against their own best interests.

They're annoying developers.
They're acting like parents in telling us customers what we can and cannot do.
They're putting up prices and offering less for that money due to a lack of competition.
They're sitting on their laurels, milking the cash cow.
They rely on lawyers instead of doing the right thing.
They don't play well with third parties and expect them to be the ones to compromise.
They've got too comfortable.

You can see the effects of this beginning with the disastrous Vision Pro. Expensive and not enough use for it.

They need a damn good kick up the backside and if the EU are the ones to do it, I'm all for it.

I want the cool, inventive, clever, cool Apple back, urgently!

Can tell you right now...getting a "good kick up the backside" from the EU...sure as heck isn't going to bring back the "cool, inventive, clever, cool Apple" back. Because the EU has pretty much made it unreasonable for Apple to do things like that. If anything, the Apple you want back...has been pushed even farther away because the EU will throw a fit and dictate that Apple share their "cool, inventive, clever" ideas with their competitors. So on Apple's part...why bother?

 

[ApAx]

I assume many here are US-based. In the US you always propagate freedom and yet most judge the EU for supporting user's rights and freedom. It specifically does not affect users outside of the EU and even if so, you have the CHOICE. Stick with Apple's own apps so nothing changes? Easy. Want to go another route? Now it is POSSIBLE.

The DMA tries to stop monopolies. Yes, you have the choice between iOS and Android but what if Android now goes the same route as iOS? Now what, what is your choice then?

If you had the choice of an old serviceable Ford truck or an Tesla-only certified repair center wouldn't it be a good idea to force Tesla to open up their services so you can choose? That ultimately leads to competition and benefits everyone.

Now imagine a world where Windows is locked down and bulged up with Microsoft apps you must use because you can't change that. Imagine being locked into their Microsoft Store because it is the only place to install apps. Imagine Teams is the sole way of communicating because Microsoft doesn't allow WhatsApp or Signal to exist. Edge is not a browser, it is the only browser. Now people start begging Microsoft to please leave their Windows locked because the EU forces them to allow Firefox or Chrome. Wouldn't that be hilarious?

The EU doesn't ban Safari or iMessage. It makes them a choice you can or cannot make

It's important to understand what the US concepts of freedom entail:

1. Freedom of individuals to live and engage society without government restriction.
2. Freedom to conduct business in a free market without government interference.

We employ our freedom to choose, based on consumer demand, where we spend our money. We do not value when government forces companies to conduct their business in a socialized/government dictated market. I want the freedom to buy the Apple product I want because it has the features I want, and not be forced to subsidize your desire to have options that you can get through buying a different product that is already available to you.

 

[31 Flavas]

Apple is slowly losing control. I'm sure all these changes will become worldwide eventually. From a consumer standpoint, it looks pretty bad on Apple that these features are only in the EU.

I'll be honest, i'm not responding to you really directly -- just kinda rambling. Wondering if my musings are way off target.

I'm thinking Android should be free marketing the crap out of iOS. That is even without the DMA or before the changes go worldwide.

Isn't the argument that with the 30% cut, the business side of the App sale is completely not workable. That App approvals are pretty much arbitrary whims of how Apple is feeling one day. Even then, Apple actively works to marginalize those that it does approve. Then also, Apple is trying to make utilizing DMA as difficult as possible: i.e. The Core Technology Fee, onerous requirements even to utilize 3rd party, requiring 27% cut (vs 30%), "scare screens" for 3rd party app installs, etc.

Where Android, allows for app developers and service businesses to take home up to 97% of their revenue (depending on their ability to handle distribution on their own). Provides for 3rd party app stores, 3rd party payments, Direct from website to Android handset app sales, sideloading, and unfettered hardware access (e.g. NFC use). Not only that Android is 70-80% of the worldwide market, so it's not being oppressed by a market leader, and has millions more consumers.

Yet, it seems to me like none of that seems very utilized by app developers or service businesses (Netflix, hulu, Disney, Spotify, etc). Rather largely ignored. With developers -- despite all the hassles and headaches -- Still choosing to deal with Apple, despite having choice on Android, a larger customer base on Android, and the superior hardware (more RAM, more megapixels, better screens, more standard storage, larger batteries, etc) on Androids.

Hence Apple needing to be given rules by the EU though the DMA.

I don't claim to be any Nostradamus -- But it would just seem with less restrictions, hassles, and fees ... that it would make iOS further more desirable. I don't know why they developers keep ignoring the advantages that the Android platform provides, but whatever. Also, what about the retail side? My understanding is that it's one or a few individual features keeping someone on Android because Apple just refuses to implement them.

With these features being implimented and the limitations removed ... What do the statistics say about someones tendancies when that someone moves to iOS?

 

[danakin]

Why even buy an iPhone in the EU at this point, just get an Android if you want to remove things like Settings and get hacked left and right.

Tinfoil cleanup on aisle 4

 

[mrat93]

Hah. The old "we'll never need anything better" argument has been mocked for decades.

I mean… we dealt with USB 2.0 speeds for 15+ years and the excuse was “nobody uses wired data transfer anyway.” And this was arguably when we could’ve used faster speeds the most! Over time, the need for faster wired transfer speeds has gone down — virtually nobody manually backs up with a cable anymore. The bitrate of Apple ProRes video is a sliver of max USB-C speeds.

Are you implying that iPhones will somehow accept more than 240W of power input at some point in the future?

Sure they were. Some iPads already moved to USB-C years before the requirement.

Bunk point. If iPad didn’t adopt USB-C, sales would have declined. Please let me know if you find an article saying that it was always Apple’s plan — but I’m pretty confident that Apple was forced to change course. Pretty sure they wanted to go all-wireless.

I don’t think “the next decade” comment was anything more than “we pinky promise that we won’t make you buy expensive, proprietary cables, again, anytime soon.”

 

[MiniApple]

This is becoming absolutely infuriating. My mum has an iPhone, which she considers easier to use than android, but it’s already quite complex for her - she uses WhatsApp, the browser, etc., but she’s usually confused by things like privacy pop-ups, editing the home screen… now I will have to once again help her in the near future because our politicians are too pretentious while having no clue about tech, and they can’t accept that a browser choice screen is an annoyance for a great majority of iPhone users.

imagine you had the options to modify your mum's iPhone, so that

• only the Apps she actually uses are on it - no bloats and apps hidden from the start screen but still there, just her essential Apps.
• the layout/size/icons/themes can be customized to something she likes and finds comfortable - instead of just Apple's way, jalibroken or SOL...
• allow you non webkit browsers and extensions and other settings that block popups completely
• all while having the peace of mind - that you - not Apple, being in control of updates/support - no popups of new functions that confuse her with you being far away. So you can update her device and explain stuff while you visit.
• knowing that your mum has a stable and quite secure device she knows on how to use

 

[Reeneman]

Requiring WebKit to power all iOS browsers was on the EU hit list too. I wonder what came of that

It did change so it would be already possible to offer a browser with its own browser engine but for tech companies it doesn’t really make sense to develop another browser version for the EU only when the version you’re offering outside the EU still needs to use WebKit.

 

[Reeneman]

Welcome changes, always a fan of a OS offers a lot of options for customisation.
Couldn’t say which app I would change or delete currently because I’m happy with Apple Maps, Safari, Photos, …
would most likely to change the keyboard but apps like Swiftkey have become so bloated that I already lost interest.
Years ago on Android Swiftkey was a blast but these times are over.