Apple to Release iOS 15 iCloud Private Relay as a Public Beta

[smithrh]

Check my profile, I've been around more than most here; I've been using Apple products for a very very very long time. Check my post history if you'd like to see if I'm a troll; hint, I'm not.

Having said that preamble, all of my trust with Apple is gone at this point, perhaps irretrievably so.

 

[JCCL]

I assume this is the future of these forums? Every time Apple announces a privacy feature, people will complain they don’t trust Apple.

Well, and how is that the users fault exactly?

Even before the recent development, I would never consider something like Private Relay as a true viable Privacy Solution - their recent announcement just turned me away of iOS15 as a whole. I don't want Apple policing my browsing habits or to decide which sites I can visit or not.

 

[CoronaOnTap]

Unreliable. I’ll stick with PIA VPN, thanks. I don’t trust Apple’s “Privacy Pledge” as far as I can throw a Gen 1 Mac Pro at this point.

You don’t trust Apple but you trust PIA considering who owns the company now? You should inform yourself better buddy.

Private Internet Access Review 2025 (Pros and Cons)

In this Private Internet Access review, we put PIA to the test to see how well it performed with speeds and security.

restoreprivacy.com

 

[Kkspire]

So what actually will be released when ios 15 is officially released??? Less and less features announced at wwdc will be available at launch. Feels like it should be called 14.9

You do realize when they say these will be features in iOS 15, they don’t mean the first day. They mean, in iOS 15….

 

[sdf]

Private, until Apple decides to compare domains you visit to a list of hashes that may or may not include sites hosting information similar to the Panama Papers or other journalistic information their buddies at the CIA blacklist.

Luckily, that's not how it works. Apple's system is two tier and encrypted: The first tier is Apple's, which is able to determine who you are but can't decrypt where you're connecting to. It's handed off to a non-Apple server, which is able to decrypt who you're connecting to but has no idea who you are (unless your username or something is in the content of an unsecured request, of course).

Assuming your traffic can go through iCloud Private Relay, nobody and nothing other than your device knows simultaneously who you are and who you're connecting to.

 

[weup togo]

Check my profile, I've been around more than most here; I've been using Apple products for a very very very long time. Check my post history if you'd like to see if I'm a troll; hint, I'm not.

Having said that preamble, all of my trust with Apple is gone at this point, perhaps irretrievably so.

Same. I thought this feature was pretty cool, before the CSAM disaster. I know exactly how they've architected their double-proxy, and I still don't trust them. They snuck the CSAM engine onto everyone's devices in December of 2020. They will make unilateral changes that they feel are morally justified, and anyone who complains is a hysterical fool, in their book.

 

[zorinlynx]

How do you get the "IP Address Location" option for the private relay settings? I don't see that and am on iOS 15 beta 7. I only get the switch to turn it on and off.

 

[rjohnstone]

I had to kill the "feature" in MacOS. Caused way too many issues with location based services.
I'd rather manage which sites can have my location and which ones can't.
Apple's implementation is a blunt instrument.

 

[Rudy69]

I’ve been testing this feature since iOS 15 Beta 1, but it’s still unreliable. Oftentimes, the relay / VPN is slow and websites won‘t even load, so I have to disable it all the time.

This.

And it wouldn't be a huge problem but the stupid thing re enables itself all the time

 

[Robin Bonathan]

When I heard someone say that Apple has, like, one guy whose sole job it is to code Reminders.app I thought they were kidding.

I’m now starting to believe them.

if that is true, I wish he would fix reminders. !

 

[scvrx]

So to summit up for those who are using Apple product with too much trust.
MacOS - use proven VPN (https://torrentfreak.com/best-vpn-anonymous-no-logging/).
Use Little Snitch and put an effort to create useful list).
Don't update from Catalina 10.15.2 or stay on earlier version.

iOS 14.2 - Don't update.

The only logical way to use your smartphone is without sim and trough MiFi VPN router like this one:

iNomad | Live and Work from Anywhere

www.inomad.tech

Privacy is not given free, or served by corporation on a silver plater.

For the rest of the herd - Apple will protect you, but not from Pegasus/NSO or other unknown special ops groups.

 

[smithrh]

Same. I thought this feature was pretty cool, before the CSAM disaster. I know exactly how they've architected their double-proxy, and I still don't trust them. They snuck the CSAM engine onto everyone's devices in December of 2020. They will make unilateral changes that they feel are morally justified, and anyone who complains is a hysterical fool, in their book.

I would like to know - if possible - exactly where (which devices, OSs) and when CSAM was deployed. I had not heard of any deployments last year, or even before the next OS versions, but anything is possible at this point.

 

[bbfc]

iCloud Private relay is part of iCloud+ anyway, so not something most users will see (or miss).

 

[VulchR]

Check my profile, I've been around more than most here; I've been using Apple products for a very very very long time. Check my post history if you'd like to see if I'm a troll; hint, I'm not.

Having said that preamble, all of my trust with Apple is gone at this point, perhaps irretrievably so.

I have been using Apple products since the Lisa (I am one of probably a handful of people who actually prepared documents on it). I feel the same. It's like Apple can't see two moves ahead about where their local machine surveillance is going.

Anyway, why not just use a reliable VPN to encrypt all traffic?

 

[katbel]

I would like to know - if possible - exactly where (which devices, OSs) and when CSAM was deployed. I had not heard of any deployments last year, or even before the next OS versions, but anything is possible at this point.

Apple Mail:https://9to5mac.com/2021/08/23/apple-scans-icloud-mail-for-csam/
Apple has confirmed that it already scans iCloud Mail for CSAM, and has been doing so since 2019. It has not, however, been scanning iCloud Photos or iCloud backups.
Maybe and so far

 

[spinedoc77]

It was really buggy and slow when I last enabled it, but that was a few public beta's ago. Will have to give it another shot as the concept is great.

 

[Airforcekid]

I am not a big fan of 1.1.1.1, assuming that is what Apple is using. I have tried their app and their DNS servers, and it seems to work ok at first, but eventually things come to a grinding halt on the network. I change back to a different DNS provider, like OpenDNS or Google, and everything on the network comes back to life. I am sure Cloudflare 1.1.1.1 works for some, I've just not had good long term results with them. And I have tried them on multiple ISP's, different routers, etc.., same result. Managing some wireless access points for someone on multiple internet providers, changing the guest network to use them, works at first and then stops, even trying their 1.1.1.1 for families, using 1.1.1.2 for no malware and 1.1.1.3 for no malware and adult content, works good at first and then craps out. For now I will stick with OpenDNS.

This is strange maybe something to do with edns being disabled by Cloudflare. Have you tried Quad9 or Nextdns? They may be a better fit if you want the same protection OpenDNS provides with more privacy.

 

[MrGimper]

Here we go again. Getting to be a regular thing. Look at all these features you may get at some point.

 

[macfacts]

So barely anything changed on iOS 15 in the first place and the features they did highlight are pretty much all delayed 😅

But iOS updates are free, you get what you pay for.

 

[CE3]

I assume this is the future of these forums? Every time Apple announces a privacy feature, people will complain they don’t trust Apple.

I mean, what do you expect? They were the ones who went to great lengths to promote privacy as a core feature (after they were caught doing the opposite along with all the other tech giants via the Snowden leaks).. saying they refuse to build backdoors to their customer’s devices, and then they went and did just that.

Oops.

 

[Jonas07]

Nothing is private anymore on Apple devices when there’s a surveillance algorithm running on all Apple devices with the latest update, this is just a dumb feature with the word “privacy/private” for marketing.

 

[hans1972]

Private, until Apple decides to compare domains you visit to a list of hashes that may or may not include sites hosting information similar to the Panama Papers or other journalistic information their buddies at the CIA blacklist. At which point, genuine journalists best expect to be at the mercy of the patriot act for “reasons”.

But of course, rebranded as “think of the children!”.

You cannot have privacy without trust Apple. Such potential pissed away…

Apple already compares every URL you browse to a list provided by a third-party and under the right circumstance that URL is sendt to a third-party outside your iPhone.

 

[FrietVanPiet]

I’m using it since the 5th beta. It works just fine. There was one website which did load or videos. I think the website owners fixed that issue.

 

[zenodux]

Private, until Apple decides to compare domains you visit to a list of hashes that may or may not include sites hosting information similar to the Panama Papers or other journalistic information their buddies at the CIA blacklist. At which point, genuine journalists best expect to be at the mercy of the patriot act for “reasons”.

But of course, rebranded as “think of the children!”.

You cannot have privacy without trust Apple. Such potential pissed away…

To be clear, no matter the method used - hashing in this case - a system like CSAM violates the privacy of everyone who is subjected to it. Privacy in this context means not knowing whether or not an account has CSAM photos or not. Then there is the issue of false positives. Then there is mission creep and pressure governments will apply to Apple and other companies operating similar services to scan for all sorts of things - like political dissidents. Then there is the issue that a private corporation is attempting mass surveillance that is not even acceptable from legitimate government law enforcement or intelligence agencies - which answer to the people. I am thinking of the children when I strongly oppose a tool like this that violates human rights and enables surveillance states. The surveillance state is a tool of fascism - democracy withers when subjected to it - to the point that it is not hyperbole to say that the surveillance state is antithetical to democracy.

In the way of apology, Apple should immediately remove the CSAM feature, roll out end-to-end encrypted everything on iCloud as soon as is technically feasible, publicly reaffirm that there are no back doors in any Apple system in its latest Platform Security Report, and publicly reaffirm its commitment to privacy as a fundamental human right.

 

[Minato1990]

Private, until Apple decides to compare domains you visit to a list of hashes that may or may not include sites hosting information similar to the Panama Papers or other journalistic information their buddies at the CIA blacklist. At which point, genuine journalists best expect to be at the mercy of the patriot act for “reasons”.

But of course, rebranded as “think of the children!”.

You cannot have privacy without trust Apple. Such potential pissed away…

always with the scenarios