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What popular server applications run on OSX that don't also run on Linux?

Well, it is good to separate out functions. So your Mail server should not be on your LDAP server nor should it be on your file server.

Yeah those functions could probably be done in Linux as well as they could be done in OS X, but then the question becomes what is the point of XServe if everything it does can be done in Linux (or Windows).
 
Well, it is good to separate out functions. So your Mail server should not be on your LDAP server nor should it be on your file server.

I can understand the point of running different apps in different virtual machines.

I don't understand how a better XServe could be a threat to Microsoft, however. What MS apps would you switch to OSX apps? Would you run Windows Server VMs on the Apple server?

With Hyper-V, Microsoft has a modern, very high performance virtual server. It has High Availability and Disaster Recovery clustering. Running VMs can be moved from server to server without shutdown or hiccups. There is a whole suite of VM management tools.

diag-hyperv-arch.png
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsserver2008/en/us/hyperv-features.aspx


Apple is missing a lot more than just a more powerful server box.


Yeah those functions could probably be done in Linux as well as they could be done in OS X, but then the question becomes what is the point of XServe if everything it does can be done in Linux (or Windows).

Yes, what is the point of a bigger XServe, and how is it a threat to MS?


xserve is used for morale boosting giggles in stressful IT buying meetings

LOL
 
Hey, we've got an Xserver here :D It's a G5 one, I think. Of course it's only one, and like 90 gajillion Windows servers and tons of Unix (err...Sun Unix that is).
 
On servers, running Linux has the benefit of being cheaper. Running Windows also has the benefit of being very mature with a big support base behind it.

As AidenShaw stated, Xserve needs a lot more than just fancy hardware to catch up to the Linux or Windows alternatives which dominate the market right now
 
With Hyper-V, Microsoft has a modern, very high performance virtual server. It has High Availability and Disaster Recovery clustering. Running VMs can be moved from server to server without shutdown or hiccups. There is a whole suite of VM management tools.

:D I actually like Hyper-V alot. That is what my R900 is running. I really wanted to move to an Apple environment (and VM Windows where needed) but when the opportunity arose to get the R900... I will admit I wish we had waited cause for the price we paid for the 16 core unit we could have gotten another 8 (24 total) for free.

Virtualization is really an area that Apple could work on.
 
Virtualization is really an area that Apple could work on.

Forget about it. We won't see any high end stuff coming from Apple in a long time if ever.

Apple is content on making toys for the masses, and ultra thin 17" laptops for rich college students to play WOW on.

I definitely don't see Apple using any quad core tech in the iMac or mini. They could have done it now but have to sacrifice everything for small footprints.
 
I said quite a few posts ago:

If you want to spend around $1000 for a good, quality, powerful quad core - why do you care whether a $5000+ octo-core is a good value compared to other octo-cores?

Well, I guess I agree with you really. I still don't agree with it being "apple tax". The way I think of it is that Apple don't offer a quad core at all: it's either 2 or 8. I think the quad-core option for the Mac Pro is terrible value for money, and probably shouldn't be offered at all. With an automobile analogy that you'll hate, it's like going to all the effort and cost of building a Ferrari and putting half of an engine in it.

Since it's either 2 or 8, I agree that there is a gaping lineup hole. Gaping in terms of a large power gap between the 3.06GHz 2 core iMac and the 2.8GHz 8 core Mac Pro. Gaping in terms of not having a reasonably priced system that you can put two drives in, etc etc. But maybe where we would disagree is perhaps it is not gaping in terms of number of extra machines in total Apple would sell if the filled the gap. But I'd buy one for doing calcs at home.
 
Mid Tower

I suspect that in this economy Apple will need to bring forward more competitive designs for the Home market if it hopes to avoid negative growth.

Imacs are nice, but fewer and fewer will be able to afford them. The pressure of commodity PC hardware and a renewed interest in Windows with Windows 7 will create tremendous pressure for households to pick 'what works well' over 'what works best'.

Not having a mid-range, expandable boxes has allowed Apple milk tremendous margins from thier product line. If they don't react quickly, they will find themselvs in the same boat as the car industry did when fuel prices skyrocketted. Left with excellent expensive products that lots would love to have, but few can afford to own and operate. This is already starting with the iPhone and will spread to thier other product lines very quickly.
 
households to pick 'what works well' over 'what works best'.

Mac OS X doesn't always work best.

I agree with everything else, and do hope that Apple does release a tower that has quad core desktop (not server) class chips and up to 8GB or 16GB of RAM.

When doing a lot of the photo work, 8 cores and 32GB isn't needed. I just need something that can hold my images in RAM and churn through some filters and adjustments.

Now when I am cutting HD, a Mac Pro would be nice.
 
I suspect that in this economy Apple will need to bring forward more competitive designs for the Home market if it hopes to avoid negative growth.
This may be another reason (besides TDP and desktop quad-cores) why Apple might choose to use the 65 W desktop quad-cores in the next iMacs.
 
Why didn't they use the 65W Conroe back in 2006? :rolleyes:

Maybe it just made more sense to use mobile processors at the time. Perhaps because they got the benefit of the lower TDP and the clock speed differences weren't enough to have an impact on sales. Where as now they need a quad core solution. For all we know Apple asked Intel for these specifically.
 
Maybe it just made more sense to use mobile processors at the time. Perhaps because they got the benefit of the lower TDP and the clock speed differences weren't enough to have an impact on sales. Where as now they need a quad core solution. For all we know Apple asked Intel for these specifically.

Apple doesn't have enough power over Intel to get em to do specific CPU's. It's actually all part of a microarchitecture's lifecycle - as the process improes, lower energy versions come out to milk as much out of the initial R&D costs.

Heck, AMD's still releasing low-energy variants of the K8 dual cores (great HTPC processors btw)
 
Apple doesn't have enough power over Intel to get em to do specific CPU's. It's actually all part of a microarchitecture's lifecycle - as the process improes, lower energy versions come out to milk as much out of the initial R&D costs.

Heck, AMD's still releasing low-energy variants of the K8 dual cores (great HTPC processors btw)

But they already did it once with the Macbook Air. They are the biggest all-in-one manufacturer, it's effectivley their market so if the reports that this is the main target platform of these processors are correct then I don't see it being to far fetched that Apple asked for a solution. I'm not saying Intel wouldn't have provided them anyway.
 
But they already did it once with the Macbook Air. They are the biggest all-in-one manufacturer, it's effectivley their market so if the reports that this is the main target platform of these processors are correct then I don't see it being to far fetched that Apple asked for a solution. I'm not saying Intel wouldn't have provided them anyway.

I agree. If Apple did go to Intel for a custom quad core for the iMac, then we may yet see it as standard on the high end, or as a BTO option.
 
Intel will tell Apple to stuff it....

I agree. If Apple did go to Intel for a custom quad core for the iMac, then we may yet see it as standard on the high end, or as a BTO option.

No chance, with Apple making so much noise about the advantages of switching to Nvidia chipsets. :mad:

Also note that the "custom CPU" in the MBA wasn't really that custom. It was a standard 65nm chip on a SFF carrier that was already in Intel's roadmap. It was a custom combination of standard parts.
 
No chance, with Apple making so much noise about the advantages of switching to Nvidia chipsets. :mad:

Also note that the "custom CPU" in the MBA wasn't really that custom. It was a standard 65nm chip on a SFF carrier that was already in Intel's roadmap. It was a custom combination of standard parts.

Interesting indeed.

Good to know, and sadly, you are right. These days you can't expect much options from the Apple camp, even if you wish and pray and hope really hard it's just not going to happen.
 
What he said was that because of general interest, roadmaps and rumors, he pegs the likelihood of a release at 25% -- not that it would account for 25% of sales.

Read it again:

Exactly. Thanks for explaining. I was trying to distance myself from the people who think a $799 windows-killer with better specs than a $1399 dell is coming out next tuesday.

Were there really people who said that? Morons. :p

I couldn't care less about the cannibalism idea, personally, so I don't know where you're coming from singling me out.

This is why there won't be an xMac anytime soon:

Remember the Macintosh 128k? Heard of the iMac line? Do you know why they were all-in-one computers?

This is from the mouth of a (really) old Apple engineer, "Because Steve Jobs didn't want the end-user messing around with his (Jobs') hardware."

A computer with user-expandability goes against Jobs' business model.

I singled you out as one of the few rational ppl who won't argue 'til their blue in the face that the company Apple is most afraid of losing sales to is themselves. Occasionally a seasoned veteran will allude to the time when Apple confused consumers with its myriad product lines as if that relates somehow to the present in which they have exactly 3 laptop lines and 3 desktop lines. When I started following apple they had only 2 of each, and if a tablet is feasible, then why not a midrange tower?

I singled you out because you'd be more likely to mention what -hh ended up hinting at: planned obsolescence and the advantages of a business model that tends to limit the end-user's upgrade options. Apple dictates terms to its customer base simply because it can without upsetting the niche market for whom it caters. Why fill the gap in the product line when the bulk of your customers are so enamoured of everything you do that they'll take the time to tell ppl who demand such a product that they're wrong for doing so (I don't mean you or -hh, I mean the ppl who will argue unequivocally that there is no such gap)?

All salient points, -hh, and I agree with you for the most part, but I think that the shift towards laptops belies the fact that more family members have their own computers nowadays. There are no more roadwarriors than there used to be, just ppl who also bring their laptop to work, but very few households have a laptop as their primary computer. Nor do they want an all-in-one.

Similarly, an IT manager whose CEO has an MBA/MBP may be asked to look into the feasibility of switching to mac, but once they weigh up how many desks will need imacs vs mac minis, and how often those minis will need to be replaced (probably not factoring in the fact that they have the best resale value of any mac), they will probably decide against it out of a similar disdain for the AIO.

Your attempt to belittle the xmac crowd to a dozen or so ppl is immensely unfair, when you consider the fact that the best part of the market for such a computer would not frequent these forums to discuss its absence. As such, the only xmac fans on the forum are ppl like me disgruntled with the fact their imac didn't have the longevity ppl associate with macs and low-end powermac users who find the server-class processors price them out of the (semi-)pro market. But as you say, midrange customers who aren't going to upgrade too often aren't apple's biggest priority.

But your suggestion that such ppl should buy 2nd-hand 2.66's just doesn't cut it. Mac Pros are overkill in more ways than just money and size. They also consume way too much electricity to be a primary computer for a home. My bosses tell me it costs £100s a year to leave a mac pro on and there's no way I could use one as my primary computer. Besides, having a computer that is far too big and powerhungry for the purpose its required just isn't very apple. Dell can produce all the predictably shaped midrange towers they want but if apple rereleased the cube with a quad-core intel chip at the peak of the halo effect with typical 30-40% apple tax, the press attention, pool of potential switchers and eventual marketshare it would attract would be insane. But apple would rather be a market leader, designing new products altogether so that it can dictate terms, set prices and keep higher margins.
 
No chance, with Apple making so much noise about the advantages of switching to Nvidia chipsets. :mad:

As such, the only xmac fans on the forum are ppl like me disgruntled with the fact their imac didn't have the longevity ppl associate with macs and low-end powermac users who find the server-class processors price them out of the (semi-)pro market.

I'd be interested in hearing what you both would actually be happy with Apple releasing spec-wise for an xMac. I started a thread here to discuss this if you wanted to partake: https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/638571/
 
please, not Cube 2

...if apple rereleased the cube with a quad-core intel chip...

Please, don't bring back a form-over-function nightmare like the Cube.

Make it user-serviceable - socketed CPU, standard memory DIMMs, standard 3.5" hard drives, standard 5.25 optical slots, standard PCIe x16 graphics card slot with PCIe power connector, a couple of standard PCIe expansion slots. Enough power and cooling to handle midrange CPUs and graphics. No laptop parts.

I don't care if the length, width and height are identical - it can be cube-shaped as long as it is easy for a user (or the Geek Squad) to upgrade with standard parts either at the time-of-sale or later.


I'd be interested in hearing what you both would actually be happy with Apple releasing spec-wise for an xMac. I started a thread here to discuss this if you wanted to partake: https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/638571/

I made an entry in that thread - I suggest a small family of systems like these, identical except for expansion:

295
 
put up another one on the "where are the desktops which use actual desktop parts ?" list
yeah the xMac (or whatever you call it) discussion is old but looking at the amount of threads which turn into such discussion again and again it seems to be more alive than ever before

my mac is 4 years old and i have to upgrade this year .. if apple can't deliver i know where i can find better hardware for a lower price at the end of the year (with windows 7 then i suppose)
 
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