Apple Touts European Job Creation Numbers, Including 500K Related to App Store

RickInHouston said:
Does anyone wonder why apple chooses to release these 'pat on the back' press releases to the public when most other companies don't. Isn't it a bit self-serving and not very humble?
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Imagine Google releasing similar statistic! Or Oracle (Java) releasing a similar statistic or even MS (so.. many windows apps)..I think just the number of pirates who are getting supported by the above are more than what Apple touted here..
 
Thunderhawks said:
Apple does taxwise what is legal. You would doi the same.

No money is being hidden and I do not see why USA should be entitled to profits generated in other parts of the world, just because Apple is an American company.
The IRS chases American citizens around the world to get a cut , even when they no longer reside here.
It is exactly that attitude which drives away businesses and makes some do illegal stuff to truly hide money.
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Only very big companies have the means to hire experts that know how to keep profits out of reach of ANY countries taxes, no matter where the profits are made or where the companies headquarters are and whether it's an American company or not.

The "It's legal / You would do the same" argument doesn't stick: The whole point is that you and I can't do the the same, because on our financial scale, it's just not possible to shop around the world for the lowest tax rates.

Apple, Shell, etc. can bend the laws that count for us: They negotiate with governments and say "Give us tax benefits, cheap licences etc. or we'll build our new plant elsewhere".

It's not just in the US, it's all over the world and it's a form of subsidising of usually very wealthy companies, that need it the least.
 
snipper said:
The "It's legal / You would do the same" argument doesn't stick: The whole point is that you and I can't do the the same, because on our financial scale, it's just not possible to shop around the world for the lowest tax rates.
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Of course you can. I know programmers who took a job and moved to the U.S. because the taxes were lower than their home country.
 
firewood said:
Of course you can. I know programmers who took a job and moved to the U.S. because the taxes were lower than their home country.
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The difference is, that Apple and Shell don't have to move anything to another country, they just move on paper.
 
I'd love for Apple to release information on how much the top 5% of the apps in the AppStore made, the top 1%, the top 0.1%, and the top 0.01%. And the bottom 60%,50%,40%, and 30%.

For some (quite obvious) reason it won't.

I'd buy the job creation numbers the day Apple did.
 
snipper said:
Only very big companies have the means to hire experts that know how to keep profits out of reach of ANY countries taxes, no matter where the profits are made or where the companies headquarters are and whether it's an American company or not.

The "It's legal / You would do the same" argument doesn't stick: The whole point is that you and I can't do the the same, because on our financial scale, it's just not possible to shop around the world for the lowest tax rates.

Apple, Shell, etc. can bend the laws that count for us: They negotiate with governments and say "Give us tax benefits, cheap licences etc. or we'll build our new plant elsewhere".

It's not just in the US, it's all over the world and it's a form of subsidising of usually very wealthy companies, that need it the least.
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..but if the laws allow these moves it is not the corporations fault.

Agreed that thi sis happening the world over.
They will all take what they can get and then some, which is not a specific Apple issue.
It just generates more lines in the press if Apple is involved.
 
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AaronEdwards said:
I'd love for Apple to release information on how much the top 5% of the apps in the AppStore made, the top 1%, the top 0.1%, and the top 0.01%. And the bottom 60%,50%,40%, and 30%.
.
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Why? There are already academic papers documenting that the revenue per app falls on a power law curve distribution.

The income of a lot of other business's fall on a similar curve (new restaurants, etc.)
 
firewood said:
Why? There are already academic papers documenting that the revenue per app falls on a power law curve distribution.

The income of a lot of other business's fall on a similar curve (new restaurants, etc.)
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I've seen a number of estimations about the share of AppStore profits, some quite good, but if Apple is going to make this argument then I would want them to actually provide the numbers too.
 
AaronEdwards said:
I've seen a number of estimations about the share of AppStore profits, some quite good, but if Apple is going to make this argument then I would want them to actually provide the numbers too.
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One has to be careful releasing this kind of information, as a lot of individuals and private companies thinks it's nobody's (especially competitors) business how much income they make. In some countries it might even be illegal to publish this without permission. Since rank is public, any really accurate info on income per rank would pretty much give away this private financial info.
 
firewood said:
One has to be careful releasing this kind of information, as a lot of individuals and private companies thinks it's nobody's (especially competitors) business how much income they make. In some countries it might even be illegal to publish this without permission. Since rank is public, any really accurate info on income per rank would pretty much give away this private financial info.
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There are 1,200,000 apps in the AppStore, the 0.01% most profitable would mean the top 120 apps.

Apple, most likely, owns this information and has the right to publish it. They also have right to remove apps from the AppStore (if company would complain, and they won't.)

Apple isn't going to release this information though, but it's not out of concern for the creators of the best selling apps. It really doesn't look as nice saying that the 100 top apps earns 32% of the revenue as it does saying that there are 1.2 million apps and they earn developers $X billion per year....
 
RickInHouston said:
Does anyone wonder why apple chooses to release these 'pat on the back' press releases to the public when most other companies don't. Isn't it a bit self-serving and not very humble?
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I wonder why Apple can't create more jobs HERE in the USA. It ticks me off that they make seemingly eleventy trillion dollars a month but somehow they just have to have Chinese slaves make everything. It's rather infuriating.

And yes, the press releases are just a self back pat. Meh.:rolleyes:

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Thunderhawks said:
Apple does taxwise what is legal. You would doi the same.

No money is being hidden and I do not see why USA should be entitled to profits generated in other parts of the world, just because Apple is an American company.
The IRS chases American citizens around the world to get a cut , even when they no longer reside here.
It is exactly that attitude which drives away businesses and makes some do illegal stuff to truly hide money.
Click to expand...

The reason why people get so torked over this though is that these companies certainly LOVE doing business with us though, don't they? We have the most expendable income and the most likely to buy their stuff. Ya know, reap the benefits of our collectively large consumer base but cut and run when it's time to pay some taxes. It's BS and I'm tired of the "legality" argument. They should be creating jobs here and paying taxes here because it's the right thing to do.

But, instead, they have to suck shareholder dick because those Neanderthals are all that matter anymore. So, slave labor and tax evasion is the norm.

The other problem with this is that when companies ditch on taxes, guess who gets to foot the bill for the missing dollars? Yeah, worker bees who are already stretched paper thin financially as it is. Homeowners and anyone on a W2 based payroll takes it in the fanny. All while these companies pocket trillions of dollars in profits. Is it any surprise people are fed up with it? Ya think?:confused:
 
AaronEdwards said:
Apple, most likely, owns this information and has the right to publish it.
.
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Apple actually did publish this information (price and exact download count) the very first week the App Store first opened. Apple backed down after many of the big developers complained. Both now consider it competitive and private financial information, even though some good academic and analytic estimates of the skewed revenue distribution exist.
 
s2mikey said:
I wonder why Apple can't create more jobs HERE in the USA.
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They did.

Apple and Next built a couple huge factories in Fremont and near Dallas back in the '80's. Employed a lot of manufacturing people on those sites. They lost money. Customers weren't willing to pay.

Creating jobs and going bankrupt doesn't help anybody in the long run.
 
firewood said:
Apple actually did publish this information (price and exact download count) the very first week the App Store first opened. Apple backed down after many of the big developers complained. Both now consider it competitive and private financial information, even though some good academic and analytic estimates of the skewed revenue distribution exist.
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I'm not talking about exact price and download count of every top app. Especially since the money makers aren't paid apps. I'm talking about share of the profits for the top/bottom X%.

And they _consider_ it to be private information. Apple is in its full rights to release it if wants. Again, it won't. Because telling people that the bottom X% of apps in the AppStore aren't generating any kind of revenue at all? Not a good move. Much better to proclaim that the 1.2 million apps are creating billions in revenue.
 
AaronEdwards said:
Because telling people that the bottom X% of apps in the AppStore aren't generating any kind of revenue at all? Not a good move.
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But they've already made that move. In an earlier financial call, Tim cook said something like that 80% of all apps in the store are downloaded at least once per month. That low number clearly says the long tail is quite thin in terms of downloads, thus revenue. No secret there.
 
Who cares about the actual number.

This is just Apple trying to say that it's okay if you don't pay any taxes as a corporation, because you're creating all these jobs and hey, those people do have to pay income tax right?

Nauseating PR waffle.
 
When Apple did this count for the US, they included all the UPS delivery truck drivers AND the people who MAKE the UPS delivery trucks. PLUS the UPS pilots AND the people who make the UPS planes.

Give me a break.

By that kind of counting, my constant use of Amazon two day delivery must mean I've created tens of thousands of jobs over the years :)
 
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