Apple TV+ Epic Saga 'Foundation' Based on Isaac Asimov's Best-Selling Novels Premieres September 24

[Rigby]

The authors of the Expanse are professional script writers and the books read like a movie script in a lot of parts. Of course it went well filmed.

They had actually never done any script writing before the Expanse TV show. They both had entirely different careers before they became famous with the Expanse books.

There's an entertaining podcast called "Ty & that Guy" with one of the authors, where he often talks about learning the ropes of making a TV show.

 

[Sam Squanch]

On the other hand, both The Expanse and GOT did a pretty good job of bringing the books to the screen IMHO.

There'll always be limitations of course.

... and ignoring GOT season 8.

GoT seasons 1 to 4 then a steady decline into garbage television. I personally thought it was unwatchable mid way through season 6 which is also when I quit and never looked back.

Friendly warning about The Expanse I already dropped it after this season as season 4 has all the hallmarks of a show going off the rails. Or, to put it another way, the show runner and writers are starting to feel their story is better than what is in the books. This saddens me as I love the books and always thought what an excellent job they do translating it to television.

 

[sjsharksfan12]

I did enjoy all the shows you list there, and I could throw in Firefly (as one one of the best, ever), Babylon 5 (which has gotten a lot of flak, but I enjoyed it, and would SO like to see a re-boot/-make of that show), and Earth 2 (obscure, but highly enjoyable).

I too love Babylon 5 and do rewatches of it every couple of years. It really was one of the first sci fi series to embrace the arc format, even though I still think of it as an arc/episodic hybrid type show like DS9 and Farscape. You had a big picture arc, but each episode had its own unique feel.

 

[ugru]

No... if you're going to have 'Eto Demerzel' then you have to start with 'Caves of Steel' - and then you'll see the utter stupidity of gender swapping that character.

SPOILER....and why would you? "he" is an artificial being, he could assume an external shell shaped as he wish/need...He can appear as a woman and 200 years later ad a man, he is a Robot...
Eto Demezrel is the only character in which a gender swap could make sense, if you are forced because otherwise Studios will not greenlight the show, i would gender swap him too. SPOILER

Look, I am against changing the lore, but in some rare occasions, if the writers are good, it could work, the already mendtioned Starbuck is an example, Stormfront in "The boys" worked too.

The real problem will be Salvor Hardin, I will always visualize him with a Vega Cigar in his mouth.....

 

[SuperMatt]

There's no spoilers in my post. I guarantee that you could precis the entire series of books in a post and not give away anything that will be in the series.
As to gender swapping major characters - what's the point? Other than as a box-ticking exercise to keep a certain segment happy and on board, there is no point. If (God forbid) they decide or are allowed to *ahem* 'adapt' any of the other related books, i.e. the Elijah Bailey novels, they'll find they've painted themselves into a corner. It is, actually, a Big Deal. If Daneel/Demerzel is female, then his designer must have been female. So Jander must also have been female, so Gladia must now be male (or gay) so Elijah must now either be female (or gay) and it gets worse and worse! And to what end?

Try doing a gender-swapped version of Anna Karenina, or Madame Bovary and see how that goes.
Anyway, the whole gender swap thing has been done to death already - we got it, male -> female character, new insight, inclusive, fresh, modern, bold, daring etc. etc. except that it isn't any more. It's become expected, and is just a lazy, meaningless sop. The only thing that'll be missing is zombies, and I'm not so sure about that...
Poor adaptation? Going by what we already know, it certainly is, though 'adaptation' is stretching it a bit, when they add in huge swathes of content not in the books and feel free to take a perfectly decent story and turn it into something simpler and more understandable for a modern audience (read: dumb it down to the point that it becomes indistinguishable from everything else, and cloak it in fabulously expensive design and graphics and hope no-one notices).
So this is what happens when the superhero movie crowd get their hands on something. Superhero movies are by their nature simplistic, immature and infantilising, so it's hardly surprising if they continue to churn out more of the same. It's a pity that they chose this particular author to do it to. Perhaps they should... *gasp* write their own stuff and show us how really good they are! Better than that old Asimov, obviously.

Some people might want to read the books, so you shouldn’t spoil what is in the books. Obviously you cannot spoil what’s in the TV show since you haven’t seen it. And as for that, you said ”Going by what we already know, it certainly is” (a poor adaptation). The thing is, what we already know is a Trailer.

Feel free to make as many assumptions as you like, and to get outraged about changing things about the characters for the TV adaptation. What works in a book doesn’t always work on TV, so some changes are to be expected. Dismissing the entire show without seeing a single episode simply because they’ve made some changes to some characters seems silly to me.

 

[SuperMatt]

SPOILER....and why would you? "he" is an artificial being, he could assume an external shell shaped as he wish/need...He can appear as a woman and 200 years later ad a man, he is a Robot...
Eto Demezrel is the only character in which a gender swap could make sense, if you are forced because otherwise Studios will not greenlight the show, i would gender swap him too. SPOILER

Look, I am against changing the lore, but in some rare occasions, if the writers are good, it could work, the already mendtioned Starbuck is an example, Stormfront in "The boys" worked too.

The real problem will be Salvor Hardin, I will always visualize him with a Vega Cigar in his mouth.....

Agreed. It’s a robot. It has no gender. Its positronic brain could be put into a shell modeled after male or female physiology or a completely gender-neutral form of some type and it wouldn’t change much when it comes to the story. I am surprised some people are already trashing the show based on just a trailer.

 

[Jerus]

Just realised that I had confused “Rama” and “Foundation” and got a bit disappointed. But maybe it’s a good thing that Rama is being left alone.

 

[quatermass]

Some people might want to read the books, so you shouldn’t spoil what is in the books. Obviously you cannot spoil what’s in the TV show since you haven’t seen it. And as for that, you said ”Going by what we already know, it certainly is” (a poor adaptation). The thing is, what we already know is a Trailer.

Feel free to make as many assumptions as you like, and to get outraged about changing things about the characters for the TV adaptation. What works in a book doesn’t always work on TV, so some changes are to be expected. Dismissing the entire show without seeing a single episode simply because they’ve made some changes to some characters seems silly to me.

We know quite a bit more than what's in the trailer. For example, casting:
"Lee Pace as Brother Day, Cassian Bilton as Brother Dawn, Terrence Mann as Brother Dusk,, T'Nia Miller as Halima, Pravessh Rana as Rowan and Kubbra Sait as Phara."
None of the characters/names appear in the books. So where did they come from? Who created them, and why? And where is Hober Mallow? Cloned Emperors? Waterworld? Black hole? Eh?
But what does Asimov himself have to say about it? From his 1983 book "Asimov on Science Fiction", ISBN 0-246-12044-4, chapter 54.

"HOLLYWOOD AND I

I have hitherto firmly resisted the lure of Hollywood. I have refused to write screenplays even when invited to do so and even when my own stories were in question.

There are two basic reasons for this resistance. First, I am not visual enough to write dialogue and events that are to be interpreted primarily in the form of moving images on a screen. I’m just a word-man, and though it is a wise person who knows his powers, it is an even wiser person who knows his limitations.

Second, I am reasonably confident that in magazines and books my fiction will appear very much as I have written it. Anything I write for the visual media, however, I am certain will be tampered with by producers, directors, actors, office boys, and the relatives of any or all of these."

And so it is.

 

[SuperMatt]

We know quite a bit more than what's in the trailer. For example, casting:
"Lee Pace as Brother Day, Cassian Bilton as Brother Dawn, Terrence Mann as Brother Dusk,, T'Nia Miller as Halima, Pravessh Rana as Rowan and Kubbra Sait as Phara."
None of the characters/names appear in the books. So where did they come from? Who created them, and why? And where is Hober Mallow? Cloned Emperors? Waterworld? Black hole? Eh?
But what does Asimov himself have to say about it? From his 1983 book "Asimov on Science Fiction", ISBN 0-246-12044-4, chapter 54.

"HOLLYWOOD AND I

I have hitherto firmly resisted the lure of Hollywood. I have refused to write screenplays even when invited to do so and even when my own stories were in question.

There are two basic reasons for this resistance. First, I am not visual enough to write dialogue and events that are to be interpreted primarily in the form of moving images on a screen. I’m just a word-man, and though it is a wise person who knows his powers, it is an even wiser person who knows his limitations.

Second, I am reasonably confident that in magazines and books my fiction will appear very much as I have written it. Anything I write for the visual media, however, I am certain will be tampered with by producers, directors, actors, office boys, and the relatives of any or all of these."

And so it is.

To be clear, those are reasons that he didn’t write for the screen. It is not about adaptations of his work by others for the screen. Granted, I do think his work will be hard to adapt, and will require some changes to make it appealing on TV. So seeing a number of changes already gives me hope that it could be an enjoyable adaptation. Also, streaming series have an advantage over movies and even weekly TV shows… they can spend a lot more time telling a story; they don’t need to wrap the whole thing up in 2 hours.

 

[Monque]

Bayta Darrell was the main viewpoint character of Foundation and Empire and Arcadia Darell was the main viewpoint character of Second Foundation.

Ah, yeah, Arcadia... Okay, name a third 😄

 

[ugru]

Ah, yeah, Arcadia... Okay, name a third 😄

Bliss 😍

 

[posguy99]

Truly can’t wait. Apple’s GOT i am hoping.

You think it will be that bad, then.

 

[sjsharksfan12]

Truly can’t wait. Apple’s GOT i am hoping.

Personally I'm hoping it's Apple's The Expanse.

 

[posguy99]

Personally I'm hoping it's Apple's The Expanse.

I never could get into Expanse. I can recognize that it's decent television, but it never held my interest. The books were good.

 

[notabadname]

You think it will be that bad, then.

I loved GOT, including the final season and episode. I understand why many didn’t, but that does not change the amazing production values and acting. It was a fantastic series for me. To each their own. And for HBO, one of the most successful series for any cable network. Apple would be happy to have such a hit.