Apple Urged to Implement Feature That Sends an iPhone's Precise Location to Responders in Emergencies

[44267547]

Phase II of E911 already sends GPS data when you call 911 to an agency that has the upgraded E911 equipment in their dispatch centers.

This is true. However, there is a caveat based on my experiences. If someone calls from a deactivated cell phone (Which surprisingly happens a lot), the GPS coordinates are not specific and provides the dispatcher a general area of where the call originated from. It's frustrating for Officers seeking the extent of the call and where it is.

 

[DeepIn2U]

You think about this and it's really odd that Apple wouldn't implement this as part of SOS, at least as a user option.

I'm all for this implementation. However I think Apple's way of doing this is:
via a specific API - which means developers will or could gain access to it.
via iOS code which means developers ... (same as above).

If Apple could do this and restrict only to authorities for emergency response then - somehow someway developers, hackers or even government will find access to it.

 

[Weaselboy]

This is true. However, there is a caveat based on my experiences. If someone calls from a deactivated cell phone (Which surprisingly happens a lot), the GPS coordinates are not specific and provides the dispatcher a general area of where the call originated from. It's frustrating for Officers seeking the extent of the call and where it is.

True... but from what it looks like, this solution would not help with that scenario anyway. It sends an automated SMS to the dispatch center, and a deactivated phone is not going to be able to send an SMS.

 

[MicahL]

Maybe Apple's dream team hasn't figured out a way to make this a subscription service.

 

[ddrulez]

Maybe Apple have not enough money to develop it! We have to buy more Apple products....

 

[teamgibbs]

I recently called 911 because I witnessed a car veer off the road late one night. First thing they asked was where are you, "I'm like, Uuuuuuuh".

I had threw my car in reverse and drave about a 1/4 mile before I hit someones driveway with a fire number on it.

This needs to be a thing, it is silly it is not.

 

[JaJaWa]

AML must also be supported by carriers. EENA said the service is fully operational in several European countries, including the United Kingdom, Estonia, Lithuania, Austria, Iceland, and New Zealand, on all mobile networks.

 

[Shawn Parr]

True... but from what it looks like, this solution would not help with that scenario anyway. It sends an automated SMS to the dispatch center, and a deactivated phone is not going to be able to send an SMS.

Deactivated phones can call 911 as the phone system is programmed to allow them to do that. If something like this was implemented in the US the phone system could allow deactivated phones to send an SMS to a designated number just like they can call a designated number (911).

SMS happens at a very low level protocol-wise. Which is why in some heavy usage situations (hurricanes, sprouting events, etc) users can sometimes send SMS even though they can’t get phone calls though due to congestion.

As such if a phone can call 911, it should also be able to send a text to 911 (or whatever).

 

[DoctorTech]

This whole thing is pretty much redundant in the United States. We have had Enhanced 911 for years now. Phase II of E911 already sends GPS data when you call 911 to an agency that has the upgraded E911 equipment in their dispatch centers.

For example, here is the Verizon Wireless disclosure page on E911.

http://www.verizon.com/about/consumer-safety/enhanced-911

I have been in the PSAP (Public Safety Access Point - i.e. 911 call center) of a major US city working with the call takers who answer 911 calls. The computer system they were running automatically and instantly pulled up a full screen map on one of the 6 computer displays on their desk showing where the call was originating from. If it was a landline call, you could see a satellite image of the home or business. In one case, a driver called to report a suspected drunk driver on the road in front of his vehicle and we could see in real time exactly where the caller's vehicle was traveling. We could not see his particular vehicle (no live video of the road) but on the map we could see within a matter of a few yards where his vehicle was located as he was talking to the 911 operator.

 

[kdarling]

This whole thing is pretty much redundant in the United States. We have had Enhanced 911 for years now. Phase II of E911 already sends GPS data when you call 911 to an agency that has the upgraded E911 equipment in their dispatch centers.

This.

In fact, this has always been one good reason to use a Verizon CDMA phone in the US, because since ~2002 virtually all of them from flip phones on up, had at least simple GPS reception built-in, and will send their raw satellite info over a special control channel during a 911 call. Servers then calculate the location using correction info such as current local tower interference, etc. This has allowed telling people coming to help, your position as close as possible.

Whereas GSM carriers opt'd for the less expensive (i.e. cheaper handset chipsets) and less accurate cell tower U-TDOA multilateration method. In other words, instead of the phone telling the network where it is, the network tries to figure out the phone's location by its transmission time distance from a tower or towers.

This is why I make sure my family has Verizon handsets. If they make an E911 call up here in the hills, their A-GPS is likely to get closer than than 50'. On AT&T, the tower method accuracy could be as rough as the length of 1 to 3 football fields, and that might make a critical difference.

 

[ActionableMango]

I recently called 911 because I witnessed a car veer off the road late one night. First thing they asked was where are you, "I'm like, Uuuuuuuh".

I had threw my car in reverse and drave about a 1/4 mile before I hit someones driveway with a fire number on it.

This needs to be a thing, it is silly it is not.

It is a thing. Just because they ask doesn't mean that they don't know. I have worked with 9-1-1 call centers. The Enhanced 911 law in the USA has required location capability in cellphones for many years.

However, ALI (automatic location information) systems are imperfect, like all systems. Your 9-1-1 center probably does know where you are and they are asking as a matter of verification. You might notice they will also ask your name and number even they they have that too.

 

[rvinny]

This.

In fact, this has always been one good reason to use a Verizon CDMA phone in the US, because since ~2002 virtually all of them from flip phones on up, had at least simple GPS reception built-in, and will send their raw satellite info over a special control channel during a 911 call. Servers then calculate the location using correction info such as current local tower interference, etc. This has allowed telling people coming to help, your position as close as possible.

Whereas GSM carriers opt'd for the less expensive (i.e. cheaper handset chipsets) and less accurate cell tower U-TDOA multilateration method. In other words, instead of the phone telling the network where it is, the network tries to figure out the phone's location by its transmission time distance from a tower or towers.

This is why I make sure my family has Verizon handsets. If they make an E911 call up here in the hills, their A-GPS is likely to get closer than than 50'. On AT&T, the tower method accuracy could be as rough as the length of 1 to 3 football fields, and that might make a critical difference.

All US carriers use A-GPS as the primary location method since 3G. UTDOA was 2G only.

 

[kdarling]

All US carriers use A-GPS as the primary location method since 3G. UTDOA was 2G only.

Ah, thanks. Apparently after 2006 GSM carriers such as ATT could use A-GPS if a handset had it, but UMTS-3G wasn't required on all handsets until 2012, when they had to meet stricter E911 requirements.

In any case, people should want more accuracy when using 911. It could save their life. There's been many cases of help taking too long to find someone who called and passed out before being able to give location details, especially in apartment buildings where even 50' accuracy (much less 300') can mean many possible multifloor locations to search.

 

[DoctorTech]

It is a thing. Just because they ask doesn't mean that they don't know. I have worked with 9-1-1 call centers. The Enhanced 911 law in the USA has required location capability in cellphones for many years.

However, ALI (automatic location information) systems are imperfect, like all systems. Your 9-1-1 center probably does know where you are and they are asking as a matter of verification. You might notice they will also ask your name and number even they they have that too.

This is exactly what the 9-1-1 call taker I was working with about 2 years ago told me. I saw live calls coming in and each time one of the computer screens instantly popped up with a map showing where the call was coming from. Between the calls the call taker told me that the system works about 99% of the time but every once in a while the computer system is off so they always ask the caller for their location to verify.

I live in a small town in Central Indiana and about a 3 years ago (before seeing a major city's call center in person) I made a 911 call (from my cell phone) to report a suspicious person lurking around my neighbor's house in the middle of the night. The operator shocked me when he asked, "is that the house with the 2 big trees in the front yard and the hedges by the driveway?" At the time I was shocked because I had no idea that they could pull up an satellite photo that quickly of my address to know what the house beside me looked like. I didn't know it was all automated.

 

[gnasher729]

Exactly. Some people might be (somewhat) comfortable with local and/or national authorities having the ability to get someone's location in an emergency in the US or other democracies/republics/non-authoritarian regimes. What about in China? Russia?

Well, if I'm in China, and I'm trying to get an ambulance to where I am, then I'm quite Ok with them getting my exact location.

Actually, I had a situation in the UK where my car broke down, I called the AA (British automobile club) for help, and they asked me for permission to locate me using data sent by my phone. So my car is broken down, I want you to come and fix it, are you allowed to get my location? Let me think about that...

 

[bornslippy]

I'm appalled that Apple hasn't implemented AML - anyone seen any official statement as to why not?

 

[nebo1ss]

What's up with that video style!? If you tried to convince me to do anything with a presentation like that, I'd ignore you too. Seriously, the animation tone and the content are miles apart.

(It sure doesn't create the impression that she's a competent woman either, but that's for another thread... maybe she's one of those women Google engineers. )

Good to see you are focussed on the important thing here.