Seiko and Citizen sell millions of watches each quarter yet this hasn't had the Swiss watch industry worried over the past 20 years. Why would the Apple Watch be any different?
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Apple Watch Sales Estimated at 5.1 Million in Holiday Quarter, Swiss Watch Sales in Trouble
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Hodinkee, a respected watch site which is often quoted on here when they post stories that paint the Apple Watch in a positive light, is advising a little caution before jumping to conclusions.
New Reports That Smartwatches Pose Heightened Threat To Swiss Watch Industry May Paint Misleading Picture
Don't forget the Hermes watchface, only available with a matching band.
Speak for yourself. For others, there are good reasons other than ego to care about classic timepieces. For example, I have some slide rule watches. I love and wear them for their clever and useful designs, which most people these days not only don't care about, but wouldn't understand anyway. (I'm thinking of learning Tizen explicitly so I could do one with the Gear S2 Classic's rotating bezel.)
In any case, it makes no sense to diss fashion purchase reasons in a thread that includes the Apple Watch. Fashion is the whole point of Apple's multiple watchbands and case materials from aluminum to gold.
Since both the insides and shape are all the same, the only reason (outside of allergies) to buy anything but the cheapest Apple Watch is to "massage one's ego" by getting nicer materials or the colors one wants. Or as the rest of us put it: "To make the owner happy!"
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The principle is still the same and the AW is not the first watch to bring added functionality.
Apple has done a decent job creating Apple Watch, but smartwatches still haven't caught on with the mainstream buyer. Expensive, finicky, negligible battery life and being tethered to a phone that adds up to an additional $700 to $1,000 dollars in additional expense is an unacceptable thought to millions.
I bought the Stainless Steel Apple Watch upon it's release. An Apple enthusiast of many years I was excited.
But that didn't last as I found many drawbacks, one of which was it's gadget like look and feel. It's a huge time waster actually. At least if you're customizing it and putting up with its shortcomings.
I bought the Stainless Steel Apple Watch upon it's release. An Apple enthusiast of many years I was excited.
But that didn't last as I found many drawbacks, one of which was it's gadget like look and feel. It's a huge time waster actually. At least if you're customizing it and putting up with its shortcomings.
I know, I've read that site everyday for years, and I said the same to them.
Either way, it doesn't look good for the Swiss watch industry. They may be entering their second Quartz-crisis moment, and they barely survived it the first time.
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I'm trying to remember your earlier posts. Didn't you only wear it for a short period of time?
Honestly, if you don't think the Watch is a great design, then you don't know watches. Even Hodinkee praises the design of the Watch. In fact, they're rather enamored with it, which says a lot. Which mechanicals do you wear?
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The AW is the first to have a great design and interface, as sales have shown. Apple also has brand/design recognition. This is much more difficult than the Quartz crisis.
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I gave my Apple Watch a comprehensive two week trial and returned it.
A serious watch lover / collector and student of horology for over two decades, it's fine hand made chronographs that I collect amongst others.
Brands I own:
Ulysse Nardin
Girard-Perregaux
Jaeger-LeCoultre
Audemars Piguet
Vacheron Constantin
Baume & Mercier
Physically, they were enamored with the packaging and the link bracelet.
The bulky "nerd" body itself, not so much. As they said in their first review, they "don't see people that love beautiful things wearing this with any great regularity."
While I think they underestimated the usefulness and attraction of on-wrist notifications, I personally agree with them and others that the body aesthetic is kind of lacking.
If Apple offered a round version, for example, I suspect it would outsell the current 1980s-style box version, at least with older folks.
Sales mostly show that the AW is the only one allowed to access iOS in an integrated way, therefore it's a walled garden scenario. I.e. no other real choice for a totally integrated device.
As for worldwide watch crisis, that would be more likely if iPhone market share was not such a small percentage overall, and mostly bought by people paying relatively little upfront (via subsidies or loans).
Yes. Before 2015, Swiss watch exports had only fallen once since 1999, and that was 2009. There were already a half dozen Swiss companies to declare bankruptcy in Q4 of last year. It's also led to a production glut that's showing up on the grey market at discounted prices, and this year looks like it will be worse than last year.
It's likely not a single reason, but a perfect storm of several factors, and the large increase in smartwatch sales last year appears to at least be a contributing factor.
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I understand, and those who are really in the thick of it like you are will certainly stick around, and I'm less concerned about the value of haute horology pieces like you own. My rather run-of-the-mill collection of Omegas, Rolexes, etc. is a different story, I'm afraid.
I think you are doom mongering a bit, as you've been talking down the Swiss watchmakers since you got your Apple Watch but I'm sure it will all become clearer in the next year or so.
I'm still to meet a single person who owns an Apple Watch (outside Apple Store staff) so my anecdotal evidence isn't as depressing as yours.
Jack and Benjamin do have slightly different takes, but both are overly positive about the design, and I think it would be a mistake to go the route of making the Apple Watch look like a round mechanical watch. That's not really in Marc Newson's DNA. His mechanical watches designs certainly aren't traditional.
The Watch certainly is walled like everything else Apple, but Android has had watch options for much longer that aren't doing near the numbers.
Why can't they have more than the one design? I would probably get one myself if they came up with a design I liked the look of and they wouldn't need to stop making the current shape. I'm convinced the Apple design team and software engineers could make a round watch work if they put their minds to it.
It would also potentially open the Apple Watch up to a much bigger customer base as it's looks are not universally popular.
I think you are doom mongering a bit, as you've been talking down the Swiss watchmakers since you got your Apple Watch but I'm sure it will all become clearer in the next year or so.
I'm still to meet a single person who owns an Apple Watch (outside Apple Store staff) so my anecdotal evidence isn't as depressing as yours.
Uh, yeah, and I've been correct every month, so far. I'm just trying to provide an honest opinion from a guy that's actually spent thousands of dollars on mechanical watches and spends a lot of time reading about them. I'm not in the price stratosphere like maxsix above, but it's a pretty major interest of mine.
Anecdotally, not only do I see Apple Watches all of the time here on the West Coast of the US, but I went to a nice resort in Hawaii last month, and I saw more Apple Watches than Rolexes, and I'm the kind of guy that looks for watches. I saw everything from sport models all the way up to an Edition (just one.)
I don't know if the estimates of Apple Watch sales are true, but, if it is around 4 million a quarter, it's significant. That's more than half of all Swiss watch exports, and it's only the first generation.
As am I but I'm yet to spot one in central England.
I know the sales figures would probably be very impressive if Apple were to actually release them but I'm not as convinced as you that most of them are at the expense of a traditional watch sale.
Apple has built its reputation as a leader in design by not designing what people ask for, but, rather, showing people what they believe to be great design. If you think a cutting edge designer like Marc Newson is going to design a round watch simply because people want something that looks like a traditional watch, it's going to be a long wait. Maybe he will, maybe he won't, but it won't be driven by consumer demand. That's what sets Apple apart. Do you think many respected fashion designers listen to average, middle class buyers when designing their lines? Nope. They're fashion leaders.
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Yeah, I do live in the heart of the tech world here on the West Coast, so it probably radiates out from here. Granted, I was surprised to see so many Apple Watches in Hawaii.
That's fine but you can't expect people to buy and wear it if they don't like how it looks.
It's probably why I've never been bothered by the latest fashions, I've always found the concept of being told what I should be wearing because it is "in" this season quite ridiculous.
Living and working in an all digital world, is one reason I love all mechanical watches without a hint of circuitry, silicon or a battery. Carefully crafted from precious metals and jewels, they represent such precision and the skill that takes many years to aquire. That's what appeals to me. I don't collect them to be seen wearing an expensive timepiece. In fact most people never notice, something I'm quite pleased about. They are for my enjoyment, nothing more.
Let's not diminish the enjoyment you get from your collection. I don't see them as run of the mill. It's not the price point. It's the intrinsic satisfaction of what these mechanical gems represent. Omega has a rich history with its moon watch and others. Rolex is brilliant with its enduring style of the Oyster Perpetual and Daytona models.
In a throwaway world of continuing upgrades, battery charging, keeping our silicon based devices synchronized and backed up... I get a big smile on my face when I see someone else who also wears a piece of history. Mechanicals are here to stay and be enjoyed by those who value true craftsmanship.
But android hasn't had watch options of the build quality Apple is offering. Nor the same level of affluence in its user base to be able to justify a non-essential phone companion.
Anecdotally, I work in Hollywood. I've seen very few Watches within that setting on a day to day basis. I've only seen mechanical watches on studio executives, producers, and actors. I've only seen one Watch on a TV producer. I don't see any Watches on anyone at high end Equinox gyms. But I do see fit bits, and other fitness trackers. Maybe your location has something to do with it. BTW, I was in Hawaii over the holidays and didn't see a single Watch, but saw lots of Swiss watches.
Now, 4 million/quarter may be more than half of all Swiss-exports, but it's not half of all watch sales. And that figure represents about 3% of the installed iPhone market. For a device that requires an iPhone, and is heavily promoted by Apple directly to its customers, that's a pretty insignificant adoption rate.
You mean like getting rid of their "perfectly" designed 3.5/4" flagship iPhone, in favor of two giant "phablet" iPhones, the type of which they said they weren't interested in making? Or making an iPad mini, despite the need for "sandpaper" to file down ones fingers to use it?
Marc Newson is going to do what the committee tells him to do. Do you think Jony Ive wanted to release an iPhone design where the camera protrudes asymmetrically out the back of the case, such that it can't even lay flat on a table? Add to that Jony Ive has emphatically stated with respect to the watch that, once people wear a product they have the expectation of choice. Seems to me they will listen to what their customers want to some degree. The customer may not always get it, or get it when they want it, but to ignore a round shape as part of an aesthetic fashion choice when others demand it seems a little short sighted. And history shows us they usually capitulate to that demand at some point. If watch saturation is still at less than 10% of the installed iPhone customer base in a year, you can bet Apple is going to try something else other than popping out more metal squares with blank black displays, and new watch band colors.
Well, that's the popular mythology, anyway
And sometimes it's true. Other times, I think the popular reception is more like a consumer electronics version of the Stockholm hostage syndrome, or maybe just Ford's "any color as long as it's black" automobile T slogan. (Of course, Ford lost a ton of customers when other makers came out with colors.)
Think back on times that we saw a leaked shell of a new model, and the forums were full of claims that "Apple would never make anything that looks like that!"... yet not long after the design indeed shows up for real, people get used to it and the outcry dies down. Because heck, they have no other choice.
I think this is why Cook showed off the Apple Watch so many months ahead of sales time. It didn't look anything like the magical designs that were predicted for it. So a long delay was necessary as a breathing space for the fans to get used to its looks, and for Ive to pump out a few handwaving videos about design / manufacturing.
That one thread was hilarious when you viewed it six months later on and some of the biggest complainers had got the iPhone 4 listed in their signatures.
I wasn't sure about it when I first saw it but expected the design to grow on me in the lead up to it's release. It didn't.
Either the apps would all have to be rewritten to look better on the round screen, or they'll remain in rectangular mode with lots of dead space on the top, bottom, and sides.
I'm sure developers would rather just worry about one screen ratio.
I'm sure they would be able to cope if it meant their apps could attract more customers. I'm confident a round design would be very popular and I would expect a lot of Apple Watch fans to snap up both styles.