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Apple Working on a Tablet Mac?

My rational for the iTAblet is described in post #78.

But I need to add something, the iTablet will not be the only device a user have, you will combine it with a desktop or a laptop (for a business user propably both).

So when you come back from a meeting with your iTablet it will 'join' with your stationary computer. So you place the tablet in a stand where you can use the tablet as an extra monitor, the 'monitor' can also be used as a wireless Wacom tablet similar to the size of the Cintiq 12 WX (12” 1280x800 resolution).

They are of course two separate computers but their unique interfaces is shared (keyboard, mouse, multitouch etc).

I have used several Tablet PCs (Compaq, HP, Fujitsu) and for me a tablet with a keyboard is to much of a compromise, difficult to write on (to thick), to heavy and with a joint between keyboard and panel that is a real weak spot.

So for me the 1280x800 12” multitouch+Wacom devices (pressure, angle sensitivity possibility to use different types of pens airbruch etc…), iSight, 32-64G flashdrive and thickness as an iPhone would be ideal.
 
Tara Davis said:
For all its faults, the good ol' QWERTY keyboard is still the easiest way to quickly enter data into a computer.
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Well, keyboards in general. The QWERTY layout, however, is known to be sub-optimal. It was actually designed to be slow in order to keep the users from jamming the mechanisms of early typewriters.

Alternative layouts (like the Dvorak layout) can produce faster typing speeds (when the typist is experienced with the layout, of course.)
MacPhilosopher said:
I agree with you that there is a market for these desktop-confused-laptops. I believe that many people are looking for that perfect blend. I cannot take that desire (or foolishness) away from them. I just think their reasoning is flawed.
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The desire to transport a computer with a desktop's power is unreasonable?

You may disagree on people's preferred solution to this problem, but to claim that there is never a need to easily transport a powerful computer is simply short-sighted.

I suppose you would want to have people committed for wanting to own one of these.
 
shamino said:
The desire to transport a computer with a desktop's power is unreasonable?

You may disagree on people's preferred solution to this problem, but to claim that there is never a need to easily transport a powerful computer is simply short-sighted.

I suppose you would want to have people committed for wanting to own one of these.
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I am only saying that their belief that size and power are necessarily linked is flawed. I never said there was no need to transport a powerful computer. I do everyday. As I said in earlier posts, my 12" G4 PB is a very powerful desktop. I can edit Final Cut Pro 6.0 with it. I regularly use it for heavy Photoshop and Illustrator editing. It has video out for a larger monitor and all the connections I need for external devices (okay, I would prefer another firewire port). It also uses 3-4 year old technology. Imagine what can be done today. The only reason I can see needing something the size of the Acer you linked to is the size of the monitor. Not the monitors bit-depth, but its physical dimensions. Those with sight limitations not correctable by eye-glasses are the only ones I can understand using large laptop monitors. As for every other basic feature in that laptop, drives are just as effective as external devices. Internals are plenty big enough for everything else. How many extra keys do you need on your board? Also, I never said people should be committed. I implied no mental disease, just foolishness and poor logic.
 
"Why buy a Microsoft touch table when you can put one in your pocket"

Btw, There are very little facts surrounding this device so what gives with so many people saying there's no market for it, or that its too big etc?
 
shamino said:
If you really don't get it, then you obviously don't understand the market well enough to design products for it. The fact is that lots of people buy these laptops, whether or not you can understand why.
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Ohh, ya almost got me, except I don't design laptops for a living, so my pride escapes your slings and arrows intact! Ha ha!

I do, however, understand marketing. And I know that, if I were going to market a laptop that came with a 17" option, I would say that about 10-15% of the 17" buyers would actually need that option, and the other 85-90% of buyers only THINK they need that option, or just WANT that option. And maybe half or more of those think that size=power and that they need the perceived power. They'd be better off with an external monitor attached to a smaller laptop, or even just a desktop.

Half of them probably drive an SUV and freak out when the first snowflakes of the year hit their windshield every year - "Aah! Snow! What do I do?" I don't know, Stupid, what did you do all last winter? Why don't you look up winter driving on your obscenely large laptop, or do you need me to set up your wifi for you?

My original point, of course, was that it saddens me to see my own family members breaking their backs with a 17" HP when they could accomplish what they do for way less money and weight. It's pure vanity or misunderstanding or both, just like paying the $160 "look-at-me" tax for a black Macbook.
 
wizard said:
... Seems like you are on a wholly different track then the rest of us. We are talking about a portable device or rather a family of such devices, where at least a couple of them fit into your pocket. The idea being to provide iPhone like functionality with support for a high resolution screen preferably sized right. The larger screen would provide a platform for the enhanced deliver of apps and multimedia especially movies.
...
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I don't see that what I said was vastly different from what you are describing, but the point of the thread was opinions anyway and that is my opinion such as it is. :)

If you are thinking of a traditional tablet computer though I think the odds are very much against Apple doing anything like that and I say that as someone who has *always* wanted a tablet computer.

There already is a "standard" tablet computer running OS-X. It's called the ModBook, and it fills a niche but is not selling gangbusters or anything. What would be the point of Apple re-inventing something that already exists?

In my experience, despite how smart we all are, most people get it completely wrong and are super surprised when Apple does eventually come out with a product that is usually not expected at all. I was thus trying to think "outside of the box" or whatever.

For portability I am hoping for the rumoured mini-laptop with NAND, or for an iPhone if they ever come to Canada and be reasonably priced. :rolleyes:

The tablet Mac as described so far by the leaks and rumours is only 1.5 the size of the iPhone, that's *tiny* if you think about it, but still far too big to fit in your pocket or be useful for typing on, creating documents etc. it is for those reasons that I do not believe that this will be the kind of device that many think it will be.

Do this experiment. Take a paperback novel the same size as the rumoured tablet and balance it on your lap. Now try some "air-typing" on it. Do you still think that a tablet Mac in the sense of a typical tablet computer of today is coming? :)

A small clamshell form-factor (as is rumoured for the "MacBook light") is much more efficient and useable for portable computing. The tablet will be something else IMO.
 
Virgil-TB2 said:
There already is a "standard" tablet computer running OS-X. It's called the ModBook, and it fills a niche but is not selling gangbusters or anything. What would be the point of Apple re-inventing something that already exists?
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Well, difficult to sell gangbusters when not selling any at all.

The latest news is early December release, after a multi-million investment by a Canadian venture capital company into Axiotron. I suspect the delay in release was actually due to the huge demand not capable of being met by such a small company without capital injection.

So somebody with a lot of money whose only job is to invest in future markets believes a tablet Mac is a viable proposition and has now put their money behind it. And that market starts with the crowds who gathered around the Modbook at Macworld where it was voted best product in show last January. And the market extends beyond that.

Including me. The only issue I face is the race between Apple and Axitron to which one delivers. I will wait for Apple first though - if Apple fails to add a stylus (eg, only multitouch) then my decision will be made to go with the Modbook.

PS: What I want and what I will pay good money as soon as it's released is a mobile Wacom Cintiq tablet so, as I mentioned, it needs a stylus. I'm simply not avant garde enough to want to paint and draw with Photoshop brushes and pens with my fingers. Full functionality for these three apps required - Photoshop, Painter & Illustrator.
 
Tara Davis said:
EVERY tablet that has ever been tried has failed.
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Wacom tablets have never failed. They sell quite well actually. I have a 21UX in front of me right now. Paid a king's ransom for it and never regretted a cent of it. Brilliant equipment if you ask me. The only problem is they're deskbound by cabling.

So what you mean is a mobile tablet. But those have only ever been tried with Windows as the OS. Sarcasm mode on -> they have 'success' and 'market appeal' written all over them.

I'm not in the market for a Windows mobile tablet and never will be. Especially with an unsightly form factor of some of those I've seen. An ugly OS on an ugly machine is never going into my Christmas stocking. I AM in the market for an OSX mobile tablet though and have been for a while. There's only one reason I haven't bought one yet - they haven't made one yet.
 
Orng said:
I do, however, understand marketing. And I know that, if I were going to market a laptop that came with a 17" option, I would say that about 10-15% of the 17" buyers would actually need that option, and the other 85-90% of buyers only THINK they need that option, or just WANT that option. And maybe half or more of those think that size=power and that they need the perceived power. They'd be better off with an external monitor attached to a smaller laptop, or even just a desktop.
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So your philosophy is "85% of my customers are idiots, so I'll try to force them to buy what I think they want instead of what they are willing to fork over tons of money for".

Gee, that sounds just like the attitude we all hate the record companies for, doesn't it? But I guess it's OK, when you are the one who thinks he knows what's best for the rest of the world.
 
I can't believe the lack of imagination and the number of assumptions being made reference the keyboard.

People that spend their life using a keyboard and are fast at it, may find it very difficult to even conceive the idea of interacting with a computer without the possibility of a hardware keyboard.

Are you making money by being so negative?

Others here have also an opinion that at times may differ from yours and are creative types that would like the interface of the iPhone / Watcom board on a mobile device with more real state than the iPhone. These people do not plan to hang it on the wall and use their arms in weird positions that are only reasonable for a computer with a keyboard. They may only use a desk for short periods of time.

A tablet is a different system, you have to "think different". If you can't then it is not for you, say your quick piece about why it is not practical and why Apple will never make it and move on.

Apple does well at marketing devices, computers and other stuff that others with less imagination fail marketing. Apple is also not stupid and will not go thru the expense of creating and marketing a device that will not sell well.

Trying to sell pencils to a man with no hands is difficult, Apple targets devices at specific populations, they do not crete one-size fits all devices. Even the iPhone, as popular as it is, it is not made for everyone, some people buy it and complain all day for what it was not designed to do. It is illogical.

There is a population (however big) out there that will find an Apple tablet to be a God send, and a much larger majority that can not envision using one and have no need for one.

I can see how to use one, I know why I can use one.

Why are some of you telling us that we are stupid, that the iTablet is not practical? Have you really ponder and opened your mind or are you still stuck with the idea that it would not have a keyboard and that a virtual keyboard is not likely to have feedback? Have you looked pass the laptop, desk and wall?

It is clearly it is not for you, fine, move along.

Let us, that do have a need for one or simply want one as a nice bright toy, have our discussion. I am not saying don't comment, I am saying that it is a waste to get in a piss ass contest as to who is right.
 
Sorry if this was mentioned inbetween pages 2 and 7, but couldn't this fall under a newton ressurection?

If the UI is all apple goodness with excellent hand writting recognition, an open osx (unlike the current iphone) and affordable, it might sell. Though I think as far as portable computing goes for the masses, it would have to be an iphone/ipod intergrated device. People want to carry only one device for everything.

The intel tablets failed because they were little bang for the buck.
 
bluedevils said:
Sorry if this was mentioned inbetween pages 2 and 7, but couldn't this fall under a newton ressurection?
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Sort of yes, in fact some have referred to the devices as such.
If the UI is all apple goodness with excellent hand writting recognition, an open osx (unlike the current iphone) and affordable, it might sell. Though I think as far as portable computing goes for the masses, it would have to be an iphone/ipod intergrated device. People want to carry only one device for everything.
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I've mentioned as such. In fact a bigger iPhone is often on my mind. I do believe there is a market for devices without the Cell capability though. From my perespective the portable device just needs to fit in a pocket but maximize the screen size and resolution. that and of course hav ehe open software platform so the app of you choice can be installed.
The intel tablets failed because they were little bang for the buck.
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I don't think they failed so much as have been eclipsed by Cell technology. The things they got used for are often found wrapped in a Cell phone. At the same time Cell phones where becoming a required item in everyones pocket technology marched forward and the Intel tablets didn't. Or at least they didn't become more capable fast enough.

As far as capable goes I believe one important item here is WiFi. Having this built in and well integrated with the rest of the software is a key element. The other thing is the idea of massive secondary storage. Well massive for a pocketable device, it is no surprise that Apple stuffs as much flash into its devices as is affordable with the current technology. It could be argued that Apple focuses on flash to the expense of other capabilities. Apple could do well in the tablet category if they simply filled in the the thin spots on their devices.

In any event my desire to see a tablet device should not be construed to mean that I don't expect to see a market for larger devices. I believe that market exist also. Potentially we could see a whole family of devices, with the current iPhone at the bottom of the heap. I would expect each of these devices to have WiFi but also alternative RF communications (cell or WiMax) options.
 
EagerDragon said:
I can't believe the lack of imagination and the number of assumptions being made reference the keyboard.
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It is actually easy to understand. Spend a little time out in the work place and you will soon find out how stupid the population in general is.
People that spend their life using a keyboard and are fast at it, may find it very difficult to even conceive the idea of interacting with a computer without the possibility of a hardware keyboard.
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Until voice recognition comes along or really good hand writting recognition the key board is likely to remain the best input device for humans. The problem is that many people don't seem to grasp that many of the uses for these sorts of hand held devices don't need a lot of data input, that Bluetooth exists, or the alternative is worst.

Are you making money by being so negative?

Others here have also an opinion that at times may differ from yours and are creative types that would like the interface of the iPhone / Watcom board on a mobile device with more real state than the iPhone. These people do not plan to hang it on the wall and use their arms in weird positions that are only reasonable for a computer with a keyboard. They may only use a desk for short periods of time.
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In my case I believe there will be a whole family of devices! Personally my interest right now is in a larger pocketable iPhone. This is very doable and frankly only needs one to look at the Touch to see how even a slightly better screen improves things.

I'm pretty much in the camp of one thing should do everything category. Thus the desire for a derivation based on iPhone.
A tablet is a different system, you have to "think different". If you can't then it is not for you, say your quick piece about why it is not practical and why Apple will never make it and move on.
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I think this is key. If it is not for you and you can't grasp why people would need it then go some place else.
Apple does well at marketing devices, computers and other stuff that others with less imagination fail marketing. Apple is also not stupid and will not go thru the expense of creating and marketing a device that will not sell well.
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Well I won't mention failed Apple products. The point is they can get it wrong. Or they can get it so close that people really get frustrated (Touch & even iPhone). Frustrated customers aren't good either but at least they are moving in the right direction.
Trying to sell pencils to a man with no hands is difficult, Apple targets devices at specific populations, they do not crete one-size fits all devices. Even the iPhone, as popular as it is, it is not made for everyone, some people buy it and complain all day for what it was not designed to do. It is illogical.
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Or we don't buy in and complain all day long. Of course the idea here is that we hope Apple is listening. That is they take customer opinions, wants and desires into account when coming up with new feature sets.
There is a population (however big) out there that will find an Apple tablet to be a God send, and a much larger majority that can not envision using one and have no need for one.
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A useful device sure. Done right though and I can see a very high adoption rate.
I can see how to use one, I know why I can use one.
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I certainly can see such a use now, the missing element is the software included on Apples current devices. The obvious hope is that this will be rectified soon. In a sense it has been rectified by hackers but I'm really am expecting a solution from Apple.

What may that solution be you may ask? Simple; we need access to the file system so that I can view PDF's and HTML files locally.
Why are some of you telling us that we are stupid, that the iTablet is not practical? Have you really ponder and opened your mind or are you still stuck with the idea that it would not have a keyboard and that a virtual keyboard is not likely to have feedback? Have you looked pass the laptop, desk and wall?
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Obviously not.
It is clearly it is not for you, fine, move along.

Let us, that do have a need for one or simply want one as a nice bright toy, have our discussion. I am not saying don't comment, I am saying that it is a waste to get in a piss ass contest as to who is right.
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Well right or wrong I'm not one to get to bent out of shape over those that don't get it. Frankly though I think these people that don't get it need to grasp an iPod Touch in their hands and imagine the capabilities of he device with a few more features thrown in. The fact is that people do make use of devices of this sort as BlackBerry (RIM) and a number of other manufactures have shown. In many cases the search is simply for a better platform than currently exists.
 
Well, i may be a little out of er,touch (sic) on the thread, but is it possible the keyboard on the macbook would be just like the iphone/itouch screen technology. The laptop screen would stay the same, we would just lose the silver keys - replaced by smooth plastic/glass whatever it is.
Then this would open the keyboard up to all sorts of applications, keyboard for usual typing etc, Logic Studio: Mixing Faders & Piano keys, possible stylus pen use as well like wacom for Adobe etc or even ink...??

Just a thought, i presume someones already thought of this.:confused:

Thanks.
 
iTextbook is the Killer App for Mac Tablet

While patiently awaiting a replacement for my 12" PB G4, I keep running across rumors of a Mac Tablet. Why would anyone want a tablet, unless they were a UPS delivery guy or some sales representative who had to gather signatures? Then when hefting my son's textbook laden 30 pound backpack out of the back of my car, it dawned on me. Apple needs to create the iText.

Imagine using Apple's content negotiating savvy with text book publishers like they currently work with the music and video content industries. In this case, working out mega deals with school districts and universities worldwide for textbooks with live links to constantly updated content. Textbook publishers would have an outlet for copyright protected content while no longer having to go through the expense of hardback publishing and distribution. The revenue sharing possibilities would inject Apple with cash just like the iPod universe has done.

E-books have been done (see Amazon's Kindle), but they're lame because they don't offer any advantage over purchasing a $1.99 paperback that can fit in your back pocket. But with text books, this opens a whole new world of possibilities.

I was just joking with my daughter that it was too bad she couldn't Google her American History text book to find out what significant event occurred in the middle colonies in the mid 1600's. Imagine using a touch interface to zoom in on graphs and multimedia content, or to pull up an instant reference, Google search, or dictionary citation. Flipping through pages would be a natural application for a touch interface and notepad (iText). There is no inherent need for a keyboard to use a textbook reference. This is the perfect killer app for multitouch.

Swapping 30 pounds of hardback texts for a sleek 1 pound tablet would be a no-brainer. Built-in WiFi and bluetooth would enable teachers to send e-mail homework assignments, checklists, and (Apple iBoard) notes, while also enabling students to submit classroom assignments and tests wirelessly. In addition to the touch interface, they could use bluetooth keyboards, or have keyboards built into their school desks that the iText would dock into to charge. The market for this would be huge. Unlike most notepads, which target a very small sales force/delivery/healthcare market, this could mean a iText for every single public school student in the country. Can you imagine the power of having your product in the hands of all those kids?

More importantly, this would be a whole new paradigm, just like the iPod was when it first hit the streets. Let's get Apple back into the education market big time. I'm hoping Steve Jobs and the folks at Apple are way ahead of me on this one. If not, they had better get busting before Bill figures this one out. I'm hoping to see both a Mac Tablet with iTextbook universe, as well as a new 12" MBP.
 
Just a thought

I'll keep it brief, as a longer post is on another thread, but my thought was

What if they're bringing out a touch sensitive mouse pad/digital palette style interface with glass front, screen underneath, 4-5mm thick that you can use as wel as a mouse and keyboard? The whole problem with touch screens is that you get your main monitor messy. What if you use the mouse mat you rest your palm on to se a mouse, to be touch sensitive. Move your wrist slightly, then interact with the multitouch sensitive pad? Think http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sIxf3ndi34E
 
Ukijima said:
I highly doubt the validity of this rumor since Leopard's handwriting recognition pretty much sucks.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CCHqMENtKkA

Apple has long way to go with their handwriting recognition before they attempt a tablet.
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The Newton was renowned for having great handwriting recognition, so I think Apple could pull that off. However, as Steve said, the finger not the stylus is the way forward so it would not be necessary.
 
psychofreak said:
However, as Steve said, the finger not the stylus is the way forward so it would not be necessary.
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The Steve has also said that optical drives don't work right when mounted vertically, and he believes that a mouse should only have one button -- so we can dismiss him as a crazy fanatic at times.

I find stylus input (on Windows Mobile phones and PDAs) to be much more precise and functional than finger input (on the Ipod Touch).

On the Ipod, the screen elements have to be really large, and even then your finger hits several of them at once, so the software makes a guess (often wrong) about which element you meant to select.
 
Well, this discussion is very interesting, and all the varying opinions of if it exists/what it might be makes me realise that i actually love everything apple has done in the last 5 years... and i can't see why this would be any different.

I trust that if apple makes a tablet, it will be clever, intuitive and well thought-out.

Go apple! Yays!
 

? Dont need an iMac obviously, and could just use the processing power of a tablet to run a normal screen.
 
I rember that Apple introduced the iPad but there was nothing so maybe the iPad may come back it said that it was a preview of it or something like that
 
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