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Apple Working on Advanced Gesturing and Multi-Touch Version of iWork

martint84 said:
... You want to try to figure out the UI of the RAT (Rumored Apple Tablet)? Go get yourself a comic book, or any other rectangle that measures roughly 10” on the diagonal. Hold it as though you’re reading what’s on the surface.

You see the problem? Your fingers get in the way. Think about how big that surface is, too. That’s a lot of acreage to scan, looking for the right buttons to push....
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My thought is a thing or two that live on the back side. Imagine a hinged loop or two that you can slip your finger through to have a stable grip on the tablet. Swing it (them) out half-way and you have a way to set the tablet on a flat surface (easel props) for when you want to use a BT Keyboard. Swing one of them all the way around and you have a thumb loop, sort of like a painter's palette. This will not be the initial design, but it might show up in later versions.
 
zed2 said:
When I'm coding in Xcode I have dozens of windows open and multiple screens.
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Couldn't there be an environment or script to align perhaps 4 windows per view and switch to different views, spaces like? The main problem I have when programming is integrating 3-4 disparate source documents while editing the target document as well.

Back in the PC-AT days there were word processors that had 3-4 windows kinda like Eudora Inbox is for one instance. These were stacked vertically, not horizontally, but if you had a word processor that would let you set arbitrary window size and aspect ratio and have several styles of source documents, all within a main window, that would simplify viewing so much stuff on a limited screen size, perhaps 1280x768 or whatever.

On DOS for file views I used a program called 1Dir which was a side to side file lister for target discs, such as HD and FD, or whatever.

Rocketman
 
martint84 said:
I think Andy Inhatko pretty much sums it up http://bit.ly/4D1u30

The iPhone UI isn’t a desktop user interface where a pen takes the place of a mouse ... which is the model that previous smartphones followed. It was designed to be held in one hand and tapped with your thumb. Occasionally you’d use the index finger of the right hand to key things in.

You want to try to figure out the UI of the RAT (Rumored Apple Tablet)? Go get yourself a comic book, or any other rectangle that measures roughly 10” on the diagonal. Hold it as though you’re reading what’s on the surface.

You see the problem? Your fingers get in the way. Think about how big that surface is, too. That’s a lot of acreage to scan, looking for the right buttons to push.

While you’ve got it in your hands, imagine that it’s a sheet of thin steel. That’s heavy, isn’t it? Hard to hold up for long periods of time.

Think about how a user interface would have to incorporate those observations. Now imagine that you’ve been doing this experiment for four years and not four minutes.​
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I'm really glad I'm not the only one who thinks that anyone waiting for a touchscreen KB is missing the boat. I have used Windows tablets for years and I can say that handwriting recognition is pretty good. I think if Apple were to work on it, they could perfect it.

I could also see voice recognition being a big part of this device. It's been said that it is part iPhone so you can imagine having in a bluetooth that will allow you not only to take calls, but also to interact with the device. Certainly nobody is going to hold up a device with a 10" screen to their ear, that would be as bad as owning a blackberry :p.

And before I get all the "the cellular is just for data" replies, just think about that for a minute. Why limit the functionality of the device when you already have the necessary phone bits created. Working while talking has been one of the highlights of the iPhone. I doubt they would give that away with this device.
 
nicholasfukuoka said:
What if the new surprise input method were a new evolution of typing using gestures rather than location on a keyboard. For example:

Simultaneous thumb-tap to enter typing mode. All letters represented by a finger tap, combination finger tap, or finger slide. Common words like 'the' could have their own combination as well. Simultaneous thumb-tap to exit typing mode.

Requires a learning curve but it completely eliminates the need for a visual keyboard or pressure feedback etc.
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Like Morse Code? That idea of tapping and sliding fingers would probably make you look like a fool with people looking at you strangely wondering "WTF is he doing?". Second, touch typing is generally the fastest means of data entry. If you have taken typing class, you would know that doing the gestures PER letter would take an immense level of training to change the mode of data entry.

The QWERTY keys are a permanent fixture on today's keyboards, besides the DVORAK. It's easier to learn and recall with this skill. EDIT: In general, 30 WPM is standard (words per minute). But 30 gestural letters/words per minute is impossible.

And lastly, the gestures PER letter has been done a long time ago with Palm's Pilot PDA originally with the stylus pen in the 1990s.
 
martint84 said:
This is starting to sound interesting...

My prediction:
Steve shows the tablet running a multitouch version of Front Row. It works and looks amazing. We all want one the same way the iPhone "had me at scrolling." Everyone is excited. He then presses the "home" button and our minds are blown because that was just one of a dozen apps. iWork, iPhoto, iCal, e-reader, some sort of back-to-my-mac/remote desktop app, and games are demoed. Ridiculous media partnership is announced bringing eBooks, subscription TV, etc. Standing ovation... Steve retires...

EDIT: HP, Dell, Microsoft, Google all $h*t their pants because Apple patents the F*** out of their ingenious new form of text entry, navigation, and gestures on a touch screen.
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Why does Steve always have to retire? Unless by retire you mean leave that place, then it is slightly better.
 
Pilgrim1099 said:
Like Morse Code? That idea of tapping and sliding fingers would probably make you look like a fool with people looking at you strangely wondering "WTF is he doing?". Second, touch typing is generally the fastest means of data entry. If you have taken typing class, you would know that doing the gestures PER letter would take an immense level of training to change the mode of data entry.

The QWERTY keys are a permanent fixture on today's keyboards, besides the DVORAK. It's easier to learn and recall with this skill. EDIT: In general, 30 WPM is standard (words per minute). But 30 gestural letters/words per minute is impossible.

And lastly, the gestures PER letter has been done a long time ago with Palm's Pilot PDA originally with the stylus pen in the 1990s.
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How long does it take to learn standard shorthand? Why should it have to be per-letter gestures? Refer back to the rumor that suggested a "steep learning curve".
 
I almost hope it is something with a really steep learning curve.

That means they went through the thought process of, okay people have to learn a whole new system and change their thinking about this, and we may actually lose some customers in the process, but in the end this is the logical future of text input and in the long run it's worth it.
 
martint84 said:
This is starting to sound interesting...

My prediction:
Steve shows the tablet running a multitouch version of Front Row. It works and looks amazing. We all want one the same way the iPhone "had me at scrolling." Everyone is excited. He then presses the "home" button and our minds are blown because that was just one of a dozen apps. iWork, iPhoto, iCal, e-reader, some sort of back-to-my-mac/remote desktop app, and games are demoed. Ridiculous media partnership is announced bringing eBooks, subscription TV, etc. Standing ovation... Steve retires...

EDIT: HP, Dell, Microsoft, Google all $h*t their pants because Apple patents the F*** out of their ingenious new form of text entry, navigation, and gestures on a touch screen.
Click to expand...

you brought up something I hadn't considered yet and I really like: remote desktop. Who really cares if it run osx or iphoneos if you can access whatever computer you have at home and whatever programs... If they make it right, it could really be very interesting!!!
 
JMax1 said:
you brought up something I hadn't considered yet and I really like: remote desktop. Who really cares if it run osx or iphoneos if you can access whatever computer you have at home and whatever programs... If they make it right, it could really be very interesting!!!
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I honestly think that this is going to be the killer app. Apple's always looking for ways to get more people to purchase MobileMe and this could be huge. Imagine dropbox for your entire home library, something like lala for music, etc, etc. I haven't used LogMeIn on the iPhone yet, but that could be interesting on a tablet. The possibilities are endless.

EDIT: Also could be a way of saying, "This thing is already awesome. But if own a Mac as well, look what it can do."
 
Berlepsch said:
If iWorks will be running on the tablet, doesn't that mean that the slate gets the full-featured MacOS X like all Macs? Doesn't that also imply that it we will see version 10.7 soon, as the current version does not have sufficient support for the tablet? .
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Not necessarily. It could be getting its own version of the OS, and an application doesn't mean a new OS. They could make iWork for the iPhone if they wanted under the same OS.
 
If Apple can throw in touch versions of iWork and iLife into the tablet I would be lining up to buy one. I don't want it to simply be a big media player with some apps and games. Being able to use iWork and iLife would make in complete and let it compete with netbooks and CULV based laptops while still being something different and innovative. The iPhone introduction has to be the best keynote Jobs has ever done. He looked like a little kid happy to showoff his new toy. I hope the tablet intro is somewhere near that level.
 
XCode = Apples IDE (Integrated Development Environment)

sampro said:
whats XCode?
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It is a suite of tools for writing programs for Mac & the iPhone. Somewhat like Visual Studio from Microsoft. XCode is nice but I sometimes feel it is bleeding edge in the wrong places.

Best part about XCode - it is free! So if you are interested in programming it is a good value.


Dave
 
I hope the article is wrong and that there aren't a slew of gestures you need to memorize for this thing. Multitouch is starting to give me unpleasant flashbacks to all the keystrokes you needed to memorize for command-line OSes, which Apple's GUI made obsolete back in the day, ironically.

Just give me handwriting recognition, a transflective screen, amazing battery life, and OS X: that's all this needs to be a solid product.
 
Sydde said:
How long does it take to learn standard shorthand? Why should it have to be per-letter gestures? Refer back to the rumor that suggested a "steep learning curve".
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I learned to type more than 20 years ago and have been using the QWERTY form for this long. The tablet is most likely going to use a standard keyboard for this reason.

To learn gestures shorthand, you've probably already know it by now by tinkering with the ipod touch/iphone/macbook air, etc.

The longhand form was, as I remember it, done by stylus on the Palm by writing a letter on the 'writing area' pad. The PDA has to translate that gesture into actual letters. It may be good for simple short messages or note-taking especially coming from the Newton. However, when doing a large document in text, gestures make no sense and would take a long time to complete an entire paper or anything of lengthy matter.

If the gestures use actual movement that look like a letter, then it's not going to be a problem. But if they use an arcane form of multi-touch finger movement, it's going to look weird. The 'steep learning curve' being mentioned in the tablet news is coming from the strong possibility of using more advanced multi-touch movements to operate the system and menu interface. It's UI that's apparently the most advanced compared to iphone but we won't know until we SEE that in action.

I just have a problem with the idea of doing weird finger gestures for typing. Makes no sense. The only reason it would work is if you have a physical disability and can't use fingers nimbly in typing and have to use simplistic gestures to represent each letter and a few movements to complete a sentence. That means using ONE hand, not two.

EDIT: someone above me mentioned wanting handwritten recognition and I agree with this. This is more natural than using weird gestures with fingers to write. And if Apple doe'snt attach a stylus with it, expect 3rd party manufacturers to bring them out.
 
Tablet is such an illused word. The word has an existing meaning with existing products yet it is getting applied to a host of new products that don't fit the catagory. Perhaps the thing I like best about the term slate it that it suggests a new product catagory and we don't have to listen to the pundits waste air talking about whether it is or isn't a tablet or tablet computer or media device or whatever....

I for one don't really expect or need my iSlate to be a great content creation device, yes I'd like to be able to type on it to keep a journal/diary on it, I'd even like to go through photograhs and choose keepers and losers. Ultimately I need 10% of the functions of a full fleged computer.

I could easily see a multi-touch version of Photoshop, it'd just be an extension of what you do with all the exisiting tablets... Oh there's that word again, you know I mean like wacom tablets, right?

I could also see a multitouch version of logic that actually would perform like all that. Bogus software you see on TV shows (csi miami) grab chunks of audio sliding them around control levels with touch activated sliders. Imagine a pressure sensitive slider.
 
That is my whole point.

dagamer34 said:
Why would they? It's like before the iPhone was released, expecting the iPod app to look just like iTunes, or iPhoto or Mail to be drag and drop equivalents.
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The problem as I see it is that we have people here dripping like a school girl on her first date thinking iWorks on the tablet will be Judy like what is on the Mac. It's good to get excited but let's face it we are talking a whole new interface here. I just don't see a writer buying such a tablet to write something like War & Peace on it. Unless the interface is far more capable than I imagine the unit will only be useful for casual use. Even then a ten inch tablet doesn't leave much room for two handed usage.

The problem, as I see it, is that expectations are to high. It's not like I don't want to see drastic advancements in input, it's just that I don't see multiTouch doing it alone.


Dave
 
Sydde said:
My thought is a thing or two that live on the back side. Imagine a hinged loop or two that you can slip your finger through to have a stable grip on the tablet. Swing it (them) out half-way and you have a way to set the tablet on a flat surface (easel props) for when you want to use a BT Keyboard. Swing one of them all the way around and you have a thumb loop, sort of like a painter's palette. This will not be the initial design, but it might show up in later versions.
Click to expand...

Nah, I like my idea I suggested earlier better... why have to move your hands to the front of the page? Why not have the touch actions be allowed to work on the backside as well?
Obciously, some of them would stay on the front side like shrink/grow, etc, but if you can articulate it, it should work on the back side. This would make typing a breeze.
 
huntercr said:
I really hope there's touch sensitivity on both sides of the device.... ( screen only one side though ) so you can type from behind. That would not only be very cool, it would allow you to hold the device and type with both hands.
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I've heard this theory of typing on the back of the tablet, yet for the life of me I can't figure out how this would work!

How are you supposed to type on a flat surface where you can't see what keys you are typing? Maybe if the back had an actual keypad that you could feel it might sort of work, but even then it would take a long time to get used to. But Apple would never have such an inelegant solution as a physical keyboard on the back of their device. Therefore I don't think a flat touchscreen on the back of the tablet that lets you type is going to happen, and if it does its going to be a disaster.
 
huntercr said:
Nah, I like my idea I suggested earlier better... why have to move your hands to the front of the page? Why not have the touch actions be allowed to work on the backside as well?
Obciously, some of them would stay on the front side like shrink/grow, etc, but if you can articulate it, it should work on the back side. This would make typing a breeze.
Click to expand...

Maybe there would be room enough in there for both of us?
 
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