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Should be MiniLED. That’s the future.
Fine for a low-end/mid-tier option from Apple; Tandem OLED is gonna be what all the flagship prosumer Apple devices will use to align with the M4 iPad Pro.

My bet is that the Pro Display XDR 2 will use Tandem OLED at 6K/8K@120hz.

Hopefully Pc monitor manufacturers don’t wait 6 years to have a comparable monitor (Asus’s Dolby Vision Pro Art 8K MiniLED and Dolby Vision QD-OLED 24.5” 4K@240hz moniotrs with the 5K version imminent).
 
… Thunderbolt 5 (M4 Pro, M4 Max and M3 Ultra) supports high bandwidth, so they should be able to support at least a single 5K 120Hz display, yes? …
Yes. The Thunderbolt 5 spec supports three 8K at 60Hz, or three 4K at 144Hz, or a single display at up to 540Hz.

An easy way to understand relative resolutions is as multiples of 720p (1280x720), the original “HD” …

4K is 3x720p
5K is 4x720p
8K is 6x720p

So support for two 5K at 120Hz is easily within the spec. If Apple does bring 120Hz to the Pro Display, I would hope they’ll talk about the engineering involved.
 
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… Presumably there are barriers to bringing a 120Hz 5K 27" panel to market. What are they and what would the price tag be to overcome them? It's a question for any of the 5K vendors, not just Apple.
I don’t know, but I’ll guess it’s economics, not engineering. A good place to look might be gaming specs.
 
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Please explain some of why it doesn't work. I don't have any strong opinion about the feasibility of bringing a 27" 5K 120Hz display to market, aside from inferring from their absence it's either technically very difficult, very expensive or both.

As to the 'monumental amount of data' to be moved, I checked Amazon just now and one can buy a 4K 240Hz panel, but direct comparisons are difficult when looking at the particulars - 27 vs 32", VA vs. LCD vs. OLED, etc... And some Windows systems (likely their primary target) have expensive non-integrated graphics cards.

On the other hand, from what I understand a number of Macs (not just M4 series) can support 2 Apple Studio Displays, and Thunderbolt 5 (M4 Pro, M4 Max and M3 Ultra) supports high bandwidth, so they should be able to support at least a single 5K 120Hz display, yes?

I'm not disputing your conclusion; I'd like to better understand the reasoning. Do you anticipate 5K at 120Hz being much more difficult and expensive to manufacture than 4K at 160 - 240Hz?
It’s very expensive because there’s not enough demand in the market for it because it’s expensive. It’s kinda like the egg and chicken dilemma. Until 5k starts becoming the standard of monitors then it is likely that the resolution will come at a premium simply because the amount of panels made is so small. Now add to that that there’s basically no devices out there except the M4 computers that can drive a display like that; I think it’s about 50Gbps of video bandwidth that it needs. So we’re talking about making a monitor panel that could only be sold to Apple so they can sell to the tiny subset of people who own a M4 Mac and are willing to shell out $1000+ for a monitor.

It’s hard to say how much more expensive to make it would be but seeing how expensive even non apple 5k displays were until recently (ie a few months ago) I would be willing to bet that the MSRP for a 5k 120hz monitor would be at least $2500 mainly due to a lack of economies of scale.

I mean most monitors out there are still 1080p. Adoption of higher resolutions in the market has been much slower than one would have expected. The Thunderbolt Display from 2011 is still a cutting edge display if you think about it.
 
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A good place to look might be gaming specs.
The gaming segment does patronize (and likely drive) edge-pushing gear, but they seem more concerned about OLED and higher refresh rates as opposed to 5K 27" 220 dpi displays.

Seems like 4K coming to OLED was a bit slow, though there are options.

Ironically, a 27" 5K 120Hz high quality display would likely be attractive to many Windows users who also use their display with a gaming console (or just play PC games), but with the Apple Studio Display, Apple appeared to make the design choice to enmesh the ASD in the Apple ecosystem (e.g.: only 1 input and that Thunderbolt 3, a niche connection standard, and while it can be used with a Windows PC, from what I've read it requires some workaround and you get an inferior experience).

If Apple were willing to court the Windows and console gaming crowds, it might make such a display more viable from a market perspective, but I don't think they'll do that (e.g.: add HDMI and DisplayPort input ports). And despite sporadic pushes to the contrary, Apple hasn't positioned the Mac as a gaming platform (if we ignore Apple Arcade), so while I'd like to see 120Hz, I think we're years away.
 
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So support for two 5K at 120Hz is easily within the spec. If Apple does bring 120Hz to the Pro Display, I would hope they’ll talk about the engineering involved.

it's in the spec numbers wise sure

but it does not physically exist in the world
 
I don’t know, but I’ll guess it’s economics, not engineering. A good place to look might be gaming specs

what do you mean by this exactly?

incidentally, it takes an insane gpu pulling hundreds of watts to do 4k 120hz games, so there's that part of the engineering....
 
Ironically, a 27" 5K 120Hz high quality display would likely be attractive to many Windows users who also use their display with a gaming console (or just play PC games)

what sort of gpu would you need to do 5k 120hz gaming?

2000 watts?
 
The gaming segment does patronize (and likely drive) edge-pushing gear, but they seem more concerned about OLED and higher refresh rates as opposed to 5K 27" 220 dpi displays.

Seems like 4K coming to OLED was a bit slow, though there are options.

Ironically, a 27" 5K 120Hz high quality display would likely be attractive to many Windows users who also use their display with a gaming console (or just play PC games), but with the Apple Studio Display, Apple appeared to make the design choice to enmesh the ASD in the Apple ecosystem (e.g.: only 1 input and that Thunderbolt 3, a niche connection standard, and while it can be used with a Windows PC, from what I've read it requires some workaround and you get an inferior experience).

If Apple were willing to court the Windows and console gaming crowds, it might make such a display more viable from a market perspective, but I don't think they'll do that (e.g.: add HDMI and DisplayPort input ports). And despite sporadic pushes to the contrary, Apple hasn't positioned the Mac as a gaming platform (if we ignore Apple Arcade), so while I'd like to see 120Hz, I think we're years away.
You don’t get an inferior experience and actually a far superior and versatile experience using Thunderbolt and especially Thunderbolt 5 as you can use USB-C to HDMI 2.1/DisplayPort and it has built-in KVM support + 100-240w power back to the receive as needed.

I use my Pro Display XDR with my PC all the time when I’m not using my Macbook or Mac Pro with it.

An ideal monitor uses all Thunderbolt 5 ports as Thunderbolt 5 is faster than HDMI and DisplayPort for monitors + superior handling of multiple moniotrs.

I only agree Apple can provide multiple Thunderbolt ports next time compared to one.

Samsung already has shown behind closed doors this year at CES 5K 27” QD-OLED.

6K and 8K 32” OLED monitors are also incoming. 8K alliance and hollywood are finally somewhat ready to begin pushing the latter correctly for panels over 32”.

Some TV manufacturers are scorned however they lagged behind accommodating 8K + the purchasing power of many consumers are shot towards them unlikely to push it aggressively indefinitely.
 
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incidentally, it takes an insane gpu pulling hundreds of watts to do 4k 120hz games, so there's that part of the engineering....

what sort of gpu would you need to do 5k 120hz gaming?

2000 watts?
I don't know, but you raise an interesting point that goes beyond just 5K displays and Apple Studio Display's potential successor.

Right now, people can get on Amazon and buy 4K displays that support fast refresh rates - such as 120 or 240 Hz, I believe. These can be hooked to a Mac, and while not a dominant gaming platform, there are video games for the Mac.

I'd like to know what frame rates Mac gamers are getting using 4K for games. Did a little quick Googling. From Dec. 20, 2023, this thread:

M3 Max and Resident Evil 4 - Wow....


From the original post in that thread:

am I impressed with how the M3 Max is running RE4 Remake. With every single setting maxed out and running at native res on the 16 inch MBP, I'm getting a solid 90fps (some dips down to the 70s in intense action and highs of 120). This is unreal considering it's a AAA game released this year. I also tried it out on the Pro Display XDR and was able to get a solid 60fps running at 4K on max settings, even at 6K I was still getting around 40fps which was playable.
So here we see report of an M3 Max Mac running Resident Evil 4 Remake at 60 fps, 4K resolution, and even at 6K around 40 fps.

From commentary in other threads or elsewhere, I'm under the impression the M3 Max and M4 Pro are similar in power. From a Googled A.I. Overview:

"The M4 Pro and M3 Max offer similar performance for most tasks, but the M4 Pro is more efficient, offering better battery life and potential for faster single-core performance in some applications. The M3 Max, however, boasts a more powerful GPU, making it the better choice for users who frequently engage in GPU-intensive tasks like video editing or 3D rendering"

So, back to your point...what kind of Mac is necessary to drive 5K at 120Hz and deliver consistently strong performance?

If Apple put out such a system and 120Hz worked fine for Microsoft Word and other low demand productivity app.s, but dropped frame rates badly when gaming using 5K, that could put Apple's obligatory integrated graphics approach in a bad light. Apple might wish to avoid that...
 
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You don’t get an inferior experience and actually a far superior and versatile experience using Thunderbolt and especially Thunderbolt 5 as you can use USB-C to HDMI 2.1/DisplayPort and it has built-in KVM support + 100-240w power back to the receive as needed

An ideal monitor uses all Thunderbolt 5 ports
Interesting assertion, but most non-Apple Thunderbolt displays also offer some other type of input (e.g.: HDMI, DisplayPort). Presumably these vendors know their market, and that's what more of their target demographics desire/prefer.

Is there any non-Apple Thunderbolt display that doesn't offer some other kind of input port?

Would it really be a selling point if a display had 2 or 3 inputs, and rather than Thunderbolt/HDMI/DisplayPort instead all 3 where Thunderbolt?
 
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Interesting assertion, but most non-Apple Thunderbolt displays also offer some other type of input (e.g.: HDMI, DisplayPort). Presumably these vendors know their market, and that's what more of their target demographics desire/prefer.

Is there any non-Apple Thunderbolt display that doesn't offer some other kind of input port?

Would it really be a selling point if a display had 2 or 3 inputs, and rather than Thunderbolt/HDMI/DisplayPort instead all 3 where Thunderbolt?
See my edited answer: Thunderbolt 5 has monitor modes with faster bandwidth than DisplayPort 2.1 and HDMI 2.2; similar to why Apple used only Thunderbolt ports for a while on Macbooks, it makes more sense and is far more flexible and versatile to use Thunderbolt 5 ports exclusively.

Asus actually shipped or intended to ship gaming monitors with this logic (not Thunderbolt though) last year. They somewhat reneged on that with their Dolby Vision 24.5” QD-OLED flagship released this year I have, but the logic absolutely makes sense for a prosumer monitor.

There’s now GPU manufacturers exploring using Thunderbolt 5 ports already which especially make sense for again prosumer GPUs like x90 and above Nvidia cards.
 
what sort of gpu would you need to do 5k 120hz gaming?

2000 watts?
…Nvidia x90 GPUs have been capable of this for at least two generations.

Especially with DLSS, their new neutral rendering constructs, and multi-frame-generation.

If you can game over 4K@240hz and 8K@60hz with such cards, you absolutely can game at 5K@120hz with them
 
Oh, by the way...per this product page, the new Viewsonic VP2788-5K - 27" ColorPro 5K Mac-Compatible Monitor with 100W Thunderbolt 4, USB C, and DCI-P3 Color Gamut, roughly around $950, can support a refresh rate up to 75Hz.

So we have one 5K 27" display option that stretches past the 60Hz point. Oddly, this doesn't seem emphasized in their sales pitch. Did a little digging. This support page has a March 19, 2025 review by a poster, Christopher, that includes this bit:

"Great image quality, but only at 70 Hz not 75 Hz. The monitor lists multiple refresh rates as supported in the operating system (i. e. 60 Hz, 70 Hz, 75 Hz), however it seems like 75 Hz is an unstable hardware overclock that causes skipped frames which makes it visibly less smooth than when the monitor is set to 70 Hz. I used the Blur Busters testufo "Frame Skipping" test with a slow motion camera to verify gaps in the squares. The "Vertical Scrolling" test is smooth with the monitor in 70 Hz and stutters significantly in 75 Hz, using both Windows and Mac. I thus have the monitor set to 70 Hz which is still better than 60 Hz, however for this product to list 75 Hz is very misleading. Text quality is very sharp as expected for a 5k resolution at 27". The text, colors, and contrast ratio are all noticeably better than my older 4k monitor. I was worried about the matte screen and it is pretty aggressive but I got used to it.
Read less
Comments by Store Owner on Review by Store Owner on Tue Mar 25 2025
Store Owner
Thanks for the detailed review! We're glad to hear you're enjoying the monitor.You're right that while 75Hz is listed as an available option, the VP2788-5K has a native refresh rate of 60Hz, with 70Hz being the highest stable refresh rate. The 75Hz setting is achieved through scalar processing and may not perform consistently, especially since this model doesn’t support FreeSync or Adaptive Sync.For the best experience, we recommend using the monitor at 5K resolution and 60Hz."

It's a Viewsonic page, so I figure 'Store Owner' is Viewsonic.

Sounds like we don't have a true, solid 75Hz option yet after all, but somebody is trying.
 
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that will never happen

5k 27" is a niche macOS resolution
…It’s not. You need 5K minimum for 27” panels to be on par with standardized high PPI of mobile devices and mobile apps (@2x).

Samsung literally has 5K QD-OLED monitors incoming and modern display standards have 5K, 6K, 8K, and 16K explicitly in mind instead of 4K which loses its high PPI status after 24”


No display/panel standards committee nor AAA creative or human-computer-interaction (HCI) professionals would agree with you.

Even modern browsers via their device pixel ratio on the global window object method would disagree with you if you understand programming.

Mobile development and production has long validated and standardized these things—and it’s essential for spatial computing hardware that depends on high PPI more than other computing hardware towards being fundamentally more expensive than traditional computing hardware.
 
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what do you mean by this exactly?

incidentally, it takes an insane gpu pulling hundreds of watts to do 4k 120hz games, so there's that part of the engineering....
The question @drrich2 was asking was why don’t these displays exist — I wasn’t clear, but what I meant to suggest is we should look at game developers (not users) for the answer. If they’re not asking for it, the display industry won’t budge.

Current consoles support 4K 120Hz, right? So televisions and displays exist for that, because the economics allow it.
 
Any cutting edge tech such as TB5 120hz refresh, OLED etc would always come to the XDR display first, not the Studio. IMHO of course.
Maybe. But the fact is, it’s easier to achieve 27” oled 5k 120hz vs 32” 6k. The density is the same, but better panel yields and cost and less interface bandwidth with 5k.
 
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Samsung literally has 5K QD-OLED monitors incoming and modern display standards have 5K, 6K, 8K, and 16K explicitly in mind instead of 4K which loses its high PPI status after 24”
While our focus is on computer displays, I suspect the industry has considerable 'cross pollination' with the t.v. industry. I was curious as to why it seemed like the t.v. industry looked to jump from 4K to 8K without passing through a 6K phase, and how Internet streaming bandwidth supply practical limitations would impair the adoption of 8K streaming video content. And then there's the more demanding hardware content creators need to generate that content, and users need to fully experience it.

Then Tom's Hardware put out a relevant article:

Whatever happened to 8K TVs?

News
By Ryan Epps last updated February 22, 2025
The next big thing that never was

From that article:

"Sony and LG stopped selling or majorly advertising 8K TVs back in 2023 and while both TCL and Hisense have 8K TVs on the market, they're a few years old at this point. As of right now, Samsung is one of the only TV makers still launching new 8K models in its 2025 TV lineup."

And here's an article that, on the face of it, didn't seem to be about 8K, but kinda was:

The biggest thing I didn’t see at CES: Thunderbolt 5. Insiders explain why

Where are all the Thunderbolt 5 laptops? Dock makers say they won't arrive until 8K hardware becomes a thing.

Senior Editor, PCWorld | JAN 14, 2025 5:38 PM PST

From that article:

"Hardware makers describe it as a chicken-and-egg problem: Without 8K broadcast content, there isn’t a market for 8K displays. And without 8K displays, hardware capable of rendering 8K content just isn’t as valuable."

"The hoped-for transition to 8K content is verging on its fifth year. And while there is a vociferous segment of the gaming audience who wants to push to higher refresh rates, a substantial chunk of the market — business users — don’t care about anything beyond standard 60Hz displays, he said." (He = Bernie Thompson of Pluggable).

"However, Abdul Ismail, the chief technical officer of the USB Implementor’s Forum (and a senior principal engineer for Intel), said his estimate was widespread USB 80Gbps / Thunderbolt 5 adoption was not until 2027 or so. He, too, used the chicken-and-egg metaphor."

"According to Lukanc, display makers are not going to invest in making 8K displays smaller. “So if the 8K is going to be a four-foot display, and it’s not going to fit on your desk, 8K is not happening,” he said. “What is happening is refresh rate.”

From what his business customers have told him, Lukanc said, “I’ve been told to plan on 165Hz for the next five years” with 4K displays."

-----
The interplay between 8K content and Thunderbolt 5 adoption suggests to me that what's going on in the t.v. and streaming video industries may well have a big impact on our display options.
 
While our focus is on computer displays, I suspect the industry has considerable 'cross pollination' with the t.v. industry. I was curious as to why it seemed like the t.v. industry looked to jump from 4K to 8K without passing through a 6K phase, and how Internet streaming bandwidth supply practical limitations would impair the adoption of 8K streaming video content. And then there's the more demanding hardware content creators need to generate that content, and users need to fully experience it.

The interplay between 8K content and Thunderbolt 5 adoption suggests to me that what's going on in the t.v. and streaming video industries may well have a big impact on our display options.

display panels are display panels, the panel doesn't care if its a tv or computer monitor

4k is the current standard resolution, which makes 5k super niche, which is why there are so few 5k displays and why higher refresh rate 5k panels are super unlikely to ever appear
 
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Current consoles support 4k 120Hz because the displays exist, not the other way around
Fair point, but I was also responding to your suggestion that 4K 120Hz gaming requires “insane GPUs” — when in fact the mid-range GPUs found in consoles can do it. It isn’t some kind of amazing engineering feat.
 
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