Apple's 3rd Party iPhone Application Plan?

[Mike Teezie]

This model sounds like a very realistic compromise to me.

I asked in another thread, but didn't get a reply - what's the problem with the online IM clients you can use on the iPhone? I never had a native IM app on my iPhone - the online clients like Beejive seem pretty great to me.

 

[grappler]

So let me get this straight. If I want to write my own app, can I put it on my own phone? If I submit it to an approval program, can it be available for free download? Or is apple going to charge everybody who wants to download MY application?

 

[nimbuscloud]

So let me get this straight. If I want to write my own app, can I put it on my own phone? If I submit it to an approval program, can it be available for free download? Or is apple going to charge everybody who wants to download MY application?

Will you calm the heck down?

Apple lets people download free software on their website, I'm sure they would do the same...that is if your software is of quality.

 

[irun5k]

Some developers may actually like this model because it reduces the piracy of their applications. If they could sell a $4.99 version of their application, not have to worry about distribution, not have to worry about taking care of the billing, etc., it would be kind of nice.

Except for the fact that Apple will take a big cut for handing the distribution, billing, certification, etc. I can see a scenario where the original developer only makes a buck on each $5 app. Trust me, as a shareware author myself, I really do not think that is far off.

 

[devilot]

Mod note: Please keep this thread ON topic, thanks.


I'm excited for games. I'm silly like that. I mean, Bejeweled over the web is barely tolerable when on wifi, so I'd be more than willing to pay a little to have a native app.

And another thing-- Apple's semi-stance of disallowing 3rd party apps ('til now), that does NOT include web apps, correct? It only excludes 3rd party apps that would be installed on a given phone, right?

 

[The General]

Pay for apps and continue the struggle with hackers?

Hello, Nokia.

I give Apple til the end of the year to open the iPhone up as much as Windows Mobile and provide an SDK. If they don't do it by January 1st, 2008 ... I'm getting a different phone.

 

[winterspan]

As someone who has had numerous PDAs and Smartphones I can vouch for the fact that 99% of thrid-party ware is crap. They tend to put their hooks into parts of the architecture that were not meant to be played with and inevitably would crash either programs or the whole PDA. At the least, the 3rd party programs would make the PDA unstable. I think the only programs I ever downloaded for my PDA's/ smartphones that worked like they should were games.
I think that Apple is wise to adopt this strategy. Make the publishers send in the code to Apple for vetting then sell them through iTunes.

99%? Give me a break. There are many people (like myself) who don't go to google and type in "free winmo/palmOS apps" and then download everything off the page. If you are a discerning customer (or developer) and don't mind paying a little bit of cash, there are alot of great little apps you can find given the limitations of most PalmOS devices/smartphones. I've been holding off on the Iphone, and for the meantime I am using a WinMo 5.0 smartphone and I run about 5 or 6 3rd party apps that are great. No frequent crashes/resetting.
I was even able to write a quick program for the mobile .NET CLR which checks an error log on a server I run and it works great!

Now given the hardware and OS of the iPhone, do I think it would be 100x better? absolutely. Selling/Downloading apps through iTunes is obviously a good idea, but I would MUCH RATHER have a policy where developers pay a small yearly fee or something to join a group and have access to submitting applications to Apple for review. If they lock out everyone but only a couple of large corporate partners, it will REALLY STIFLE innovative development on the iPhone. I mean EA making stupid little games? WTF? I want REAL 3rd party apps from creative sources, not some half-buggy crap that some corporation spits out.

 

[winterspan]

And what are the chances that this will come to the iPod touch as well...? Somehow I feel the iPod touch owners will be left out in the cold, since Apple doesn't want it to compete with the iPhone.

If they leave out the Touch it will be so stupid. However, I don't think they will since they are selling like crazy and represent a good chunk of app revenue

 

[desimus]

for anyone at apple that actually reads this...

Thank you for not allowing every Tom & Charlie to put up applications up on our phones without some sort of screening policy. Thank you for keeping us safe from crummy applications that cause our phone to crash. Thank you for not listening to the loud vocal minority that always gripe and complain because "it's not open". There are those of us that are very happy with the product you've put out and will be even more happy as you continue to develop it.

Oh and another note...for all the whiners out there that continue to gripe about ringtones.... Apple is not making a bunch of cash off of this. They are required to do this because of their iTunes contracts with the record companies (did you actually read the user license or did you just click "yes I agree" and go on about your daily lives only to realize you didn't realize you don't agree with it...if that's the case then use a different media player and quite griping about it. Bottom line is you can't LEGALLY use your music for ringtones. It's the law. PERIOD) Wanna gripe about corporate greed? Then look at the record companies. Apple is just playing by the rules. If you have a problem with it then go buy the phone that allows you to download any file as a ringtone.

 

[lookmark]

The Sidekick model sounds fine to me, except for Apple taking 2/3 of profit - that's insane.

If Apple takes a *much* more modest cut (1/3 or less) from developers - that's more like it.

 

[fastbite]

I need another beer --but regardless, from an outside POV this is what I think: Apple doesn't give a **** about the tsunami of nerds and lovers and me wanting to have a shower app in their iPhones so they can wash their armpits. They know what they are doing. they will get all the apps and games and any other crap we want -- we'll pay for it, smile and be happy. But we will get them THEIR WAY! That's apple to the core. so let's stop frigging moaning. If the platform is a turkey, well, then stuff it! If not... wait, and enjoy the ride (but then again moaning may speed things up)

 

[Unspeaked]

This is typical Apple '07...

::sigh::

It's nice to see they want to follow in the footsteps of Sidekick's great third party application development, because as has been pointed out, *that's* been such a huge hit.

(Show me ANYONE, ANYWHERE on a Sidekick using ANYTHING other than the stock application set...!)

Thank you for not allowing every Tom & Charlie to put up applications up on our phones without some sort of screening policy. Thank you for keeping us safe from crummy applications that cause our phone to crash. Thank you for not listening to the loud vocal minority that always gripe and complain because "it's not open". There are those of us that are very happy with the product you've put out and will be even more happy as you continue to develop it.

Oh and another note...for all the whiners out there that continue to gripe about ringtones.... Apple is not making a bunch of cash off of this. They are required to do this because of their iTunes contracts with the record companies (did you actually read the user license or did you just click "yes I agree" and go on about your daily lives only to realize you didn't realize you don't agree with it...if that's the case then use a different media player and quite griping about it. Bottom line is you can't LEGALLY use your music for ringtones. It's the law. PERIOD) Wanna gripe about corporate greed? Then look at the record companies. Apple is just playing by the rules. If you have a problem with it then go buy the phone that allows you to download any file as a ringtone.

So why don't you write a nice letter to Steve & Co. asking them to disallow application installs on the Mac that aren't done via iTunes' new software download store?

That way we can get rid of all these third party freeware and shareware titles (and a few commercial products) that cause all the problems you read about in the Help forum here and in places like MacFixIt - heaven knows there's plenty of buggy applications.

Apple can screen these and let me know which applications I'm allowed to use on my iMac and which are taboo. Sounds like a plan to me!

 

[sblasl]

I don't understand that everytime there is discussion about the iPhone, there is always some "noob" that thinks in some strange way that it should be applicable to the iPod touch as well. Go play in your own sandbox.

And what are the chances that this will come to the iPod touch as well...? Somehow I feel the iPod touch owners will be left out in the cold, since Apple doesn't want it to compete with the iPhone.

This would be my greatest concern as well. Specifically speaking about Ambrosia who has been a longtime developer of Mac applications. There would be another firestorm if Apple starts these kind of shenanigans.

I'm all for Apple "vetting" third-party applications for the iPhone (ala the "Certified for Windows" program MS Labs runs), but I would not be in favor of Apple refusing to vet third-party applications that pass all the necessary requirements, yet compete with their own stuff (such as ringtone installers).

 

[jhande]

Not really they should allow code signing for use with a single iPhone. This is similar to the method individuals use to write J2ME stuff for Blackberries and other phones. It allows them to access protected fucntions, but only on the single phone.

Exactly!! Why is that so difficult for people to get?? The only thing I'd add, would be a developer connection a la Palm, and we'd have a functioning model.

I've been using the Palm since the V days, and they almost got it right. The only bit they missed was the code-signing aspect.

I hope we'll end up with this model.

 

[sblasl]

Anyone that has an application called "Dating Boot Camp" looses all credibility immediately in my opinion. You have bigger problems than worrying about 3rd party apps.

As a sidekick 3 owner and huge Mac fan, i'm going to warn you all...you will regret the day that apple made this decision.

As a sidekick 3 owner, I have lots of 'wonderful' apps in our catalog. Let's take a quick look.

Excel viewer- Oh great, now i can look at excel files but not touch them in any way. Awesome.

Dating Boot camp- An ebook that tells me how to get women.

MPTAG- A program for editing id3 tags

PhotoTwist- a zany and totally crazy app that lets you add hilariously awesome effects to your pictures! Oh great!

Time traveler- A freaking alarm clock. That's right, we had to pay for something that should have been there in the first place.

The Cycle- An app that tells you when you shouldn't bust inside your girlfriend, when she's most fertile. Wow thanks guys.

AudioLab- let's me record 10 seconds of audio wihch i can then add lots of zany effects to. Hooray.

Showcase- Slide show creator for 6 dollars.

File manager- Want to access the file system on your sd card? Buy this for 10 dollars!


I'm warning you apple users, you will absolutely hate this arrangement. You will get a ton of useless apps, all in the name of stability, and nothing of what you actually want. Do bear in mind all of the above terrible apps usually cost around 4-10 dollars. Useless.

 

[The General]

Thank you for not allowing every Tom & Charlie to put up applications up on our phones without some sort of screening policy. Thank you for keeping us safe from crummy applications that cause our phone to crash. Thank you for not listening to the loud vocal minority that always gripe and complain because "it's not open". There are those of us that are very happy with the product you've put out and will be even more happy as you continue to develop it.

You act like the programs just show up on your phone and mess them up. Are you aware that you have to perform the installation yourself ...

Oh and another note...for all the whiners out there that continue to gripe about ringtones.... Apple is not making a bunch of cash off of this. They are required to do this because of their iTunes contracts with the record companies (did you actually read the user license or did you just click "yes I agree" and go on about your daily lives only to realize you didn't realize you don't agree with it...if that's the case then use a different media player and quite griping about it. Bottom line is you can't LEGALLY use your music for ringtones. It's the law. PERIOD) Wanna gripe about corporate greed? Then look at the record companies. Apple is just playing by the rules. If you have a problem with it then go buy the phone that allows you to download any file as a ringtone.

I don't even really know where to start ... if I buy a CD, I should be able to use songs on it as ringtones. I can play the music through the speaker using the iPod application. It is no different to have it play through the speaker when there's an incoming phone call.

You act like these "laws" that exists are because of the record industry. This is grossly inaccurate.

The RIAA wanted to be able to distribute ringtones of its artists without having to pay them big money to do so. It won a decision last year before the Copyright Office saying that ringtones weren't derivative works, meaning they didn't infringe on the copyright of the songwriter.

The reason they try to make it seem illegal is to scare people like you, gullible people, into paying twice for a song just to make 30 seconds of it play during an incoming call.

It is not illegal to make my own ringtones, don't even try to say it is.

 

[PBz]

To the person who said this is a great start, I totally agree.

To the folks talking about how bad the Sidekick apps are, I say give Apple a chance to get it right.

I am actually excited. I don't need endless apps that I use less than 5% of the time cluttering my phone and this is partially why I have not bothered to hack my iPHone.

I WILL pay a fair price for good, stable software. For example, if anyone here has used Jive Talk by BeeJive you know what I mean. This app is ROCK SOLID for the BB and may be the best IM app I have ever used. I got to beta test for it before it went truly live and the dev team was VERY interested in getting it right and making continuous improvements. Luckily, JT will be free for me if it comes native to the iPhone as I have a lifetime license.

A good sign this is IMO.

 

[Unspeaked]

I am actually excited. I don't need endless apps that I use less than 5% of the time cluttering my phone and this is partially why I have not bothered to hack my iPHone.

What's your point?

If you don't want the applications, then don't hack your iPhone - as you clearly aren't.

But why not allow other people if they'd like to?

 

[nbs2]

Anyone that has an application called "Dating Boot Camp" looses all credibility immediately in my opinion. You have bigger problems than worrying about 3rd party apps.

I don't think there was an insinuation by the poster that he has purchased all those apps. Just highlighting some of the bigger losers in the catalog.

In the end, it's up to Apple to decide if they will limit apps to major players to maximize the percentage of "quality" apps or open the field to everybody and risk a bit of a rise in the number of poor apps. I don't see why a free system like the widget system isn't possible, but, I'm not privy to the inner-accounting at Apple.

 

[Marx55]

iPhone and iPod touch open to any third party applications is a must. And not limited to Web 2, but also for the full OS X.

Or better yet, a brand new handheld computer based on Intel Silverthorne with a full Mac OS X 10.5 inside!

 

[sblasl]

It is NOT Apple's role to be the ringtone police. There are 100's of free ringtones available as well as those folks who have the talent to create ringtones that they give away. Any iPhone owner who wants to put a ringtone of their choice on THEIR phone should have no restriction placed upon them by Apple, Inc.

Oh and another note...for all the whiners out there that continue to gripe about ringtones.... Apple is not making a bunch of cash off of this. They are required to do this because of their iTunes contracts with the record companies (did you actually read the user license or did you just click "yes I agree" and go on about your daily lives only to realize you didn't realize you don't agree with it...if that's the case then use a different media player and quite griping about it. Bottom line is you can't LEGALLY use your music for ringtones. It's the law. PERIOD) Wanna gripe about corporate greed? Then look at the record companies. Apple is just playing by the rules. If you have a problem with it then go buy the phone that allows you to download any file as a ringtone.

 

[sanford]

Devilot,

Correct. There is a little alpha application, Telekinesis, that runs an Apache server on your Mac that, among others things, let's you take snaps with your Mac's iSight, stream audio and video (even FairPlay if the iPhone is associated with that Mac), view iPhone-compatible files, like Word documents, on your iPhone while they are stored on your Mac. It's really supposed to be an extensible framework for developing new uses more than end of itself.

You access your Mac running this software application via Safari on the iPhone. Nothing, besides perhaps allowed Safari web cache, is stored on the iPhone. It is 100% compliant with Apple iPhone development standards; and it proves you can do some pretty robust things under those strict standards.

And games aren't silly, game are big business. And "mini-games" for mobile devices, especially for mobile devices not dedicated to games, are the fastest growing segment of the games industry right now.

Mod note: Please keep this thread ON topic, thanks.


I'm excited for games. I'm silly like that. I mean, Bejeweled over the web is barely tolerable when on wifi, so I'd be more than willing to pay a little to have a native app.

And another thing-- Apple's semi-stance of disallowing 3rd party apps ('til now), that does NOT include web apps, correct? It only excludes 3rd party apps that would be installed on a given phone, right?

 

[sishaw]

So, Apple has final say as to what software is worthy enough to be considered an iPhone application and what software isn't?! Gee how freakin special is **that**

D

Well, it's their product. The marketplace will ultimately decide whether it is a good decision.

 

[thedarkhorse]

this sounds perfect to me. As long as they also support the touch with these apps. I probably wont buy tons of apps but if there are a couple useful or fun looking ones i won't mind dropping $5 per, i mean i already payed $500 for the iPod, what's $5 if it can add more functionality? Especially since this will gaurentee that they work and will be officially supported

 

[grappler]

Wwwd

What Would Woz Do?