Apple's anti-competitive behavior with browsers: Why does Apple get a pass?

Discussion in 'iOS 6' started by Calidude, Jun 28, 2012.

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Is it ok for Apple to not allow other default browsers and gimp their Webkit usage?

  1. Yes

    128 vote(s)
    38.7%
  2. No

    203 vote(s)
    61.3%
  1. Calidude macrumors 68000

    Calidude

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2010
    #1
    I don't use Chrome myself, but today was a big deal for a lot of people and I'm surprised that Apple isn't being heavily criticized for their anti-competitive behavior when it comes to browsers.

    It's ridiculous enough that other browsers can't be set as default, but to actually gimp them by not allowing them to harness the full Webkit abilities of Safari is just blatantly destructive to end users and developers alike.

    I'm seeing people say "you need to jailbreak" yet this board is overwhelmingly anti-jailbreak . Is this something we should have to jailbreak? Not at all. Apple has a mobile OS that doesn't even act like an OS should, and people don't seem to have much of a problem with it.

    Why is that?
     
  2. Telp macrumors 68040

    Telp

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2007
    #2
    I don't know where you've been. Apple is criticized greatly for just about everything they do. It's just nothing new anymore. It's Apple's OS and they can lock it down as they want.
     
  3. batting1000 macrumors 604

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    Sep 4, 2011
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    Florida
  4. realeric macrumors 6502a

    realeric

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    United States
    #4
    It should be fine since Google became big brother.
     
  5. nuckinfutz macrumors 603

    nuckinfutz

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    Jul 3, 2002
    Location:
    Middle Earth
    #5
    I'm ok with it because Apple's koolaid tastes better.

    :apple:
     
  6. gloss macrumors 601

    gloss

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    around/about
  7. MattInOz macrumors 68030

    MattInOz

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    #7
    Care to provide a Link to your claim that Chrome isn't allowed to use full webkit?
     
  8. gloss macrumors 601

    gloss

    Joined:
    May 9, 2006
    Location:
    around/about
    #8
    No non-Safari browser is allowed to use the much-faster Nitro JavaScript engine, ostensibly for security reasons. This includes Chrome.
     
  9. rorschach macrumors 68020

    rorschach

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2003
    #9
    I don't know what you're going on about. Apple has plenty of competition. They aren't being "heavily criticized" because most people just don't care, whether you like it or not.
     
  10. Daveoc64, Jun 28, 2012
    Last edited: Jun 28, 2012

    Daveoc64 macrumors 601

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    Location:
    Bristol, UK
    #10
    It's common knowledge.

    Efficient JavaScript engines (such as Nitro) require low level and fast access to device resources like memory. The downside of allowing that access is that it's easier to exploit weaknesses in the device's operating system.

    Apple takes the view that third party developers can't be trusted with such a level of access, so it only lets their apps (using a UIWebView) access an older version of the JavaScript engine that doesn't use the more efficient low-level JIT compiling.

    That means that Apps like Facebook and Google Chrome (as well as every other browser - excluding Opera Mini*) are not able to run as fast as Safari can.

    It's not technically related to WebKit.

    Until iOS 5.0, the same restriction applied to web apps installed to the home screen, although there's far less of a risk there.

    *Opera Mini gets around Apple's restrictions by processing and rendering web page content (including JavaScript) on their server, before sending the results to the user's device. That approach has horrific JavaScript performance though.

    What are the most popular web browsers (excluding Safari)? IE, Chrome and Firefox.

    Until now, we didn't have any of them on the App Store.

    I think that the profile that Chrome has should mean that it'll be more popular than other third party iOS browsers have ever been and that we'll see people taking note of some of the limitations in iOS.

    Mozilla's supposed to be releasing an iPad browser soon as well.
     
  11. Renzatic Suspended

    Renzatic

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    Aug 3, 2011
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    Gramps, what the hell am I paying you for?
    #11
    You should write a strongly worded letter to the EU for forcing MS to provide a browser ballot to let the end users pick which they want instead of making IE the default.

    I mean hell, it's their OS, right?
     
  12. Lvivske macrumors regular

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2011
    #12
    I don't think its fair, especially with how Windows/IE has been raked over the coals for being 'anti-competitive' for much less.

    It's not like people want the phone unlocked, just let us pick our own default browser. Don't stymie the competition, be competitive and don't give people a reason to want to switch.
     
  13. aristobrat macrumors G4

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2005
    #13
    Wasn't the whole Windows/IE thing over the fact that Microsoft had dominance over the personal computer OS market?

    Apple doesn't have dominance over the smartphone OS market. Depending on which analyst report you read on a specific day, they may be slightly ahead of Android, but that's not dominance.
     
  14. MattInOz macrumors 68030

    MattInOz

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2006
    Location:
    Sydney
    #14
    Thanks Daveoc64 & gloss,
    then it would be expected at some point in the future Apple will find a way to overcome the security issue and could then in OS update switch all Webkit view to nitro?

    So if Apps and Webapps drive hardware sales then it's in Apples interest, as much as anyone's, to overcome this weakness.
     
  15. killmoms macrumors 68040

    killmoms

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2003
    Location:
    Washington, DC
    #15
    Microsoft's bundling of IE was disallowed because it was an anti-competitive use of their operating system monopoly. Apple does not have a monopoly in the phone market (nor do they have one in the smartphone sub-market), therefore they can still do whatever the hell they want with their platform.
     
  16. Kurwenal macrumors 6502a

    Kurwenal

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    Jun 27, 2012
    #16
    It took the DOJ three years to sue MS over IE. Chrome for iOS has been out for 6 hours.
     
  17. Daveoc64 macrumors 601

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2008
    Location:
    Bristol, UK
    #17
    Theoretically the problem will always be there. It simply comes down to whether Apple cares more about trying to stop people jailbreaking their device, or improving the user experience.

    Given that Apple has not done anything to help Facebook (one of the most popular Apps of all time) in this situation, I don't really hold much hope.

    It looks like Facebook has given up and is going for a native iOS App.
     
  18. Sylon macrumors 68020

    Sylon

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2012
    Location:
    Michigan/Ohio, USA
    #18


    It boggles my mind how much Apple is against Jailbreaking. I see it as free beta testers for Apple. Figuring out which tweaks and apps work, where the flaws are and how popular they are, then Apple can steal it back, perfect it for the system and release it in a new iOS. VERY similar to iOS 6. They could view the JB developers as extended employees not on the payroll. Not to mention JB'ing boosts innovation.






    As for the browser situation, the first thing my mind goes to when I read about Apple not allowing users to change the default browser is the whole MS/EU fiasco. Which, I never understood the MS/EU issue either. MS always allowed you to change your default browser, so what was the big deal? Apple doesn't allow it at all on their mobile devices, and yet they get away with it. I bet no one bothers with it on the mobile level because Apple allows it on their computers. I think the mobile restriction gets hidden because no one cares enough to bother with it.
     
  19. blackhand1001 macrumors 68030

    blackhand1001

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2009
    #19
    I agree apple should take a page out of googles playbook and embrace the rooting/jailbreak community. Many features of rooting have been implemented into stock android. In fact the most popular rom developer for android, cyanogen got hired by samsung.
     
  20. chiefpavvy macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2008
    #20
    Which they (Facebook) should have done to begin with. A native iOS App will always provide a better experience. Nothing against HTML5 but...
     
  21. JS82712 macrumors 6502a

    JS82712

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2009
    #21
    Judging from your past few posts, it's obvious that you are a fandroid who has nothing better to do but troll on this forum. Why don't you go worry about that not-so-revolutionary jellybean of yours instead?

    and no, Apple doesn't have 90% of the mobile market share like microsoft did with the PC.
     
  22. 212rikanmofo macrumors 65816

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2003
    #22
    That's what I've been saying. This guy is annoying with all his posts. Stop whining already. Can't you be any more obvious?
     
  23. ethana macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2008
    Location:
    Seattle, WA
    #23
    The reason it's legal is because Apple doesn't fully control the smartphone market. If you don't like how Apple does it, go use Windows Phones, Blackberry, Android, etc etc etc.

    The reason Microsoft was sued about it back in the 90's for this same issue was because they had a monopoly in the marketplace.

    Ethan
     
  24. Calidude thread starter macrumors 68000

    Calidude

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2010
    #24
    1) If Microsoft had created the first touchscreen capacitive multitouch phone, had a sizable chunk of the market and did what Apple is doing while Apple took more of an OSX-approach to browsers, you'd be pointing how how ridiculous Microsoft's policy was. Don't even try to deny it.

    2) Monopoly doesn't matter. It's a matter of user experience and developer freedom.
     
  25. 212rikanmofo macrumors 65816

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2003
    #25
    Seriously? When do you ever stop?
     

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