Apple's Chipmaker Pledges $100 Billion More for US Plants

[CapitalIdea]

Using tariffs to force the issue is somehow worse than American companies sending jobs overseas because they can get by with paying people in Asia pennies on the dollar? I want the jobs here. I want investment in the US because I'm an American. And yeah....I would like to equalize trade deficits to some extent to spread American made goods more around the world and take the job creation that comes along with that. I don't love the tariffs, but I also don't love being so reliant on outsourcing so many segments of the economy.

You "want the jobs here" but for the last 40+ years didn't want to pay the prices it would have cost to keep them here. Ever time you decided to buy some socks, a frying pan or some other item made abroad to save a few dollars, you told the market that you cared about the price more than the person. As for "equalizing trade deficits," that's not how this works. You either are a capitalist who believes in supply and demands in a free market, or you aren't. You don't go to your local grocery store and say "Hey, I give you more money than you give me, so I hereby demand you lower your prices or give me free food!" You'd get laughed right out of the place.

I have yet to get ONE workable answer to the same question I always pose. Let's see if you can do it: If I buy a pair of jeans made in Vietnam for $35, and the same pair of jeans made in Akron would cost me $105, but the jeans aren't actually 3x as good, why should I have to spend the extra money? Are the people in Ohio 3x as important as other humans abroad? Are they 3x as educated, or 3x as focused on the greater good? Current events clearly show that no, they aren't. Also, please don't attempt the line the last guy tried, about how back in the day people would buy used clothes and maybe we should get back to that. I look forward to your workable, realistic answer, sans platitudes about patriotism.

 

[turbineseaplane]

You "want the jobs here" but for the last 40+ years didn't want to pay the prices it would have cost to keep them here. Ever time you decided to buy some socks, a frying pan or some other item made abroad to save a few dollars, you told the market that you cared about the price more than the person.

This is a very fair point and the situation is one in which all us Americans are very complicit with.

 

[CapitalIdea]

Pew is far from a credible source. No one is trying to get into China or any country in the EU, legally or otherwise, while everyone is clamoring to get into the US.

"Pew is far from a credible source" because you don't like that the math didn't agree with you. Guess what? America's no longer popular. We have become unreliable, abusive, and imperialistic. Also, if "no one is trying to get into any country in the EU" then why is Elon Musk vocally supporting all the nationalist parties in the various EU countries whose primary complaint is that there are so many people trying to get in? Are all those people in Reform UK, AfD in Germany, and National Rally in France secretly part of a psyop? Are they illusions? Or are you just lying?

 

[marco114]

wouldn't be surprised if they don't shut these down as soon as tax / tariffs change.

 

[shawnforever]

Using tariffs to force the issue is somehow worse than American companies sending jobs overseas because they can get by with paying people in Asia pennies on the dollar?

It's much worse.

Because now we're all (a) demonstrably poorer from paying more for goods and (b) we've opened the presidency up to bribery and corruption on a massive scale, which is how tariffs are largely understood to work in practice. I don't think that's a fair tradeoff for a couple of people having manufacturing jobs, or your baffling idea that we need to equalize a trade imbalance. You strike me as the type of guy who'd want to "even" the number of wheels on a tricycle just because it's an odd number. But I digress.

 

[dblissmn]

First bit of good economic news I've heard in 18 months. But consider this -- the more balanced approach of the previous administration was bringing announcements like these all the time. Manufacturing investment and employment was going up increasingly quickly under Biden; we've lost tens of thousands of manufacturing jobs already under Trump. And the power of a country that depends on threats to get its way is not long for this world. The smart thing to do would be technology transfer -- you know, what the Chinese were doing from 1980s on, and effectively what Biden was trying to imitate. Most of what we have now is busting out the joint, maxing the credit card on consumption that doesn't earn money rather than with investment in production that does.

 

[BaldiMac]

Using tariffs to force the issue is somehow worse than American companies sending jobs overseas because they can get by with paying people in Asia pennies on the dollar? I want the jobs here. I want investment in the US because I'm an American. And yeah....I would like to equalize trade deficits to some extent to spread American made goods more around the world and take the job creation that comes along with that. I don't love the tariffs, but I also don't love being so reliant on outsourcing so many segments of the economy.

So you want to force Americans to pay more, so the government has leverage to control private companies?

Huh. Seems pretty anti-American to me.

The whole “we need to do this for American jobs” falls flat when we’ve been near record low unemployment for almost a decade outside of COVID.

 

[DEMinSoCAL]

Using tariffs to force the issue is somehow worse than American companies sending jobs overseas because they can get by with paying people in Asia pennies on the dollar? I want the jobs here. I want investment in the US because I'm an American. And yeah....I would like to equalize trade deficits to some extent to spread American made goods more around the world and take the job creation that comes along with that. I don't love the tariffs, but I also don't love being so reliant on outsourcing so many segments of the economy.

Where is the legislation that addresses that issue with hiring off-shore workers for pennies on the dollar? Somehow, I think if that were made not-so-attractive, US companies would hire US workers without our Government extorting countries to build here that may only last until 2029.

 

[TheOldChevy]

Using tariffs to force the issue is somehow worse than American companies sending jobs overseas because they can get by with paying people in Asia pennies on the dollar? I want the jobs here. I want investment in the US because I'm an American. And yeah....I would like to equalize trade deficits to some extent to spread American made goods more around the world and take the job creation that comes along with that. I don't love the tariffs, but I also don't love being so reliant on outsourcing so many segments of the economy.

You realize that the one who pays the tariff is the customer, right ?

 

[ELman]

Unsure, but I bet they will have an enhanced sleep mode. 🤣

No, that's the Biden model.

 

[DEMinSoCAL]

I mean....it's been (one of) the President's ever changing justifications for the tariffs. Like I said, I don't love them but at the same time they aren't exactly new either. The President has just applied them more broadly.

That is certainly the politically correct way of stating it. Others might say tariffs are used as an extortion tool to get countries to bend to our President's whim.

 

[turbineseaplane]

That is certainly the politically correct way of stating it. Others might say tariffs are used as an extortion tool to get countries to bend to our President's whim.

"Al Capone is out there more broadly applying his preferred tactics and techniques on the street."

 

[tridley68]

This is great news 👍

 

[DEMinSoCAL]

No, that's the Biden model.

Trump falls asleep on a daily basis in meetings or practically everywhere, which you'd see if the news you watched reported it.

 

[turbineseaplane]

No, that's the Biden model.

Surely you're not unaware of how often it happens with Trump?

I mean, search literally any information source

🔎 trump asleep - Google Search

www.google.com

Fox News, of course, has tried to hide it:

Hey look at that ... a good use of AI! 👇

 

[name99]

"TSMC has historically reserved its most advanced manufacturing processes for its home plants in Taiwan, meaning Arizona made chips have trailed several generations behind whatever Apple ships at any given time."

This seems as dumb as saying that Apple has historically shipped M-Pro chips with a 2-core E-cluster – a statement was kinda true in 2021, but unhelpful and based on wild extrapolation from a single data point.
Let's look at the timeline:
Fab 1 is operational at 4nm
Fab 2 begins production in 2027 of 3nm
Fab 3 has broken ground and targets 2nm and 1.6nm, for 2029
There's also a packaging plant for 2029, and an R&D center is also planned.

Technically it's true that AZ is lagging Taiwan, but to call that "historical" based on a few years is to stretch the truth. Likewise to stretch the definition on "several" generations.
A more reasonable analysis is that TSMC is acting in good faith, ramping up the US as fast as is practical given the size and difficulty of the project. And that as AZ gets established, they will move closer and closer to leading edge (as we are already seeing). Especially once the R&D center is up and established, I expect we will start to see timing parity in the US and Taiwan.

 

[DEMinSoCAL]

Yes. It's wild how many so called Americans are anti-American these days. I guess privilege gets boring after a while.

Yeah, I can't think of anything more Patriotic, as an American, than to force foreign countries to build on our soil. I mean, they've bought up half our land, they might as well build on the other half, yes?

 

[DEMinSoCAL]

Surely you're not unaware of how often it happens with Trump?

I mean, search literally any information source

🔎 trump asleep - Google Search

www.google.com

Fox News, of course, has tried to hide it:



View attachment 2645927

Doctors have attributed extended blinking to staying up ALL NIGHT posting on your own social media platform instead of actually sleeping. Go figure. And all this time we've been brainwashed into thinking we need 8 hours of sleep for good mental and physical health.

 

[turbineseaplane]

Doctors have attributed extended blinking to staying up ALL NIGHT posting on your own social media platform instead of actually sleeping. Go figure. And all this time we've been brainwashed into thinking we need 8 hours of sleep for good mental and physical health.

You've really gotta get up to speed.
All one needs is a coke & a Big Mac each day.

I read that on the back of my Happy Meal I think.

 

[MiamiFL]

"Pew is far from a credible source" because you don't like that the math didn't agree with you. Guess what? America's no longer popular. We have become unreliable, abusive, and imperialistic. Also, if "no one is trying to get into any country in the EU" then why is Elon Musk vocally supporting all the nationalist parties in the various EU countries whose primary complaint is that there are so many people trying to get in? Are all those people in Reform UK, AfD in Germany, and National Rally in France secretly part of a psyop? Are they illusions? Or are you just lying?

Only one lying to themselves is you 😉

 

[turbineseaplane]

Only one lying to themselves is you 😉

There was a lot of incongruity he asked you to address there.
Please do so.

 

[MiamiFL]

There was a lot of incongruity he asked you to address there.
Please do so.

Nah I didn't feel the need to because it was all nonsequitor nonsense.

 

[Doomtomb]

$100B for company the size of Apple looks like a small number these days

 

[Happy_John]

You think these foreign companies would be spending billions on building in the US if it weren't for our current policies of extorting countries with tariffs unless you build in the US?

Will these investment pledges actually be realized, or are these pledges of investments just placeholders until the administration in the WH changes?

Pledges, agreements, and "memorandums of understanding" are not carved in stone, and, especially under the current administration, shouldn't be treated as "future fact".

It's not actual until it is actual.

 

[VulchR]

Yes. It's wild how many so called Americans are anti-American these days. I guess privilege gets boring after a while.

Not "anti-American". Anti-autocracy.

Anyway, inward investment into the US manufacturing sector is good news, but not if it comes at a price of trade wars and international hostility. No country can stand alone, or should want to.