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I hope some of you never buy a car using these principles. You'd just be happy with your defective car huh? NO! You would want it to operate how it is suppose to and like the dealer said.

This would be harassing the dealer saying your own studies show you to be getting 23.2 miles per gallon and the sticker for the car clearly showed 24 miles per gallon.
 
There won't be a hardware revision, simple as. You really think they would give away third party cases for free forever? They are only stopping it on Sept 30th because they release their financial stats so they can see just how much this has cost them.

The rubber band bumpers cost them like ¢5 a piece. ASP Apple get for an iphone is over $600 so they should include all the five colors in each iphone sales package. That's what I thought they'd be doing after September after solving any sourcing problem they may initially have had. Of course they rather sell them for $29 a piece... Greed is good I guess.

The effect touching "the spot" is very real and demonstrated in just about all reviews I've read so far so no, it's not imagination of anyone. Thickheadedness of someone at Apple is amazing.
 
There is no evidence to say that the iP4 doesn't do what it is advertised to do. On the contrary, the stats shown are saying that it has lower levels of dropped calls than the previous versions, so going by that, why would Apple declare a full exchange/recall? Makes absolutely no sense. People are buying this phone knowing it had a problem. Those who didn't were then told that you got a free case or a full refund, and that applies until the 30th September. I honestly don't know what Apple could do more for these people, seems some just want to moan for the sake of it, no matter how many options they are given.
 
I didn't request a case. I could care less. This has been such an incredible non-issue for me. I've been enjoying my iPhone 4 - it gets FAR fewer dropped calls than my 3GS did.

Maybe AT&T recently upgraded the Chicago area's network or something, and switched it on the day I got my 4. Don't really care either way. I suspect it's just a better antenna design.
 
There is no evidence to say that the iP4 doesn't do what it is advertised to do. On the contrary, the stats shown are saying that it has lower levels of dropped calls than the previous versions, so going by that, why would Apple declare a full exchange/recall?

iphone-reception-pc-0933-rm-eng.jpg


Makes absolutely no sense. People are buying this phone knowing it had a problem.

That doesn't make any sense... "You knew we'd be selling a defect product for you", is Apple running some sort of bazaar shop?

Those who didn't were then told that you got a free case or a full refund, and that applies until the 30th September. I honestly don't know what Apple could do more for these people, seems some just want to moan for the sake of it, no matter how many options they are given.

Include the freaking ¢5 rubber band bumpers in the sales package.
 
The rubber band bumpers cost them like ¢5 a piece. ASP Apple get for an iphone is over $600 so they should include all the five colors in each iphone sales package. That's what I thought they'd be doing after September after solving any sourcing problem they may initially have had. Of course they rather sell them for $29 a piece... Greed is good I guess.

The effect touching "the spot" is very real and demonstrated in just about all reviews I've read so far so no, it's not imagination of anyone. Thickheadedness of someone at Apple is amazing.

Do people think things through when they say stuff like this.

Let us say the total cost for a bumper is $5.00. Including all 5 colors for each sales package would be $25 of extra cost to Apple. If they sell 10 million phones in a year that is a quarter of a billion dollars each year.

You think your solution is so easy and smart, but that is not how the world works, and what you propose is a horrible business solution to a seemingly minor issue that only impacts some customers.

The funny thing is as this period comes to an end, Apple still can't make phones fast enough to sell all the ones people want.
 
If they did secretly update the hardware after september 30th, they are effectively screwing their customers who were willing to upgrade as soon as it came out. Completely wrong. If it was a hardware defect - they should replace ALL iPhone 4's for free. Not just give out some plastic case.

So they should replace it for free even for customers who aren't experieincing problems?:confused:
 
"The more a small problem with your product turns into a press fiasco, the more it is a sign of your success." -- allegedly said by Henry Ford commenting on the 500,000th Model-T sold by Ford Motor Company.

You raise a novel point, but however we look at it, this was a PR disaster. Yes, the success was there and yes, it is still present. But the question remains - how much has this incident cost Apple in sales and in terms of their brand values? What is sure is that the Genie is out of the bottle and some damage is done.
 
That doesn't make any sense... "You knew we'd be selling a defect product for you", is Apple running some sort of bazaar shop?

The product isn't defective. Defective would be part of the antenna falling off, or the glass getting stress fractures, or short circuiting batteries. Things like that.

The laws of physics are not a defect.
 
Do people think things through when they say stuff like this.

Let us say the total cost for a bumper is $5.00. Including all 5 colors for each sales package would be $25 of extra cost to Apple. If they sell 10 million phones in a year that is a quarter of a billion dollars each year.

Rubber bands don't cost $5 a piece. ¢5 a piece is an overestimation. For 10m iphones a year that's less than 2.50m a year.

You think your solution is so easy and smart, but that is not how the world works, and what you propose is a horrible business solution to a seemingly minor issue that only impacts some customers.

The funny thing is as this period comes to an end, Apple still can't make phones fast enough to sell all the ones people want.

That's no excuse for being cheap. On the contrary.
 
Quick Google search gives endless amounts of pages that says the iPhone 4 has less dropped calls than the 3Gs, http://www.google.co.uk/#q=dropped ...uNjAeD1MHRBg&ved=0CAoQpwU&fp=da3e0a7a830a4626

Also, are you trying to tell me that people all around the place aren't buying the iPhone 4 regardless of the reported problems, knowing all about it?! There are users all over this forum who have done just that. Why should they include the bumper in the sales package when you can apply to get one free? Not every single iP4 owner out there has these troubles, so why give away millions of cases that might not get used or be needed?
 
The product isn't defective. Defective would be part of the antenna falling off, or the glass getting stress fractures, or short circuiting batteries. Things like that.

The laws of physics are not a defect.

Glass getting stress fractures is not caused by laws of physics? Are you serious? You need to take those laws into consideration when you design a phone. If you don't, the result will be a defective product. Be the defect stress fractures or loss of antenna signal.
 
Glass getting stress fractures is not caused by laws of physics? Are you serious? You need to take those laws into consideration when you design a phone. If you don't, the result will be a defective product. Be the defect stress fractures or loss of antenna signal.

Sigh. The iPhone 4 is NOT experiencing stress fractures. That was an example.

You can design a phone in such a way that the glass will not fracture all by itself. You cannot, however, design an antenna in such a way that touching it won't cause signal attenuation.
 
Rubber bands don't cost $5 a piece. ¢5 a piece is an overestimation. For 10m iphones a year that's less than 2.50m a year.



That's no excuse for being cheap. On the contrary.

The cost for the bumper cases is most likely closer to $10 (probably $8-$9) as opposed to the 5 cents you claim.

It is not about being cheap. It is about wasting money for no good reason and to no good cause. Apple is a publicly owned company with shareholders to answer to... Apple is one of the highest rated customer satisfaction companies out there.

What you suggest is just silly and ignorant. My point to you was you don't just flippantly say something is only $5 or 5 cents when you are selling 10s of millions of them. A 50 cent decision for such numbers is a big deal.
 
Anyone who has had to replace a logic board or similar internal will find that the revision numbers are rarely the same (and often the board looks different in other more obvious ways). This may involve simple PCB rerouting or the use of slightly different peripheral chips. This is not unique to Apple, it happens in the auto industry, as well as many other consumer electronics manufacturers.

Issues come up, engineers re-design, and a revision is pushed to manufacturing. But, the iP4 antenna problem is such a hot-button issue that much more is being made of the supposed HW revision than any other time in recent memory.

Apple may use different chips inside their MacBooks, but that's 'cause they source them from different suppliers. Like the Screens inside are LG's, Samsungs, AU Optronics, etc... This isn't some secret upgrades Apple's putting it - it's just them sourcing parts for different OEMs to make their products.

Yeah, sucks for the customer when the carrier and manufacturer can just shift the blame, huh? :rolleyes:

Shifting blame is one thing. As I said in my OP - in Australia, France, Canada, etc... the Antenna-Gate is a non-issue. Pretty much nothing reported on it other than US people complaining about AT&T network issues.

Let's see if Antenna-Gate continues on any wide-scale if/when a Verizon iPhone 4 comes out. I kinda doubt it.

Sony had about 5 internal revisions of their Fatty PS3 before finally changing the outside case.

All posted about and all different things than changing the hardware inside of a phone - which would necessitate an FCC approval process.

"We now know that the iPhone 4 antenna attenuation issue is even smaller than we originally thought."


This IS the MOST critical sentence in this announcement. They are trying to make people believe that the problem is small and there is no reason not to buy an iPhone4.

Steve Jobs is a smart guy but we will see if this trick will work or not.

I personally will NOT buy an iPhone4 until they make a hardware change or release the iPhone5 which I believe if this last trick does not work, they will either make less money from iPhone4 or they will release something new soon.

They already said it's a small problem - back in July. And produced facts to back it up. Research and return rates are more accurate than fanboys whining in forums online.

That doesn't explain them ending the 30-day return guarantee. That's actually the part that worries me the most; if I buy an iPhone 4 and find it does have the grip-of-death, I will have to pay $30 to return the thing. That is STUPID, as such an issue is a defect and should allow a free return. :mad:

The 30-day thing I can see - but 14-days has always been Apple's return policy. If you *do* have the antenna-gate, you can *still* get a free bumper, and if you're still unsatisfied after 14-days you can return it. If you kick up *ANY* tiny bit of Fuss, I've NEVER seen Apple Stores charge a restocking fee. I have a friend who works at an Apple Retail store and he's only seen one instance of a restocking fee - when the customer failed to return the power cable with the MacBook.
 
If you don't like it, take it back. If you don't like the solution to the problem, get a refund.

Try reading the article; after the 30th, there is a 10% restocking fee if you do. And only 14 days to return it instead of the 30 days they'd been allowing. 14 days is not really enough time to test a phone in all the conditions it might encounter.
 
iPhone case program

That's sooooo stupid.

By the end of september, I won't have one in my hand anyway because they are still not available in Canada. There are people running in malls all day long to hope to get one.
 
I have read the article, and yes the 10% restocking fee applies, but you know it applies. If you already own one, it doesn't apply to you. If you haven't already got one, you know it applies.

Apple tell you that there is a small issue, and they provide FREE cases that normally retail at £/$30. They tell you you can get a full refund as well if you are not happy. What else would you like Apple to do? There is nothing that says it is your right to have an iPhone 4, nor does it say anywhere that if it is faulty, that you should be made to keep that device. After the 30th you can refund withing 14 days, subject to a 10% restocking fee, that is something that when you buy a new product and read any terms and conditions you would be made aware of. You do read the terms and conditions of any contract that you enter don't you? I assume so, therefore why complain about something you have signed and agreed on?
 
The "Antenna-Gate" problems largely seem like AT&T Problems, as Australian and French press have already said - and My experience here in Canada on Rogers confirms. I have yet to see anyone of my friends (most of whom have iPhone 4's) have any signal problems here in Canada.



Which is probably what most people did... and it's costing Apple Money and they're gonna stop it. If you call Applecare with a problem - they'll still give you a free bumper if you whine hard enough, I'm sure.



When have they replaced hardware internals "secretly" on their computers mid-cycle without announcing it? I've never heard of this before with MacBooks/iBooks/PowerBooks/etc...?



This sounds like an AT&T issue - not an iPhone 4 issue.

It's a big world out there. America and Canada aren't the only countries in existance. Plently of people in the UK have reported the issue.
 
The product isn't defective. Defective would be part of the antenna falling off, or the glass getting stress fractures, or short circuiting batteries. Things like that.

The laws of physics are not a defect.

It doesn't work as intended. It is therefore defective.

Physics weren't responsible for Apple choosing to use external antennas or where they placed them.
 
It doesn't work as intended. It is therefore defective.

Who decide how an artifact is supposed to work? Who decide if an artifact is defective?

Of course the iPhone 4 work as intended for the most part (every products has bugs). You can make phone calls and you can receive them and for most people it is even better than the previous models in doing this.
 
Apple may use different chips inside their MacBooks, but that's 'cause they source them from different suppliers. Like the Screens inside are LG's, Samsungs, AU Optronics, etc... This isn't some secret upgrades Apple's putting it - it's just them sourcing parts for different OEMs to make their products.

I don't think you're reading my posts very carefully. What I'm describing is not the same as what you are describing. I spent several years repairing electronics in high school and mid-cycle revisions are a common feature of all consumer electronics manufacturers, be it cell phones, radios, or computers. I've replaced a PowerBook logic board that was from the same cycle and had a noticeably different layout, not to mention Rev number. As long as the screw holes and cable jacks are in the same place, it still works.

I also just attempted to replace the faceplate of my VW's radio with parts from a radio made the same model year, and the two were so different I had to just order a new radio altogether. No, there was no service notice from VW.
 
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