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Apple's Next iMac Pro: Everything We Know
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This definitely proves that Apple revolves in its own little world and have no idea about the desktop computer market or what the public wants. 2K bottom end with 512GB on board storage, just think what 2K will get you in the PC market. I have been using Macs since the Emac but my next machine will be a PC, more bang for your pound/bucks.
Right I Agree, that is why I put if they decide to go the Pro route… like not put a premium on thinness for the larger iMac. I’m still not sure they will give this route. I still think it may make more sense to have a Mac Pro and Mac Pro mini and expand their external display lineup and then that larger iMac while maybe having a more processor options may not be a full on iMac Pro replacement.
There’s a difference between a $200 increase and a $1000 increase. Numbers matter.
YouTubers and MacRumors whine about $100 or $200 price increases, about the notch, about the chin, about the availability of cleaning cloths… Can you imagine how completely nuts they’d go over a $1000 increase?
For 3D and gaming tasks, the 32 core MAX is a bit slower than the 5700XT. But the 5700XT has been available on iMacs for more than 2 years, the 6800XT is 2X as fast as the 5700XT, and now the 7700 XT is coming and is rumored to be another big jump in performance.
To justify a Pro naming, Apple must find the way to put a 64 or 128 cores GPU in it.
They also need to rise the clock speed: the latest Intel CPU offer a single core performance in the area of 1900-2000 according to Geekbench, the M1 is stuck at 1750. A 10-20% higher clock speed would do it.
Going by Canadian prices the M1 iMac 24 starts at $1599 and replaces two previous 21.5in. models that were $1399 and $1699 respectively. And the new iMac 24 is far more powerful than the units it replaces. In that respect the ne 24 looks like a great buy. The only real downer is, like with the previous models, ordering more RAM and more storage costs you distinctly more than buying aftermarket and upgrading it yourself. Even so an M1 iMac with 16GB and 512 SSD still costs less than a maxxed out 21.5 and gives you a lot more power. The value is there.
I suspect the new iMac “Pro” (or whatever it’s called) will come in about $2400 CAN and maxxed out will be less than a maxxed Intel 27in. It will almost certainly be less than the starting price of the previous iMac Pro.
It’s easy to get hung up on price alone and always assuming we’re being charged too much and getting ripped off. But one also has to understand the value of what is being purchased.
Case in point: presently the best iPad overall for the money is certainly not the Air or the Pros, but the 9th generation 10.2 64GB. Apple upgraded the hardware and doubled the storage while holding the same price as the previous 32GB model. It’s great buy for what you‘re getting.
I suspect the new iMac “Pro” (or whatever it’s called) will come in about $2400 CAN and maxxed out will be less than a maxxed Intel 27in. It will almost certainly be less than the starting price of the previous iMac Pro.
It’s easy to get hung up on price alone and always assuming we’re being charged too much and getting ripped off. But one also has to understand the value of what is being purchased.
Case in point: presently the best iPad overall for the money is certainly not the Air or the Pros, but the 9th generation 10.2 64GB. Apple upgraded the hardware and doubled the storage while holding the same price as the previous 32GB model. It’s great buy for what you‘re getting.
Hence the 'Pro' moniker being rumoured, and an Apple pro price to go along with it. Seriously your dreaming with your guesses at pricing if they call it the iMac Pro, and we have had plenty of rumours of it being a 32" model even from Koh himself if I recall.
For a form factor larger than 27"-30", I think I'd rather go with some sort of "Mini Pro" box and a separate 32"-ish display but something less pricy than the current XDR. A good reliable 5K with a stand that isn't an extra $1000!
I haven't seen a single person in You Tube complain about the notch, not one. And neither about the price because of the speed and quality of the laptop and it's Apple. Plus as I said multiple times now, iMac Pro, that means Pro pricing, and that's it 200 dollars, that's a lot more then that.
Pretty sure I know the answer is no, but there's no chance this would be mini-led lit is there? I have a 2020 iMac that I absolutely love, but for whatever reason the display causes me massive headaches. I got my 14" MBP two weeks ago and that display causes me no problems at all.
I haven’t seen Paris, France, but I’m pretty sure it exists.
If you haven’t seen the YouTubers whining, you haven’t looked very hard.
And as I have said multiple times now, Apple can use the term “Pro” any way they choose. They are not obligated to accept your definition.
In case you haven’t noticed, Apple even calls the $1300 M1 MacBook (which you can now find for $1200 at Black Friday sales) “Pro”.
Not every professional needs, or wants, the fastest, most expensive machine on the market. Insisting that the word “pro” can only be attached to those machines is nonsense. That may be the way you use the word “pro” but it isn’t the way Apple uses it, and it isn’t the way the rest of the world uses it.
Well the only gaming you are going to be doing in Apple Silicon is with Metal and the M1 family Metal scores are incredible so...
And 3D is also looking hyper-impressive. MaxTech just posted a video where a 16" MBP with an M1 MAX and 32GB of RAM pretty much embarrasses a $15K 2019 Mac Pro with a 12-core Xeon, 192GB of RAM, a Vega II Duo video card and the Afterburner card.
Koh's first leak was back in March 2020 where he said Apple was sourcing a 27" MiniLED display "for an iMac Pro". We all assumed at the time this would be an update to the Intel iMac Pro with new Xeons and AMD GPUs.
Next round of rumors were "up to 32 inches", but I don't think those came from anyone with any real track record and then just before WWDC we started hearing "28 to 29 inches and definitely not 32 inches" from someone with a very small, but also very solid, track record. That person also said Apple wanted to keep the price at around $2000.
And now we're back to reports that collaborate Kuo's original rumor - 27 inches, MiniLED and "for an iMac Pro".
Yes the rumors all point to MiniLED with ProMotion for this next Apple Silicon iMac.
“Gaming tasks” are professional? But managing a doctor’s office (which does not require 64 or 128 GPU cores) isn’t?
This is getting silly.
The way Apple uses the term 'Pro' is as a label for its flagship expensive products, but you can choose to ignore this if you prefer. The first MacBook Pro isn't really an example considering it was old technology and case design etc, just with the same chip in it as it's non Pro PC's, excluding the flagship iPad Pro. I agree it shouldn't have had the 'Pro' moniker attached to it.
So you do confirm Apple is using the Pro name for not so Pro devices. So what makes you so shure they won't do that in the near future again?
I just think Apple doesn't want a huge price gap in its Desktop Mac lineup. If they start with $5000 for the big iMac there would be no offer for people who like to spend $3000-$4000. Also if they start with that price and keep it at 27" they most definitely need to put the Jade 2C-Die in to justify that price. And I think that chip is much too powerful even for many pros. There is simply no good reason why the would not put the M1 Pro and Max in there.
Also based on the recent rumours from Kuo, Gurman, dylandkt and Ross Young we will see a 27" MiniLed iMac with the M1 Pro and Max and maybe one "added configuration" (the Jade 2C-Die) that is called iMac Pro and has a starting price of over $2000. That also would make sense price-wise. @CWallace already did the math some posts ago.
Everything else is just making things up right now.
Yup.
If the iMac Pro starts at $5000 as before, they're going to want to do a $2000-4000 large-size iMac in between. Which I don't think they want to do; the size of the market segment doesn't warrant it. Instead, the large-size iMac starts at $2000, but you can easily configure it to be $5000 with an M1 Extreme.
I’m afraid I don’t recognise your accusation I agree the Pro moniker is used in lower end devices, it is not, and neither did I claim it was. The low end MacBook Pro is the exact same computer as the previous generation Pro computer it was based upon, apart from its CPU and GPU, so it’s Pro moniker still stands.
My argument is the pricing would start at around 3000, and I would expect them to offer something extra over a laptop for the money and less restraints on thermals and power consumption. We shall see.
So far, there's no evidence of a significant price increase for Apple Silicon vs. Intel - of course, it depends what you consider "significant", whether you expect any price rises due to the events of the last 2 years, and what you think are the "equivalent" Intel models of the new Macs are...
The 13" Intel "two port" MBP started at $1299. It's been replaced by a 13" M1 "2 port" MacBook Pro at $1299
The 16" Intel MacBook Pro started at $2399, It's been replaced by a M1 Max at $2499... an increase of $100.
The 21.5" Intel iMac started at $1299 - the 24" M1 iMac starts at $1299. Same price - better screen.
The Intel Mac Mini started at $799, the M1 Mac Mini starts at $699...
The "4 port" 13" MacBook Pro started at $1799, the 14" starts at $1999... an increase of $200.
...as for the last one, the "4 port" 13" Intel MBPs had less powerful processors and GPUs than the Intel 16". With M1 Max, the only real difference is the size of the screen - which is still bigger & better than the old 13". So, for many people, the 14" is going to be a viable upgrade from an Intel 16" & more portable too - so for them it looks like a $400 price cut. Still no cheap(er) 16" M1 MacBook for people who just want more screen estate for "mundane" tasks, though.
Bear in mind that the $1799 5k Intel iMac already includes a screen with the same panel as the $1200 LG/Apple Ultrafine, and that both the MacBook Pros have seen significant screen upgrades with only a $100-$200 price bump. Also, the $5000 XDR display is now 2-year-old technology so the prices should be coming down (witness the Mini-LED displays in the new MBPs). Anyway, these prices have more to do with strategic decisions based on the market than any sort of "Bill of materials + costs + markup" formula.
My guess (just a guess, but nobody has any hard info) is that maybe the current $1799 entry-level 5k will disappear (with those customers being served by the 24" M1) and we'll see a $1999 entry price (so it doesn't undercut the MBP) with the same sort of intermediate (M1 pro with more storage) and high-end (M1 Max) options, plus BTOs to infinity and beyond. At worst. maybe, similar prices to the three 16" MBP models...
It has to be remembered that - unlike in the Intel world - these iMacs are not going to be significantly more powerful than their laptop brethren, they're going to be running the same M1 Pro/Max chips, the same integrated GPUs (which are only really impressive by laptop standards or when running native Metal-optimised apps) with maybe a slight speed advantage due to better cooling.
As for screen size - I really don't see the point of making the whole computer significantly larger than the 5k iMac, which is already a big slab to have on your desk (and less than convenient to reach around to get at the ports). Bigger than that and you're going to be looking at putting it on an arm (or a much better adjustable stand than Apple offers) at which point it gets messy having all the cables dangling from the display. Also, if I wanted to spend $2000 on a screen I'd want it to outlive the computer and/or work with other equipment. I'd guess they could fit a 28"-29" display into the same sort of sized package by shrinking bezels.
Those prices were ridiculous, yes, but I suspect the target for those was the guy in the corner office who "needed" a fully tricked out system to "evaluate" the work of the cubicle-dwellers (who get cheap VESA stands and buy their own wheels from IKEA). Probably a lot of them were "thrown in" to sweeten bulk deals with illusory "discounts". (The true scandal was $200 for the VESA adapter when any sensible display would have contrived to hide 4 threaded bolt holes in the steampunk-themed back). I never had cause to find out what sort of "serious callers" business discounts were available on Mac Pro stuff - but it's pretty common for firms selling "business-to-business" to publish ridiculous prices so that they can offer fake discounts to customers who sign a contract.
I'm sure there's a section of the iMac market who are paying the bill and won't fall for quite that "you must be kidding" level of gouging, certainly if it extends beyond the non-mandatory trimmings - but then those £30 cleaning rags sold out so who can tell...?
I am inclined to believe Apple will hold back the release of Jade2C-Die and Jade4C-Die until WWDC to talk about them alongside the Apple Silicon Mac Pro announcement and then use the conference panels to discuss how to program for them to maximize their effectiveness with scheduling and such. So if the iMac Pro launches before WWDC, I do not believe it will offer anything more than the M1 MAX. If it launches alongside the Mac Pro at WWDC, then I could believe it might have Jade2C-Die as a BTO option if the thermals can handle it.
And I do expect thermals are going to be a consideration in what will fit in the iMac Pro because while it will be a uniform thickness (like the 24"), I expect it is still going to be "thin". The 24" iMac is 1.15cm thick and I expect the 27" to be thicker - at least the ~1.5cm of the MacBook Pro and maybe closer to 2cm if it does offer Jade2C-Die.
And even if the first generation Apple iMac Pro does not offer more than a single M1 MAX SoC, there are rumors that M2 ("Staten") will be offered in both single and dual die variants and perhaps the dual die model ("M2 Duo?") will fit.
And then there will be M3/M3 Pro/M3 MAX ("Ibiza"/"Lobos"/"Palma") further down the road, so it is possible that M2 is meant to be a direct M1 replacement for the MacBook Air, Mac mini and 24" iMac with no M2 Pro or M2 MAX variants and then the MacBook Pro and iMac Pro will get the M3 generation the following year.
And I do expect thermals are going to be a consideration in what will fit in the iMac Pro because while it will be a uniform thickness (like the 24"), I expect it is still going to be "thin". The 24" iMac is 1.15cm thick and I expect the 27" to be thicker - at least the ~1.5cm of the MacBook Pro and maybe closer to 2cm if it does offer Jade2C-Die.
And even if the first generation Apple iMac Pro does not offer more than a single M1 MAX SoC, there are rumors that M2 ("Staten") will be offered in both single and dual die variants and perhaps the dual die model ("M2 Duo?") will fit.
And then there will be M3/M3 Pro/M3 MAX ("Ibiza"/"Lobos"/"Palma") further down the road, so it is possible that M2 is meant to be a direct M1 replacement for the MacBook Air, Mac mini and 24" iMac with no M2 Pro or M2 MAX variants and then the MacBook Pro and iMac Pro will get the M3 generation the following year.
It will be interesting to see how they top the M1 Max. Will they throw more cores into the pot, or tweak the cores, or expand the various cache pools. It could get exciting to see the next version, be it an M1 Supermax, or an M2.
To be fair, some of those had previously seen price increases. The 15-inch MacBook Pro, over the years, went from $2000 (2006) to $1700 (2009), $1800 (2010), $2200 (2012), $2000 (2013), $2400 (2016), and finally to $2500 (2021). A different analysis would be to say that the 2016 model included a dGPU whereas the 2012 model did not; I believe that was a $400 option at the time. Nonetheless, the starting point of the large MBP has gone up.
I indeed don't think we've seen significant price hikes in the CPU transition, though. I think we might even see a price-dropped M1 MacBook Air once the redesigned M2 MacBook Air comes out.
You’re agreeing with yourself? That’s nice.
I agree with Apple. With people who were hired by a trillion-dollar corporation to make marketing decisions.
If Apple’s marketing team wants to call a $300 video editor or a $1300 laptop “Pro”, that’s what they should do.
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Calling the M1 MacBook Pro “old technology” is nonsense.
Whining about the case design is also nonsense. Especially coming from someone who’s so hung up on the word “pro”.
Real professionals don’t buy computers in order to have the latest, hippest, most modern case design. They buy computers to get work done.
In other words a gradual price increase, one or two hundred dollars at a time. Which is what the rumors indicate and what we can reasonably expect this time. Not a sudden $1000+ increase as some people here are predicting.