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Glideslope

macrumors 604
Dec 7, 2007
7,948
5,376
The Adirondacks.
It strikes me that Apple should really be releasing a 6.5" iPad Mini successor (iPad Nano) but with cellular tech so it can make phone calls. This would be a killer device and would make billions for Apple. Whereas a 6.5" iPhone is just the scatter gun approach suggesting Cook and co have no clue. It'll flop.

Of course it makes sense for the customer, but you're not a stock price. You need to remember it's the post 2011 Apple. Apple is lost. They currently have the direction, and leadership of a Zombie Apocalypse. The Walled Garden is starting to crumble. Tim needs to go. :apple:
 

joeblow7777

macrumors 604
Sep 7, 2010
7,048
8,754
It strikes me that Apple should really be releasing a 6.5" iPad Mini successor (iPad Nano) but with cellular tech so it can make phone calls. This would be a killer device and would make billions for Apple. Whereas a 6.5" iPhone is just the scatter gun approach suggesting Cook and co have no clue. It'll flop.

I can’t tell if you’re joking or not. What exactly would be the difference between this “iPad nano” with cellular/phone functionality and a 6.5” iPhone?
 

Septembersrain

Cancelled
Dec 14, 2013
4,347
5,451
I think the mini had a niche but with the missing features, it just wasn't the better value.

I know I moved to the Pro for 4 speakers. I might be a small minority but I'm sure there are other features on the Pro that make up other small minorities.

So if you add all of us up, that small minority increases drastically.
 

krause734

macrumors 6502a
Jul 30, 2010
592
1,405
More options are better. I think the iPad Mini is a great size for kids, portability, reading, etc. It's a bad move to only offer 128GB for $399 with no updates in sight. Lower the price and people will buy it. 32GB for $299 I would see more people buying it.
 

tmarks11

macrumors 6502a
May 3, 2010
509
32
I want a new mini ipad to buy to replace my dated one. For $350-400.

A 6.5" iphone for $850 (with a $50/month service plan) isn't what I want.
 
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eVolcre

macrumors 68000
Jan 7, 2003
1,979
587
I can’t tell if you’re joking or not. What exactly would be the difference between this “iPad nano” with cellular/phone functionality and a 6.5” iPhone?

I *think* that was sarcasm BuT a long and skinny 6.5 inch phone can’t actually be compared to a 4:3 6.5 inch tablet. I’d still take the tablet. You’re looking at about 50% extra effective screen real estate.

I’m fairly price insensitive and also OS agnostic. In 2016 I spent close to Usd 1800 for a thinkpad because there was no Apple laptop that met my needs. (Keyboard, decent screen, ports and the option to switch it around into tent and tablet mode 2 in 1).

Been quite happy but now I can see myself moving to an iPad Pro workflow with a desktop at home. Probably the iPad X hopefully with a 10.3” chassis and a 11.3 inch screen.

An iPad mini complements that very well. Bonus if I can use the pen.

If not, I’ll be looking hard at the rumored Microsoft surface mobile device. Foldable “phone” that can handle laptop mode as well as turn into a 7” tablet with pen support.


Apps and workflow? I like Apple but can get around it. MS office, browser, social media, kindle, OneNote and scrivener work pretty much the same across devices and OS’s. I’ll miss the convenience of Apple but if they don’t give me a device that fits into my workflow and needs I refuse to buy what they THINK I need.

It’s about physical size not screen size and I still see room at the bottom for a small highly specced out mini pro.
 
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subjonas

macrumors 603
Feb 10, 2014
5,541
5,870
I don’t care much about Apple’s profits nor market trends. All I know is I like small phones and small tablets, and strongly dislike large phones. Always have, always will.

I’m at a point where I’d like to upgrade from my 10.5” to a 12.9” iPad Pro and an iPad Mini. I like the idea of using the Pro as an almost replacement for my laptop and using the mini on the side for reference book reading, watching movies, etc. Something on the side.

I have stopped carrying my MacBook Pro home from the office. I used to carry both the Mac and the 10.5” together. I quickly realized that when I am home I pretty much only use the iPad Pro. I don’t want to read a book on the 12.9”. The 10.5” is really good for that. I think the mini does have a place. And the more and more we start to shift to using the mobile OS as a primary OS the more you might find yourself wanting a smaller secondary device. It’s difficult to find the right mix I think. I bought the 10.5” instead of the 12.9” because I just wasn’t sure which way to go. I never thought I’d use the 10.5” as much as do as a replacement for the laptop. Once that happened I felt like the larger iPad would have been a better choice.

I would like to see more powerful apps. Between Files and Documents I feel like we’re pretty close. And being able to download to Dropbox helps. Now I feel like I want one app that does what I use Dropbox, Files and Documents for all rolled into one and I’d like that to be Files. Files needs to have more feature parity with Documents and Dropbox. And being able to save anything like zip files, images, or any file in a link from the web via Files needs to become a reality.

The Multitasking is surprisingly good. That took me a while to get used to but I’m pretty much there. I feel like we’re so close with this now. Closer than ever.

If the extra money isn’t an issue, I highly recommend the 12.9 + mini combo over a single 10.5. I find the 12.9 much better for work (12” rMB is also good but assuming iOS is the preference here), and the mini much better for casual consumption. I see the 9.7/10.5 as more of a compromise, which I would only get if I could only have one device to do both.


I can't speak for the market, but for me I can see use cases for tablets and phones both large and small. You either want compact usage and portability, or extra screen space for productivity/consumption. They're both valid.

It'd be like me saying that since I do heavy work on my 15" quad core laptop and would be more constrained by the dual core 13" alternative, they should just kill off the 13" because its "worse". Meanwhile a lot of people don't need that extra size/power and do value the portability.

It feels weird to me that the mentality that bigger is objectively better does seem to have become the standard in mobile devices, when lightweight mobility was their original purpose. We even went through a period early on when absurdly small cellphones were the coveted choice. Heck does no one remember the point where we had a 3.5" iPhone and people were mostly asking for a mini option?

I always wonder how much it is the industry nudging the public towards whatever can be positioned as the most expensive option. For a period they could sell the miniaturization of components as the premium. And once they hit a practical limit with that they just went the other way of saying "what you really want is bigger!"

Just my 2 cents.

I strongly agree with every point. Well said.
 

eVolcre

macrumors 68000
Jan 7, 2003
1,979
587
I don’t care much about Apple’s profits nor market trends. All I know is I like small phones and small tablets, and strongly dislike large phones. Always have, always will.



If the extra money isn’t an issue, I highly recommend the 12.9 + mini combo over a single 10.5. I find the 12.9 much better for work (12” rMB is also good but assuming iOS is the preference here), and the mini much better for casual consumption. I see the 9.7/10.5 as more of a compromise, which I would only get if I could only have one device to do both.




I strongly agree with every point. Well said.

12.9 with a mini does seem like a great combo (laptop replacement assumption) I found the 12.9 too unwieldy in tablet mode and the 10.3 too cramped in laptop mode.

My dream iPad Pro would be the body of the 10.3, edge to edge like the X, giving us an effective screen size of about 11.3 inches. The MacBook Air 11 is still my all around favorite Mac in terms of portability and actually getting stuff done.

I’m going to hold out and look at rumors. If there’s a 11 inch ish IPP I’m covered. If not, I’ll have to go for the larger one and take a serious look at the upcoming foldable surface mobile based on andromeda. That’s a seriously cool piece of tech.
 

Amplelink

macrumors 6502a
Oct 8, 2012
934
392
The only reason I can think of for not updating the iPad mini is to prevent that device from cannibalizing any iPhone sales. iPhone is still Apple’s most important device by far. As phones get bigger, the difference between the mini and the iPhone diminishes. Apple doesn’t want there to be anyone settling for an iPad mini.

Which is a shame because the size is perfect. And the screen aspect ratio is better for web surfing and for reading books. It’s a pretty awesome device.
 

kltmom

macrumors member
Oct 9, 2015
86
132
Was it the wrong bet, or did the product just run its course as people finally accepted monster-sized phones instead? Phablets took some time to gain traction over smaller form factors, so iPad mini capitalized on that in the meantime. One could still argue that the mini is a great option for those looking for something comparable to a Kindle, but not just a Kindle.

I also think they need to keep the 4" iPhone alive. When Apple announced the SE, it sold like hotcakes too. I would seriously consider a next-gen SE if Apple managed to get up to a 4.7" screen in it.

Off Topic: LOVE your screen name and pic. I’m a BIG lifelong fan of Next Gen
 
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willmtaylor

macrumors G4
Oct 31, 2009
10,314
8,198
Here(-ish)
Does the demise of the iPad mini not also mean the demise of the iphone SE?

The same arguments apply to both.
No, I don’t think they would. Sales of larger smartphones cannibalize smaller tablet sales. This isn’t the case for a smaller form factor smartphone.
 

Greenmeenie

macrumors 68020
Jan 14, 2013
2,060
3,181
Nope. I refuse to believe the iPad mini is dead until Apple OFFICIALLY discontinues it. I think if Apple doesn't update it this year, they will discontinue it. But I am holding out hope for an update this March or perhaps at WWDC in June. If not, i will buy the smallest ipad pro this summer.
 

bensisko

macrumors 65816
Jul 24, 2002
1,471
1,307
The Village
As much as I love the Mini (and I really love the form factor, and no, a 6.5” phone does NOT replace the Mini), I have somewhat moved on. I still use the Mini, but it’s not used as much and has been supplanted by the 10.5”. For me, I probably wouldn’t buy an updated mini - unless it used the Apple Pencil, then it would be an instant buy (if the specs were good enough, it may even supplant the 10.5 as my go-to mobile device!).

In a wider market, I can buy “phablets killed the min-tablets” but I don’t think it was what did the Mini in. What really killed the Mini was lack of attention from Apple. The Mini had ONE shining spotlight where it was “part of the family” - when the Mini 2 sold next to the iPad Air. From then on, Apple just did not update it like it should.

The only reason I can think of for not updating the iPad mini is to prevent that device from cannibalizing any iPhone sales. iPhone is still Apple’s most important device by far. As phones get bigger, the difference between the mini and the iPhone diminishes. Apple doesn’t want there to be anyone settling for an iPad mini.

Which is a shame because the size is perfect. And the screen aspect ratio is better for web surfing and for reading books. It’s a pretty awesome device.

No iPad would cannibalize iPad sales. That’s not even close to something Apple would need to worry about.

Of course it makes sense for the customer, but you're not a stock price. You need to remember it's the post 2011 Apple. Apple is lost. They currently have the direction, and leadership of a Zombie Apocalypse. The Walled Garden is starting to crumble. Tim needs to go. :apple:

Thank you sir for the laugh! It was indeed hilarious!!
 

ejb190

macrumors 65816
Tablet/phone sizes are interesting to me. The industry says, "We want to make two or three product lines that are good enough for everyone." That makes sense from a manufacturing and profit standpoint.

The general population laughs because, a) we don't all fit into their neat little sample sizes, and b) the public is going to find uses for the device that the manufacturer never imagined. I read about biologists scuba diving with iPads to do fish counts on reefs, for pete's sake...

Next, they have to walk the line between profitability and leaving behind market share. Apple could make an iPad for everyone, but it's going to cost them in profitability to keep that many devices on the market. Frankly, I see a few too many devices in the iPad/iPhone lineup the way it is.

The next thing is the line between a tablet and a phone. Seriously aside from making calls, what can one do that the other can't - and why is that a thing for a cellular connected device? If I carry a cellular connected iPad all day, why do I also need to carry an iPhone?

For work, my perfect tablet would be a ruggedized iPad Air with the largest memory, a beast of a cellular antenna, integrated GPS, an eInk monochrome screen so it can be read in full sunlight, and a week battery life. For some reason, aside from Trimble ($$$ for outdated equipment), manufactures just don't cater to the outdoor markets. So we make do with iPad Air 2's, Otterbox cases, external battery packs, good database design (to compensate for the sketchy cell coverage), and finding a shade tree to read the screen.
 

ctg7w6

macrumors 6502
Oct 23, 2014
486
858
It strikes me that Apple should really be releasing a 6.5" iPad Mini successor (iPad Nano) but with cellular tech so it can make phone calls. This would be a killer device and would make billions for Apple. Whereas a 6.5" iPhone is just the scatter gun approach suggesting Cook and co have no clue. It'll flop.

Lol, what? A 6.5" iPad Nano with cell tech would be different from a 6.5" iPhone how?
 
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Greenmeenie

macrumors 68020
Jan 14, 2013
2,060
3,181
Even if Apple does come out with a 6.5" iphone X plus, i think the mini is still viable. Right now, the 7.9" screen is the smallest screen i'd like to do serious work on. A 6.5" iphone will still be a phone. Plus Apple plans to decrease the bezels of the upcoming ipad pros suppossedly. So the 10.5" will have an 11" screen and the 12.9 will have a 13.5" screen. If this happens, i think releasing an ipad mini pro with an 8.5" screen would be perfect.
At the very least to be able to use the apple pencil on a mini would be a great thing. You cant or wouldnt use the pencil on an iphone. The ipad mini pro, especially one with an 8.5" screen that you could use the apple pencil on would be my dream ipad. Portable, but with a usable size screen to do serious work on. As an artist, i'd buy one of these instantly. So i hope the following comes true:

6.5" iphone x plus
8.5" ipad mini pro without bezels
9.7" low cost regular ipad
11" ipad pro without bezels
13.5" iPad pro without bezels

To me this would be the perfect line up. Something for everyone. Make it happen Apple.
 

oldmacs

macrumors 601
Sep 14, 2010
4,924
7,122
Australia
The iPad Mini has a place and t still sells despite Apple putting in zero effort. I see them all the time, and people love them. Apple has constantly gimped the iPad Mini. The first gen was A5 based when A6X was in the normal iPad. The Mini 3 was A7 1GB when the iPad Air 2 was A8X and 2GB of ram. Then the iPad Mini 4 was a gimped version of the iPad Air 2 which was already aged by late 2015....
 
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subjonas

macrumors 603
Feb 10, 2014
5,541
5,870
Even if Apple does come out with a 6.5" iphone X plus, i think the mini is still viable. Right now, the 7.9" screen is the smallest screen i'd like to do serious work on. A 6.5" iphone will still be a phone. Plus Apple plans to decrease the bezels of the upcoming ipad pros suppossedly. So the 10.5" will have an 11" screen and the 12.9 will have a 13.5" screen. If this happens, i think releasing an ipad mini pro with an 8.5" screen would be perfect.
At the very least to be able to use the apple pencil on a mini would be a great thing. You cant or wouldnt use the pencil on an iphone. The ipad mini pro, especially one with an 8.5" screen that you could use the apple pencil on would be my dream ipad. Portable, but with a usable size screen to do serious work on. As an artist, i'd buy one of these instantly. So i hope the following comes true:

6.5" iphone x plus
8.5" ipad mini pro without bezels
9.7" low cost regular ipad
11" ipad pro without bezels
13.5" iPad pro without bezels

To me this would be the perfect line up. Something for everyone. Make it happen Apple.

As a small phone user, one thing I always wished that was in Apple’s lineup was a large-as-possible secondary handheld device. A device that’s as big as it can be while still being able to be palmed comfortably in one hand. I estimate the width for this device for the average person would be almost exactly 4 in./10 cm. In contrast, iPhone plus is 3 in. wide, and likely will not get bigger since it needs to be a phone (not to mention iPhone plus doesn’t make a great secondary device, due to price and lack of Continuity functionality). iPad mini is 5.3” wide, much too wide for the average person to palm comfortably, and likely will not get smaller since it has to use 9.7” iPad UI apps.

But of course this device won’t exist as long as phablets are popular. The size difference is too nominal for a secondary device. This device would only be for small phone users who want a bigger, but still handheld secondary device, maybe for home. Pretty niche, sadly for me. Maybe if someday phablets go out of fashion.
 

Macalicious2011

macrumors 68000
May 15, 2011
1,724
1,741
London
Once you've got it covered with the requisite small and large phone + 9.7 iPad, it's all about filling niches. While I don't have a need for an iPad Mini I appreciate that it's:

  • Great travel/commute companion for those not carrying large bags or brief cases.
  • Light enough to hold in one hand while walking - think retail stores, construction sites and warehouses.
  • Proportionate in size for children to play games on.
 
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dgdosen

macrumors 68030
Dec 13, 2003
2,742
1,381
Seattle
If Apple is discontinuing the mini - you'd think they'd tell the public. I, for one, prefer the mini over a larger iPad - and I might be in a minority - but by Apple not communicating their future, they're leaving me waiting on the sidelines to every replace this iPad - which is a little long in the tooth.
 

joeblow7777

macrumors 604
Sep 7, 2010
7,048
8,754
If Apple is discontinuing the mini - you'd think they'd tell the public. I, for one, prefer the mini over a larger iPad - and I might be in a minority - but by Apple not communicating their future, they're leaving me waiting on the sidelines to every replace this iPad - which is a little long in the tooth.

They never announce when they discontinue a product, at least not until it's VERY obvious that it's finished, like the click-wheel iPod. To date, have they even declared the iPod Touch dead? I think that they worry about the negative connotations of "killing" a product line. There are no doubt people still buying the Mini 4, but saying that the line is officially discontinued would probably make people see it as "obsolete" and not want to buy one. So they probably won't call the iPad Mini "discontinued" until they stop selling and supporting them all together.
 

007p

macrumors 6502a
Mar 7, 2012
987
649
They never announce when they discontinue a product, at least not until it's VERY obvious that it's finished, like the click-wheel iPod. To date, have they even declared the iPod Touch dead? I think that they worry about the negative connotations of "killing" a product line. There are no doubt people still buying the Mini 4, but saying that the line is officially discontinued would probably make people see it as "obsolete" and not want to buy one. So they probably won't call the iPad Mini "discontinued" until they stop selling and supporting them all together.

Well that’s only a year and half away for both the mini and iPod touch. Assuming they drop support for A8 in iOS 13.

I don’t remember Apple continuing to sell products that close to discontinuing entirely. I’d say the mini has to go this year or it would be pretty bad for a consumer if they did in fact stop supporting it in iOS 13.
 
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