LOL hilarious! I know it's off topic to say so, but posts like this make this forum so much more enjoyable. Well done, sir.
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Apple's remaining surprise....4K at 60Hz.
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LOL hilarious! I know it's off topic to say so, but posts like this make this forum so much more enjoyable. Well done, sir.
I am very surprised that GTX680 does 4K 60Hz via SST but it is likely that is more forward thinking than the MST kludge.
It seems many 7xxx AMD cards do 4K 60Hz via MST OOTB in 10.9.3.
Not only the high powered 7950 and 7970 but also the more pedestrian 7870.
Here are screen shots from a flashed 7870. The choices shown in Display Preferences are rather odd, but by using the app "Display Menu" I am able to choose a nicer 2560x1440 that appears to be HiDPI.
I am wondering if Nvidia is just going to skip MST altogether (other than 750M).
BTW, thanks for 9100 PCI. Years ago when I started playing with GPUs that opened my eyes up to ideas. Flashed cards didn't have to be just the ones that already existed. With a little more work and time investment it was possible to create NEW cards.
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I was surprised that a 4K SST 60 Hz display existed. Now I just need one to support a VESA mount for a display arm. There's the ASUS PB287Q available June 10th which does support VESA mount. Next, I'll need one to be better quality (viewing angles and color) than the Apple 30" Cinema HD Display that I have now.
Thanks for the screenshots. The Display Menu and Display Preferences screenshots are definitely from HiDPI.
What does "(low resolution)" mean in the Display Preferences screenshot?
Your Display Preferences screenshot is missing the Rotate option. Is it because the display is in MST mode or because of the graphics card? I wonder if the 680GTX supports rotate with the SAMSUNG U28D590D at full rez?
I've attached a screenshot of the SwitchResX display menu - it indicates which resolutions are HiDPI (see first attachment). Seems Display Menu is missing that feature. Oh wait, the HiDPI modes in Display Menu are indicated by the white aspect ratio icons (I think that's too subtle).
The screenshots don't actually prove you're using 3840x2160@60Hz (it could be showing a scaled resolution). With SwitchResX, you can see the HiDPI resolution 3240x2025, scaled resolution 6480x4050, and the timing resolution and frequencies 2560x1600@60Hz (see second attachment). I don't know what it would show for an MST display though.
The 750M you refer to is the discrete graphics chip used in the MacBook Pro (Retina, 15-inch, Late 2013). Since MST is supported by that, then how hard would it be to add the feature to other NVIDIA chips and cards? Can the NVIDIA web driver be installed on a MacBook Pro (probably not since the driver docs say Mac Pro only)? If so, then does MST still work? Or maybe it doesn't matter since MST is already on the way out...
Yeah, OpenFirmware was fun. I haven't gotten into EFI stuff yet. I was thinking of rewriting Apple's Boot Camp EFI app for better compatibility on my old MacPro3,1 with OWC Accelsior and EVGA GTX 680 Mac Edition but I fixed that problem by putting the graphics card in slot 2.
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UHD @ 60Hz with OSX 10.9.4?
MacVidCards, could you update us with the status of your 4K Asus monitor, specifically it's ability to display UHD @ 60Hz within OSX? Also, do you know if UHD @ 60Hz is possible with the GTX Titan? I'm currently running a 4K Dell UP3214Q with the GTX 680 in my 2010 Mac Pro running 10.9.4 and I can only get 30Hz. Thank you for any help.
MacVidCards, could you update us with the status of your 4K Asus monitor, specifically it's ability to display UHD @ 60Hz within OSX? Also, do you know if UHD @ 60Hz is possible with the GTX Titan? I'm currently running a 4K Dell UP3214Q with the GTX 680 in my 2010 Mac Pro running 10.9.4 and I can only get 30Hz. Thank you for any help.
I have been unable to get 4K 60Hz from any Nvidia card, even in 10.10.
At this point if I was Nvidia I would just concentrate on SST since the "MST Kludge" seems likely to fade into the past. Apple may have put something in the drivers to keep 60Hz MST an AMD thing. AMD cards have had 60Hz MST 4K for several iterations of OS at this point. 7870, 7950, 7970 all can do it in OSX with ease.
I'd appreciate your thoughts on the below, since you are also dealing with attempts to get 60 Hz on a Mac Pro, even though mine is a Mac Pro (late 2013) and is supposedly supported, its not working either.
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/1753557/
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/1753557/
What kind of Mini DisplayPort to DisplayPort cable do you use? I am unable to get 60hz on my Asus 4k and nMP with D500s and I think my problem is the cable. Mine doesn't support DisplayPort 1.2 and I'm gathering that is necessary?
The cable needs to support HBR2 bandwidth. There's a discussion of 4k 60Hz SST monitors at https://discussions.apple.com/message/26280749
Cables are discussed near the end (starting at page 9). The bandwidth requirement for 4K @ 60 Hz is going to be similar whether it's via SST or MST.
Thank you for that information. Now I am leaning towards upgrading to an AMD 7970 instead of the Titan. But I've read conflicting reports about the benefits of OpenCL vs CUDA for Adobe Premiere Pro. Do you know if I would see faster render/export times using a Titan Black (CUDA) or an AMD 7970 (OpenCL)?
I got a Radeon R9 280X for my 5,1 Mac Pro in the hopes that it would support UHD @ 60Hz on my Dell UP3214Q monitor. So far I've been unable to get it to play nice. I attached some photos of what the 280X is doing to my UHD monitor. (note: the Dell UP3214Q is on the right, the left monitor is 1080p)
It seems to recognize the Dell as two monitors but I haven't found a way to enable MST. Notice how all my icons are on the rightmost "monitor".
When using Display Settings to Scaled 3840 x 2160 @ 60Hz for both "monitors" it shrinks the display areas so that there are big black bars above and below that cannot be used. My cursor cannot enter those areas of my Dell monitor. Wasted space. And the icons, windows, and text are so small!
When using Display Settings to Scaled 1080p @ 60Hz for both "monitors" it stretches the display vertically so that all the icons and windows are distorted.
I've tried the other "lower resolution" settings in Display Settings to no avail. I've tried "Best For Display" setting which produces a result similar to Scaled 3840 x 2160.
Can anyone please tell me if there's a way to get the 280X to play nice with my Dell UP3214 monitor?
It seems to recognize the Dell as two monitors but I haven't found a way to enable MST. Notice how all my icons are on the rightmost "monitor".
When using Display Settings to Scaled 3840 x 2160 @ 60Hz for both "monitors" it shrinks the display areas so that there are big black bars above and below that cannot be used. My cursor cannot enter those areas of my Dell monitor. Wasted space. And the icons, windows, and text are so small!
When using Display Settings to Scaled 1080p @ 60Hz for both "monitors" it stretches the display vertically so that all the icons and windows are distorted.
I've tried the other "lower resolution" settings in Display Settings to no avail. I've tried "Best For Display" setting which produces a result similar to Scaled 3840 x 2160.
Can anyone please tell me if there's a way to get the 280X to play nice with my Dell UP3214 monitor?
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Now, when you say "enable MST" are you referring to in OSX preferences?
You definitely need to turn it on on the Dell to have it work.
What is odd is that Dell is very similar to my test Asus here. My Asus is 100% identical to Apple's current "favorite" 4K and that is why I test with it.
Your Dell has same panel with some updates.
In reading the review at Anandtech they also had many issues with MST mode.
If it is like the Asus/Sharp 321 twins, it requires a total of 10 button pushes to switch from one to the other
I was in fact using the Asus with one of our R9 280x cards just last night. I was able to use 60 Hz with zero issues.
Do you have "Display Menu"? It is a cool little app that lets you choose a variety of Retina (gosh, did I just use Apple's marketing word...jeez) modes.
The "Pro" version is only a "few dollars more".
Are you using the DP or MDP input? Do you have another DP/MDP cable you can try?
I am 100% convinced that the card and drivers are capable of running full 60Hz. So, you may need to update the firmware on your Dell.
The entire 2nd half of this page outlines these issues and the firmware fix:
http://www.anandtech.com/show/7906/dell-up3214q-review/2
We early adopters are going to pay the price, SST 60Hz is going to be the way things go. Much less clunky. Still love my Asus, running it in HiDPI around 2560 gives best of both worlds, lots of real estate and easily readable.
I have been working on a bunch of images recently and having all those pixels has been a dream.
Best monitor for the 7950?
have been reading through the threads with great interest, i'm just wondering --
I've got a Sapphire 7950 Mac Edition in my oMP. What 4K monitors would work @ 60Hz with this card with the least amount of drama? Does Yosemite break the 60Hz functionality at all?
have been reading through the threads with great interest, i'm just wondering --
I've got a Sapphire 7950 Mac Edition in my oMP. What 4K monitors would work @ 60Hz with this card with the least amount of drama? Does Yosemite break the 60Hz functionality at all?
People are reporting that the latest Yosemite betas fix problems with New Mac Pro AMD cards and 4K 60 Hz SST monitors. I don't know about the 7950 though.
Thanks... Where are people discussing this... I'd like to follow the discussion.
Same thread I linked before. Yosemite fix is mentioned on page 12.
https://discussions.apple.com/thread/6080897
One BIG gotcha: when using the Samsung U28D590D, I couldn't get the system to boot with the card in EFI mode (note: using a flashed 7950). Once the system makes it past the bootscreen your fine, but I found the only way to avoid unhooking & rehooking up the monitor after boot was to put the card in PC rather than EFI mode - so if you want a bootscreen, you need to hook up a second video card & monitor.
The nvidia 680 will make it past the bootscreen with the monitor attached, but gives no image until OSX fires up. This is what I'm currently using, with a 27" hooked up to the DVI port so I can see my FileVault login screen.
I don't have any other 4k 60hz monitors, so not sure if this behavior true on other SST and/or MST monitors. My seiki 4k (30hz, hdmi) I believe did get a bootscreen, though its been a while since i tested on the oMP.
Very odd. If this is the same display as MacVidCards and I have, this certainly shouldn't be happening. I suggest hunting through the settings or reading the manual to determine how to enable MST. I'm not sure if you mentioned what cable you're using. I believe you should use display port cables. I also suggest making absolutely certain that the cable you are using supports DisplayPort 1.2. Finally, inquiring about the firmware update is a good idea.
Take a look at https://discussions.apple.com/thread/2750329
Maybe it's a solution for this problem? I don't know if the com.apple.Boot.plist is accessed early enough.
Try using <string>3840x2160x32@30</string> and if that doesn't work, try <string>2560x1440</string> or <string>1920x1080</string>
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Not related. It a EFI problem, not a OS problem - it won't even get to the point where it tries to boot off a harddrive for me.
With the card set to PC mode, the video subsystem won't come up until OSX loads - if you're using filevault, you'll have to either have a second video card or blind type your password (proper method is right arrow, return, password assuming your user was the first in the list). If you use the held-down option button to select a boot drive, you'll really want a second video card -- not even sure the drive order shown is predictable.
It *could* be my flashed card, but I'm using the rom from a sapphire, not a hacked up one, and my card was a sapphire reference 7950, so I'd be cautious w/ a SST monitor.
Thank you for this information. I am out of town right now but I will try these remedies once I get back to the office. I'm hopeful that the Display Menu app will work. Otherwise it looks like I'll have to pester Dell for a firmware update and/or a refurbished monitor.
Thank you for this advice. The monitor came without a manual. I have tried different DP cables. I have looked through all the Dell monitor menus and there's no MST option. I found the option to enable DP 1.2 and it's enabled. I will try updating the firmware.
It's strange that the ASUS would be so different from the Dell considering that it's the same IPS panel.
You should start at the Anandtech review:
" As I mentioned earlier, you need to enable MultiStream Transport mode to get a 60 Hz UltraHD image on the Dell."
In my Asus, it is literally a 10 button pushing ordeal to switch. There is a "setup" menu and in that is a "Displayport Stream" I believe. You click on that and finally you see whether it is set for SST or MST. It is literally one of the most illogical and poorly thought out things I have seen in awhile. Why not a light that goes from red to green on bezel, with a single button push?
I typed it all out in a chat with Deconstructo once, it is miserable. There must be something similar for Dell, hence the Anand comment. I'd look for a manual online, most places keep them on their websites. Between that and automated calling routed to the far east, they cut WAY DOWN on customer service calls.
If it is at all like Asus/Sharp 321 twins, it will be a royal pain and hidden and clumsy and illogical.
By the way, MacVidCards: Did you get the firmware update for our Asus display? I was having issues getting iTunes to recognize HDCP when using MST and then tech-support sent me a firmware update. It fixed the issue. I put it on my Dropbox if anyone is interested.
Thank you for this advice. I downloaded the user manual for the Dell UP3214Q monitor and scoured it for any reference to MST but there is none. There is a Picture-by-Picture option which is entirely different. There is an option to enable DisplayPort 1.2 which I have done. I spend two hours on the phone with Dell Tech Support only to have them tell me that they "don't support Mac configurations" and that there's no MST option in the monitor menu so I should call Apple Tech Support to see if they could help me with UHD @ 60Hz. Frankly, at this point I'm thoroughly disappointed by this monitor and want to get rid of it.
You say that UHD @ 60Hz is possible with the ASUS PQ321Q monitor you have but it's very difficult to enable MST through its menu. I've looked at the ASUS monitor's user manual online and I couldn't find any reference to MST. Could you please share your method to enabling MST on your ASUS?
I'd like to buy one but I want to make sure that I can enable MST before I do so.
For the Asus we have, the method is:
Choose Menu > Setup > DisplayPort STREAM > MST > SET
Just as mentioned here: http://support.apple.com/kb/ht6008
If there is no menu option for this on your display, then I'm guessing it doesn't support it. I don't believe there is any software solution at this time, but I have not been following what the new beta of Yosemite can accomplish.
I have the ASUS PQ321Q and I enabled MST. And yes, I'm getting UHD @ 60Hz finally! Thank you.
But I'm encountering one quirky behavior. When I try to make QuickTime Player or any application go full screen it only fills one of the monitor halves. So there's no way I can watch a full screen movie with this monitor as is. Am I missing some work-around, or is this a limitation of MST?