Apple's Unix Future...

arn

macrumors god
Original poster
Staff member
Apr 9, 2001
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David Coursey of ZDNet writes about what he learned from meeting with Steve Jobs:

In general, it appears Apple does not want to pursue the home entertainment niche (ala Tivo) and instead focus on the hub-strategy... which is what Jobs has been pushing all along.

Of interest Jobs and Apple are also aware that they are now one of the largest Unix vendors around... and with that comes new opportunities. Interest in Apple in the unix/dev community has really peaked with the introduction of Mac OS X...
 

networkman

macrumors regular
Jan 1, 2002
247
0
california, usa
the sad thing is that if os x gets anywhere and cuts into microsoft's share of the desktop market, bill may come in again with money and bribe steve

maybe steve is bill's slave as some hardcore mac fanatics consipire on the net
 

Kid Red

macrumors 65816
Dec 14, 2001
1,379
87
Of interest Jobs and Apple are also aware that they are now one of the largest Unix vendors around... and with that comes new opportunities. Interest in Apple in the unix/dev community has really peaked with the introduction of Mac OS X...
Does this mean we might actually get some fricking app support? Seems no one cares about the mac anymore, bastards!
 

Gelfin

macrumors 68020
Sep 18, 2001
2,166
4
Denver, CO
Originally posted by Kid Red
Does this mean we might actually get some fricking app support? Seems no one cares about the mac anymore, bastards!
Hunh. And here it seems to me like support for the Mac is growing like it hasn't done in I don't know when. Slowly, to be sure, but it's happening. Until about six months ago, I don't think I ever saw an article that started, "I'm a die-hard PC user, but I checked out Mac OS X and [insert complimentary review here]." Now it seems like every other week there's a new article exactly like that.

Considering what a major change in direction OS X represents, the software is practically flooding in. Trust me, the conversion from Classic to OS X is going MUCH faster than the conversion from 16 to 32-bit Windows did (actually, since Windows Me -still- had some of the vestigal 16-bit code base, you might say they only just now finished the process, seven years later). Most of the major apps you'd need are either available or on the way, and the gaming area at MWSF was HUGE. I'd say it was at least three times last year's size.

Stick with your Mac, and give it a little time. Jeez, I'm going to sound like a marketing drone here, but this is probably the best time ever to be a Mac user. Apple's done a lot of very big things very right in the last couple of years, and it seems like it's all starting to finally come together. Just have to wait for enough of "the 95%" to notice.
 

Proton

macrumors newbie
Feb 8, 2002
6
0
Mac - Pc...

Well I'm currently a window user, I strayed from the path to go to windows 4 - windows 2000 - and now windows xp... what a load of crap... I'ts like a facelift gone bad. I like my system pretty with all the bells and whistles I can find, but with windows xp they did all that but forgott to think first. I love mac and have allways been looking back to see if what's happening, will there be a time when I will look back and say it's time to return to my cult? Whell gues what. I've been following the succes of X and let me tell you it didn't start of so great, but now.... wow. This digital hup idea is great, Unix rocks... Windows XP may have done alot to change the gap between usability and look and feel, but common they havent scratched the surfice of X... X seem extreemly staple. It's fast and gorgeas...

Would you trust a system that can't even remember what kind of icon should be assotiated with an app? I mean sometime when I'-m working I look at my quick launch bar and to my dismay I see some of the icons have changed?? This sometimes happens on the desktop to. It seams that this is a huge problem. XP is sold on the fact that it's richer in graphics and is robust... yeh right.... thats why I get the blue screen all the time..
The fact that the system is so badly written for the visualy loving.
Try this. In windows xp go to Display prop. go to appearans. then go to advanced... I'm not retarded so I want my quick launch bar to be slimmer, and by doing that I totaly **** up the lush icons.. would this happen on a mac... no...why ... Theyre not retards.

Well I could go on and tell you endless stories....

Thanks Bill & thanks Ballmer for showing me how stupid I have been to listen to your brain dead scouts of the Microsoft monapoly.

Steve I coming back...
iMac is astounding, dual is great.... But I want G5.
Keep on the good work steve.... apple 1 Microsucks 0
 

b8rtm8nn

macrumors member
Dec 13, 2001
34
0
In complete agreement. XP Home is an improvement for the common man that is clueless about machines - compared to Millenium. But XP Pro is a joke! I actually think it is slower than 2000 in real work relaed tasks. And the fact that crappy interface is on by default really irks me.

The Unix core has enabled me to recommend Macs to coworkers and end users alike. OSX is beautiful and even if it is rough around the edges, it is ten fold more stable than OS9 or below. I just cannot wait to see the future changes to Server X and related HW, I might actually put one in production if they keep the improvements up.
 
XP

I now alot of windows people and none of them have gone to XP. If Microsoft keeps releasing apps that are upgrades to XP then everyone will switch to Mac after Win 2000 becomes old. They don't want to use the XP crap it shouldn't be long before we see more converts.

___________________________
Not all who wander are lost.
 

agreenster

macrumors 68000
Dec 6, 2001
1,892
2
Walt Disney Animation Studios
mmmm-kay back to the subject.....

I think Steve is making a big mistake for not pursuing the entertainment market.

Imagine if you will....its May of 2004 (or '03) and the average consumer gets home from a long day at work. He/she eats dinner with their family/wife/ husband, or kids, and afterwards decide to kick back and enjoy some evening entertainment.

Instead of just hittin' the couch and the remote to randomly surf, they launch their iMac, more specifically -iTheater, connect via the internet to whatever movie, sports game, or TV show that has played in the last 48 hours, or is in their 'favorite movie' download folder on their desktop. Then, it is streamed via infared or AirPort (or whatever will be out by that time) to their 60 inch SONY-plasma HDTV, where they then hit the couch and grab their Apple remote, which controls the iMac that is in the den three rooms away. Coupled with their Harman Kardon surround-sound system, they have a true home theater.

If they dont do it, Microsoft will. Its the Holy Grail of home computers, and Apple has repeatedly denied the idea of venturing into this market. The only thing that makes me feel better is Steve Job's statement that there are still lots of suprises in store for Apple. I sure as he|| hope this is it.
 

agreenster

macrumors 68000
Dec 6, 2001
1,892
2
Walt Disney Animation Studios
Okay, its understandable to be pessimistic--point taken.

But honestly, most of the technology is already there. MPEG4 movies are EVERYWHERE online, HD's are certainly big enough to hold compressed (or somtimes uncompressed) movies, TiVo has proven that it can be practical, and digitally recording broadcast TV is done all the time at people's homes. AirPort can stream. Wireless mice are everywhere, and thats could easily be transferred to a remote control.

Whats left? The signal between the TV and the iMac seems like the biggest hurdle, but if Apple and Sony worked together, or worked a deal, I bet it could be done with a quickness.

2004? Why not? Thats two years away. I thought I was being generous.
 

agreenster

macrumors 68000
Dec 6, 2001
1,892
2
Walt Disney Animation Studios
Good freakin-grief. Thats not my point. Did I say somewhere in my posts that EVERYONE should do NOTHING but sit and watch TV? Man, I dont mean to get upset, but for creep's sakes-I was just making a scenario where people could use their f*cking iMac as a home entertainment hub. What, do you think people DONT watch TV? God. I'm as big of a 'get out and do something' advocate as the next person, but lets not deny the fact that people WATCH movies, and LISTEN to music, and enjoy the arts. (term used loosely)

Besides, we are talking about MAC here- quit changing the subject. Gimme a break. This forum thread is about the MAC being a entertainment hub, not a discussion about the laziness and obeisity of America. Jesus man, if you want that, go to "ILoveMountainBiking.com" Dont bring it here.

I know Im coming off as a total *ss here, but c'mon. Im just advocating the iMac as an entertainment hub, and no one seems to want to make any comments--just changing the subject. Who freakin' cares if its 2004 or 3004--or whether or not it is 'good for the family.' What do you think about the IDEA people?
 

blakespot

Administrator
Jun 4, 2000
1,316
49
Alexandria, VA
Originally posted by Gelfin


Hunh. And here it seems to me like support for the Mac is growing like it hasn't done in I don't know when. Slowly, to be sure, but it's happening. Until about six months ago, I don't think I ever saw an article that started, "I'm a die-hard PC user, but I checked out Mac OS X and [insert complimentary review here]." Now it seems like every other week there's a new article exactly like that.

Considering what a major change in direction OS X represents, the software is practically flooding in. Trust me, the conversion from Classic to OS X is going MUCH faster than the conversion from 16 to 32-bit Windows did (actually, since Windows Me -still- had some of the vestigal 16-bit code base, you might say they only just now finished the process, seven years later). Most of the major apps you'd need are either available or on the way, and the gaming area at MWSF was HUGE. I'd say it was at least three times last year's size.

Stick with your Mac, and give it a little time. Jeez, I'm going to sound like a marketing drone here, but this is probably the best time ever to be a Mac user. Apple's done a lot of very big things very right in the last couple of years, and it seems like it's all starting to finally come together. Just have to wait for enough of "the 95%" to notice.

Well said, Gelfin.


blakespot
 
S

StuPid QPid

Guest
Apple Workstations?

What with Steve emphasizing UNIX in MacOSX, does this mean we can expect an Apple Branded Workstation sometime in the near future?
What with the acquisitions of some of these previously UNIX based movie software companies, this may make sense. This could be a nice, profitable niche market to enter, competing with SGI, Sun etc. This would make infinitely more sense than trying to enter the already crowded and loss-making PDA market.
With the G5 coming sometime this year, I could see the opportunity to offer a OS X based top-range ?quad model workstation. As a workstation, Apple could also afford to up their margins little...
Anyway, just thinking aloud....
 
U

Unregistered

Guest
So what are we calling a workstation these days? Does my new DP800 qualify? It's certainly faster than my sun "workstation" on my desk at work (and a *lot* more stylish to boot).

These days when someone says workstation I just envision a slower pizza box with a larger price tag...I'd trade my sun workstation for a mac anytime!

Now, what I would really like to see is a rack mount server version running OS X Server. I think that's what will make it possible to move some macs into the mainstream computing environment.
 

agreenster

macrumors 68000
Dec 6, 2001
1,892
2
Walt Disney Animation Studios
Not bad

Glad to see someone not say that Apple runs the movie studios--it is an SGI world out there. Its also no suprise that Steve's other company, Pixar, is ALL SGI and Unix (and the occasional IBM Workstation for Maya-they use proprietary software for animation -all in Unix- though).

It WILL be interesting to see if a 64bit G5 Quad Workstation will be available for high-high-high end users, once OSX is caught up to BeOS and Linux. It's close, but still has some bugs to work out. I know OSX will never BE Linux or BeOS, but compatible enough so that power users in the Animation/Movie industry will be able to incorporate OSX into their pipeline very efficiently, without stopping production.

I wonder if it's Steve's agenda to eventually get Pixar to move solely to Apple? Im not sure thats a good move, but who knows? Pixar seems to be setting the standard in the world of 3D computing, especially with their rendering software, RenderMan. Everyone uses RenderMan. I'd love to see THAT ported to the Mac. The day that happens, Apple could be very widely used in the studios.
 

OSeXy!

macrumors regular
Jan 17, 2002
239
0
London (or virtually here)
best of both worlds?

I like what Steve is doing... And I think both 'consumer' and 'pro' markets potentially have more in common than some like to believe.

The point of 'true' workstations is that they can be scaled up and/or reconfigured easily, as needed. The Unix-OS X/PPC combo looks great here. Already people are discovering how easy it is to put together ad-hoc renderfarms of G4s and G3s in combination under OS X. Much easier than Linux, where machines typically need to be equally matched for the chain to function properly...

But the PPC's other major plus-point is its miserly power consumption in relation to its computing power. As I understand it this fact (and many other things) makes it a great chip for 'embedding' in consumer products.

Now combine the two: instead of a lab or a graphics house, substitute an ordinary house, full of not just networked, but interlaced gadgets which know how to work together. Whatever new product you add to the matrix is 'recognised' by all the others, and can interact with them on an equal footing...

That reality is a couple of years away. But I'll bet "GigaWire", or whatever the new wireless protocol turns out to be, makes both possible -- high end and low. PPC 85xx chips will be developed for both, and will transform both...

Please! GO FOR IT APPLE!
 
U

Unregistered

Guest
mac rack mounts

Speaking of Mac rack mount equimpment ( and its actual near total non existence) I would like to put out a dream spec of a rack mac that would be able to compete in the server and cluster markets.

1 It should be updated to replace the current tower and be designed to serve for both tower and rack.

2: It should offer a drop down front panel and behind that it should have accessible up to 6 hot swappable 3.5 inch drives to accomadate all kinds of raid configurations.

3: The front view width and height should not change much but the depth should change to allow more modularization of the insides.

4: The motherboard should allow the modular addition of cpu modules. These modules should be dual processors have have local main memory of at least 4 slots of DDR266 at least. The motherboard should accept from 1 to 4 of these cpu modules.

4A: Based upon the trendline of performance of the current dual 1Gig systems that should be capable of between 6 and 15 Gigaflops, the projected G5 systems should be capable of 10 to 20 Gigs at 1 Gigahertz, a Quad system should deliver 20-40 Gigaflops and if the systems can get to 2.5 Gigahertz then a quad could perform at 50-100 Gigs. 2, 7 foot rackmounts of these and you can have a Teraflop Mac

5: The motherboard should act as the IO distributor . The pci bus should become PCIX with 4 slots of 64bit/66 Mhz, 2 slots of 64 bit/100 MHZ and 1 slot of 64 bit/133 Mhz, 7 slots. There should be 2 AGP video slots. There should be 2 Giga ethernet, 4 1394B Firewire and 4 USB2 ports + airportX.

6: The power supply should be modular with hot swappable N+1 sections.

7: The main case should contain all components and the lid should have none. The current case is 17x 9 x 18.4 inches. It should go to about 17x9x24 inches to meet these changes.

If Apple could deliver a decent crate that would be functionally competitive in the server and cluster arenas then the Unix part of OSX could really gain a foothold.
 

kablooie

macrumors newbie
Feb 8, 2002
3
0
Isn't it ironic that the computer designed specifically for non-technical users is becoming popular with the uber-technical Unix users.
 

agreenster

macrumors 68000
Dec 6, 2001
1,892
2
Walt Disney Animation Studios
Dont forget, in order for a computer for to be user-friendly, you have to have really smart, nerdy people making them that way........computers dont work by magic. There's still code in there....Ü Its just that now Unix is the new, better toy.

By the way, are you familiar with 'Hamster Huey and the Gooey Kablooie?' Points for anyone who knows where thats from.......
 

cryptochrome

macrumors regular
Jan 4, 2002
123
0
I find Steve's recent comments to be perplexing. He's made a big fuss over the whole mac-as-the-digital-hub-of-your-digital-lifestyle thing, which he is delivering with the iApps, but not the iProducts. People watch TV more than just about anything else, but apple isn't working on on an iBox that will work with your set. People need their data and communicate on the road sometimes, but apple isn't working on an iPDA or iMobile. Which part of my digital lifestyle ARE they addressing?

Saying the market isn't developed for a particular product isn't a very good reason for not pursuing it. I thought apple was supposed to be the great innovator, trailblazer, and packager. Creating markets where there were none before, developing new technologies, and turning promising applications into really useful ones.

Maybe it's true that apple is working on a portable device that can do PDA things but is mostly about interacting with your computer remotely, which they're not calling a PDA due to Steve's semantics. I hope so. Leading professional markets like science and entertainment is great, but if they're going to talk digital lifestyle they'd better do more than iPod. They risk being left behind when Microsoft and Sony come out with their next generation game consoles, which are going to be serious TV convergence boxes (Games, Music, DVD, PVR, and Internet). It was no coincidence that the UltimateTV developers moved over to the Xbox team. All the more reason to team up with Sony I guess - except they are their primary competition.
 

cryptochrome

macrumors regular
Jan 4, 2002
123
0
Originally posted by agreenster
Dont forget, in order for a computer for to be user-friendly, you have to have really smart, nerdy people making them that way........computers dont work by magic. There's still code in there....Ü Its just that now Unix is the new, better toy.

By the way, are you familiar with 'Hamster Huey and the Gooey Kablooie?' Points for anyone who knows where thats from.......
Calvin and Hobbes, of course.
 
S

StuPid QPid

Guest
Originally posted by agreenster
By the way, are you familiar with 'Hamster Huey and the Gooey Kablooie?' Points for anyone who knows where thats from.......
Why, it's Calvin's favorite bedtime read...