i see your point, i just hate to buy a product that has been unchanged for 5 years in its last year.
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are you less likely to buy a pro now (rumors)
- Thread starter tim100
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i see your point, i just hate to buy a product that has been unchanged for 5 years in its last year.
I'm not due to buy a new computer anytime soon anyway (current MBP is only a year old this coming April). But as others have said it is a matter of need vs. want. I buy what I need when I need it.
For example, my iPhone 3GS broke (dropped it, screen shattered, was unusuable...little shards of glass would come off while I navigated the touch-screen, LOL). I bought the iPhone 4 even though I knew the 4GS was coming up pretty soon. I needed a phone so I bought it. No regrets.
For example, my iPhone 3GS broke (dropped it, screen shattered, was unusuable...little shards of glass would come off while I navigated the touch-screen, LOL). I bought the iPhone 4 even though I knew the 4GS was coming up pretty soon. I needed a phone so I bought it. No regrets.
I just bought a high spec - 2.5ghz i7, 750GB 7200rpm, Hires AG - 15in Pro two weeks ago and don't regret it one bit. Why? I need discrete graphics, multiple drives (I now have a SSD + the 750GB drive), and upgradeable RAM (I have 16GB now, and will have 32GB when 16GB dimms become more available).
Essentially, I need a mobile workstation. And always have, a long string of machines dating back to the pair of a IBM A30p and a 500mhz TiBook.
I would have jumped on an air if they had discrete graphics and upgradeable ram. I would be able to live with the lack of additional storage and lack of antiglare screen, but I can't live with the soldered RAM and Intel graphics. Any video editor will tell you the same.
So if Apple revamps the "pro" line with what they are saying they will I will buy a Macbook - another Pro to replace my WhiteBook, likely the low-end 15in with a HR AG panel. It may seem excessive but the WhiteBook is basically my "home computer" and the Pro is my on-the-go workhorse that I hope to get 5 years out of.
Anyway I doubt Apple would drop the pro line. I've had Macs since 2001 (TiBook 500, iBook 500, AlBook 1.67, Mini, WhiteBook, Pro), and I think with every consumer revision there's talk of the Pro line being melded into it, but it's never really happened.
I hope not, as well both for my wallet and for my longevity of laptops. I had the TiBook until the 1.67ghz 12in AlBook came out, and had the AlBook until I bought the WhiteBook. I had a series of PC laptops (A30p, T43p, Dell 8600, T61p, Dell D620, and HP 8440p) along the line that were doing the heavy lifting, but man am I glad to be back to having my high-end workhorse being a Mac. If you couldn't tell I had a LOT of PC's during that period...
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Agreed. The AG panel is the most gorgeous laptop panel I've laid my eyes on, maybe second only to RGBLED panels on the Lenovo W520. If it's discontinued, I'll buy another one before it rides off into the sunset.
Essentially, I need a mobile workstation. And always have, a long string of machines dating back to the pair of a IBM A30p and a 500mhz TiBook.
I would have jumped on an air if they had discrete graphics and upgradeable ram. I would be able to live with the lack of additional storage and lack of antiglare screen, but I can't live with the soldered RAM and Intel graphics. Any video editor will tell you the same.
So if Apple revamps the "pro" line with what they are saying they will I will buy a Macbook - another Pro to replace my WhiteBook, likely the low-end 15in with a HR AG panel. It may seem excessive but the WhiteBook is basically my "home computer" and the Pro is my on-the-go workhorse that I hope to get 5 years out of.
Anyway I doubt Apple would drop the pro line. I've had Macs since 2001 (TiBook 500, iBook 500, AlBook 1.67, Mini, WhiteBook, Pro), and I think with every consumer revision there's talk of the Pro line being melded into it, but it's never really happened.
I hope not, as well both for my wallet and for my longevity of laptops. I had the TiBook until the 1.67ghz 12in AlBook came out, and had the AlBook until I bought the WhiteBook. I had a series of PC laptops (A30p, T43p, Dell 8600, T61p, Dell D620, and HP 8440p) along the line that were doing the heavy lifting, but man am I glad to be back to having my high-end workhorse being a Mac. If you couldn't tell I had a LOT of PC's during that period...
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Agreed. The AG panel is the most gorgeous laptop panel I've laid my eyes on, maybe second only to RGBLED panels on the Lenovo W520. If it's discontinued, I'll buy another one before it rides off into the sunset.
No. I want to buy the latest and greatest model at the time. I guess there's going to be talk about Haswell being released next year when the Ivy Bridge stuff and things is done and dusted. Uh, I hope these rumours are true and are not true.
Apart of me wants the MBP now, but apart of me wants to wait.
I could buy a 13" Macbook Pro but that doesn't suit my needs one bit.
Tricky situation.
Apart of me wants the MBP now, but apart of me wants to wait.
I could buy a 13" Macbook Pro but that doesn't suit my needs one bit.
Tricky situation.
I'm concerned whether the new MBP13 will be discontinued. (This is my preferred screen size and power balance).
If they do discontinue it, I could live with the new 13" Air Salad Dicer if the RAM/SSD were user upgradeable. (But I'm going to bet it won't be).
If they do discontinue it, I could live with the new 13" Air Salad Dicer if the RAM/SSD were user upgradeable. (But I'm going to bet it won't be).
There's so much truth in this statement right here. I don't see it happening with Apple just yet though.
I will be purchasing one of the new 15" MBP's, and I have a feeling it is going to be a lot better than most are expecting at this point from all of the Air talk going around lately. I think the bottom line people need to look at is, will it be more powerful than the previous model, will it have better graphics than the previous model, will it supply as many ports as last years model, will memory be expandable, will storage be expandable? I think Apple will hit the mark on every single one of these items. Oh, and it will be thinner too? Hey, that's a nice plus to me.
Careful what you hope for. We MBP13 users took a GPU downgrade. If Apple would do this to their #1 selling MBP don't believe they won't compromise the 15 and 17 models (if ever so slightly). Now... if we were talking about an iPad or iPhone? That's different.
Another problem will be the likelihood the new macbook line will be "sealed". Think about it... in order to get these things pancake thin with some power all kinds of crap will need to be crammed into every nook and cranny. (They don't want you inside the Air's, iPhones and iPads for this reason).
Nothing to base this on mind you... just trying to think like an Apple accountant who just convinced Tim that the designers and engineers are wrong.
I think one thing that everyone forgets is heat output.
Thinner is great, but at what cost? Just how much hotter will the MBP be because of the lack of ventilation space inside? The MBP isn't an Air, it's a powerhouse machine, and even the best performing machines can't perform optimally if it can't efficiently cool itself. Currently, that's the biggest glare I'm giving the rumors.
If Apple found the magic balance between optimal heat output to size-cut, then by all means let's speed the production process up already. But if they're sacrificing performance (just because it has better specs with better performance doesn't mean it's performing optimally) for size, then I'd rather get the current MBP.
Thinner is great, but at what cost? Just how much hotter will the MBP be because of the lack of ventilation space inside? The MBP isn't an Air, it's a powerhouse machine, and even the best performing machines can't perform optimally if it can't efficiently cool itself. Currently, that's the biggest glare I'm giving the rumors.
If Apple found the magic balance between optimal heat output to size-cut, then by all means let's speed the production process up already. But if they're sacrificing performance (just because it has better specs with better performance doesn't mean it's performing optimally) for size, then I'd rather get the current MBP.
When upgrade time rolls around, which won't be forna while yet, i will take a hard look at both e MBP and the MBA. If Apple are making an MBA with a 15" screen, and a high capacity SSD, then I would but that over the Pro 17" I use now.
On the contrary. The IB chips will run cooler. The question isn't the CPU and heat (not from me anyway). It's what other compromises they will make just to get them thinner.
Intel graphics on a 15" and 17" perhaps? :eek
Not yet.
You're assuming the Air/MBP lines won't merge. You're also assuming Apple really wants to make inroads in the laptop arena. I'm betting they don't really care as they've got their hands full just staying #1 in the phone/tablet market. (iOS is at least 70% of their revenue).
On the contrary. The IB chips will run cooler. The question isn't the CPU and heat (not from me anyway). It's what other compromises they will make just to get them thinner.
Intel graphics on a 15" and 17" perhaps? :eek
Not yet.
I get that the odds of drastic under performance are low because of thinner size, but as a casual gamer that plays games like LoL and SC2, ventilation is pretty big on my list.
Also, I must reiterate what I wrote before: just because it has better specs with better performance doesn't mean it's performing optimally. The IB chips will no doubt run cooler but the bonus might not be evident (or be minimal) if the thinner size is going to work against it.
I would like to share my thoughts as a Pro user. I do not say this lightly or in any kind of an arrogant way. I simply mean Pro user in the context of somebody who does high-end work. Personally, I have multiple VMs going at the same time, I use PS on TIFF images, I have Eclipse, Xcode, and VS (in VMW) running at the same time. I probably also have three or four different browsers open along with various other tools (Text Wrangler, Navicat, etc). Lastly, I use my MBP for work. I also enjoy using it but it is a high-end, precision tool, that I use to accomplish some sophisticated tasks. I know my work, I know my needs, and I know what I need from my tools.
I think many of us in the Pro category have seen Apple shrink away from the Pro stance of yesteryear as they have found fortune and success living in the consumer world. There is nothing wrong with that and they deserve all of their success.
At one time the Mac line was Apple's focus and they truly made some high-end notebooks that the Pro field respected. This has somewhat eroded with the rise of iOS and the merger of features from iOS into OS X (though the same core OS).
I do not feel the MBA is designed for high-end work. With the limits on ports, CPU, memory, and HD space, it seems more for a consumer based user on the go. Again, nothing wrong with that, but a tool that does not meet my needs or requirements.
A 15" or 17" MBA with a new CPU but reduced features is not something that I am interested in. I suspect many other here in the Pro field would feel the same. My biggest concerned isn't weight or thickness or a fast SSD (with little space) so the main selling point of a MBA like Pro machine would be lost on me. Again, I suspect other Pros would feel the same.
I very much enjoy my MBP and it is a wonderful tool to work with. However, I am also a person that can easily move between OS X and Windows without missing a beat. I currently enjoy Windows 7 as much as I enjoy OS X. Truth be told, I wish I could merge them to get all the features I like and enjoy into one OS.
I cannot speak for others here but I am interested in Windows 8 running on Windows 8 notebooks with Kinect 2.0 cameras. I like many of the features so far in Windows 8 and am interested in seeing where MS goes with this by the end of the year. I am also interested in the rumors of Kinect 2.0 cameras augmenting the Windows UI on those notebooks.
So, when Apple releases a new notebook I will have to review its features and weigh it against what I have and what is coming out from MS et al. I felt the 2011 MBP was a great update for Apple with some really solid features. We'll have to see how 2012 plays out.
If Apple would do a MBA Pro machine with reduced ports and options I still think it would be a big seller for them as they would fit right into the consumer marketplace. Though, I would be looking elsewhere for my next purchase.
-P
I think many of us in the Pro category have seen Apple shrink away from the Pro stance of yesteryear as they have found fortune and success living in the consumer world. There is nothing wrong with that and they deserve all of their success.
At one time the Mac line was Apple's focus and they truly made some high-end notebooks that the Pro field respected. This has somewhat eroded with the rise of iOS and the merger of features from iOS into OS X (though the same core OS).
I do not feel the MBA is designed for high-end work. With the limits on ports, CPU, memory, and HD space, it seems more for a consumer based user on the go. Again, nothing wrong with that, but a tool that does not meet my needs or requirements.
A 15" or 17" MBA with a new CPU but reduced features is not something that I am interested in. I suspect many other here in the Pro field would feel the same. My biggest concerned isn't weight or thickness or a fast SSD (with little space) so the main selling point of a MBA like Pro machine would be lost on me. Again, I suspect other Pros would feel the same.
I very much enjoy my MBP and it is a wonderful tool to work with. However, I am also a person that can easily move between OS X and Windows without missing a beat. I currently enjoy Windows 7 as much as I enjoy OS X. Truth be told, I wish I could merge them to get all the features I like and enjoy into one OS.
I cannot speak for others here but I am interested in Windows 8 running on Windows 8 notebooks with Kinect 2.0 cameras. I like many of the features so far in Windows 8 and am interested in seeing where MS goes with this by the end of the year. I am also interested in the rumors of Kinect 2.0 cameras augmenting the Windows UI on those notebooks.
So, when Apple releases a new notebook I will have to review its features and weigh it against what I have and what is coming out from MS et al. I felt the 2011 MBP was a great update for Apple with some really solid features. We'll have to see how 2012 plays out.
If Apple would do a MBA Pro machine with reduced ports and options I still think it would be a big seller for them as they would fit right into the consumer marketplace. Though, I would be looking elsewhere for my next purchase.
-P
Whether or not the rumor turns out to be true is of little consequence to me. I don't plan to buy another laptop for at least 3 years.
But in the event that my current laptop must be replaced, it will not be Apple. I simply don't care for the small and thin form factor at the expense of everything else.
But in the event that my current laptop must be replaced, it will not be Apple. I simply don't care for the small and thin form factor at the expense of everything else.
It's not small and thin at the expense of ANYTHING. Do you really think Apple is going to cripple these notebooks? Really?
They're going to remove the nearly-useless optical drive. That ALONE will give them enough leeway to thin out the design. It'll become tapered, lose the ethernet port and gain some power or battery life with the space gained from nixing the optical drive. It'll be a sleeker, slightly thinner and much more refined notebook with better battery life and, in my opinion, it'll be a sight for sore eyes. It's about time the notebooks have physically changed. It's a great design but EVERYONE has one.
If you can't figure out how to acquire disk images of your legitimate software online, please learn because it's very, very easy. It also costs about $40 for a quality external disc drive for occasional use. Why cripple an entire design over it? We're moving past it.
They're going to remove the nearly-useless optical drive. That ALONE will give them enough leeway to thin out the design. It'll become tapered, lose the ethernet port and gain some power or battery life with the space gained from nixing the optical drive. It'll be a sleeker, slightly thinner and much more refined notebook with better battery life and, in my opinion, it'll be a sight for sore eyes. It's about time the notebooks have physically changed. It's a great design but EVERYONE has one.
If you can't figure out how to acquire disk images of your legitimate software online, please learn because it's very, very easy. It also costs about $40 for a quality external disc drive for occasional use. Why cripple an entire design over it? We're moving past it.
Pentad makes some excellent points which I totally agree with. For the most part, I can work in Windows 7 or OS X but I prefer to work in OS X because I just find it somehow more comfortable and convenient. I also have a large texture and photo library which I manage through Aperture and it would be a pain to shift all that over to Windows....Along with my iTunes library which is also quite substantial.
I'm a 3D graphics artist and for the foreseeable future, we will always need bleeding edge technology, bags of RAM and big hard drives. Workstations do lend themselves somewhat more than Laptops to my kind of work but for the last 4 or 5 years, it has been feasible to work around the limitations of a portable which has opened doors for me with new clients who want me in the office but for whom I don't want to drag in my workstation.
But I'm realistic enough to recognize that what I do is niche. If it weren't for the gaming industry pushing and gamers themselves for the same advances that I need, we'd still be in the land of Silicon Graphics workstations that you need to remortgage the house in order to own one.
My concern is that Microsoft don't go exclusively after the same facebook / twitter users with Windows 8 that Apple have and make the same mistake of forgetting about the professionals who actually make quality content for the hordes to consume on their Macbook Airs and iPads. I don't mean this in a derogatory way....Computers are demonstrably fast enough now to cater for the needs of casual users who just want to surf, watch movies and keep in touch, occasionally do some admin stuff and I'm fine with that. But not all of us are in that target audience. We need the hardware and the software to keep pushing back the frontiers.
I'm loving my late 2011 MBP that is maxed out on CPU speed, RAM, HD and GPU. It is in some cases faster than my 2008 Mac Pro for 3D work which is awesome. And it runs Snow Leopard so I have a fast machine that can do all the stuff I've been doing over the last few years with no compromises. But I feel like I'm living on borrowed time, like this could be my last Mac Laptop that can meet my needs and that the next move is going to have to be something like a Lenovo, a decent Vaio or something else with decent build quality and reputation.
We'll see I guess.
I'm a 3D graphics artist and for the foreseeable future, we will always need bleeding edge technology, bags of RAM and big hard drives. Workstations do lend themselves somewhat more than Laptops to my kind of work but for the last 4 or 5 years, it has been feasible to work around the limitations of a portable which has opened doors for me with new clients who want me in the office but for whom I don't want to drag in my workstation.
But I'm realistic enough to recognize that what I do is niche. If it weren't for the gaming industry pushing and gamers themselves for the same advances that I need, we'd still be in the land of Silicon Graphics workstations that you need to remortgage the house in order to own one.
My concern is that Microsoft don't go exclusively after the same facebook / twitter users with Windows 8 that Apple have and make the same mistake of forgetting about the professionals who actually make quality content for the hordes to consume on their Macbook Airs and iPads. I don't mean this in a derogatory way....Computers are demonstrably fast enough now to cater for the needs of casual users who just want to surf, watch movies and keep in touch, occasionally do some admin stuff and I'm fine with that. But not all of us are in that target audience. We need the hardware and the software to keep pushing back the frontiers.
I'm loving my late 2011 MBP that is maxed out on CPU speed, RAM, HD and GPU. It is in some cases faster than my 2008 Mac Pro for 3D work which is awesome. And it runs Snow Leopard so I have a fast machine that can do all the stuff I've been doing over the last few years with no compromises. But I feel like I'm living on borrowed time, like this could be my last Mac Laptop that can meet my needs and that the next move is going to have to be something like a Lenovo, a decent Vaio or something else with decent build quality and reputation.
We'll see I guess.
I went with the late 2011 15 MBP, as it's exactly what I wanted and there was no guarantee the redesigned MBPs would be.
I agree with a lot of what has been said, but I don't think Apple will cut off its nose despite its face on this one. The new MBP may lose its optical drive, but I think it'll outperform the current MBP in every other way and continue to be a market leading notebook in its class. Very much doubt Apple is going to hand over a customer segment to the likes of Lenovo.
I agree with a lot of what has been said, but I don't think Apple will cut off its nose despite its face on this one. The new MBP may lose its optical drive, but I think it'll outperform the current MBP in every other way and continue to be a market leading notebook in its class. Very much doubt Apple is going to hand over a customer segment to the likes of Lenovo.