AT&T Cracking Down on Unauthorized Tethering

[LegendKillerUK]

Please point that out in the contract, know it all.

Guess what, it isn't there.

Go look up the word Unlimited in the dictionary. Internalize and understand it. Come back here when you're done. Then come into a court room. Id like to sit back watch you (as I will eventually be watching AT&T) dance around the clear and concise definition of the word.

I've engaged in long, drawn out discussions with my legal pals about this very issue for several years, and they all agree it would completely impossible for AT&T to get out of court unscathed over this word "Unlimited"

Most of you people don't grasp the significance of the word in this case, which is not at all surprising given the crowd. (young and/or naive).

Most also think that because AT&T includes fine print in a contract, they can enforce it however they wish...which of course is a laughable fantasy to anyone who has sat through the first day of contract law.

y so mad?

I look forward to reading about your success against AT&T in the near future. Based on your immature responses I think we all have our answer on that.

 

[samcraig]

Please point that out in the contract, know it all.

Guess what, it isn't there.

Go look up the word Unlimited in the dictionary. Internalize and understand it. Come back here when you're done. Then come into a court room. Id like to sit back watch you (as I will eventually be watching AT&T) dance around the clear and concise definition of the word.

I've engaged in long, drawn out discussions with my legal pals about this very issue for several years, and they all agree it would completely impossible for AT&T to get out of court unscathed over this word "Unlimited"

Most of you people don't grasp the significance of the word in this case, which is not at all surprising given the crowd. (young and/or naive).

Most also think that because AT&T includes fine print in a contract, they can enforce it however they wish...which of course is a laughable fantasy to anyone who has sat through the first day of contract law.

Go look up the words: entitlement, spoiled, ignorance and unfounded

 

[pmz]

FAIL

6.2 What Are The Intended Purposes Of The Wireless Data Service?
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Except as may otherwise be specifically permitted or prohibited for select data plans, data sessions may be conducted only for the following purposes: (i) Internet browsing; (ii) email; and (iii) intranet access (including access to corporate intranets, email, and individual productivity applications like customer relationship management, sales force, and field service automation). While most common uses for Internet browsing, email and intranet access are permitted by your data plan, there are certain uses that cause extreme network capacity issues and interference with the network and are therefore prohibited. Examples of prohibited uses include, without limitation, the following: (i) server devices or host computer applications, including, but not limited to, Web camera posts or broadcasts, automatic data feeds, automated machine-to-machine connections or peer-to-peer (P2P) file sharing; (ii) as a substitute or backup for private lines, wireline s or full-time or dedicated data connections; (iii) "auto-responders," "cancel-bots," or similar automated or manual routines which generate excessive amounts of net traffic, or which disrupt net user groups or email use by others; (iv) "spam" or unsolicited commercial or bulk email (or activities that have the effect of facilitating unsolicited commercial email or unsolicited bulk email); (v) any activity that adversely affects the ability of other people or systems to use either AT&T's wireless services or other parties' Internet-based resources, including "denial of service" (DoS) attacks against another network host or individual user; (vi) accessing, or attempting to access without authority, the accounts of others, or to penetrate, or attempt to penetrate, security measures of AT&T's wireless network or another entity's network or systems; (vii) software or other devices that maintain continuous active Internet connections when a computer's connection would otherwise be idle or any "keep alive" functions, unless they adhere to AT&T's data retry requirements, which may be changed from time to time. This means, by way of example only, that checking email, surfing the Internet, downloading legally acquired songs, and/or visiting corporate intranets is permitted, but downloading movies using P2P file sharing services, redirecting television signals for viewing on Personal Computers, web broadcasting, and/or for the operation of servers, telemetry devices and/or Supervisory Control and Data Acquisition devices is prohibited. Furthermore, plans (unless specifically designated for tethering usage) cannot be used for any applications that tether the device (through use of, including without limitation, connection kits, other phone/smartphone to computer accessories, BLUETOOTH® or any other wireless technology) to Personal Computers (including without limitation, laptops), or other equipment for any purpose. Accordingly, AT&T reserves the right to (i) deny, disconnect, modify and/or terminate Service, without notice, to anyone it believes is using the Service in any manner prohibited or whose usage adversely impacts its wireless network or service levels or hinders access to its wireless network, including without limitation, after a significant period of inactivity or after sessions of excessive usage and (ii) otherwise protect its wireless network from harm, compromised capacity or degradation in performance, which may impact legitimate data flows. You may not send solicitations to AT&T's wireless subscribers without their consent. You may not use the Services other than as intended by AT&T and applicable law. Plans are for individual, non-commercial use only and are not for resale. AT&T may, but is not required to, monitor your compliance, or the compliance of other subscribers, with AT&T's terms, conditions, or policies.

LOL and you believe that would hold up in court against the significance of the word "Unlimited"?

You are Flat Out Wrong. AT&T would hold up their fine print. The prosecution would wave it away, and so would the judge. It happens every day, and only most uninformed of legal amateurs are unaware of this.

 

[spaceballl]

To be honest, I'm not too upset by this. I've used an iPhone for tethering via jailbreak long before the official support came. I did that fully knowing that I was breaking the rules, and that ATT might mess with me, but they didn't offer an official plan so I knew the risks. I still jailbreak my phone and use MyWi, but I pay for an official tethering plan so I'm not breaking the rules.

 

[Howdr]

And stop making silly assumptions about subjects you know nothing about.

I've had an iPhone for a few years now and have unlimited data.

You made the comment Unlimted should be charged extra not me

It's a very clear line to me and many/most people who aren't so stubborn to think of the big picture.

I'm not sure you can speak for "most"

You can only use x amount of data a month using your phone if you're on an unlimited plan. Realistically - even if you're eating as much as you can - there's a "limit" you can reach. Not because of ATT - but because of what your phone can actually access/handle. ATT's bean counters multiply/average out typical usage on a single device basis.

Agreed but unlimited should be unlimted

Now if you use that phone to supply 2,3,4 or more devices - you are using data in a way that was not agreed upon and isn't in line with what has been accounted for. If you don't understand this basic concept - there's little I can do. You can not LIKE it. But if you don't understand that there's a difference here - then you're lost.

not true they have no way to know how many devices you are connected to.
But I use it for one device Laptop

Conversely - if someone spends money to buy a clearly finite (and smaller) chunk of data - and they want to spread it out however they want - I see little problem with that. The fact that ATT does bothers me. But it's not my problem as I don't have that plan and I don't tether using my iPhone.

This same thread/discussion has happened a million times before. Those that feel "entitled" will argue every excuse under the sun why they should be allowed and how evil ATT is. And those that can see the big picture of cause/effect will be seen by those people as shills or some other name calling word.

LOL and you are not Righteous? You said

making silly assumptions about subjects you know nothing about.

You do not know me or others, I contend most who tether are responsible.

And I just LOVE (sarcasm) that people bring up wanting to sue or that they could go to court over this. Whatever happened to taking responsibility for ones own actions.

So take the law into one's own hands? We do not agree with At&t's interpetation of what is allowable to charge and what is overcharging, paying twice for the same product.

You clearly see it one way, At&t is right no matter what.

ATT sold you an iPhone Unlimited Data Plan

Do you understand - it was an IPHONE unlimited data plan. They didn't sell you an unlimited iPhone + laptop + desktop + ipad + other device data plan.

It's always the guilty who shout the loudest because they really have nothing to lose, do they. At best - they might get away with it - at worst, their situation remains the same.

Sounds to me like you're pissed you got caught. That's all that's happening here...

Whats the point? Tethering didn't exist when I signed up for unlimited.
If grandfathered and by your definition it means that tethering should not be an issue.

Data=Data and on that point for some reason we do not agree.

I think its useless to keep this up we will not agree.

 

[cublah]

I use HandyLight to tether, but only occasionally. I wonder if they can detect that. I don't know what method the jailbreak way uses.

They can detect in a lot of way, for instance since you can't use flash on an iphone or iPad, if they see lots of flash stuff they you are probably tethering, also certain popular sites detect mobile devices and send the mobile version of the site if you are loading the full versions of those sites they could detect tethering, these are only a couple of simple things but there are plenty more, so I don't think this is going to be limited to the latest iOS.

Just my thought on the matter.

 

[pmz]

Go look up the words: entitlement, spoiled, ignorance and unfounded

What the hell is your problem? AT&T has broken the law. Are you content with that?

Do you think it's appropriate for any company to sell an unlimited service, and make every attempt possible to limit it?

 

[jmcrutch]

sounds like someone on here thinks he's a lawya! Must have stayed in a holiday in last night.

 

[jamespa66]

They can detect in a lot of way, for instance since you can't use flash on an iphone or iPad, if they see lots of flash stuff they you are probably tethering, also certain popular sites detect mobile devices and send the mobile version of the site if you are loading the full versions of those sites they could detect tethering, these are only a couple of simple things but there are plenty more, so I don't think this is going to be limited to the latest iOS.

Just my thought on the matter.

Easiest way is for them to sniff the network traffic and look at the packets, the origination machines MAC address is listed. If the MAC address is not in the Apple iPhone list of MAC addresses then it is obviously coming from a tethered machine.

 

[Jack Stacks]

AT&T already gets $50 I'll be damned if I pay anymore for the 1 time a month I actuly need to pull up a full web page due to flash. Yes they get $50 for data, $30 for my unlimited plan (I use ~1gb) and $20 for unlimited texts which is simply insanely small amounts of data.

What contract did I physically sigm when I got my phone? The only thing I signed was a credit card receipt. All you idiots need to read up about Ma Bell and the **** they tried pulling years ago. It's headed back in that direction now.

To all the morons who say if you don't like it don't get it. Your right the carriers should rule over ours lives. We should simply not have phones if we don't want to grab our ankles and like it, every time the phone companies come up with a new way to stick it to us.

Weak minds will continue to be brainwashed by larger corporations site any TOS you want. Your the same people that argued about how AT&T needed 2 years to get MMS to work, and they were right. Probably the same lot that gladly ponied up extra cash to unclock Bluetooth and ringtones on your celluar one / vzn phones.

 

[Howdr]

LOL and you believe that would hold up in court against the significance of the word "Unlimited"?

You are Flat Out Wrong. AT&T would hold up their fine print. The prosecution would wave it away, and so would the judge. It happens every day, and only most uninformed of legal amateurs are unaware of this.

Yet Apple showed the Fine print to the US Gov and they got slapped in the face. Jailbreaking is OK and legal!

As I said : A contract does not make it legal, its just an untested agreement that may or may not stand up to court ruling.

With Jailbreaking there were those using the same arguments before.

I need to go good conversation

I think extra charge for tethering is not ok and think at&t is wrong. no matter the contract.

GL everyone

 

[aristobrat]

No matter what fine print they include in the contract, they cannot sell an unlimited data plan, and then limit it, in any way.

Even if your lawyer is somehow able to pull a Harry's Law and convince a court to rule that way, the end result is guaranteed to be that no US wireless carrier will ever offer an unlimited smartphone data plan again.

Big win.

 

[LegendKillerUK]

AT&T already gets $50 I'll be damned if I pay anymore for the 1 time a month I actuly need to pull up a full web page due to flash. Yes they get $50 for data, $30 for my unlimited plan (I use ~1gb) and $20 for unlimited texts which is simply insanely small amounts of data.

What contract did I physically sigm when I got my phone? The only thing I signed was a credit card receipt. All you idiots need to read up about Ma Bell and the **** they tried pulling years ago. It's headed back in that direction now.

To all the morons who say if you don't like it don't get it. Your right the carriers should rule over ours lives. We should simply not have phones if we don't want to grab our ankles and like it, every time the phone companies come up with a new way to stick it to us.

Weak minds will continue to be brainwashed by larger corporations site any TOS you want. Your the same people that argued about how AT&T needed 2 years to get MMS to work, and they were right. Probably the same lot that gladly ponied up extra cash to unclock Bluetooth and ringtones on your celluar one / vzn phones.

Well no not quite. Over in the UK I laughed at AT&Ts inability to get the ball rolling on MMS. But if you sign a contract you stick to it. It couldn't be any simpler.

O2 charge extra for tethering, guess what? I voted with my wallet and didn't pay it.

 

[aristobrat]

What contract did I physically sigm when I got my phone? The only thing I signed was a credit card receipt.

Where'd you buy your iPhone?

 

[NikeTalk]

That guy that used 90GBs should be the first one converted.

 

[samcraig]

Ignorance of the law and/or terms of the contract does not equal being vindicated.

Good luck with that. There's really nothing else for me to add. If you want to rant, post and have your go at a lawsuit - go for it. Have fun. Just don't expect to win.

PS - just because you keep stating things as fact doesn't make it fact. Good luck with that too.

 

[jmcrutch]

you can buy an iPhone without signing a contract (eBay, from a friend, etc.) however you cannot get service for the iPhone (in the U.S. at least) without entering into an agreement with a carrier, which a court will enforce as a contract, regardless whether there's a physical signature or not.

 

[larrybeo]

Level of Ignorance

People who complain that your service provider is going to make you follow the rules unnerve me with their uncanny ability to disregard all that stands to reason with the sustainability of your "toys." They are like little sissies on the playground crying after a Barbie Doll has been taken from them. Those people should man up and start paying for the footprint they leave on the network.

 

[einmusiker]

Option 3; STOP trying to cheat the system, and START using your iDevice the way the manufacturer designed it and the way your carrier supports it. (Is it unfair? YES! Are all of us iPhone users getting hosed, even though there's now two carriers? YES)

And while you're at it, knock off the piracy with the napster/limewire/torrent crap.

(Yeah, I said it! SOMEBODY had to!)

Thanks for the insight Debbie downer

 

[G5isAlive]

Sir it is perfect.

You are paying for the same thing.

I have an unlimted plan

and I never have gone over 5gb

if one has a 2gb plan and never goes over and we both surf on the internet
Tethering whats the difference?

I have no idea why you can't understand Data=Data
Water=Water
both are pure
the logic so you understand

I drink water = use Data on the phone
I pour water over my head = Data through tethering

So its valid. Using the same amount of substance, what we pay for, to do things in different ways, what should not matter.

Amount should be the issue not how I used it.

even my 10 year old son LOL when we talked about this, he said he doesn't understand why you would pay twice for the same thing.

Obviously it escapes you.

Sir,

I recommend you go to someone other than your 10 year old son for legal advice as it is clear you have no idea what a contract is. While you may wish the amount is the issue, that is not what you agreed to. Its also clear you don't understand how AT&T comes up with their pricing models and how your selfish actions effect us all.

Again, no one forced you to enter into an agreement with AT&T. There were other phones. And now that Verizon has the iPhone you can even switch carriers.

But you did agree, and now you are operating outside that agreement and crying foul. Sorry, the foul is on you. It doesn't matter if you think they are charging too much etc, any more than you can go in to a store and buy one bottle and steal one bottle of your beloved water because you think their price is too high.

If you feel you are operating under your contract legally, then have the backbone to enter into legal action. I am sure there is a class action hungry lawyer who would love to take on AT&T for some quick bucks, if in fact you do have a case.

But we both know, you don't have a case because you are in fact operating outside the contract.

Just because you can fool a 10 year old into justifying your actions, does not mean you can fool the rest of us.

 

[RaNdOm]

Wap.Cingular

So just took a look at my bill and I see that there are two charges on there for 1Kb under "wap.cingular" for the two times that I tested tether on my jailbroken phone using the TetherMe app from Cydia. All other data charges like streaming Pandora or other radio apps just show up at "phone" on my bill. So it seems that they have indeed started breaking out the type of data traffic used to monitor tethering. I don't know if it would then be possible to start masking the tethering as Pandora. I currently stream radio and video on my phone to the tune of 3+Gb a month and haven't tethered other than to test the function.

 

[InsanelyApple]

Hey mates! I live in the UK and according to what I've read, what american mobile companies are charging you is a rip-off! I pay £35 per month (tax included, about $55 USD) and I get: 2000 any network-any time minutes, 5000 same network minutes, 5000 any network messages, UNLIMITED internet, that's right, no capping, no "fair usage policies", UNLIMITED! AAAAND I can tether with up to 5 devices, (macbook and iPad in my case and even my mates iPod touch from time to time when we are out). No extra fees, no hidden tricks. And my iPhone is unlocked, so I can sell it when my contract finishes and any person can use in any country or any network. COMPLAIN PEOPLE!

We do but the government is run by corporations. Nobody cares about the lower 98% of the people in this nation. The government only cares about the top 2% of money earners. America isn't great, and I wish I lived in Europe. Heck, I bet even China is better than this place.

 

[Eso]

Sir it is perfect.

You are paying for the same thing.

I have an unlimted plan

and I never have gone over 5gb

if one has a 2gb plan and never goes over and we both surf on the internet
Tethering whats the difference?

It's easy to make the argument unlimited data plans are priced according to an average amount of data that wireless devices use. The average amount of data used while tethering can be shown to be substantially higher, resulting in higher costs, and justifying a higher price. The key is that their argument may rest upon the price of providing unlimited data. You argument rests upon the amount of data used, however in either case (whether tethered or not) users can use an unlimited amount of data.

 

[CylonGlitch]

Those of you who are so upset over this, please, get a lawyer, and start a class action lawsuit. Let's get this matter settled, should we, or should we not be allowed to use our data any way we want?

I'm not a lawyer, but I do think we should be allowed to use our data how we want. If you're on the 2GB plan, who cares if you use 2GB tethering or 2GB of emails, you should be allowed to use it any way you want.

With an unlimited plan, yeah, there needs to be something in place because truly unlimited just bring out a few ******s who abuse it and makes life miserable for everyone.

Still; let a judge decide, get this going and see who finally wins. Best case, AT&T loses and we get tethering for our data plans. Worst case, AT&T offers no unlimited plans anymore and at the end of every contract EVERYONE has to get off, and you still have to pay for tethering. I'm guessing we'll see something in the middle. You can stay on unlimited, but are not allowed to tether, or you can move to a capped plan (2gb, 4gb, etc..) but can use it any way you want.

Go for it, make it happen, let's get it settled!

 

[cdembek]

I'm waiting for the class action lawsuit as this is wrong.

X2 - I think they are going to require "real" proof that the user is tethering. What is to say the user is not just using a lot of data via the phone? I am sorry, but this really appears of a way to transfer people away from the unlimited plan.

Another reason for folks to move over to Verizon