I can't blame AT&T one bit for trying to protect their network. And as some have already said, those who are trying to game the system are hurting those of us who are being honest by bloating the network unnecessarily.
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AT&T Cracking Down on Unauthorized Tethering
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The network load claims from AT&T are a bit of a red herring. Don't trust their numbers as they can't get the accounting right on their end anyway. See this long running thread on Apple's forum - http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=2450738
For those of you on the tiered plan... watch the data usage closely on AT&T's account management site. Make sure it matches what you know of your usage. For many people, AT&T's accounting of data usage does not match their own use of the device.
AT&T MUST fix their accounting before they have a moral leg to stand on to pull a stunt like this.
For those of you complaining about the theft of service, how about the theft of money from the customer by AT&T?
Seriously....The fact that someone want to Bit Torrent over a mobile phones data connection just makes me SMH. It's so much slower then your home internet connection. Maybe they don't have home internet.... OK, give them that. But really, at the end of the day, it's 1s and 0s. Whether it comes from your phone or laptop, you should not get double charged. I will never tether as long as that extra charge is there. ATT or any other carrier will not get another 20/month from me. I think it's crooked. That's my thoughts. Again, I DO NOT tether because of that. I would if it was free, since I'm already paying for DATA whether I use it or not.
What about using mifi without data?
I want to jail break my iphone 4 and install mifi. The reason is to create a mobile router that my iPad and camera can connect to so that images shot my camera will appear on my iPad. This will not involve any data going to the internet. Is this a violation of my ATT agreement? Will then even be able to tell I'm doing it?
I want to jail break my iphone 4 and install mifi. The reason is to create a mobile router that my iPad and camera can connect to so that images shot my camera will appear on my iPad. This will not involve any data going to the internet. Is this a violation of my ATT agreement? Will then even be able to tell I'm doing it?
This. I wouldn't mind paying a bit more for tethering, but the $20/mo extra or nothing is really unacceptable. For those of us who only tethering sporadically, it's really a waste of money paying $20/mo. If the carriers really want an extra revenue stream from tethering, they should have different options available.
I would easily pay $5-10 more a month for 1GB of tethering data, and for those who want 2+ gigs for tethering, then $20/mo is fine. They really need a lower option.
AT&T will never have my business anymore. I used AT&T’s service for my older iPhone 3G I had bought off eBay. After a year, they decided to take it upon themselves to have me buy their data plan. I have, and never have had, a need for a data plan. I rarely find myself without Wi-Fi or I do without for those rare occasions (as if their service never has it’s outages). I told them I don’t need it, or ever use it.
They feel it’s fair to require me to pay for service I don’t need. My phone’s hardware is no different than the dinky little flip phone I’m forced to use until the contract expires (it was the only way for them to keep from charging me for data). Just because of the name of my phone they are telling me I need to buy more from them. That is terrifying if it’s legal.
Now, they are telling people that because their service is split amongst devices you need to pay more, too? Hah! What if you had to pay extra to have more than one phone on your land line? Or you had to pay extra for having more than one computer on your home Internet? Or more if you use a wireless router?
Wireless service companies in the U.S. (can’t speak for elsewhere) have people by the balls. I don’t like it.
P.S. Isn‘t it illegal if they sniff your data? Against privacy laws?
They feel it’s fair to require me to pay for service I don’t need. My phone’s hardware is no different than the dinky little flip phone I’m forced to use until the contract expires (it was the only way for them to keep from charging me for data). Just because of the name of my phone they are telling me I need to buy more from them. That is terrifying if it’s legal.
Now, they are telling people that because their service is split amongst devices you need to pay more, too? Hah! What if you had to pay extra to have more than one phone on your land line? Or you had to pay extra for having more than one computer on your home Internet? Or more if you use a wireless router?
Wireless service companies in the U.S. (can’t speak for elsewhere) have people by the balls. I don’t like it.
P.S. Isn‘t it illegal if they sniff your data? Against privacy laws?
Two separate issues.
ATT can prove if you're tethering or not. This has nothing to do with how much data you are or are not using.
Even if you use 1KB via tether and you aren't on their plan - they have a leg to stand on.
MyWi
To everyone that is running jailbroken and tethering (against your AT&T TOS) via MyWi. Did you purchase the app or are you pirating that as well?
To everyone that is running jailbroken and tethering (against your AT&T TOS) via MyWi. Did you purchase the app or are you pirating that as well?
I'm a little split on this. My usage is under 5 gigs usually 99% of the time with legit Netflix streaming, pandora, and GPS usage.
Have I tethered before? I won't lie and say I haven't. I have a developer account and created an app to try it out.
That said, AT&T should upgrade their networks too. I pay for a service, and I believe they should serve me, not the other way around. If I obey the rules, don't clamp down to avoid upgrades.
Also anyone who says "change providers." I simply say, work doesn't allow me. Let alone, AT&T has the best coverage where I live. Just sucks that while having the fastest 3G is handicapped if you can't use it for a while. I also travel, so GSM is the best option for me.
I wish in America all frequencies between cell phone companies are standardized to the other foreign countries so all cell phone carriers would have to actually compete for your business.
Have I tethered before? I won't lie and say I haven't. I have a developer account and created an app to try it out.
That said, AT&T should upgrade their networks too. I pay for a service, and I believe they should serve me, not the other way around. If I obey the rules, don't clamp down to avoid upgrades.
Also anyone who says "change providers." I simply say, work doesn't allow me. Let alone, AT&T has the best coverage where I live. Just sucks that while having the fastest 3G is handicapped if you can't use it for a while. I also travel, so GSM is the best option for me.
I wish in America all frequencies between cell phone companies are standardized to the other foreign countries so all cell phone carriers would have to actually compete for your business.
Well I dont want to "cheat" ATT out of anything.
I want to pay for 2gb and use 2gb.
Why in the f*&# should I have to pay $20 dollars MORE for 2gb of data I DONT WANT?
People on tiered data plans should not have to pay for tethering, period. Its ridiculous.
Damned if they do and damned if they don't, aye?
When ATT provides options (whether you like them or not) - you have a choice. You can either choose to take advantage of the options, not use them, buck the system and deal with the consequence, or terminate your agreement and move to another company.
When they didn't provide options- people were up in arms over not having any choices..
Everyone can be an armchair critic, lawyer, etc... I would imagine that few if ANYone here is qualified to determine what ATT (or other carriers) can or cannot/should or should not do when it comes to their business model. You speak (naturally so) for yourself and some of your fellow customers.
I have seen this repeated several times throughout the thread. Can someone actually post the relevant contractual section? Thanks.
Fwiw, I think AT&T is bluffing people who are suddenly using significantly more data.
I've never once tethered or hotspotted yet my usage for last month was over 9GB....this is just normal iPhone usage for me, they better not automatically change me to the tiered plan.
Check out this thread on Apple's forums - http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=2450738
Its a long running problem for a lot of people. AT&T's accounting of data usage has been messed up for quite some time. I don't see how AT&T can justify any claim against someone when they can't correctly account for data usage.
I actually paid for MyWi and I only use it to tether my iPad. I use it instead of (not in addition to) my iPhone and only when wifi is not available.
Ok, so my comment about what don't people understand about unlimited was super snarky. Sorry.
What I meant was, If I can use 6GB (for example, I don't use this much) on my iPhone, what's the difference between that and 3GB iPhone and 3GB iPad (tethered)? If I am "entitled" to those 6GB or 4 or whatever on an unlimited plan, why does it matter how that bandwidth is distributed among my devices?
What I meant was, If I can use 6GB (for example, I don't use this much) on my iPhone, what's the difference between that and 3GB iPhone and 3GB iPad (tethered)? If I am "entitled" to those 6GB or 4 or whatever on an unlimited plan, why does it matter how that bandwidth is distributed among my devices?
I can blame AT&T for this because they don't account for data usage properly.
See this thread on Apple's forums - http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=2450738
If AT&T could account for data usage properly and show their customers what was using the data, then I would say ALMOST say its ok for AT&T to do this (other than the fact they just automatically sign you up instead of having you opt in).
you people who think being charged for tethering is justified, exemplify what is wrong with this country. You would bend over and take anything up the rear end, just b/c it was written in a contract.
contracts are crap .. they mean nothing. Many of them don't hold up in a court, despite what they say. They are intentionally written in a manner to screw the consumer. They do this for as long as they can, until a court or a law tells them otherwise.
you deserve all the ******** these corporations are feeding you.
losers ....
I'm going to plug in my phone, and let netflix run for the next 4 hours, as a nice big FU to AT&T, and all you uncle tom's.
contracts are crap .. they mean nothing. Many of them don't hold up in a court, despite what they say. They are intentionally written in a manner to screw the consumer. They do this for as long as they can, until a court or a law tells them otherwise.
you deserve all the ******** these corporations are feeding you.
losers ....
I'm going to plug in my phone, and let netflix run for the next 4 hours, as a nice big FU to AT&T, and all you uncle tom's.
WOW in plain English......... If you use a lot you should pay for it.People who complain that your service provider is going to make you follow the ru
OK I agree
but AT&T are the ones who advertise Unlimited Data
Should they not "Man UP"? and stop this hiding behind definitions of nonsense in a contract.
Essentially the point many and I make is
we pay for Data that is contracted as unlimited,
At&t then has a contract that says its unlimited Data with us and then says they can decide when its abused.
OK using 5gb or less is not considered abuse by them, OK
But tethering 100mb of that 5gb is abuse even though it does not go over the usage and it makes no network difference to At&t
the problem is the contract itself is contradictory in how it is written and the enforcement of this issue is in huge suspect, At&t truly may not have one kb of proof that you tethered.
I see many problems with this.
Lawsuits? Class action maybe not individuals.
and it would have to be those paying for tethering and or charged a fine for doing so or forced into a tethering contract.
Not I, I have no emails nothing, = No harm.
Why do they have to charge for tethering? It's a self-fulfilling prophecy. If I tether a lot, I will use more than 2 gigs in a month. Charge me extra at that point. At least they now give you 2 Gig extra for your tethering money. I would just prefer to not pay for that extra 2 gig until I need it. I only need to tether once a month at best, so I don't want to pay for a bunch of tethering. I also don't want to leave my unlimited plan. Sadly, I have never gone over 2 GB, but I like knowing that I don't have to worry about it.
I'm not aware of any non-wireless ISP in the US that charges on a per-computer basis. There are many that offer supported wireless routers to their customers for an additional fee, but there's nothing stopping a customer with enough knowledge from just buying their own.
This whole situation very closely resembles the early days of broadband internet. The ISPs wanted an additional fee (I recall mine was $10/month) for each additional computer on the network. This was enforced by IPs or MAC addresses. Users balked.
Then along came the consumer-level router, which substituted its own IP and MAC address into all packets to/from the local network, making detection difficult.
Since you can determine the manufacturer of the device from its MAC address, the ISPs then started charging extra for any MAC address that indicated it was from a company that manufactures routers (think Linksys, Dlink, etc.). Users balked.
Router companies then added the ability to clone the MAC address of one of the local computers onto the router, effectively making it appear as if all traffic was coming from that one machine. ISPs eventually gave up, and now routers are commonplace.
We're going to see the same progression here eventually, but since all the carriers in the US act as a single unified collective, it will probably take lawsuits to eventually make it happen. When it comes to cellular carriers, there's no such thing as "voting with your dollars" in the US as there is in other parts of the world.
Hardly, if people are complaining about theft from AT&T, by the customer, then the very same people should be complaining about theft from the customer by AT&T. That is what this incorrect data usage accounting amounts too. AT&T charging people for data usage that they did not use and that AT&T can not prove they used (based on the experience of customers calling AT&T and their usage of the AT&T management website).
The validity of an accusation, by a thief, that someone else is a thief is questionable.
Found it:
"Furthermore, plans (unless specifically designated for tethering usage) cannot be used for any applications that tether the device (through use of, including without limitation, connection kits, other phone/smartphone to computer accessories, BLUETOOTH® or any other wireless technology) to Personal Computers (including without limitation, laptops), or other equipment for any purpose. Accordingly, AT&T reserves the right to (i) deny, disconnect, modify and/or terminate Service, without notice, to anyone it believes is using the Service in any manner prohibited or whose usage adversely impacts its wireless network or service levels or hinders access to its wireless network, including without limitation, after a significant period of inactivity or after sessions of excessive usage and (ii) otherwise protect its wireless network from harm, compromised capacity or degradation in performance, which may impact legitimate data flows."
Interesting. All AT&T has to do is believe you're tethering and they can modify your plan? I'm going to keep tethering, and if they try to change my plan, get out of my contract with no ETF. Id also be very curious to see how the "believe" provision would hold up in court if they had no other proof than an increase in data usage. I'm guessing not very well.
"Furthermore, plans (unless specifically designated for tethering usage) cannot be used for any applications that tether the device (through use of, including without limitation, connection kits, other phone/smartphone to computer accessories, BLUETOOTH® or any other wireless technology) to Personal Computers (including without limitation, laptops), or other equipment for any purpose. Accordingly, AT&T reserves the right to (i) deny, disconnect, modify and/or terminate Service, without notice, to anyone it believes is using the Service in any manner prohibited or whose usage adversely impacts its wireless network or service levels or hinders access to its wireless network, including without limitation, after a significant period of inactivity or after sessions of excessive usage and (ii) otherwise protect its wireless network from harm, compromised capacity or degradation in performance, which may impact legitimate data flows."
Interesting. All AT&T has to do is believe you're tethering and they can modify your plan? I'm going to keep tethering, and if they try to change my plan, get out of my contract with no ETF. Id also be very curious to see how the "believe" provision would hold up in court if they had no other proof than an increase in data usage. I'm guessing not very well.
I think ATT needs to find a middle ground with wireless data usage.
Non-USA users, please chime in.
I think Candaian users get "free tethering included" with their 6GB data plan?
So ATT needs to say something like here's 5GB of data. Charge us $30 (which I think is a very fair price). And we can tether or do whatever we want with that data as long as phone plus tethering is less than 5GB a month.
Of course, ATT is greedy and charging a ridiculous $45 for only 4GB total of data (it used to be worst and only included 2GB data).
Non-USA users, please chime in.
I think Candaian users get "free tethering included" with their 6GB data plan?
So ATT needs to say something like here's 5GB of data. Charge us $30 (which I think is a very fair price). And we can tether or do whatever we want with that data as long as phone plus tethering is less than 5GB a month.
Of course, ATT is greedy and charging a ridiculous $45 for only 4GB total of data (it used to be worst and only included 2GB data).
This is what I do, I'm on the "unlimited" plan and I haven't received any text or email regarding the warning about tethering, i hope it's because I dont surpass the 5 gb cap
<soapbox -- move on if you are not interested>
It's you. He's right. I could care less about the whiners who say "I need 10GB per month to tether all my devices to my iPhone." I don't like subsidizing that. If you use that much data on your iPhone directly without tethering then more power to you -- that was AT&T's mistake for offering an unlimited plan.
But the "unlimited plan" they offered did not say "unlimited devices on one plan". It was very specifically restricted to the iPhone. To those who have cheated system, I applaud your brilliance for working around the rules. But when the rule maker starts cracking down on your circumvention crying that it is "unfair" is a bit comical.
Everybody signs a contact with their carriers when they get service. They sure as heck know what they are signing up for -- some of amount of money every month for some sort of access to their network with some set of limitations.
Sure, if you buy an iPhone it is yours. You can do what you want with it. However, your use of the carrier's network is subject to a contract with specific terms. If you don't like the terms then you don't need to agree to them. But if you choose to agree to them and try to cheat the carrier through unfair practices then don't expect others to be happy about subsidizing your practice through increased rates or degraded service.
The carrier is going to make their money one way or the other. They are a corporation driven by profits. Retail stores raise prices to compensate for shoplifting just like carriers raise rates to compensate for network expansion and lost customers due to network overload from those who circumvent the agreement they signed up for.
Any measure by the carrier to crack down on those who cheat the system is a welcome effort to those who choose not to cheat the system. They could be jerks and just decide that its not worth the effort to go after those folks and make everybody pay for it.
Do I believe that AT&T will drop their rates once they crack down on the bandwidth cheaters? Heck no. Do I believe that the network performance will get better for the rest of us without added monthly fees, probably. Either way, what's fair is fair. Nobody is born entitled to an iPhone and mobile data. But the sense of entitlement in this country has gotten so out of hand.
</soapbox>