I should care, because of the principle of it and the precedent it sets, and the applicability to tethering (well the principle, since I have MiWi anyways), but I just can't get myself to care about Facetime. It's just so... irrelevant.
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AT&T Responds to Net Neutrality Concerns Regarding FaceTime Usage Policy
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Please stop generalizing all AT&T users into a bifurcation fallacy
Bifurcation Fallacy
No. It is specifically NOT the whole entire issue. AT&T has more than just 2 types of plan options (Unlimited and the new Share plans). There are at least 3 types of plans (Unlimited, the new Share plans, and the Tiered data plans that they began offering a couple years ago to get people off the unlimited plans)
AT&T is not saying that ONLY Unlimited data users will be unable to use facetime over cellular data. They are saying that ONLY Shared data plans can use it. Which means they are alse specifically denying the Tierd data plan users from using facetime over cellular.
I am one of the Tierd data plan users. I have 5GB of data, unlimted voice calls and text, and tethering enabled. My current plan provides EXACTLY the same services at the same rate of service (5GB, unlimted voice, etc.... not referring to price or pay rate) as a Shared plan. The Shared plan is more expensive and I would have no other device to "share" that data with so it's pointless for me to switch to one.
If AT&T wants to limit ALL video conferencing type services accross the board, than at least that would be fair treatment to all of their customers. Alternatively, If they wanted to limit ALL video conferencing type services to not be usable by unlimited plans, then at least that would follow the logic of how they instituted tethering and would make some sense. But they're screwing over of the Tierd data plan customers by falsly making the argument look like it's all about the unlimited users is shameless.
AT&T will lose business. My Business. Any my Companie's business.
Bifurcation Fallacy
No. It is specifically NOT the whole entire issue. AT&T has more than just 2 types of plan options (Unlimited and the new Share plans). There are at least 3 types of plans (Unlimited, the new Share plans, and the Tiered data plans that they began offering a couple years ago to get people off the unlimited plans)
AT&T is not saying that ONLY Unlimited data users will be unable to use facetime over cellular data. They are saying that ONLY Shared data plans can use it. Which means they are alse specifically denying the Tierd data plan users from using facetime over cellular.
I am one of the Tierd data plan users. I have 5GB of data, unlimted voice calls and text, and tethering enabled. My current plan provides EXACTLY the same services at the same rate of service (5GB, unlimted voice, etc.... not referring to price or pay rate) as a Shared plan. The Shared plan is more expensive and I would have no other device to "share" that data with so it's pointless for me to switch to one.
If AT&T wants to limit ALL video conferencing type services accross the board, than at least that would be fair treatment to all of their customers. Alternatively, If they wanted to limit ALL video conferencing type services to not be usable by unlimited plans, then at least that would follow the logic of how they instituted tethering and would make some sense. But they're screwing over of the Tierd data plan customers by falsly making the argument look like it's all about the unlimited users is shameless.
AT&T will lose business. My Business. Any my Companie's business.
Umm, I'm on the lowest plan they offer (450 min/month) and I have over 4k rollover minutes and it's maxed at that because I have about the same amount expire as I accumulate.
Looking at my last bill I can see:
Anytime Minutes: 15 (this is what the rollover comes from)
Night/Weekend: 66
Mobile to Mobile: 93
So, do I need rollover minutes? No.
But more to your point, is my plan "way too high" - well probably, but they don't offer a smaller one.
You missed the point. The person I quoted cited roll over as a reason to stick with AT&T. I pointed out that if you actually accumulate any substantial roll over minutes, then you don't actually *need* them. So losing them by switching providers is not a big loss.
The only scenario where rollovers would be consistently helpful is if your usage patters vary significantly throughout different parts of year
What about Apple?
Remember the speach "Apple does the phone and software- AT&T does the network"! Why does Apple cave and let them cripple the device like this? They can always take the ability for the carrier to limit it out of IOS and then problem solved!
AT&T did this also to the hotspot on the new iPad. Even though you purchase the amout of data you can use... they want to tell you how you can and can't use it.
I have been a AT&T customer since 2007 and when the 5 is realeased.. I will move to VZ contract or not.
Remember the speach "Apple does the phone and software- AT&T does the network"! Why does Apple cave and let them cripple the device like this? They can always take the ability for the carrier to limit it out of IOS and then problem solved!
AT&T did this also to the hotspot on the new iPad. Even though you purchase the amout of data you can use... they want to tell you how you can and can't use it.
I have been a AT&T customer since 2007 and when the 5 is realeased.. I will move to VZ contract or not.
I specified an 'unlimited' data plan! No higher bill, no additional income to AT&T.
Same. We're on FT 850. We could switch to 700 with M2AM for the same price, and probably end up with even more Rollover Minutes, and we have too many phones for the 550... For the price and service, it's great though, as I never have to worry about running out of minutes. It is, for all practical purposes, unlimited. The only thing I have to watch is data, but at $10/GB, it's not a big deal if I go over now and then.
The thing is, you *DON'T* have unlimited data if AT&T decides that in the preloaded apps (e.g., Facetime, or how about Safari or Mail?), your data plan won't work anymore.
They are effectively dishonoring the old plans by stating that the new phones won't work with the old plans. (And don't give me any BS about how it's a new feature and the phone still works - if they're going out of their way to specifically disable built in functionality of the phone so that your plan won't work when it would otherwise work fine, they are doing everything they can to force you off your plan, and it will only get worse from here.)
Know what they did on my grandfathered laptop connect unlimited plan? They prevent it from connecting to the LTE network - so I now no longer get the speed everyone else gets, and as they transition over and slow maintenance on the older network, I will eventually have severely degraded service even compared to what I have now, which is already 1/3 or less of the speed of the guy next to me using the same device.
AT&T is an example of why we need a new model for airwave allocation which does not involve government selling off airspace to "buyers" who are also, not coincidentally, campaign contributors, and regulating for their benefit.
A) Learn how to Jailbreak.
B) No one cares about Facetime anyways. It's all about tethering, and MiWi already takes care of that.
To those of us who have, say, kids of our own and retiree-aged parents who like to talk to them, and who are not going to jailbreak their phones, Facetime is something we actually use, and this is a big deal.
The number of people who could, and would, jailbreak their phones is way under 1% of iPhone users, and even if I am comfortable with it for myself, I'm not going to jailbreak my mom's phone and then have her show up at the Apple store 3000 miles away with a jailbroken phone when it has a problem and be turned away.
No, that is simply not a solution at all for the average person, and every single person at AT&T involved in this decision can choke on it. Now I just have to decide whether to switch to Verizon or spend the money for an unlocked EU phone.
First of all, it's useless. Get Skype if you actually want to videochat.
Jailbreaking is drop-dead simple. It's point and click. One reason I switched to the iPhone. Much easier than flashing ROMs and such.
There are already millions of Jailbroken iPhones out there.
You can always un-jailbreak the phone if there's an issue.
I would say Just Jailbreak. You're making excuses and avoiding the simple and obvious solution. However, it's irrelevant, since it's a crappy, useless feature.
Just so we're clear, are you arguing that what AT&T is doing is ok because you, or better yet your 70 year old grandmother who just wants to chat with her grandkids using the built in feature of the phone, can potentially void her Apple warranty and/or brick her phone by jailbreaking?
Or rather than actively arguing it's ok for AT&T to do that, are you merely trying to distract from the point? I'm not following your point of reference here.
Grandma doesn't want to use Skype, and I use it with some folks, but not with others - just because Mr. Cool You thinks Facetime is lame does *NOT* mean it is useless to everyone, and jailbreaking is not a solution everyone is interested in.
It's extremely bad from a precedent and net neutrality point of view. HOWEVER, from a practical view, it is a non-issue. Everyone who has half a clue is Jailbroken or could easily Jailbreak if they wanted a feature that they don't have on a stock device. You also can't brick you device by Jailbreaking, so get you facts straight. I primarily Jailbroke for MiWi. I like to be able to have a DSL connection in my pocket for my laptop or iPad almost anywhere I go. I recently used it several times while traveling, since the airports didn't have free wifi.
Secondly, Facetime is such a turd bird in the first place, and that there is no way to even get mad about the practical implications of this "feature", because there are none. Because of that, even though I know I should be up in arms about it from a principle, net neutrality and precedent POV, I just can't get myself to care.
The concept of Facetime as a closed Apple system sucks from the get-go. Just grab your laptop and get Skype. Oh yeah, and my quad-i7 MBP has a lot more processing horsepower to get nice audio and video than the A5 in my iPhone.
Are you kidding? Everyone who has a clue has jailbroken? I think your perspective is so egocentric I don't really know how to respond.
I would wager that less than one percent of iPhone owners have jailbroken, and certainly less than ten percent. To say we shouldn't be irritated with the "practical implications" of something that adversely impacts the non-technical 90-99%+ of users is just silly... Things only matter if they affect technical people (who would even understand what jailbreaking is, let alone go do it) who are willing to void their warranties to try to work around carrier restrictions? I don't think we are going to be able to communicate here.
I'm not kidding. If they have a clue, they know how to find out how to Jailbreak (the Google as they call it). If they can't figure out how to use the Google, then they must not have a clue. Jailbreaking is literally a one-click process at this point.
Then we should be a lot more pissed off about how we "can't" tether on the old plans. Of course I have MiWi, so I can do whatever I want. I guess all the morons out there who apparently can't figure out how to JB leave more network capacity for me!
You're complaining about a problem that simply doesn't exist, just like the tethering "problem". It's not a problem because if you want that feature, you can just go Jailbreak to get it. That's what you seem to be missing here. That's aside from how little of a feature Facetime even is.
You don't break your warranty by JB'ing. I had a JB'ed phone replaced by Apple, and if you're concerned that they're not going to replace one, just go restore to stock before you bring it into the store to get it replaced.