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All i can say is this crap of ATnT not supporting MMS until later this summer (if ever!) and not supporting teither on a 30 dollar a month data plan is crap. While they can bend over backwards for Apple to get the iphone, they are still a monopoly and can do whatever they want.

ATnT better shape up soon because if they keep pissing off current iphone users, Verizon starts looking far more promising and the demand to Apple to make the verizon deal will be more apparent. I think there are millions who want the iphone but don't want ATnT (hell i am trying to get my mom to get one but she doesnt want to be on ATnT and she really wants an iphone too).

I can just see the flood of 3G Iphone owners going to verizon next summer with what i think will be a complete hardware refresh at WWDC. ATnT better star finding ways to keep iphone owners with ATnT ... the best way to do that is to get them into a new two year contract now so they can't switch without a penalty to verizon next summer. ATnT can then weather that storm while getting 4G networks up and running while insuring iphone owners stay with ATnT ... it only makes sense :) lol
 
Wow. To be honest you can drop the math. It's very simple, there is no such thing as an upgrade fee. You want a $600 phone and AT&T offers to pay for half of it if you use their service. That's all there is to it.

I paid full price for my 3G back in august and I still pay the same monthly data that subsidized people did. Don't overcomplicate things.
 
I'm with all the people that don't understand how business or simple math with numbers bigger then 200 works.

AT&T should give us all (iPhone 3G Users) a free iPhone 3GS, just because we are so loyal, and while they are at it, perhaps they could lower my monthly bill and let me out of my contract next month too!!!!

AT&T should also on behalf of us (iPhone 3G users) take all the money that they make off of us and donate it to the Human Fund on our behalf.

If you have to bitch about the cost of upgrading early, perhaps an iPhone isn't for you, if 200 dollars is going to break the bank, maybe you shouldn't have an iPhone in the first place.

In closing I think all iPhone 3G users should demand that Obama forces AT&T to allow us to upgrade for free!!!!! You know in the spirit of change and hope and what not.


Now there's and idea!
 
Despise? Get a life. It's a pricing model, not a life and death issue.

If people don't like ATT, buy from another carrier.

All these threads filled with people whining because they can't get a subsidized phone prove how self centered and self absorbed they are. Man up, ATT sold you EXACTLY what you signed up for. ATT isn't the federal government doling out cell phone welfare.

I think tasset meant that the subsidizing model really stifles competition. Network compatibilities aside for a moment, if I could purchase an iPhone for $400 (or whatever) and use it on ANY network, wireless costs would come down. And if I could buy a Pre for cheaper than an iPhone, then handset prices would come down, maybe not by a lot, but maybe not $600.

Second, AT&T recoups its subsidy after 2 years, after that the rates I'm paying are pure profit to them. The only way it works out for me is if I either sign up every 2 years to a new contract, or get early upgrade pricing as often as possible.

I too don't particularly like the subsidy model, but I certainly don't want to pay $600 for an unlocked device AND pay the regular wireless service costs to be contract free.
 
"Grass is always greener on the other side of the fence"

I can promise you if Apple went with Verizon instead all the bitching about ATT would be exactly the same wiht Verizon replacing ATT.

I've been with all the majors and I think they all suck equally.

My point though is if Apple expanded (not switched, that will never happen) to other providers, that's the only reason for AT&T to waive the fees. They would do it to retain iPhone customers who might defect next summer. If they're not worried about this since they will likely buy next year's iPhone, they will lose money. ATT is losing money by waiving the fee. If they have nothing to lose, they're not going to do it. In other words, it's probably not going to happen.
 
What people don't seem to realize is that the 2G iPhone wasn't subsidized, people payed full price for it upfront, so AT&T wasn't losing any money by letting people upgrade early to the 3G.

Yep, they came out about even.

The first phone DID have the usual $10-$15 monthly customer subsidy amount given out, but it was paid to Apple monthly instead. (Remember, the "revenue sharing" - haha cute name - paid to Apple).

No extra skin off ATT's back, of course. They didn't care who got the subsidy fund.

Reportedly this deal only was good for one year. After that, the customer got the subsidy to lower the phone price.
 
Maybe the 2yr Contract/Subsidy Model is outdated?

I just thought I'd throw in my 2 cents. Not they are any better or worse then anyone else's, but I thought I'd add to the dialogue.

Maybe the typical 2yr Contract/Phone Subsidy itself is outdated from a technological standpoint, at least as far as the physical hardware of phones is concerned? Having owned cell phones for 10 years now I have observed, much like everyone else, that technology has come a long way. For most of the recent history of cell phones, up until the release of the original iPhone 2 years ago, your typical consumer cell phone hasn't technologically advanced all that much from year to year. I'd say my first 3 cell phones were basic phones that I was just happy they could make a phone call, and the last two had some extra features like built in cameras, the ability to record video, and/or ability to playback mp3 music files. Sure it was cool at first when cell phones had built in cameras, but they were grainy and unspectacular in their resolution - more a gimmick then anything else. I'm not sure how other networks have worked, but coming from Verizon since my cell phones had the ability to download music over their network has been a joke -- since their "Get it Now/VCast" network uses a weird points-instead-of-dollars system that is crippled and you actually end up paying more for music if you had just downloaded it from iTunes or elsewhere on the Internet.

Anyway, long diatribe short -- from one year to the next you didn't have rabid consumers clamoring over the next great phone; if something you were interested came onto the marketplace, usually you could hold yourself over until your contract was up. Sure, designs changed ever so slightly and technology advanced bit by bit, but nothing seemed "leaps and bounds" over the previous version. It really wasn't a big deal to be locked into a 2 year contract, unless you had buyer's remorse and hated your phone from the beginning or hated your cell phone service.

Enter the age of the smartphone - technology is advancing so fast that from one year to the next you could have a revolution in cell phone technology, rather than a slight evolution. The original iPhone was such a phone; the Palm Pre may or may not be such a phone -- at least for Sprint users. Whether the 3GS is a revolution over the 3G, I really don't know. The 3GS will be my first iPhone and its certainly going to be a revolution over the LG Chocolate 2 I have used for the past 2 years, love it though I may, the faithful and reliable little one. What I do see and hear is that 3G users are rabid enough that they can't handle the thought of their being a new iPhone release and not being invited to the party, so to speak. I agree that you sign a 2 year contract and you should be able to live with waiting an extra year, but if consumer sentiment and fanaticism is so high for the iPhone and Apple products, there should be some solution Apple, AT&T, and "the market" should be able to provide that would make consumers happy and also be profitable to the companies that make the products and services we love. Unfortunately, with this problem, I just have observation and no real solution -- I don't know what the best answer is.

Maybe AT&T could just have a 1-year contract and a higher initial purchase price of the iPhone with less of a subsidy? Admittedly, this wouldn't please Apple or enable the sale of the same volume of iPhones as its not the most consumer friendly, as consumers look at the initial purchase price of the phone moreso then the total cost of ownership for however long they use and own the phone. I'd say Apple could only come out with a new version of the iPhone only every 2 years, but this wouldn't work either as technology advances and their competitors try to play catch up and could possibly usurp the iPhone's current success, so there is no chance in the world of this option. Maybe if Apple opens up the iPhone to other networks after the original AT&T exclusivity contract, competition will somehow bring prices down -- but knowing Verizon and the way they want to cripple and control anything other then pure voice with their "Get it Now/VCast/Rhapsody/Whatever" services -- I don't see them enabling the open ended App store that makes the iPhone the iPhone. So -- I just don't know.

I just feel like the whole 2-year contract/subsidy model is outdated in that new hot phones are coming on the market every year that consumers can't wait to ditch their year old phones for. However, if abandoned, how do the wireless telecom companies make their profit? Just some thoughts...
 
What's the difference between a 1 year contract and paying $400 or a 2 year contract and the option of buying a new phone after a year for $400? At least with the later I have an option save $200.
 
If a company charges more than I think something is worth, than I don't buy it. It is their right to charge what they see fit, as long as it's not gouging. $700 is not gouging.
 
Maybe AT&T could just have a 1-year contract and a higher initial purchase price of the iPhone with less of a subsidy? Admittedly, this wouldn't please Apple or enable the sale of the same volume of iPhones as its not the most consumer friendly, as consumers look at the initial purchase price of the phone moreso then the total cost of ownership for however long they use and own the phone. I'd say Apple could only come out with a new version of the iPhone only every 2 years, but this wouldn't work either as technology advances and their competitors try to play catch up and could possibly usurp the iPhone's current success, so there is no chance in the world of this option. Maybe if Apple opens up the iPhone to other networks after the original AT&T exclusivity contract, competition will somehow bring prices down -- but knowing Verizon and the way they want to cripple and control anything other then pure voice with their "Get it Now/VCast/Rhapsody/Whatever" services -- I don't see them enabling the open ended App store that makes the iPhone the iPhone. So -- I just don't know.

The problem is that Apple completly changed the game in the cell phone arena. People think all Apple needs to do is take out the sim card slot and verizon will be good to go, but thats not the case.

O2, Att, T-Mo Germany and everyone else had to bend over backwards to support the iphone's data centricity. The ease of web browsing and downloading apps and such OTA has ushered in a new era of data consumption. Visual Voicemail is a server-side function which requires interoperability on the head-end. We do not know the costs associated with this, but we do know that Apple demanded alot from the carriers in support of these devices.

Now, carriers having made such a giant initial investment, on a phone that may not have even done well , want to see some serious returns.

This is not a case of a broken model. This is not a case of corporate greed. This is a case of a spoiled subset of users who want what they want when they want it. RIM comes out with new phones all the time yet no one expects them to do it. The silliest complaints i've seen are comprised of the fact that ATT subsidized the phone once and individuals expected ATT to do it again. This is the fallacy of angry 3g customers.

In addition to this, you now have people blaming Apple for making the costs so high. Seriously. The unsubsidized price for the iphone is right in line with other high end smart phones. The only way you will truly solve these issues of self entitlement is to not include a subsidy, at all, ever. Sales will plummet and carriers know this, because as said earlier people will shy away from an intial $700 down payment, but don't mind when those payments are rolled up in a low monthly payment.
 
I seriously doubt they will. Why would they? Your in a contract and you need to live up to what YOU signed. If you terminate it, then you have to pay their fee's. Overall it does suck not having a reduced price for upgrading, but that's the price your paying for waiting the latest and greatest toys.
 
The only thing that matters is the mighty dollar.

AT&T subsidizes the phones and in turn makes money off the plan.

I doubt that AT&T will change policies, now I would assume that there are some AT&T employees that will give in if you whine and complain, but that could back fire.

Also the new iPhone is just not worth sticking yourself for another 2 years, I think Apple and AT&T see it that way too.
 
I have no problem with the $399/$499.

What I do have an issue with is the arbitrary way they determine your ability to get the $399/$499 upgrade.

In my case, I have to wait 18 months while some can do it a year after their contract started. AT&T doesn't give clear reasons why the difference.

Also, I found a contradiction between full retail on Apple.com and AT&T. Apple says in their disclaimer that even full retail requires a new 2 year contract while AT&T says not.

At least tell the same story for everyone.
 
How much did the original iPhone cost again? :rolleyes:

If people think this is too expensive for a phone they should complain to Apple, not AT&T (not that it would do any good).

Also, a lot of other smartphones cost the same, people just don't realize it because they're used to the subsidized price. The iPhone is no different.

Thank you!! I saw a Balckberry the other day for 750.00 w/o a 2 year contract the other day. You are 100% right, the iPhone is no different.
 
Every cell phone maker that is worth anything releases new cell phones every year. Should AT&T ignore the two year contracts for them as well? There are some seriously ignorant and selfish people here.
 
You all need to remember that all this crap that could fundamentally cripple the iphone (like the way verizon does things on their network), we all know Apple would NEVER allow to happen. They forced atnt to accept their terms and conditions for the iphone and verizon is the same. We all know that Steve Jobs goes into a room and makes any high powered exec kiss his butt and bow before his godlyness.
 
AT&T is all about making money. I don't see it happening.

Wow so is my compnay.. what jerks!!! :rolleyes: My company better make money or I don't get a paycheck. If I don't get a paycheck, then I can't buy from other companies that want to make money.
 
I can't see them giving in to "pressure" Sure people are bitching, but they're also pre-ordering like crazy. What would motivate them to lower the price when the product is selling. If on the other hand people were complaining about the upgrade fee and were not upgrading or ATT thought that people would be jumping ship to the PRE that might be different but they have a winner and they know they do. It makes no sense to lower the price.
 
Can't we just pay the early termination fee to get out of our AT&T 2 year contract, then sign back up to get the new iPhone at the subsidized price?
 
AT&T is all about making money. I don't see it happening.

God forbid a company makes some money! :rolleyes: If AT&T wasn't about making money and was just ripping up contracts left and right, they'd run out of money, fold up and go out of business and you'd be left with a very expensive paperweight instead of an iPhone.

Motorola, Nokia and Samsung are releasing new phones practically every month. Do you honestly expect AT&T to void contracts for those people so they can buy the latest Motorola phone at a subsidized price? Absolutely not. Why should iPhone users be any different?
 
Well Well, Look It Here Guys. Did I Call It Or Did I Call It? Boom!

WELL WELL, LOOK IT HERE GUYS. DID I CALL IT OR DID I CALL IT? BOOM!
 
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