Australia Considers Case for Opening iPhone NFC Chip to Third Party Payment Systems

[Joosst]

Although I’m usually not a fan of governments telling tech companies what to do, can we just agree Apple Pay is a completely unnecessary and greedy idea, only to collect money.

There’s nothing about the safety or the user experience that can’t be done with NFC. Nothing.

I have a bank that still doesn’t support Apple Pay, because they don’t agree with Apple’s terms. But the same bank app on Android just painlessly adds your card to NFC and let’s you pay in every shop. Because there are no terms or hidden costs to agree with.

Apple is just being greedy here. They could have made the easiest and safest NFC payment system, for every bank to use. In stead they chose for a lame and evil way to make more money. I’m glad regulators oppose.

 

[frenchcamp49er]

It’s NFC, and apps use it already outside of payment use for writing and reading NFC tags.

in terms of payments, banks are likely just after some middle ground to lower transaction costs.

Do you really think banks will lower any fee. ?

 

[boak]

Although I’m usually not a fan of governments telling tech companies what to do, can we just agree Apple Pay is a completely unnecessary and greedy idea, only to collect money.

There’s nothing about the safety or the user experience that can’t be done with NFC. Nothing.

I have a bank that still doesn’t support Apple Pay, because they don’t agree with Apple’s terms. But the same bank app on Android just painlessly adds your card to NFC and let’s you pay in every shop. Because there are no terms or hidden costs to agree with.

Apple is just being greedy here. They could have made the easiest and safest NFC payment system, for every bank to use. In stead they chose for a lame and evil way to make more money. I’m glad regulators oppose.

So you oppose a company making a profit in an area that competition exists?

 

[frenchcamp49er]

So you oppose a company making a profit in an area that competition exists?

They all want everything for free.

 

[PhoenixDown]

Although I’m usually not a fan of governments telling tech companies what to do, can we just agree Apple Pay is a completely unnecessary and greedy idea, only to collect money.

I disagree.

Apple created a system that doesn't just use NFC as a payment mechanism, it also created a way to transmit the payment details through a one time use token between the card issuer and merchant. This significantly cuts down on credit card fraud which is a major issue for many people to this day.

When people think of Apple, they think 'security'. To open NFC to third parties -- which may not have anywhere near the behind the scenes protections Apple Pay has implemented, is disingenious and possibly damaging to their brand.

 

[I7guy]

Seems like this is profit motivated, not functionality motivated.

 

[_Spinn_]

If this happens I can see the big banks pulling their support for Wallet/ApplePay and making users use their own apps for everything - similar to how Walmart and Kroger are fighting contactless payments with their respective payment methods. This would end up being a huge pain for the consumer.

 

[boak]

Banks want access to NFC chips on as many smartphones as they can. Apple wants commission from as many transactions as they can.

Let the market decide who has the upper hand. Do people switch phones because of no contactless payment or do people switch banks because of no Apple Pay? If it’s the former, Apple will open up NFC. Let the market work and speak.

 

[I7guy]

Although I’m usually not a fan of governments telling tech companies what to do, can we just agree Apple Pay is a completely unnecessary and greedy idea, only to collect money.

No.

There’s nothing about the safety or the user experience that can’t be done with NFC. Nothing.

That above may not be true.

I have a bank that still doesn’t support Apple Pay, because they don’t agree with Apple’s terms. But the same bank app on Android just painlessly adds your card to NFC and let’s you pay in every shop. Because there are no terms or hidden costs to agree with.

That's the banks' problem not Apples.

Apple is just being greedy here. They could have made the easiest and safest NFC payment system, for every bank to use. In stead they chose for a lame and evil way to make more money. I’m glad regulators oppose.

Okay. Maybe next the government will force you to open up your house to people who really need a place to stay.

 

[frenchcamp49er]

No.

That above may not be true.

That's the banks' problem not Apples.

Okay. Maybe next the government will force you to open up your house to people who really need a place to stay.

Or want to access your camera system for anything they want.

 

[Deguello]

Conversely, who are you to decide what consumers have been asking for?

If consumers want open NFC so much, they're free to buy other phones since it's a free market. I'm not asking you to go away. I'm just pointing out that the market is working fine on its own in pushing manufacturers to include features consumers want, therefore this shouldn't be an issue that requires regulators to get involved.

What were you saying when people were calling for bigger iPhones and Apple wasn’t delivering? Should they just have bought other phones?

 

[frenchcamp49er]

Banks want access to NFC chips on as many smartphones as they can. Apple wants commission from as many transactions as they can.

Let the market decide who has the upper hand. Do people switch phones because of no contactless payment or do people switch banks because of no Apple Pay? If it’s the former, Apple will open up NFC. Let the market work and speak.

I just switch banks as the would not join the Apple Card program. I know of others who have done the same. Side note, the bank was bought by another back that uses the Apple Card program. I really dont want to have more than one app to use my debit or credit cards. If I cant use Apple Pay I'll get a card that allows me to.

 

[boak]

What were you saying when people were calling for bigger iPhones and Apple wasn’t delivering? Should they just have bought other phones?

Yes. And the market spoke, so Apple caved and made bigger iPhones. Free market is alive.

 

[CarlJ]

Why should iOS users be at a disadvantage?

If iOS users in Australia want it, then they should be imploring Apple to add it, not making their government legally require Apple to add it. If I want a restaurant to add pizza to their menu, I don’t go to the government and get them to pass laws requiring the restaurant to serve pizza.

 

[Deguello]

Yes. And the market spoke, so Apple caved and made bigger iPhones. Free market is alive.

Free market doesn’t imply that people shouldn’t voice their concerns about missing features, though. Non sequitur. Kind of silly to suggest that people leave the brand they prefer rather than alert the brand to their desires, but you do you.

 

[kerr]

As an Australian, I trust Apple more than I do Australian politicians, regardless of their political persuasion.

 

[GM…]

Not fond of having the NFC chip compromised by any government or third party.

Third-party applications can already use Touch ID and Face ID for authentication. How is opening up NFC for others different? Any references explaining this would be helpful.

 

[SactoGuy18]

Ironically, QR-code based payment systems have been making big inroads in recent years. Alipay in China and PayPay and LINE Pay in Japan have become tremendously popular, especially now with most cellphones having decent quality rear cameras to read QR codes. Maybe the people who created the now-shelved CurrentC system, which is QR code based, was just before their time.

 

[boak]

Free market doesn’t imply that people shouldn’t voice their concerns about missing features, though. Non sequitur. Kind of silly to suggest that people leave the brand they prefer rather than alert the brand to their desires, but you do you.

What exactly do you mean by alert here?

To me, it’s the customers’ money. Apple knew people were switching to other brands for bigger phones and so they made big phones. They received the alert just fine. No regulator was required to compel Apple to make big phones.

 

[GM…]

I have to say, I can understand arguments about opening up app stores on the iPhone. But I would rather they left the NFC chip and wallet system alone and in the hands of Apple as personally I feel it’s secure, and use it a lot. I don’t live in Australia but I know when one country makes a rule it can spread to others

Are Google Pay and Samsung Pay less secure?

 

[boak]

Ironically, QR-code based payment systems have been making big inroads in recent years. Alipay in China and PayPay and LINE Pay in Japan have become tremendously popular, especially now with most cellphones having decent quality rear cameras to read QR codes. Maybe the people who created the now-shelved CurrentC system, which is QR code based, was just before their time.

Just shows that Apple Pay has competition - NFC-based and QR code-based.

 

[GM…]

Ironically, QR-code based payment systems have been making big inroads in recent years. Alipay in China and PayPay and LINE Pay in Japan have become tremendously popular, especially now with most cellphones having decent quality rear cameras to read QR codes. Maybe the people who created the now-shelved CurrentC system, which is QR code based, was just before their time.

Yes. It’s becoming common even in India. Apple Pay, on the other hand is still unavailable, due to regulatory issues.

 

[Deguello]

What exactly do you mean by alert here?

To me, it’s the customers’ money. Apple knew people were switching to other brands for bigger phones and so they made big phones. They received the alert just fine. No regulator was required to compel Apple to make big phones.

Complaints. Posts on social media. Delaying upgrades. Any number of things, even apart from changing brands, can alert a company that their customers aren’t happy with its decision.

I didn’t say regulators were required. As I said before, I hope the free market views here aren’t limited to Apple products and more people want less government involvement in markets.

 

[SactoGuy18]

Yes. It’s becoming common even in India. Apple Pay, on the other hand is still unavailable, due to regulatory issues.

Walmart here in the USA was the main proponent for CurrentC. When CurrentC failed, Walmart just folded it into the Walmart Pay section of the Walmart app for iOS and Android.

 

[gaximus]

Why should iOS users be at a disadvantage?

Because its our choice, we could change to Android if we think we are at too much of a disadvantage.