AW S watch untethered?

[BarracksSi]

Sticking with the AW vs. fitness gadget tangent…

AW and Garmin/Suunto/etc are "competitors" in the sense of "competing" for the space on my wrist.

I have rarely worn my Garmin since getting my AW. I'll be fair and say that this model, a Forerunner 410, is discontinued and has no chance of receiving texts or emails (let alone anything more). The most I've worn it lately was to see how it compares with the AW, and for me, they're close enough.

Where the 410 loses is in its clunky size, its fitness-gadget-only sense of style, its terrible interface, and its inability to do anything else.

I still think the 410, and other similar GPS/HR/ANT+ devices, are great workout computers. I don't think they're very good at anything else.

I took this third pic to compare what I need to wear for each device to read my HR during a workout. It's not a great representation of today's tech, though, because I could pair a Bluetooth HR strap with the AW and get one of the new Garmins with optical HR.

 

[jasie02]

All you have to do is read the articles with every new device release. It's pretty obvious.

You are effectively saying that point and shoot digital camera and mp3 player manufacturers had nothing to worry about when the iPhone was released.

What is obvious, I don't understand, Mr "Expert and know what I don't know"?

 

[zhenya]

What is obvious, I don't understand, Mr "Expert and know what I don't know"?

It's you making the fairly outrageous claim that the AW doesn't compete or intend to compete with fitness watches, to which I am likening your argument to saying that camera and mp3 player makers also had nothing to worry about because they weren't competing with a 'phone.' Give us something to go on to sway us to see your point.

 

[jasie02]

It's you making the fairly outrageous claim that the AW doesn't compete or intend to compete with fitness watches, to which I am likening your argument to saying that camera and mp3 player makers also had nothing to worry about because they weren't competing with a 'phone.' Give us something to go on to sway us to see your point.

Dude, if you are going to jump into someone else's, who you never meet, conversation, when other people are talking, at least be nice and don't act like an anti-social never know how to talk to people person. Your attitude don't desired any answer at all.

 

[matt9013]

Based on what you are saying here I have a feeling you don't follow the wearable market that closely. All those players you've mentioned are petrified of what Apple will eventually do because they are definitely a risk to swallow up nearly all the profits.

Yes, Garmin makes a better fitness watch than Apple right now, but they've been doing it for years and they are focusing on one thing. Apple is pretty darn close in their first iteration where fitness was really an afterthought. There is no question that once the battery life and UI concerns are taken care of many current fitness watch owners will switch to Apple.

I agree, I mean look at the Fitbit Blaze. You can't get anymore AW like which is a good thing as Fitbit needs to get with the times. Fitbit still outshines AW in the fitness department though.

Once Apple gets a good health/fitness tracker app, I can see a lot of people ditching Fitbit's and Garmin's for the AW. Apple just needs more time to work on the fitness end of the AW.

 

[canvasback13]

They are all competing for wallet and wrist share. Smart watches are trying add good fitness features and the fitness/activity watches are adding the smart watch features. This lines are blurring quickly. I hadn't seen the Fitbit Blaze, I just looked it up, and it couldn't make this point better.

People considering a blaze or Garmin Fenix are most likely also considering an Apple Watch an option. At this point it depends on what features are the priority. They are certainly competing.

Completely untethering is probably very far away. Untethering it for fitness is doable and would be good for user experience. It would be great to be able to go for a run, have music through wireless headphones and have accurate route tracking with no phone. The need to have a phone is cumbersome. You have hold it, use an arm band or there are some belly band type holders. These are all functional, but a bit annoying. I would certainly give up calls and texts for the 30-45 minutes i run.

 

[lordofthereef]

I am thinking what the OP would like is more/better options when not linked to a phone. (or maybe I am reading his request as such since these are the things I want lol)

GPS without a phone
Music and/or music streaming without a phone
Real time (and accurate) run/cycle tracking

Right now the watch is mostly just a tiny notification center on the wrist, which is fine for some, but it can certainly be expanded.

 

[Laserducky]

I am thinking what the OP would like is more/better options when not linked to a phone. (or maybe I am reading his request as such since these are the things I want lol)

GPS without a phone
Music and/or music streaming without a phone
Real time (and accurate) run/cycle tracking

Right now the watch is mostly just a tiny notification center on the wrist, which is fine for some, but it can certainly be expanded.

In addition to your list : I wish we had more apps available for the watch AND they loaded faster. Notifications are excellent on the watch but the current crop of apps are slow to load and this sometimes kills the experience. Its a first gen product so hopefully they'll have this fixed in future iterations.

Cheers !

 

[tperry]

GPS without a phone

Biggest issue I have had with my Surge is that the GPS REALLY sucks the battery down. I used mine for my trike rides (Catrike 5.5.9) and it REALLY pulled the battery noticeably. After a ride, I was having to hit a charger within 12 hours (max time I was able to go without putting it on charge).
I really don't see a slim (as it is now) AW with GPS unless there are some major battery advances made.

 

[pika2000]

Sorry flat tire kills it for me...rushed product x 2 generations! It is round is about the only argument you can make. Plastic back. Where the band attacks to body is cheap. Poor fitness due to horrible heart rate sensor accuracy. Poor Android Wear...i used one recently...OMG, horrible interface. If you have Gen1, then that processor is just bad.

Flat tire: it looks weird at first, but I never receive any comments about the flat tire from regular people, only from the nerds parroting tech blogs.
Plastic back: definitely a design flaw with the way the bands are connected. First gen product, what can I say.
Heart rate sensor accuracy: Can't comment much as you can only know it's inaccurate if you have a second 100% accurate device to compare it to, and I don't have one. Maybe an issue, but I use the watch mainly for notifications.
Android wear: it has its issues, but I still think it's better than having tiny icons on a screen ala AW. Wouldn't say one is "horrible" vs the other. Each has its own design language.
First gen: Yup, I have the first gen. Bad processor? I am not playing Crisis on a watch, so it doesn't really affect my usage. Battery life is good for 1.5 days. Google has since updated the firmware that it is as usable as any of the modern Android wear watches.

 

[lordofthereef]

Biggest issue I have had with my Surge is that the GPS REALLY sucks the battery down. I used mine for my trike rides (Catrike 5.5.9) and it REALLY pulled the battery noticeably. After a ride, I was having to hit a charger within 12 hours (max time I was able to go without putting it on charge).
I really don't see a slim (as it is now) AW with GPS unless there are some major battery advances made.

A sport device (for me) doesn't need to be slim. Of course that would require that Apple stop using the term "sport" as "entry level" for this product line.

I certainly don't need all day gps, by any stretch. But having to rely on a phone 100% for things like this defeats the purpose of such a. Device.

 

[tperry]

A sport device (for me) doesn't need to be slim. Of course that would require that Apple stop using the term "sport" as "entry level" for this product line.

For me, a watch should be able to be worn daily at any time.. not just when you are participating in the "sport". I don't think they advertise the AW as a sport device.. but as a watch.

I certainly don't need all day gps, by any stretch. But having to rely on a phone 100% for things like this defeats the purpose of such a. Device.

My point was, that you either have to have a large device (for the larger battery) currently (due to battery limitations) or you link to the phone.
You won't like the new FitBit Blaze... since it has "Connected GPS" - from their site

Connect Fitbit Blaze with the GPS on your phone to map your routes and see run stats like pace and duration on display.

If you want a sport device with GPS, you get a Surge, Suunto or Garmin Fenix. But with them you don't have the abilities that you do with the watch. I honestly don't think we will see a svelte (which the AW is) watch in the near future that has cellular (which is something I've seen wishing for), GPS, streaming media, etc (in other words, a replacement for a phone).

 

[BarracksSi]

Biggest issue I have had with my Surge is that the GPS REALLY sucks the battery down. I used mine for my trike rides (Catrike 5.5.9) and it REALLY pulled the battery noticeably. After a ride, I was having to hit a charger within 12 hours (max time I was able to go without putting it on charge).
I really don't see a slim (as it is now) AW with GPS unless there are some major battery advances made.

Yup.

I figured out my Garmin's battery life while using GPS is maybe ten percent the duration of being on standby. That is, it'll last over a week of just being a watch, but it'll be empty after eight hours of recording GPS.

Applying the same idea to the AW, I'd guess that, from a full battery, it would last for 60-75 minutes of a GPS-tracked workout.

Like you say, the AW would need to be a lot fatter, or use totally revolutionary battery technology, to make onboard GPS practical.

 

[Thai]

Flat tire: it looks weird at first, but I never receive any comments about the flat tire from regular people, only from the nerds parroting tech blogs.
Plastic back: definitely a design flaw with the way the bands are connected. First gen product, what can I say.
Heart rate sensor accuracy: Can't comment much as you can only know it's inaccurate if you have a second 100% accurate device to compare it to, and I don't have one. Maybe an issue, but I use the watch mainly for notifications.
Android wear: it has its issues, but I still think it's better than having tiny icons on a screen ala AW. Wouldn't say one is "horrible" vs the other. Each has its own design language.
First gen: Yup, I have the first gen. Bad processor? I am not playing Crisis on a watch, so it doesn't really affect my usage. Battery life is good for 1.5 days. Google has since updated the firmware that it is as usable as any of the modern Android wear watches.

Parroting tech blogs...i have used Moto360. Bad design. Only owners self-rationalize it away.

Heart rate sensor is important for fitness and calculating energy expenditure. If you don't care for fitness aspect, then why get it? Might as well get Casio or Timex.

Tiny icons...easy fix...SETTINGS...REDUCE MOTION ON.

Email Ti and ask them if they support that processor...or better yet, how long ago did they stop supporting it...hint: Moto literally took that processor out of the trash can and put it into Moto360.

Battery life 1.5 days? With Ambient ON? Not what i got with Moto360...not even close! You pulling my leg?

 

[pika2000]

Parroting tech blogs...i have used Moto360. Bad design. Only owners self-rationalize it away.

Heart rate sensor is important for fitness and calculating energy expenditure. If you don't care for fitness aspect, then why get it? Might as well get Casio or Timex.

Tiny icons...easy fix...SETTINGS...REDUCE MOTION ON.

Email Ti and ask them if they support that processor...or better yet, how long ago did they stop supporting it...hint: Moto literally took that processor out of the trash can and put it into Moto360.

Battery life 1.5 days? With Ambient ON? Not what i got with Moto360...not even close! You pulling my leg?

Only tech blogs refer to the design as flat tire, and thus people saying so are parroting those blogs. I have many lay people saying compliments on my Moto 360 (most thought it to be the AW), and none of them even note the "flat tire" design.

Like I said, I use it for notification. If heart rate is so important for you, get a fitness tracker like fitbit.

Regardless of the age of the processor, it runs fine and still supported to the latest version of Android wear. It's a watch, not a gaming PC.

1.5 days. I don't play games on my watch, nor touching it all the time. I just go about my daily activities. Why do I need ambient on when I'm not staring at the watch all the time? You sound like girls that have their phones on max brightness and screen on all the time, and then complain about short battery life.

 

[JayLenochiniMac]

Plastic back: definitely a design flaw with the way the bands are connected. First gen product, what can I say.

That's not a good excuse as they've kept the plastic back (as well as the tacky gold trim around the crown) in the second gen Moto 360. They simply don't know good design, period.

 

[pika2000]

That's not a good excuse as they've kept the plastic back (as well as the tacky gold trim around the crown) in the second gen Moto 360. They simply don't know good design, period.

The design flaw was more about how the bands are connected. On the first gen, due to the way the bands are connected, due to pressure, it can crack the base through time (although it's cosmetic and does not affect functionality). The second gen changed the way the bands are connected and this is no longer an issue. I didn't even realize it's plastic until I noticed the crack. Unless you are wearing yours upside down of course, but I wear mine normally.

You keep talking about gold trim around the crown. You do know you can get a black body one, right?
For a company that was owned by Google (people not really known for design) and now Lenovo (also not particularly exemplary for design per se, although they have few good ones of their laptops), I still give credit to Moto for going outside the grain and do a round-face smartwatch, and not a completely bad one (still looks better than LG's and Samsung's).

I still prefer a round faced watch vs a square one. I really hope Apple would do a round face AW since Android Wear has quite limited functionalities with iPhone.

 

[Thai]

Only tech blogs refer to the design as flat tire, and thus people saying so are parroting those blogs. I have many lay people saying compliments on my Moto 360 (most thought it to be the AW), and none of them even note the "flat tire" design.

Like I said, I use it for notification. If heart rate is so important for you, get a fitness tracker like fitbit.

Regardless of the age of the processor, it runs fine and still supported to the latest version of Android wear. It's a watch, not a gaming PC.

1.5 days. I don't play games on my watch, nor touching it all the time. I just go about my daily activities. Why do I need ambient on when I'm not staring at the watch all the time? You sound like girls that have their phones on max brightness and screen on all the time, and then complain about short battery life.

Flat tire is a BAD design. Period. You can rationalize it all you want...and the sad part is that you do NOT even use the ambient light sensor! That is a bad purchase!

Yeah, lets see how long Moto supports 360 Gen1.

Lots of rationalization on your end there....

 

[pika2000]

Flat tire is a BAD design. Period. You can rationalize it all you want...and the sad part is that you do NOT even use the ambient light sensor! That is a bad purchase!

Yeah, lets see how long Moto supports 360 Gen1.

Lots of rationalization on your end there....

Not using ambient light sensor? Do you know the function of an ambient light sensor? The LCD can show varying brightness, thus the ambient light sensor is used when I activate the face. Ambient light sensor != the ambient on feature. Are you pulling straws now?

The moto 360 gen 1 is still getting updated for every Android wear update. Still better than those Samsung Tizen watches. By the time it's no longer supported, I expect I will be sporting an AW anyway.

Err, what do you want me to say? I am using and liking my Moto 360. I use it everyday, and can't leave home without it. Just because you are on the hate bandwagon, doesn't mean other people must follow your opinion. I still get compliments from people, and it fulfills my need. Even better, I bought mine for $150.

 

[JayLenochiniMac]

You keep talking about gold trim around the crown. You do know you can get a black body one, right?

It makes no sense though. They kept the gold ring on the silver body in the men's 42mm, but it's absent from the ladies 42mm. Yes, I do see they've fixed it for the black 46mm model.

 

[lordofthereef]

For me, a watch should be able to be worn daily at any time.. not just when you are participating in the "sport". I don't think they advertise the AW as a sport device.. but as a watch.

I am unsre how the simple existence of a gps chip[ would stop you from wearing the watch allday, though. Unless I have a fundamental misunderstanding of how these hardwares (currently) work, it would only be active when the user calls upon it. If one was added to your AW right now, presumably you could never use it and your battery life and usage patterns would remain exactly as they are today, no?

AW already isn't the thickest watch on the planet either, so I imagine thickness wouldn't be a problem. I have actuyally seen more arguments (albeit few on both ends) arguing the watch could/should be chunkier rather than smaller. Anyway, I wouldn't be against a slightly thicker watch.

As far as the AW S sport, I would argue they really do advertise it as a sport device in various videos and still shots (pics/video of a runner and a biker in the form of and advertisement imply, IMO, this is asuitable for sporting). It even has the word "sport" in the title. I am unsure how anyone can look at the Sport model and say "this is probably not a sport device".

But to be evcen more clear, if the AWS is NOT intended to be a sport device, I would like an Apple watch that is.

 

[tperry]

I am unsre how the simple existence of a gps chip[ would stop you from wearing the watch allday, though. Unless I have a fundamental misunderstanding of how these hardwares (currently) work, it would only be active when the user calls upon it. If one was added to your AW right now, presumably you could never use it and your battery life and usage patterns would remain exactly as they are today, no?

And as soon as you used it as a sports/fitness GPS tracker, within a short period of time (considering that the Surge has a 7 day normal use life and 10 hours GPS use and is MUCH larger than the AW) you would probably be looking for a charger to plug the AW onto every 3 hours or so if using it for a 2 hour run/ride.
The thing is.. it's NOT a sport fitness tracker. It's a watch. Folks that are wanting it to do all also want it to "look good". I am pretty sure Apple would not come out with a watch with a GPS that was needing to be charged after 3-4 hours of use of the GPS or it was dead. With current technology you can't have your cake and eat it too.
The addition of a GPS chip (and hell, even a cellular radio) isn't that big of a deal.. it's getting the power to make those real world useful which is the big deal.

 

[lordofthereef]

And as soon as you used it, within a short period of time (considering that the Surge has a 7 day normal use life and 10 hours GPS use and is MUCH larger than the AW) you would probably be looking for a charger to plug the AW onto every 3 hours or so if using it for a 2 hour run/ride.
The thing is.. it's NOT a sport fitness tracker. It's a watch. Folks that are wanting it to do all also want it to "look good". I am pretty sure Apple would not come out with a watch with a GPS that was needing to be charged after 3-4 hours of use of the GPS or it was dead. With current technology you can't have your cake and eat it too.

I added to my original post. I will paste what I added here.

I respect your opinion... I am still just teling you what I would want in a next gen device to get me to buy one. It's simple. It could launch spaceships into the air and it wouldn't matter to me because it doesn't fit my current needs. And by needs I mean wants. AW is a luxury item, for me.

AW already isn't the thickest watch on the planet either, so I imagine thickness wouldn't be a problem. I have actuyally seen more arguments (albeit few on both ends) arguing the watch could/should be chunkier rather than smaller. Anyway, I wouldn't be against a slightly thicker watch.

As far as the AW S sport, I would argue they really do advertise it as a sport device in various videos and still shots (pics/video of a runner and a biker in the form of and advertisement imply, IMO, this is asuitable for sporting). It even has the word "sport" in the title. I am unsure how anyone can look at the Sport model and say "this is probably not a sport device".

But to be evcen more clear, if the AWS is NOT intended to be a sport device, I would like an Apple watch that is.

 

[tperry]

I respect your opinion... I am still just teling you what I would want in a next gen device to get me to buy one. It's simple. It could launch spaceships into the air and it wouldn't matter to me because it doesn't fit my current needs. And by needs I mean wants. AW is a luxury item, for me.

My point is, with todays battery technology, it will have to be substantially larger to give the level of user satisfaction (in use) that Apple would want. Hell, I'd love to have GPS built into it also, but since I actually ride a trike, I can put my phone in several locations on it and not worry about it. I'm realistic enough to know that to get it to work as a fitness watch with GPS, heart rate, etc it's going to be much larger - and uglier. The Surge (and the Blaze) are not the most svelte things to wrap around your wrist - and the only time I wear the surge is when I was riding - because otherwise it's butt-bottomed fugly. Apple positioned it as a watch.. not a sports tracker/device. Just because it has "sport" in the name does not mean it's USED for sports. Heck, my wife's Fusion is the sport model. Does that mean I should expect to be about to go out and race it on the track or get involved in rally races with it?

But, until battery technology advances (or they design a new power method to provide juice to it) you most likely will not be seeing features like that.

 

[lordofthereef]

My point is, with todays battery technology, it will have to be substantially larger to give the level of user satisfaction (in use) that Apple would want. Hell, I'd love to have GPS built into it also, but since I actually ride a trike, I can put my phone in several locations on it and not worry about it. I'm realistic enough to know that to get it to work as a fitness watch with GPS, heart rate, etc it's going to be much larger - and uglier. The Surge (and the Blaze) are not the most svelte things to wrap around your wrist - and the only time I wear the surge is when I was riding - because otherwise it's butt-bottomed fugly. Apple positioned it as a watch.. not a sports tracker/device. Just because it has "sport" in the name does not mean it's USED for sports. Heck, my wife's Fusion is the sport model. Does that mean I should expect to be about to go out and race it on the track or get involved in rally races with it?

But, until battery technology advances (or they design a new power method to provide juice to it) you most likely will not be seeing features like that.

I get youre oint. I am still just saying what I would want from the device, nothing more.

I have seen some intirguing battery extender bads (where the links actually contain battery cells and claim to extend the battery to double), which could be a future option. Or not, I don't know.

I wouldn't mind a larger device geared towards sport users. Apple has tapped the luxury watch market. I don't think tapping the sport market full on is bad idea.