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Bad Apple

LV426

LV426

macrumors 68000
Original poster
Jan 22, 2013
1,981
2,543
Apple have the barefaced cheek to advertise movies for sale, and ‘build your collection’ but make no guarantee you will be able to download them any time in the future.

I wanted to watch one of my purchased movies today and it has gone. Bad Apple. You really need to sort this out. Just because it’s no longer available for sale, it doesn’t mean I’m happy you’ve removed the file from your servers. This is a very sharp practise. Bad Apple.
 
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Check your purchased list. It has happened before but it’s very rare for a film to be completely removed.

Is it a film from Universal?
 
steve23094 said:
Check your purchased list. It has happened before but it’s very rare for a film to be completely removed.

Is it a film from Universal?
Click to expand...
Thanks. It's there in my purchase list (UK iTunes account): Lilya 4 Ever. The seller is listed as being 'Metrodome Distribution Limited', so unlikely to be Universal.
 
LV426 said:
Thanks. It's there in my purchase list (UK iTunes account): Lilya 4 Ever. The seller is listed as being 'Metrodome Distribution Limited', so unlikely to be Universal.
Click to expand...

DAMN!!! This is EXACTLY what happened to me with a film from a 'tiny' distribution company. It seems to be these tiny ones that 'remove' the file.
Of my other films that have been removed off the store, they are still playable on my Apple TV and can be downloaded still.
Did you make a download back up? Whilst i'm not keen on leaving loads of iTunes films downloaded on my Mac, I download each film that I love and drag and drop it onto a USB Stick in case a film disappears!

Get in touch with Apple and see what they can do.

Apple seem to be the very best of the film services in downloads etc. If you look at AMAZON's small print, they state that you can only download a film just TWICE and that's it. How useless is that!!! I'd NEVER in a million years buy a download film from AMAZON.
 
BODYBUILDERPAUL said:
Did you make a download back up? Whilst i'm not keen on leaving loads of iTunes films downloaded on my Mac, I download each film that I love and drag and drop it onto a USB Stick in case a film disappears!

Get in touch with Apple and see what they can do.

Apple seem to be the very best of the film services in downloads etc. If you look at AMAZON's small print, they state that you can only download a film just TWICE and that's it. How useless is that!!! I'd NEVER in a million years buy a download film from AMAZON.
Click to expand...
I believe I do have a copy of the file on disk somewhere, but frankly it's 2018! We shouldn't need to be inconvenienced in such a manner. How would I view that movie on an iPad if I wanted to, for example? Grrrr. Amazon seem even worse from what you say.
 
LV426 said:
I believe I do have a copy of the file on disk somewhere, but frankly it's 2018! We shouldn't need to be inconvenienced in such a manner. How would I view that movie on an iPad if I wanted to, for example? Grrrr. Amazon seem even worse from what you say.
Click to expand...

I TOTALLY agree and yes, the crazy thing is with so much piracy of films, YOU HAD THE DECANCY to buy the film and the distributor STOLE it away from you - in reality, they are the pirates!
It looks terrible on Apple when this happens and ruins or tarnishes their reputation. Hopefully they have agreements to keep files from the Hollywood players aa
1. 4K iTunes movies ARE NOT downloadable
2. iTunes Extras are not downloadable (as from 2014)
With that being the case, it is illegal that they take those away due to the fact that you've bought them.
Certainly I have friends who only own a iPhone and Apple TV and do not own a computer. There's no way that they can download films and quite frankly, would not go to the extra trouble of doing it - they are career people, work hard, play hard and have many outdoor interests - like you and me, they don't think 'Gosh, I must download that film from Itunes that I paid a lot of money for, just in case they steal it'.

Also, I've used Apple Homesharing of iTunes films on and off for 3 years and man, for me, it's not a very nice experience - going from MacBook to ATV via wifi is flaky - sometimes it's flawless, other times several pauses of buffering which ruins the film for me!
 
steve23094 said:
No, it's not.

I would think that by now everybody is clear this is how a service like iTunes works (your licence is effectively a long term rental).
Click to expand...

So where is the small print? Where on the iTunes page does it say this? Under the download button, there should be small print saying 'Apple recommends that you download this film for future reference'.

I havn't been able to see any small print on the iTunes Film Store about this being a long term rental.

I'm sure that whilst Eddy was negotiating hard with Hollywood, he'll of made an agreement about keeping files on the servers even when the film is taken away from being sold or available for rental.
 
amazon are awful , i made the mistake of buying a film on there that i couldn't get on itunes

the quality of pq and sq was dreadful plus despite me having infinity 2 the pic keeps breaking up with artefacts

doesn't happen with any other app , just amazon
 
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steve23094 said:
Check your purchased list. It has happened before but it’s very rare for a film to be completely removed.?
Click to expand...

Not really rare, but mostly expired..... There can be time, which has happened to me, where a movie has been re-leased, or instead been removed from the store, but only available as a "bundle" pack

Apple has the right to do this, your using thir service, but we still think we should be able to watch whenever we want? You don't own those movies, you never did..

There*should* be something on Apple website, because this confuses everyone..... Until you psychically talk to Apple that is, or realize your purchase cannot be played.

If Apple music songs get removed/expired, why would it be different to movies?

Same result, but different thinking
 
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BODYBUILDERPAUL said:
So where is the small print? Where on the iTunes page does it say this? Under the download button, there should be small print saying 'Apple recommends that you download this film for future reference'.

I havn't been able to see any small print on the iTunes Film Store about this being a long term rental.
Click to expand...


You haven’t looked very hard then. Available under the Terms and Conditions for the iTunes Store, which is accessible from the bottom of the page:
You may be able to redownload previously acquired Content (“Redownload”) to your devices that are signed in with the same Apple ID (“Associated Devices”). You can see Content types available for Redownload in your Home Country at https://support.apple.com/en-gb/HT204632. Content may not be available for Redownload if that Content is no longer offered on our Services.
Click to expand...

And Apple does recommend you download and backup copies. From the same T&Cs:
It is your responsibility not to lose, destroy or damage Content once downloaded. We encourage you to back up your Content regularly.
Click to expand...

I’m gobsmacked if this is news to you.
 
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steve23094 said:
You haven’t looked very hard then. Available under the Terms and Conditions for the iTunes Store, which is accessible from the bottom of the page:

And Apple does recommend you download and backup copies. From the same T&Cs:
Click to expand...

Right. A lawyer's paradise. How about this... Apple, don't remove the fecking thing from the service just because you feel like it. People pay good money for this stuff. Apple TV doesn't come with a backup option, and you can't actually download and backup your expensive 4K movies bought from iTunes. So your argument is dead in the water.
 
LV426 said:
Right. A lawyer's paradise. How about this... Apple, don't remove the fecking thing from the service just because you feel like it. People pay good money for this stuff. Apple TV doesn't come with a backup option, and you can't actually download and backup your expensive 4K movies bought from iTunes. So your argument is dead in the water.
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It's not an argument, it's written in black and white in the Terms & Conditions you agreed to in iTunes, TVOS and your iOS devices. If you don't like it don't use the service.

If you didn't read them then that's your fault. But even if you couldn't be bothered then you must have been living under a rock for the last decade because all download and streaming services operate the same way. Nobody promises your purchases are available in perpetuity.
 
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LV426 said:
Well done. You were asked to clarify how someone can follow Apple’s (and your parroted) advice to download a movie, and you then link to an article that shows downloading 4K movies is not allowed. Some fantastic logic going on there!
Click to expand...

And what would be the point of answering a question everybody knows the answer to? You can’t. I’m merely pointing out the likely reasonable explanation posted right here on this website why you cannot.

To mitigate not being able to download 4K:
a) you can download and backup HD copies.
b) it could change in the future. 4K on iTunes has only been available for 5 months.
c) why whinge about something that hasn't even happened yet? Can you name a 4K film removed from Apple’s servers?

I, like most reasonable people, would take free 4K upgrades and cheap prices over downloads any day of the week and twice on Sundays. It’s just people on these forums sometimes like to whinge over stuff they haven’t really thought through.

But back to the issue raised in your original post. You either knew the rules of the game when you signed up so what’s the point of moaning now? It won’t get you anywhere. Or for some inexplicable reason you were not aware how every download and streaming service operates and has done so since their inception. And if that’s the case then I’m speechless.
 
PSA: You do not own digital copies of movies you "purchase" on any of the streaming services. Always buy the disc if you care about ownership.

It is not an apple issues. Technically any of the services could lose any movie at any time.
 
steve23094 said:
It's not an argument, it's written in black and white in the Terms & Conditions you agreed to in iTunes, TVOS and your iOS devices. If you don't like it don't use the service.

If you didn't read them then that's your fault. But even if you couldn't be bothered then you must have been living under a rock for the last decade because all download and streaming services operate the same way. Nobody promises your purchases are available in perpetuity.
Click to expand...

Fair points. Can you now explain then how I can download my iTunes film in 4K and also the iTunes Extras that came with it? I'd love these to be downloaded as a back up.
[doublepost=1519500556][/doublepost]What is amusing is how dishonest the whole of Hollywood is with all of this streaming business. Is there any wonder that people pirate or download for free.
Seriously! There's no wonder many people are no longer buying film and just relying on Amazon or Netflix today!
It's about time that some agreement was made.
 
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BODYBUILDERPAUL said:
Fair points. Can you now explain then how I can download my iTunes film in 4K and also the iTunes Extras that came with it? I'd love these to be downloaded as a back up.
[doublepost=1519500556][/doublepost]What is amusing is how dishonest the whole of Hollywood is with all of this streaming business. Is there any wonder that people pirate or download for free.
Seriously! There's no wonder many people are no longer buying film and just relying on Amazon or Netflix today!
It's about time that some agreement was made.
Click to expand...

You cannot download them for backup. They do not allow you to download them for the whole you do not own it reason.
 
steve23094 said:
To mitigate not being able to download 4K:
a) you can download and backup HD copies.
b) it could change in the future. 4K on iTunes has only been available for 5 months.
c) why whinge about something that hasn't even happened yet? Can you name a 4K film removed from Apple’s servers?

I, like most reasonable people, would take free 4K upgrades and cheap prices over downloads any day of the week and twice on Sundays. It’s just people on these forums sometimes like to whinge over stuff they haven’t really thought through.

But back to the issue raised in your original post. You either knew the rules of the game when you signed up so what’s the point of moaning now? It won’t get you anywhere. Or for some inexplicable reason you were not aware how every download and streaming service operates and has done so since their inception. And if that’s the case then I’m speechless.
Click to expand...

If I ‘BUY’ a 4K movie (that’s the word Apple use on the iTunes Store) I expect to own the right to play it, no less than I own the right to play a physical disk. I will repeat: I am not that fussed if the movie is subsequently withdrawn from sale. What I object to is the movie being withdrawn from streaming or downloading for no good reason. Or requiring additional equipment that may under some circumstances be used as a backup. We are not living in the dark ages here. It’s 2018. Disk space on servers is ridiculously cheap, as is the amount it costs a big player to stream a movie. It doesn’t really matter how Apple have operated their streaming service since its inception. Removing a file from a server is a policy decision, not a technical or financial one. The cloud should be backup enough.

If the phrase ‘Bad Apple’ appears often enough it might persuade Apple to change tack. It certainly worked as far as the battery fiasco is concerned, even though I had little argument with Apple’s approach on that particular matter.
 
LV426 said:
Removing a file from a server is a policy decision, not a technical or financial one. The cloud should be backup enough.
Click to expand...

It’s almost always a licensee decision. If the rights holder wants it removed for any reason or the rights holder changes from one company to another there is not a lot Apple can do. Apple doesn’t own the films either.
 
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Stuff like this is why nobody should feel bad about pirating stuff. Perfect example here, of people trying to play by the rules, and then get screwed over anyway. Whether it's technically legal or not for Apple/studios to do this is besides the point, doesn't make it right.
 
BODYBUILDERPAUL said:
So where is the small print? Where on the iTunes page does it say this? Under the download button, there should be small print saying 'Apple recommends that you download this film for future reference'.

I havn't been able to see any small print on the iTunes Film Store about this being a long term rental.

I'm sure that whilst Eddy was negotiating hard with Hollywood, he'll of made an agreement about keeping files on the servers even when the film is taken away from being sold or available for rental.
Click to expand...
You don't even own the film if you bought it on a disc. You bought the disc but only a lisence to watch it on the disc. You dont own the movie itself so it is illegal to rip the movie and then sell it to somebody else or whatever else
 
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LV426 said:
Right. A lawyer's paradise. How about this... Apple, don't remove the fecking thing from the service just because you feel like it. People pay good money for this stuff. Apple TV doesn't come with a backup option, and you can't actually download and backup your expensive 4K movies bought from iTunes. So your argument is dead in the water.
Click to expand...
And how is it apples choice to lose a movie rights? Is it Netflix's fault Disney nullified it's deal and is now making their own service? It it apples fault that Disney refuses to play ball to allow 4k movies on iTunes for $19.99?
 
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