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Be VERY afraid - Northwest Delta

If prices went down the closer you get to flight time then everyone would wait to the last minute to book their flight and it would be chaos!

And why wouldn't my empty seat today be worth more than an empty seat two weeks from now? Your grandmother just died and you need to get to Denver? I can get you there in time, but you'll have to pay!!!!

kind of a mean example but that's capitalism. And the airlines know there are people who will need these last minute tickets and hold some. They have gotten very good at pricing over the years.

Writing to the TSA themselves wont do anything. It's gotta come from above them.
 
But the airlines *aren't* very good at pricing. They provide what is widely considered sub-standard service and are despite all their gamesmanship and government subsidies they're *still* going bankrupt.

The first entrepreneur who starts up a "luxury" airline - easy-to-understand pricing, balanced schedules, one well-cared-for class, bypassing security hassles and generally making flying a pleasant experience will be the new winner.

Cut-throat priced, TSA-laden, no legroom busses-with-wings are killing travel.

This summer I'm taking the train. Literally.
 
American Airlines introduced that "more room in coach" and the easy pricing plan in the 90's and both were an abysmal failure. The airline lost money like crazy and they had to go back to the familiar just to stay in business. The majority of the public just isn't willing to pay the premium.

And they are good at pricing which is shown by the fact that they aren't out of business yet . Those who were not good at pricing are going out, (ATA, Aloha, Skybus (esp.), Champion, Frontier, etc). Expensive tickets do not sell because the Low Cost Carriers (Jetblue, Airtran, southwest) sell cheap tickets then go out of business and the legacy carriers have to sell at the same price to compete. So instead of being able to pass the cost of fuel onto the customer, they simply take it out of their employee's wages.
 
That doesn't sound like correct pricing, it sounds like a flawed business model. There needs to be a major reorganization of the business of flying. Regardless of what we argue here the airlines are in trouble. They can't get where they say they're going, do it on time, or with any sense of satisfaction on the part of their customers - even those with cheap tickets.
 
Northwest and Delta failed to learn from the lesson given by US Airways and America West - get the pilot groups on the same page before merging. The pilot situation at US Airways is a mess, and I bet it'll be the same at Delta.
 
joeshell383 said:
I disagree with most of your post, and the combined airline will be called Delta.
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Thanks for telling us that you disagree, but if you made the effort to post and tell everyone, you might as well tell us why you disagree with me.
 
Thanatoast said:
That doesn't sound like correct pricing, it sounds like a flawed business model. There needs to be a major reorganization of the business of flying. Regardless of what we argue here the airlines are in trouble. They can't get where they say they're going, do it on time, or with any sense of satisfaction on the part of their customers - even those with cheap tickets.
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Do you think customers even care whether or not they have a comfortable seat, or if it just cost them less?
 
StealthRider said:
I would gladly pay a little more for a little bit more comfort. I choose my flights based on timing, connections, and type of aircraft, not necessarily based on the price.
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How much more? It'd have to be enough to make up the difference in the lesser amount of seats in the aircraft configurations for the airlines to actually do it.

The only time when I maybe choose my flights based on comfort is when I go overseas. I'm planning a trip to Asia, and Singapore Airlines is about $200 more than United, but it's worth it to me because it's a long flight. Domestically, since a flight to the west coast is no more than 2 hours from my home airport of Denver and no more than 4 hours to the east coast, it really doesn't matter how comfortable I am. I'd rather spend the extra money while I'm there, and they all pack you in like cattle anyways.
 
Both suck. They deserve each other. The only thing I'm concerned about is my Onepass account and if they'll stay travel partners w. Continental when I'm forced to fly them/it. Want to keep my miles you know;)
 
Thanatoast said:
The first entrepreneur who starts up a "luxury" airline - easy-to-understand pricing, balanced schedules, one well-cared-for class, bypassing security hassles and generally making flying a pleasant experience will be the new winner.
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Part of the problem is that the airlines don't control the security, so that hassle will always be there unless you want to charter your own jet. :)

As I see it, the problem is that the vast majority of people are still booking the cheapest tickets they can find, and therefore the airlines are keeping prices lower than what's reasonable. They're cutting costs in all sorts of ways - usually at the expense of their employees, and simply refuse to raise fares to a level required to keep things running in the black. It just doesn't make sense to me.
 
dmr727 said:
Part of the problem is that the airlines don't control the security, so that hassle will always be there unless you want to charter your own jet. :)
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There are some companies out there, like NetJets, where they are based on fractional ownership-- in other words, you share ownership of a plane with other people, and for the yearly dues you pay, you are allowed a certain amount of hours to fly. I don't know how expensive it is, but it's certainly cheaper than owning your own plane, and my dad flew it with one of his friends, who is a member, and said it was very pleasant.

As I see it, the problem is that the vast majority of people are still booking the cheapest tickets they can find, and therefore the airlines are keeping prices lower than what's reasonable. They're cutting costs in all sorts of ways - usually at the expense of their employees, and simply refuse to raise fares to a level required to keep things running in the black. It just doesn't make sense to me.
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I guess it's a neverending paradigm.
 
iMacZealot said:
There are some companies out there, like NetJets, where they are based on fractional ownership-- in other words, you share ownership of a plane with other people, and for the yearly dues you pay, you are allowed a certain amount of hours to fly.
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Netjets is certainly an option. But it's an expensive one - generally out of the realm of possibility of the majority of people. I know this only because I fly trips for Netjets, and therefore know the costs. The people that can afford to fly a step above the airlines certainly don't have to deal with the crap that regular people do, but the costs aren't incremental. For example, a one way trip from Socal to Seattle on a plane like mine will run close to $20K. That's a huge amount more than a first class ticket on an airline. In other words, there's a large gap between the airlines and the next level.
 
Eos Airlines just filed chapter 11....http://www.eosairlines.com/

With 48 seats in a 757, it was the only airline with an all first class cabin...

They only went overseas from paris to jfk i believe, but even in international flights which are still heavily regulated they were unable to turn a profit because no one will pay for it! They want to be packed in like cattle! It's the only thing they'll pay for!
 
The masses are just not willing to pay extra. jetBlue recently began charging an extra $10-$20 for seats in an exit row, which have the most leg room. I ponied up my $20 on a NY-Denver round trip and had the row all to myself both times. Best 20 bucks ever spent. :D
 
rdowns said:
The masses are just not willing to pay extra. jetBlue recently began charging an extra $10-$20 for seats in an exit row, which have the most leg room. I ponied up my $20 on a NY-Denver round trip and had the row all to myself both times. Best 20 bucks ever spent. :D
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I avoided that cuz of the fee, but a whole row to yourself? Hmm maybe it might be worth it after all :D
 
In any event, you are miles in the air in an aluminum cylinder, targeted by medieval crazy people, maintained by the lowest bidder, controlled by not enough people using old technology, luggage checked by the uncaring and security trying to find plastic guns and who knows what else.

Every now and then, you find out that some of these people that you depend on are disgruntled, stupid, cheap, criminal or crazy.

A more rational transportation system would use high-speed trains for short hauls, reserving air travel to long distance travel.
 
carlgo said:
In any event, you are miles in the air in an aluminum cylinder, targeted by medieval crazy people, maintained by the lowest bidder, controlled by not enough people using old technology, luggage checked by the uncaring and security trying to find plastic guns and who knows what else.

Every now and then, you find out that some of these people that you depend on are disgruntled, stupid, cheap, criminal or crazy.

A more rational transportation system would use high-speed trains for short hauls, reserving air travel to long distance travel.
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Agreed, but unfortunately Amtrak is slow as molasses and expensive. I mean, Amtrak from San Francisco to Los Angeles costs about $100, and takes almost 10 hours. A plane from SFO to LAX costs $40, and takes 1 1/2 hours. Even with the security hassles and etc, it's still 7 hours faster at the least, and $40 cheaper.

The only place Amtrak is worthwhile is between New York City and Washington, DC and Boston. And even then, I'd take Greyhound. $20 versus $70, and only a couple hours longer.
 
Delta and Northwest Merge, Creating Premier Global Airline

Customers can expect ‘business as usual’ with no immediate changes in operations

ATLANTA, Oct. 29, 2008 – Delta Air Lines, Inc. (NYSE: DAL) and Northwest Airlines, Inc. today merged, creating a premier global airline with service to nearly all of the world’s major travel markets.
The new airline, called Delta and headquartered in Atlanta, will begin its first day as a combined company with a commitment to delivering excellent service to customers in 66 countries and more than 375 worldwide cities – more than any other airline; with a dedicated base of approximately 75,000 worldwide employees; and with a best-in-class cost structure and strong liquidity balance that better positions the company to adapt to the weakening global economy.

http://news.delta.com/article_display.cfm?article_id=11176
 
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