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Discussion in 'iOS Blog Discussion' started by MacRumors, Oct 18, 2018.
Macrumors really ought to stay away from The Onion.
The amount of frankly ignorant and well, stupid posts for this article is off the charts.
Sleep apnea is a major killer. Most are undiagnosed.
This has an SpO2 sensor in it. It can detect pulse rate and most importantly, oxygenation levels. Yes, the forehead is a good site for such a sensor. Otherwise, the good sites are the earlobe and fingers, and there are issues with those sites while sleeping.
Medical tape is used all the time in... guess what - medical situations, and this is one of those.
Hypoallergenic because some people - like me - react to some types of tape adhesives.
But hey, I actually worked on and helped to design SpO2 devices when they first came out, so what do I know? And that work extended into sleep apnea studies... with a 5 pound box of gear and leads and what have you. You know, the stuff that actually impacted sleep patterns.
If this works (and I have a lot more questions on this, I have no connection to the vendor), it's damn near the ideal device for in-home sleep apnea testing.
What kind of "recommendations" could a device/app like this make? Honest question.
When your airway is obstructed, your pulse rate will go up and your oxygenation will plummet - those will be detected by the SpO2 sensor.
The accelerometer will detect movement, should be able to do some detection of sleep levels.
Overall, if all the device does is confirm you have sleep apnea (or rule it out), it's a winner. Have it? Go get treatment (CPAP).
I'd need to see a lot more to understand what sort of recommendations it might be able to generate.
I am inclined to buy it once released. I like the features.
Bingo. Anyone who has been around for a while knows about Zeo, which was around from 2003-2012. While Zeo failed, its excess inventory of headband monitors was rapidly snapped up by enthusiasts. One Zeo user was Steve Gibson, who talked about it on his Security Now! podcast. I don't know many of the business details, but I suspect this startup's main failure was coming along a bit too early. I wouldn't be surprised if some of those employees are part of the new company.
Agreed. I just had a friend diagnosed with a slight case of sleep apnea -- which had been going on for a very long time. This is like afib -- if we can diagnose earlier, we will save bucketloads of wear and tear on humans.
Agreed. Pseudoskepticism sucks. It's just another kind of pseudoscience.
I wouldn't be surprised if AAPL looked at acquiring these guys. It's complementary to the daytime health-monitoring emphasis of their Watch.
...it's damn near the ideal device for in-home sleep apnea testing.[/QUOTE]
And then what? If you are willing to purchase this to confirm your suspicions that you have apnea, why not just go to the doctor? It won't replace the controlled test environment needed for treatment. You still need to schedule a sleep study to get a diagnosis from a pulmonologist and receive an Rx for the CPAP. If you're not willing to do that, why bother to find out?
It's possible they were trying to get SpO2 off the wrist, since they already have accelerometers on the watch.
But this approach is better, as you can get head orientation this way (side, laying face up, laying face down).
Plus, can you imagine the howls from the street if Apple were to introduce this? Look at the top of the thread to see what I mean...
I'd hope Apple is funding companies like these, and helping them with development as needed. Create a bigger ecosystem.
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First of all - please don't clip off important parts when quoting. It's bad form.
You're getting diagnosis and treatment mixed up. I believe you might have meant to say you need a controlled test environment to diagnose for treatment to be prescribed. But anyways...
If this works - it potentially could alter that diagnosis part, and put into the home. Lower costs, higher acceptance by patients... This was the holy grail even in the late 80s when I worked on it. It's still the holy grail today.
Early, low-cost, high acceptance diagnostic measure. Perhaps it leads to a sleep study, maybe it leads right to CPAP.
So much road ahead, but I'm cautiously optimistic that this isn't another Theranos.
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I was recently diagnosed with sleep apnea. It required 2 visits with my Primary Care Physician, an at home sleep study, and an in faculty sleep study at a lab. The amount billed to my insurance for all of this is well north of $10,000, just the in facility sleep study was over $3,000, plus the Pulimony specialists who runs the sleep lab billed separately from the lab.
Many Americans either don’t have insurance, or have terrible insurance. I’ve seen people complain about having $4,000 deductibles. So far this process they would have to pay at least $4,000. And I haven’t even got to the part where I was sold a machine by a DME, and those costs.
A lot of forums and sites used to discuss/research Sleep Apnea are full of questions from people about how to be sure they need it so that they don’t start amassing huge bills, or how to get around the typical process to save money (I.e. where and how to do things out of pocket). OOP may sound crazy, but you can buy a nice APAP machine online (with prescription) for $800 or less if you do it yourself. That same machine may be billed at $1600 or more to insurance by a DME. Add in a high deductible and....
I’m lucky and have pretty decent insurance, though not as good as it was a few years back. I only have a $400 deductible, and then only pay 20% on medical equipment after that. Other issues caused me to hit my deductible early this year so the Apnea stuff wasn’t hard to swallow, other than it taking 5 months to work through the process.
I’m interested in this device just for the more data it can provide to correlate to what my APAP provides to try to treat my Sleep Apnea as best as possible. I could easily see some being interested in it if t can accurately predict Apnea so that they can be sure before either going down a very expensive route, or possibly finding a Doctor who will help them go down the most cost efficient path.
Why not just insert a flat metal plate under your skin and then a magnet can hold it on.
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Has anyone tested this for size for a choking hazard?
Funny, everyone's getting worked up about BlueTooth (it's far too low power to cause any trouble), my first reaction skimming the article was, "Wait, Fitbit has a Nike watchband, WTF?" I thought that was exclusive to the Apple Watch; a quick glance at Fitbit's site doesn't show such a band, but the googles leads to 3rd party knockoffs on Amazon. So, is Beddr tarting up their competitors products with 3rd party accessories before showing them in their comparison table? Weird.
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Well at least Theranos seeks balance in all things. Oh, wait, am I getting that mixed up again?
Since it's got a heart rate and oxygen Level monitor... Why not wear it all day?
No, I'm getting mixed up. I read that as Thanos seeking balance in all things.
So you think putting your head in a microwave oven can cause no harm, it’s non ionizing radiation too...
Not to mention going through life with a rectangular mark on your forehead, much like the mark you see after removing a bandaid.
I’m quite happy with the AutoSleep app with my AppleWatch series 0 as the detector. I charge my watch for a bit before going to sleep and again in the morning when I shower. I also discovered putting the watch in airplane and theater mode while I sleep preserves battery life and keeps the display off when I move. Results upload in the morning when I turn off airplane mode.
I have a series 4 on order and haven’t decided if I will just switch and use it the same way or if I will keep my series 0 just to wear at night. I believe we can pair 2 watches to the phone right? So I could just switch watches at bed time.
I feel like removing that from your head would improve sleep for a start
Do you understand the term "orders of magnitude?"
I'm guessing you might not.
Because the full-blown sleep study is disruptive enough that many, many people will simply never do it. A low-barrier device like this not only provides some initial screening, but also provides some motivation if positive indications are shown. "Oh, crap. I guess I really better go back to the doctor and get one of those studies set up."
But this device is not microwave, besides your cancer argument is plain wrong...
And not to mention that if you're concerned about RF radiation, your phone's cell-band emissions are probably a far greater theoretical threat than low-power BT.
Those of you saying a low powered radio connection will give you cancer should move to a cave in the mountains, that's about the only way you will avoid having your body penetrated by radio waves all day. If you want to worry about cancer causes, think about the trillions of cosmic ray particles and neutrinos that pass through your body every second instead...when they do interact with a DNA molecule connection they actually cause mutations in cells, including cancer as well as genetic variations. And, a cave doesn't help you in that case, since neutrinos pass through the entire planet.
Those of you crapping yourself about all the stuff flying through your body every second should now stop, because worrying about that is as silly as worrying about getting brain cancer from these, or Bluetooth headsets, or you iPhone.
If you've done a sleep study, you understand what a leap this is...if it gets you 80% of the information with a tiny patch on your forehead, it's a huge improvement over being wired up, with stuff pasted/taped all over you, and trying to sleep while wired to the bed.
Oh, there's no mark - the device is magnetic. It doesn't take too long for the scars to heal from the surgery to install the small steel plate in the front of your skull, and after that, the Beddr just adheres as if by magic. You may have a little trouble at airports and courthouses, though.
It depends on the power and frequency of the Signal, As well as length of exposure and distance to the signal. That’s why brought the microwave up when the Argument was made not to worry cause it’s non ionizing radiation. Non ionizing radiation can be harmful too.
And yes my cell might be worse that this thingy. I don’t stick that to on My head for extended periods of time either.