Better build quality worth the $$$?

[Artagra]

I know people love their Apple products, but I assumed it was more of a style issue. Recently, though, a friend kept going on and on about the better build quality and longevity of her Macbook Pro.

My question is - really? I am looking for a laptop that will stand up to frequent use, being carried around a lot, sometimes being sat on by cats, etc. If I can get more years out of it, then maybe it is worth the more than double price increase from a cheap laptop. I don't want to pay extra for fancy-computer-street-cred, but I will pay extra for a laptop I won't be cursing at in two years...

Thanks!

My experience has been that the Total Cost of Ownership (TCO) for MBPs ends up being lower for than for PCs, but only slightly. Example with figures from my sale (in SA rands, but applies also in dollars)

- Buy a Macbook Pro for R14 000. Keep it for three years, sell it for R7k. Cost per year? R2.3k

- Buy a PC Laptop for R10 000 (Toshiba). Keep it for two years, sell it for R4k. (In this example, my sister was forced to sell it because it was beginning to die and no longer useable - screen hinges cracking, battery dead, random reboots). Cost per year? R3k

Now, this only applies if people look after the machine. My experience is that a MBP stands up to "normal" use much better than most PCs, with the exception of some of the business class PC notebooks (Think a *good* Lenovo Thinkpad, HP or Dell - but then you are paying a similar price). However, their resilience in the face of abuse is similar.

So my advice? For people who look after their computers, get MBPs. For people who don't, get cheap PC laptops and good insurance, and tell them that they pay the excess if they break it!

 

[vitzr]

Just for scientific purposes I've done a comparison of similarly specced laptops.

After reading some threads today about buying a Dell or Lenovo and getting "more bang for your buck" I thought that it was time to try and do a detailed spec for spec comparison

Late 2011 15" MBP

Lenovo ThinkPad W520

So with the normal price of $2338 vs $2998 the difference is $660, but with the cybermonday coupon the difference is over $1000.

Respectfully your "scientific comparison" is a complete fraud.

You obviously do not know which models to compare. You've incorrectly chosen the "workstation class W series" ThinkPad. A more expensive model.

A fair and equal comparison is outlined below.

I've used Macs & ThinkPads concurrently at work & home for over 20 years. The correct & equal comparison is:

15" MacBook Pro vs 15" ThinkPad T520,

The two laptops I currently own. Mine are identically configured & purchased without any discounts involved.

Fully loaded top of the line machines, without tax or shipping, the two which were purchased in the same week, US dollars:

MacBook Pro --- $3200
ThinkPad T 520 - $1900
(prices rounded down to even hundreds)

Cheers

 

[miniConvert]

MacBook Pros are tough, but they're not a 'toughbook'. Yes you're probably going to find the laptop lasts considerably longer than a cheapie plastic thing costing a fraction of the price, but you've also got to consider whether you actually want to spend so much on such a great product and then, essentially, treat it badly.

The unibody construction is probably going to serve you well, but don't just buy the MBP for the durability factor. Buy it because you want a really great Mac, and a really great computer.

 

[thundersteele]

15" MacBook Pro vs 15" ThinkPad T520,

The two laptops I currently own. Mine are identically configured & purchased without any discounts involved.

Fully loaded top of the line machines, without tax or shipping, the two which were purchased in the same week, US dollars:

MacBook Pro --- $3200
ThinkPad T 520 - $1900
(prices rounded down to even hundreds)

Cheers

I agree. But $1900 is what Lenovo calls the "web price." The list price of the fully loaded T520 is near $3000 I think. Apple is able to sell their machines to consumers at list price (or less than 10% rebate, given that it's very easy to get education or similar discount through the workplace or school), while Lenovo gives a 30%-40% discount to consumers.
I remember seeing a flyer at my universitywhen thinkpads were still made by IBM. The machines were priced at $4000-$5000, but the education price was half of that. I guess this works well for IBM/Lenovo, since they also have business customers. The list price is then the base to negotiate a volume discount etc.

 

[thejadedmonkey]

You know using a keyboard cover of some kind would also take care of the problem. You just have to make sure to wipe it down if anything gets on there to prevent it from transferring to the display. It's also not that difficult to clean a display if you're gentle.

Might as well as just bring a netbook everywhere, and then transfer all your work back to the Macbook Pro every evening with an attitude like that.

-------------------

If you're trying to find a well built machine, I'd highly suggest an HP EliteBook, or the Dell vostro/latitude line. They're the business lineup, and they can take a beating. Personally, I find the flimsiness of the unibody design annoying as anything, and for what you get (excluding OS X) it's about $600 overpriced. More if you're considering a 15" or 17" Macbook.

 

[arcite]

I was actually seriously considering an HP elitebook, but ultimately my urge to use OS X won out (previously I used IBM Thinkpads exclusively). If you want to use OS X, you can't go wrong with a Macbook. On the other hand, there are many viable alternatives on the PC side of things if the Operating system can be flexible.

 

[Macdeez]

I've actually dropped my MBP twice off my bed because I'd be watching/reading something and I'll just fall asleep. l got 2 tiny dents, one on the top right of the lid and another on the bottom left of the body. I was so surprised it was still working perfectly fine! The second time I dropped it and realized it was still working like it should I really started caring more about it and that's when I actually thought to myself "damn if I spent a grand less and got a normal windows laptop it would have been in pieces now".

Seriously get an MBP!

 

[yeah]

Lol I went to an Office Max next to me today and I found the lowest priced macbook pro ($1200) and the poster said $1500 LOL

BTW Get a macbookpro. Just tried it. IT'S AWESOME!

 

[EricT43]

I think the build quality is great, but only you can decide if it's worth the money. To be quite honest, the only thing comparable in terms of build quality are ThinkPads and Dell Latitudes and laptops along those lines (enterprise-class). And those are not going to be much cheaper than a MacBook.

 

[miniConvert]

I find the flimsiness of the unibody design annoying

Eh?! It's like computing on a slab of granite!

 

[theSeb]

Respectfully your "scientific comparison" is a complete fraud.

You obviously do not know which models to compare. You've incorrectly chosen the "workstation class W series" ThinkPad. A more expensive model.

A fair and equal comparison is outlined below.

I've used Macs & ThinkPads concurrently at work & home for over 20 years. The correct & equal comparison is:

15" MacBook Pro vs 15" ThinkPad T520,

The two laptops I currently own. Mine are identically configured & purchased without any discounts involved.

Fully loaded top of the line machines, without tax or shipping, the two which were purchased in the same week, US dollars:

MacBook Pro --- $3200
ThinkPad T 520 - $1900
(prices rounded down to even hundreds)

Cheers

Respectfully I disagree. The MBP 15" and the Thinkpad I compared have nearly the exact same hardware and have nearly the same benchmarks. What exactly are you disagreeing with? The devil is in the details so please provide them like I have. Can you show me exactly which part of the specification sheets should not be compared?

 

[Mojo1]

Really? There have already been several threads here with photos that show significant denting/flex when the MBP appreared to have been dropped and struck a corner. Your inability to consider this a possibility is naive.

Kindly note that I used the word "bend." I understand that dents are a possibility. But any portable PC that I have seen will also dent, if not break when dropped on a corner.

Moral of the story: don't drop the computer. If you are prone to dropping, throwing, kicking, etc. your computer then it should be in a hard case whenever you move it.

The MBP is flimsy? Give me a break...

 

[shansoft]

I can tell you MacBook Pros does not have better build quality in general.

They have the same failure rate as any other laptop (except those really crappy one), and bend easily when drop since the case isn't really for drop resistance.

But is the MBP really worth its money? It's really up to your usage.

If you need it's feature or OS, then sure...
Else if you just want a laptop, I personally would not pick a MBP up unless I have no other choice based on its price tag with no additional advantage/feature than any other laptop.

 

[IllIllIll]

Kindly note that I used the word "bend." I understand that dents are a possibility. But any portable PC that I have seen will also dent, if not break when dropped on a corner.

Moral of the story: don't drop the computer. If you are prone to dropping, throwing, kicking, etc. your computer then it should be in a hard case whenever you move it.

The MBP is flimsy? Give me a break...

Kindly note that I never said the MBP is flimsy. You are implying that plastic construction == cheapness, lower quality, and/or poorer durability. This is clearly untrue. Both aluminum and plastic have their advantages and disadvantages, and the fact that you choose to ignore this only highlights your bias and lack of knowledge on the subject.

Not long ago even Mac laptops were made of - guess what - plastic. Why weren't more people complaining back then?

 

[thundersteele]

My old Vaio had a magnesium enforced body with some plastic elements. Very solid and stable feeling.

Lenovo Thinkpads are rock solid... you can stand on them

My old aluminum pre-unibody 17'' is a bit feeble, and does squeak and bend when pressed in the wrong areas. When carried around in a bag, sometimes the keyboard would touch the screen, and leave some dirt there.

The new unibodys seem more stable. It's still aluminum, so it will bend and deform under pressure. Usually the internals are well protected though.

 

[Freyqq]

Basically, I see it this way. Pay twice as much for a mac and keep it for 4 years, or pay half the cost of a mac for a PC and replace it every 2 years. In the end, it's a wash cost-wise.

 

[IllIllIll]

Basically, I see it this way. Pay twice as much for a mac and keep it for 4 years, or pay half the cost of a mac for a PC and replace it every 2 years. In the end, it's a wash cost-wise.

Except you haven't explained why you need to replace a Windows PC after 2 years while you can keep a Mac for 4.

 

[Wattser93]

Euh???

You gave the solution to your problem yourself...

Mac and PC have the same CPU, the Intel i-series, so W7 runs perfectly on a MBP.

Maybe I'm interpreting your text wrong, but Bootcamp is just a bootloader, so it only partitions your MBP in a OSX part and W7 part.
The interaction between W7 and the internal hardware is directly without using a VM-ware type (Fusionz) and OSX.

So even when the professional world is using W7 as standard, you can still use a MBP perfectly.

The main thing is cost. I can save money by buying a Thinkpad, get very similar quality, get a more powerful machine, and have accident protection with my warranty. Not to mention the built in Huey color sensor, the 1920x1080 95% gamut in the 15" form factor, and the superior set of built in ports (I despise dongles...). Why would I buy a MBP instead?

The answer is OSX. But is OSX worth the extra cost for less hardware? That's why I'm trying W7 as my main OS. If I use W7 and find it to be suitable, I'll buy a Thinkpad instead for my next machine. If I don't like W7, and find it to be a poor replacement for OSX, then I'll buy a MBP and use W7 bootcamp to fulfill professional needs.

OSX is getting more mainstream, but Windows is the standard, and the slight variations between OSX and Windows versions of programs can be frustrating.

 

[Sybrant]

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Like several people have stated already, the MBP is very well constructed. I've had my MBP for about 4 years now and it is still in pristine condition. I travel A LOT and still managed to keep my MBP is excellent condition. I would definitely recommend getting a durable skin for the it because I have seen the aluminum lose its beautiful finish from constant friction when being set down on a desk or surface. The better condition you keep the laptop the higher chances of it maintaining a significantly high resale value, in the even that you would need to get rid of it. I sold my wife's MBP from 2007 from $850 six months ago. A windows laptop will never hold such a great value and reputation like that.

 

[Freyqq]

Except you haven't explained why you need to replace a Windows PC after 2 years while you can keep a Mac for 4.

It really comes down to build quality. I've found some part of the case, keyboard, or trackpad breaks over about 2 years on a PC if used regularly, while macs tend to last longer. After 4 years, I replace my macs b\c the specs are no longer what I need rather than due to it actually breaking.

A hard drive or other internal component will likely last for the same amount of time in a mac or pc b\c they both use pretty standard parts.

 

[theman]

I've had my MBP for over 4 years now. It runs just like new. It's not just the physical construction... its the OS. Mac OS has much better self maintenance than Windows. Before I switched to Mac I'd have to wipe and reinstall windows at least every 2 years, often once a year on some systems that were heavily used (or used by certain family members...). With my mac, I don't even have to restart the thing more than once every few weeks. Every year or so I do a quick wipe of caches and repair permissions which seems to make things a bit snappier, but not much. I never even upgraded from Leopard (OS 10.5) because I can't see anything I need that it doesn't have. Bottom line: there's no registry to get clogged with junk, programs (apps) run in an essentially self contained manner, and it's just hard to screw up the OS and make a mess.

I've honestly never been happier about a purchase in my life. The only thing lacking was storage space (originally had a 120GB hdd), but I replaced the optical drive with a cheap 1TB drive and now it perfectly suits all my needs. Maybe I'll eventually go from 2gb to 4gb of RAM.

Additionally, I would HIGHLY recommend purchasing the 3 year applecare warranty. About 2.9 years after my purchase the logic board had a failure and I couldn't have been happier with Apple's service. I sent it out monday morning (free overnight), and I had the thing back by wednesday afternoon with a new logic board, at no cost to me at all! Amazing. 18 months later, no issues.

Aside from that, I've only got some dings and scratches on the case, but I think that just makes the machine look more distinguished. I had someone spill half a beer onto my keyboard a few months ago, and I ended up just popping a bunch of keys out and wiping it out with a rag. I've bumped it, dropped it, all that jazz. It's taken a beating.

 

[ranoi]

My oldschool Powerbook still works after 5 years, and being dropped and abused many times


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[IllIllIll]

It really comes down to build quality. I've found some part of the case, keyboard, or trackpad breaks over about 2 years on a PC if used regularly, while macs tend to last longer. After 4 years, I replace my macs b\c the specs are no longer what I need rather than due to it actually breaking.

A hard drive or other internal component will likely last for the same amount of time in a mac or pc b\c they both use pretty standard parts.

Valid explanation but it sure sounds like you've been shopping or buying inferior PC brands. Wouldn't durability depend on the manufacturer? Or are you saying that Windows somehow affects build quality? Buy a Lenovo Thinkpad and it will last just as long as an MBP, and they are significantly less expensive as well.

So without being more specific about manufacturers, your comparison doesn't necessarily ring true.

 

[wallysb01]

To me an "accident" is an intentional action resulting in unintended consequences.

Consider that definition, then consider someone sitting on ANYTHING.

Are all actions intentional?

 

[wallysb01]

Lastly the price. On average I pay $1,000 more for a 15" MacBook Pro, than I do for a ThinkPad of identical configuration.

Where are you finding a thinkpad with the i7 2.2GHz for <$800? The only way I can see this is if you're assuming the apple prices for RAM, etc., upgrades.