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Bloomberg: Apple's AR/VR Gaming Headset Plans Altered By Internal Divisions

darngooddesign

macrumors G3
Jul 4, 2007
9,634
522
Atlanta, GA
Jobs would’ve settled this in 30 seconds Immediately giving them a better idea and telling then to get on board or get the f out.

No he wouldn't. All Jobs would have done is say he didn't like their ideas and tell the to come up with something different.
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Completely agree with this.
But can we be really that surprised that Timmy sided with his buddy Jonny on this?
Tim comes across as not really have the balls to tell Jonny where to go on anything...?
Even with the Mac Pro which is great, why on earth is the headphone port on the back!?
So many dumb design decisions. They really needed someone who’s role was “Userbility” to counter Jonnys obsession with thinness.

Its hard to take you seriously when you infantilize their names like that. If you are unhappy with Ive's decisions you can blame Jobs who set him up as basically untouchable when it came to design decisions.
 
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dysamoria

macrumors 6502a
Dec 8, 2011
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i'm guessing you were touching a Jony designed device when you typed that out.
Point being what...? I’m holding a device that Ive designed because it’s the only choice that made any sense amongst the options at the time. That doesn’t mean I like much of what Ive did at Apple, especially in his later years.

Owning the device doesn’t prove implicit support of the design choices involved. The illusion of choice is one of several lies of laissez-faire capitalism.
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Oh, come on. Decent VR has only been around for 4 years, with the release of the Vive, and later the Rift with Touch controllers.
We have decent VR now? It hasn’t filtered down beyond gaming bros with the ability to spend crazy amounts of money on pimped gaming rigs & accessories, so I really wouldn’t know.
 
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farewelwilliams

macrumors 68040
Jun 18, 2014
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I’m holding a device that Ive designed because it’s the only choice that made any sense amongst the options at the time.
so out of thousands of devices available in the entire world, jony ive designed the one device that made any sense at the time to you.

sounds like he did his job.
 
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duffman9000

macrumors 68000
Sep 7, 2003
1,909
7,110
Deep in the Depths of CA
We have decent VR now? It hasn’t filtered down beyond gaming bros with the ability to spend crazy amounts of money on pimped gaming rigs & accessories, so I really wouldn’t know.

You bring up an important point: despite the monster rigs we have only decent VR. I have VIVE Pro and thought about getting an Index. I decided not to because what VR really needs is a generational leap forward and the Index ain’t it.
 
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Amacfa

macrumors 68000
May 22, 2009
1,732
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D.C.
I agree with Ive on this. Requiring a wearable to be tethered (albeit wirelessly) to a hub is just silly for a consumer product. That simply means the tech available is not ready yet.

The tethered to a hub version only make sense for a specific niche applications. Eg. Game arcades where they have a fixed room for the devices. Or a lab or hospital with fixed rooms. But Apple probably wanted this for consumers.

um, who said you can’t just wear the hub?
 
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travelsheep

macrumors 6502a
May 30, 2013
697
710
Am I the only who is NOT excited about any of these AR / VR stuff.

Until you see your favourite Youtuber/Fitness Expert/Teacher/Musician/... sitting with you in the same room having a session with you that looks more or less real, plus with your bro who's at the moment on holidays 8000 miles away
 
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cmaier

macrumors Core
Jul 25, 2007
19,717
20,639
California
Until you see your favourite Youtuber/Fitness Expert/Teacher/Musician/... sitting with you in the same room having a session with you that looks more or less real, plus with your bro who's at the moment on holidays 8000 miles away

I am horrified at the concept of having a favorite YouTube, let alone sitting in the same room as a YouTube.
 
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HowardEv

macrumors member
Jun 1, 2018
91
29
Medford ma
Oh yeah, I missed/forgot the word “stationary”. Fair enough then.
“Stationary” doesn’t mean it has to be plugged in to the wall! It means, sitting on a nearby desk, or picnic table, or in a backpack, like literal literary stationary. It will certainly have USB C to charge and all day battery life. That way the headset can have all day battery life too, and be light and unobtrusive.
 
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cmaier

macrumors Core
Jul 25, 2007
19,717
20,639
California
“Stationary” doesn’t mean it has to be plugged in to the wall! It means, sitting on a nearby desk, or picnic table, or in a backpack, like literal literary stationary. It will certainly have USB C to charge and all day battery life. That way the headset can have all day battery life too, and be light and unobtrusive.

In a backpack it’s not stationary (unless the backpack is stationary). Nor is it stationary if you’re carrying it to a picnic table. The thing that the article was talking about was a literally stationary object, like a box plugged into the wall.
 
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HowardEv

macrumors member
Jun 1, 2018
91
29
Medford ma
In a backpack it’s not stationary (unless the backpack is stationary). Nor is it stationary if you’re carrying it to a picnic table. The thing that the article was talking about was a literally stationary object, like a box plugged into the wall.
That just doesn’t make sense. Why would it need to be plugged into a wall? For line power? That’s not the problem. The problem is the goggles are too big and get too hot, even while running on batteries. The idea is, separate them into two parts. One you wear, and one that sits nearby. True, it’s not stationary if you are wearing it, so maybe it needs to be sitting still while the goggles move around it? I don’t know how that stuff works, I just want a battery powered Mac mini to use with a regular laptop, not VR.
 
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cmaier

macrumors Core
Jul 25, 2007
19,717
20,639
California
That just doesn’t make sense. Why would it need to be plugged into a wall? For line power? That’s not the problem. The problem is the goggles are too big and get too hot, even while running on batteries. The idea is, separate them into two parts. One you wear, and one that sits nearby. True, it’s not stationary if you are wearing it, so maybe it needs to be sitting still while the goggles move around it? I don’t know how that stuff works, I just want a battery powered Mac mini to use with a regular laptop, not VR.

we are talking about an actual device prototyped by apple. That device was a stationary box, plugged into the wall. Your hypotheticals are irrelevant. The original author of the piece says that ”stationary” means “plugged into the wall.”

Yes, one COULD make some sort of box you carry around (and maybe that would have the horsepower necessary), but that’s not what this post is referring to, or what “stationary” was referring to.
 
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nwcs

macrumors 68000
Sep 21, 2009
1,927
2,556
Tennessee
Oh, come on. Decent VR has only been around for 4 years, with the release of the Vive, and later the Rift with Touch controllers.
I’ve been around long enough to hear a version of that many times. Even so, let’s assume what you said is true. How is it anything but a novelty? How would it become a mass market consumer device? What utility beyond small niche applications and niche gaming will it have?
 
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HowardEv

macrumors member
Jun 1, 2018
91
29
Medford ma
we are talking about an actual device prototyped by apple. That device was a stationary box, plugged into the wall. Your hypotheticals are irrelevant. The original author of the piece says that ”stationary” means “plugged into the wall.”

Yes, one COULD make some sort of box you carry around (and maybe that would have the horsepower necessary), but that’s not what this post is referring to, or what “stationary” was referring to.
Oh we were talking about the prototype? Lol.

This is VERY interesting from the article:
“(The technology in the hub didn’t go entirely to waste: Some is being recycled to build the powerful processors Apple plans to announce next week for its Macs, replacing components made by Intel Corp.)“

Yes! I bet they have figured out how to cut the display cable, to make wireless displays fast enough to separate the display from the burning hot CPU.
From the article:
“Still, dispensing with the hub means graphics won’t be as good as they might have been, and the download speeds could be slower. It will also probably make the experience less lifelike than originally hoped.”
 
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twinlight

macrumors 6502a
Sep 4, 2016
614
456
In a backpack it’s not stationary (unless the backpack is stationary). Nor is it stationary if you’re carrying it to a picnic table. The thing that the article was talking about was a literally stationary object, like a box plugged into the wall.

You guys want a small hub that is going to push out 8K video to a VR headset.. this small hub will be battery powered and run a GPU that does 8K? 2030 maybe.. but I guess by then we need 24K or something per lens.
 
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cmaier

macrumors Core
Jul 25, 2007
19,717
20,639
California
You guys want a small hub that is going to push out 8K video to a VR headset.. this small hub will be battery powered and run a GPU that does 8K? 2030 maybe.. but I guess by then we need 24K or something per lens.

No, i don’t want that. My point was the damned thing is stationary and plugs into a wall. Go bother someone else about it.
 
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konstantnn

macrumors newbie
Jun 16, 2020
2
6
Republic of Serbia
Dear Jony, please go away, you have ruined so many Apple products by making them worse performing actual products just so you think they look nicer.
Go away, stay away and shut the F up.

I'd be more than happy with an additional computer unit, say that was attached to your belt or something if it means the headset can be lighter, and perhaps the compute unit can be boosted in time without needing to replace the headset part as well.

The great design of Apple products that Jony invisioned is the only reason Apple products are different than the competition. Go buy a Samsung phone, it has many more features and capabilities. Apple products are superior because they look and work nicer.

It’s deep in Apple’s DNA to do the right thing — Jony didn’t even want the headphone jack in the original iPhone because it made it asymetrical.

In 5 years, the technology will be advanced enough to the point where they can put it into a thin AR headset. Now, instead of strapping a black box on your belt, let’s not put it on the market. It’ll get there in a few years. Let’s focus on design first, because that’s THE MOST IMPORTANT THING & the one consumers ACTUALLY CARE ABOUT. Specs will get better.

This is the way Apple thinks and obviously it’s the right one.

Jony is the closest we have to Steve Jobs here and you KNOW Steve would agree with him on this. The idea of having two pieces of the same product is OBSURD.

And the reason none of you guys in this comment section get this, is why you’ll never come close to working at Apple.
 
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Mdracer

macrumors regular
Jul 1, 2016
132
629
The market is rapidly changing and people will not accept a unit that looks for feels 1-2 years old.
 
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HowardEv

macrumors member
Jun 1, 2018
91
29
Medford ma
You guys want a small hub that is going to push out 8K video to a VR headset.. this small hub will be battery powered and run a GPU that does 8K? 2030 maybe.. but I guess by then we need 24K or something per lens.
I want a wireless display that is as fast and hi res as HDMI. It sounds like the prototype is of a wireless connection to a hi res display.

I do worry about all the microwave antenna radiation if everything is wireless. It does all get absorbed as heat, whereas a wired connection doesn’t radiate extra energy.
 
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wigby

macrumors 68000
Jun 7, 2007
1,974
1,544
Hmm....don't you need an iPhone to use an Apple Watch?
Not for the past few years but we won’t be getting away from any AR glass tethering for some time. The Apple Glasses will certainly be relying on UWB from iPhone in a pocket to process and transmit data. However that is a lot different than an AC powered hub referred to in this rumor.
 
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Piggie

macrumors G3
Feb 23, 2010
8,574
3,024
The great design of Apple products that Jony invisioned is the only reason Apple products are different than the competition. Go buy a Samsung phone, it has many more features and capabilities. Apple products are superior because they look and work nicer.

It’s deep in Apple’s DNA to do the right thing — Jony didn’t even want the headphone jack in the original iPhone because it made it asymetrical.

In 5 years, the technology will be advanced enough to the point where they can put it into a thin AR headset. Now, instead of strapping a black box on your belt, let’s not put it on the market. It’ll get there in a few years. Let’s focus on design first, because that’s THE MOST IMPORTANT THING & the one consumers ACTUALLY CARE ABOUT. Specs will get better.

This is the way Apple thinks and obviously it’s the right one.

Jony is the closest we have to Steve Jobs here and you KNOW Steve would agree with him on this. The idea of having two pieces of the same product is OBSURD.

And the reason none of you guys in this comment section get this, is why you’ll never come close to working at Apple.

So why bring out the Apple watch, when it was not a complete final product that needed/still needs? to be tied to an iPhone to work fully?
Why is that any different to say a headset that would be lightweight but needed the grunt of say a high end iPhone to deliver the processing power to it?

I don't dislike Apple designs, I just despise SOME choices made when a designer things they know better than the actual engineer who has to make the product work well.
Some things are VERY important when it comes to looks, others vastly less so.
Like the iMac. Let's make the product technically worse, overheat, impossible;e to upgrade to make the computer/monitor unit thinner. When had anyone had any issues about the dept of the display on a stand being half an inch thicker/thinner?

I'm amazed Apple is not constantly slammed for the lack of any stand adjustment on an iMac.
Even low end screens have a height adjustment to allow for good posture for the operator, but not on an iMac, So you have to lift it up on a stand or some books or something.
Anyone else did that, they'd be moaned at, but Apple it's ok.
 
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hipnetic

macrumors 65816
Oct 5, 2010
1,171
477
Jony is the closest we have to Steve Jobs here and you KNOW Steve would agree with him on this. The idea of having two pieces of the same product is OBSURD.
The Apple TV needs to be tethered to a television. Is that obsurd?

Read my prior replies. A VR system is used inside a home. It doesn’t need to be optimized for portability.
 
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Piggie

macrumors G3
Feb 23, 2010
8,574
3,024
Remember, what's needed in the home for 3D headsets is 5G
That way you can have a headset as light as you want, and the full power of the BIGGEST computer you like, to do all the work.
Make the connection between the two 5G and problem solved :)
 
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HowardEv

macrumors member
Jun 1, 2018
91
29
Medford ma
Not for the past few years but we won’t be getting away from any AR glass tethering for some time. The Apple Glasses will certainly be relying on UWB from iPhone in a pocket to process and transmit data. However that is a lot different than an AC powered hub referred to in this rumor.
Was stationary hub really referred to as AC powered in the article? Anyhow that was only a prototype, perhaps it was prototyped using a Mac mini.

The innovation that they prototyped successfully and is coming to new Macs is the wireless connection to the hi res display. it could connect to a full power desktop class or a laptop CPU with battery, but it’s the lack of an HDMI cable that is exciting.
 
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