Burning Music CDs

Discussion in 'Mac Basics and Help' started by Huntn, Aug 9, 2018.

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  1. Huntn, Aug 9, 2018
    Last edited: Aug 9, 2018

    Huntn macrumors P6

    Huntn

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    The Misty Mountains
    #1
    I'm in the process of attempting to back up some music CDs, some I've had since the 80s. I brought part of this comment over from another thread.

    Part 1 Where is the eject button?
    I could swear that on my current late 2016 MBP that I could and have burned a CD via an external disk drive as a one step method. Put in the disk, right click on it and select burn, the disk is ejected, put in a blank CD and it burns.

    However I'm running into a problem because when this dialog pops up to burn, the only choice in this window is to "cancel". Otherwise I've found no eject button to eject the disk so a blank disk can be inserted. Now maybe I'm having a flashback to when I had both an internal disk drive and an external or when I was copying files to a disk.

    But I thought there was a "swap function" in the MacOS where with a single drive, it directed you burned a disk into memory, the MacOS, (or a former MacOS version?) then told you to eject the original and put in a blank Disk?

    I've also followed directions I found on line to add an eject button, to the Touch Bar, did that, but I see no eject button there after doing these steps. (https://discussions.apple.com/thread/7807810)

    Part 2 Not readable by this computer
    Ok so if no eject button, I've gone the route of trying to used Disk Utility to make a copy of a CD-R, previously used as a back up. When put into the drive, it pops up as a disk on the desktop. In Disk Utility, I select it and under the File>New Image> New Image from "Audio CD" (the name of the CD is Audio CD), I select DVD/CD Master and create a new image which ends up with a .cdr suffix, which I assume means CD-R?

    Of possible importance, when I open the existing CD (a CD-R that I previously burned) that I'm trying to duplicate, it has two AIFF files on it listed as Track 1 and Track 2. When I insert the CD into the drive, iTunes opens up and offers to play the tracks. So to get a functional music CD, can't I just tell the Mac to burn this disk, or drag the two files to a blank CD and let them burn?

    After creating the new image, I select the new .cdr file in the Finder, right click on it and tell it to burn. With a blank CD disk in, the drive starts spinning and a burn dialog appears, and then verifies. But afterwards, the CD eject and when I put it back into the drive, I get a message from the MacOS that this disk is "not readable by this computer". WTF.

    Now these blanks are Sony CD-R 700MB which could be over 10 years old. I'm going to get some new ones to see if that is the issue, but in the mean time, what the heck could I be doing wrong? It's never been this hard. So far I've produced two CDs that are "unreadable by this computer".

    PT3 Technical details
    • Is there a file difference between an original music CD and one you created burning a CD-R?
    • Is there a significant difference between a regular CD-R and a Music CD-R?
    • Am I missing a step where the disk is designated an audio/music CD?

    Thanks!
     
  2. Longkeg macrumors regular

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    S. Florida
    #2
    Isn't there an eject button on the external drive? Since Apple has done away with built-in optical drives I wouldn't expect to find an eject key on the computer. It's been so long since I've burned anything. My memory is fuzzy, but I remember burning audio CDs in iTunes from playlists of content already living in my iTunes library. When copying whole disks I found it much easier to use Toast as doing it with the native OS was a royal pain. If all you want to do is have back ups for safe keeping, why not just rip everything in some lossless format and store on a drive or high volume optical disk (like blue ray).
     
  3. Huntn thread starter macrumors P6

    Huntn

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    #3
    I finally got a good copy of a music CD by going through iTunes. I guess burning a music Cd via Disk Utiliy does not do it, by making a disk image, or was it something I overlooked?
     
  4. Sackofnickels macrumors 6502

    Sackofnickels

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    #4
    Use Disco. Works great. Who uses CD's anymore?
     
  5. Huntn, Aug 10, 2018
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2018

    Huntn thread starter macrumors P6

    Huntn

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    #5
    I’ll check it out. An initial search turned up many links for different products. Is this it? https://disco.ac/ Primarily I’m looking at CDs as a reliable storage medium.
     
  6. Sackofnickels macrumors 6502

    Sackofnickels

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    #6
    http://discoapp.com/
     
  7. Fishrrman macrumors G5

    Fishrrman

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    Feb 20, 2009
    #7
    OP:

    I will -guess- that there is no dedicated eject button because Apple believes you do not need one any more, since there is no built-in CD/DVD drive.

    To eject a CD/DVD, RIGHT CLICK and choose "eject" from the contextual menu that appears.

    For audio CD burning, I'd suggest one of the following:
    - Burn (that's the name) -- free
    - Simply Burns -- free
    - Toast (various versions available) -- commercial, "pay for".

    I believe these apps can also create an "mp3 CD". Note that this IS DIFFERENT FROM an ordinary "audio/music" CD, because a music CD is created using AIFF files and the disc is burned per the "red book" specifications for creating music CDs.

    An mp3 CD, on the other hand, is a collection of "files", which in this case happen to be mp3 (music) files.

    For "duping" an existing CD, I believe the apps I mentioned above can do this for you with a few clicks of the mouse.

    The reason you see "track 1", "track 2", etc. when mounting a music CD on the desktop is -- again -- these are in AIFF (or WAV) format and are not "named" (unless they were burned using software that can insert text onto the CD as well using the metadata in the files). You need to refer to the CD label or elsewhere to know what the track names are.

    Really, I suggest you investigate the apps listed above.
    They'll make things easier...!
     
  8. MSastre macrumors 6502

    MSastre

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    Aug 18, 2014
    #8
    Using a combination of Toast and iTunes, you can make exact copies of your CDs with all the song names listed. You can also choose to save the files and a disc image for later use, either another duplication or "rolling your own" compilations from different albums. (I have a 6 CD changer in my truck.) When you load a commercial CD, iTunes will read and identify the song names, then launch Toast and wait for the CD icon on your desktop to have the title of your CD on it, then drag that into Toast, which will then extract the files. Wait for it to finish, then use Toast to burn it (Toast also has an eject button). You can save the AIFF files and a disc image if so desired, just choose a location. (I have a separate HD for all my music.)
     
  9. kohlson macrumors 68000

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    Apr 23, 2010
    #9
    Lots of ways to eject.
    - You should be able to drag the CD icon from the desktop to the trashcan, which immediately changes to an eject icon.
    - Open a Terminal window and type in: drutil tray eject
    - https://support.apple.com/kb/ph25141?locale=en_US <-many more!
     
  10. organicCPU macrumors 6502a

    organicCPU

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2016
    #10
    Part 1
    The discussion's accepted answer is about an eject button in Menu Bar, not at Touch Bar.
    I don't have access to a Touch Bar to test, but I read that Better Touch Tool is capable of customising the Touch Bar to execute scripts respectively commands like 'drutil tray eject'.

    Part 2
    You can deactivate the automatic launch of iTunes in System Preferences while an optical drive is connected. AFAIK, Disk Utility is not recommended for copying Audio CDs.
    Besides the Red Book standard there are different formats, copy protections or even physical damages, that make it difficult to back up Audio CDs with just one strategy. The CD drive itself is another factor to consider. Some are performing better with error correction or reading certain formats. The earlier mentioned apps Burn and Toast are great and capable of copying directly an Audio CD to another disc or creating an disk image file. They can write data to temporary files and will ask you to swap the disc if needed.
    Terminal users might use the command 'dd' for creating disk images, data recovery tools like ddrescue for damaged CDs and Cdrtools for advanced tasks. I've found that simply Drag'n'Drop all the sound files of an Audio CD in Finder to a folder and then use this command works in many cases:
    Code:
    drutil burn -audio /path/to/soundfilesFolder
    Then there is another GUI app called Max that could help you with archiving Audio CDs.

    Don't miss to read those old threads:
    https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/dumb-how-to-duplicate-audio-cd.128662/
    https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/how-do-i-create-an-iso-image.220740/

    EDIT:
    For me it crashes immediately on launch running macOS Sierra 10.12.x
     
  11. Huntn thread starter macrumors P6

    Huntn

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    #11
    Thanks, I’ll check out this threads.

    Regarding part 1, I’ll see if there is an eject button in my menu bar, but first I have to find that. :oops: In hindsight, this would not help me, because with the window open that asks me if I want to burn an existing CD, I can’t do anything else, unless I select “cancel” which makes the window go away but cancels the operation. What this window wants is for me to insert a blank CD. The goal is to select “burn”, then eject the original CD to put the blank CD in. But as I previously said, although I thought the MacOS once operated like this, maybe it no longer does, or I am confused.
     
  12. organicCPU macrumors 6502a

    organicCPU

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    Aug 8, 2016
    #12
    If you're not in Fullscreen Mode, the Menu Bar is the top part of the macOS interface. A Menu Bar item is usually shown between the Help Menu and the Date and Time item.
    So the tray doesn't open automatically while some window is asking you for a blank CD? I don't get what app shows the window nor in what situation that occurs. Are you still trying with Disk Utility, talking about Finder or is that a third-party app?
    IMO, without a third party app, your best bet is to use the Terminal. Even with a third party app for the burning part, I prefer to send open and close commands in certain situations from Terminal. That should also work well, if some dialog window is open:
    Open the tray, if there is and if there is no media inside
    Code:
    drutil tray open
    Open the tray, only if a media is loaded
    Code:
    drutil eject
    Close the tray
    Code:
    drutil tray close
    Those commands can also build the basis for a script that is assigned to a (Touch Bar) key and meant to replace the missing eject button.

    There shouldn't be the issues you describe if using e.g. Burn http://burn-osx.sourceforge.net
    Choose among 3 versions to download You need to figure out which one works with your setup. I recommend starting with the 64-bit version.
    To copy a common Audio CD, select the copy tab in Burn app, drag your Audio CD icon from Desktop to Burn window, press Burn, wait a while, then you should get prompted to insert the empty CD, the tray should open automatically, insert a blank CD, close the tray* and wait until the copy is done, eject the burnt CD** and enjoy listen to it from a CD player.
    * Tray closes automatically, if you're pressing OK
    ** Ejecting can be set in Burn preferences, done through the Burn menu or by a shortcut (Shift + Cmd + E)

    If the problem still persists, try to describe in detail all the steps that leads to the trouble.
     
  13. kohlson macrumors 68000

    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2010
    #13
    IMHO, Apple hasn't had their Top People working on this since they abandoned optical media several years ago. So it's a little clunky. But some suggestions:
    - In Finder Preferences, make sure that Sidebar Devices has a check for CDs, DVDs, and iPods
    Now, when you insert a DVD or CD, it will show up in a Finder sidebar. You can always eject from there.

    In my experience, whenever you put a CD/DVD a connected drive, it will spin and then ask if you want to do something like burn.My answer is always Cancel. Then the media shows up on the desktop, and in the Finder sidebar.

    To duplicate the media, you can use Disk Utility to essentially make a disk image to your SSD, then burn 1->many CD/DVD.
    -
    To create a disk image from source CD:

    - Insert the source CD, fire up Disk Utility
    - Select File -> New -> Disk Image from Folder; select whole CD and click on the Image button
    -- In the Where box, choose someplace appropriate.
    -- In the Image Format box: DVD/CD master
    -- Save. A new image file will be created titled the name of your CD with a “.cdr” extension. This file is a disk image of your CD.
    - Eject your original CD from the CD drive
    - In the Disk Utility program, there should be the newly created image on the left side. Select the image, and then click on the Burn button
    - Follow the directions and insert a blank CD-R disc when prompted

    I've used this to dupe CDs. I usually use Burn to create CDs.

    Note that for data DVD and CD, after inserting the media (Cancel!) and the media shows up on your desktop, you can just drag files to it. When you want to burn them, just try to eject, and you should get queried as to whether you want to burn them.
     
  14. organicCPU macrumors 6502a

    organicCPU

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    #14
    You can set this behaviour in System Preferences -> CDs & DVDs -> When you insert a blank CD / DVD -> Do nothing
    Does this really write Red Book Audio CDs if the source of the disk image was an Audio CD?
     
  15. kohlson macrumors 68000

    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2010
    #15
    My understanding is it makes an exact duplicate. I have copied music CDs (such as those purchased at a place like Tower Records, RIP) though it's been a few years. Unfortunately I can't verify - I don't have ready access to a burner.
     
  16. Huntn, Aug 14, 2018
    Last edited: Aug 14, 2018

    Huntn thread starter macrumors P6

    Huntn

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    #16
    Thanks for the help. I will try the burn link. :)

    This process should not be hard at all. Let me describe my experience again.

    I have a late 2016 MBR using an external Apple super drive, no tray, a slot. When I put in a Audio CD it appears on my desktop. ITunes launches and assigns it an unrelated name. For example, an unnamed CD with a 1 hr recording called Gentle Ocean, is renamed as “Remembering Joe Henderson”, from the Jazznet Radio Broadcast. It has no such name, at least not one that I assigned to it. The recording was purchased around 1990 from the Nature Company Store. This is a burned copy as I’m currently having a challenge finding the original CD. I declined to add it to my iTunes library, but when I play it, it is Gentle Ocean. I don’t remember naming it when I burned it in the 1990s, but I certainly did not name it that.

    Ok, so now if I right click on the audio CD desktop icon, and select “burn Remember Joe Henderson to disk” a window pops open on my desktop which says: “To begin insert a blank disk”. There is one option in this window “cancel”. So the disk to be burned is in the drive and no easy way I’ve figured out how to eject it.

    As I recall the last time I burned CDs, I had an internal CD drive and a second drive, so this was not an issue, the original cd in one drive, the to be burned cd in the other.

    I also want to say that with a single CD drive, sometime in the past, the MacOS would eject the original CD when asking for a blank disk to start the burn process. Not happening. So is this a glitch or operator error?

    Also note that I copied two audio tracks from an audio CD, placed them in my desktop in a folder, and when I click on them, they play in iTunes. However, When I Highlighted these two tracks and right clicked on them and selected burn, they seemed to be burned to the CD but after the process completed, the CD auto ejected, and when I pushed it back in the drive, it ejected with a message my “Mac could not read the disk”. This was an old CD-R that I’ve had for possibly 10 years. Now that I have a new supply of blank CDs, I’ll try it again using this method.

    Since starting this thread the only successful music burn, I’ve achieved is when I loaded a song into the iTunes library and tell it to burn them into a CD. This produced a audio Cd that can be played.

    Thanks for the assistance! :)
    Please note that as in the description above, reply to orgsnicCPU, when I Right click on the cd icon on my desktop and tell the computer to burn it, the window that pops open, says “insert blank CD”, the cd currently in the drive does not auto eject, and there is NO option to make the Cd in the tray eject so a blank cd can be inserted. When this window is open, nothing else can be selected, so I can’t right click the sidebar CD icon and tell it to eject. The only option in the window asking for a blank cd is “cancel”, which unless I don’t understand means cancel the burn operation.
    --- Post Merged, Aug 14, 2018 ---







    Also note, I may move these recordings to 32GB thumb drives and say to hell with CDs. :D Are thumb drives considered any more perishable than Disks? Are they subject to magnetic destruction? What about immersion in water? Yes, a newb question. :)
     
  17. Huntn thread starter macrumors P6

    Huntn

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    #17
    Another question, can you play music off a CD or a Audio file, without it being added to your iTunes Library? My hard drive space is limited on my MBP and I don't want to fill it up with music. I'll assume there is a way to put you music library on an external drive? Thanks!
     
  18. Fishrrman macrumors G5

    Fishrrman

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    Feb 20, 2009
    #18
    I, for one, MUCH dislike apps that "auto-open" when I do something like mount a CD onto the desktop.

    There are ways to STOP this.

    Here's what I did:
    I downloaded a small free preference pane named "RCDefaultApp":
    http://www.rubicode.com/Software/RCDefaultApp/

    As you'll note, it's OLD, but IT STILL WORKS, at least with Low Sierra and High Sierra running under HFS+ (not sure how it will behave under APFS).

    Once installed, it will present a preference pane named "Default Apps", and you can go into it and control nearly everything. With the "media" tab, you'll have control over what happens with the following:
    Camera
    Webcam
    Blank CD
    Blank DVD
    Blank BD
    Music CD
    Picture CD
    Video DVD
    Video BD
    Mini-DVD Device

    With each item, you'll have a popup menu giving you the options to ignore, open with any app you choose, or perform other actions.

    I'd suggest that you take stops to stop "auto-opening" of apps like iTunes, which seems to be causing you all sorts of problems....
     
  19. MSastre, Aug 15, 2018
    Last edited: Aug 15, 2018

    MSastre macrumors 6502

    MSastre

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    #19

    Load CD in external Super Drive and quit iTunes if it launches. Open Disc Utility, select New Image from "Name of CD"
    and select "DVD/CD master". This will make a disc image you can burn.
    Drag CD icon to the trash to eject (or eject from Finder).
    Click on disc imge (.cdr), go to File "Burn Disk Image "CD name" and insert blank CD into external Super Drive and burn your CD.
     

    Attached Files:

  20. MSastre macrumors 6502

    MSastre

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    Aug 18, 2014
    #20
    Yes you can have iTunes pointed to an external drive for all your Music Library and keep them off your internal. FWIW, I extract all my music files (full AIFF) with Toast and keep them on an external.
     
  21. Huntn thread starter macrumors P6

    Huntn

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    #21
    Thanks for uploading these images. As it turns out getting some new CDs has produced a successful recording by copying the music tracks to my desktop, then telling my Mac to burn them to cd. I assume the Disk image method you illustrated will work to. Before that, with the older CD-Rs, that did not work...new CDs made the difference. :)

    Now these tracks are unusual because most of these CDs have a single track, as they are nature recordings. However some have several tracks and I see the advantage of using the Disk Image method for CDs with multiple tracks. I plan on using this method for further burns.

    My questions are:

    • Just for knowledge sake, if I throw the tracks on the desktop and select them as a group, and tell my Mac to burn them as a group to CD, will these play sequentially in the burned CD? Would there be any pause issue between tracks?
    • Was there a time when using the MacOS to burn CDs, you put the CD you want to burn in the drive, say burn, then the Mac would eject the disk automatically and ask for a blank? That’s what Inremember doing at some point in time, but obviously, this no longer works.
     
  22. Huntn thread starter macrumors P6

    Huntn

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    #22
    Burn works great. Thanks for bringing it to my attention! ...and for copy it works just like I remember the MacOS used to work. Am I remembering this incorrectly?

    I've noticed that many of my recorded CDs just a say "auto cd". For the Burn program if you want them to have a name, you have to select "Audio" among the choices, not copy, then drag the music from the audio cd to Burn. This allows you to name the cd where as copy, just makes an exact duplicate.

    Right now my iTunes library is 17GB. I need to get a new iPod, but as someone asked, "why are you using CDs?", I'd like to move this over to a 32GB thumb drive at least for backup storage.
    Would the format be mp4?

    If I hook a thumb drive to my car via USB, will it have the ability to play these tunes, or do I need an interface like an iPod?
    Thanks to all for your help! I think I'm getting it. ;)
     
  23. MSastre macrumors 6502

    MSastre

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    Aug 18, 2014
    #23
    The media (disks) you use is very important. Always use quality media for best results. I use CD-Rs, but buy the best I can get and do not have any problems.

    As for your questions, I've always used Toast for burning CDs and DVDs, because I can control burn speed, and with CDs, control the amount of pause, title, song order, etc. I still use a 6-CD Changer in my truck and "roll my own" custom CDs.
     
  24. Huntn thread starter macrumors P6

    Huntn

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    #24
    Thanks! I used to have toast. Maybe I can do an update or an upgrade, but I just used Burn and that seemed to work well. I’m just curious about recording a bunch of songs, if there is any control in Burn (the app) to set pauses, or it’s just automatic? Maybe @organicCPU is listening! :)
     
  25. Fishrrman macrumors G5

    Fishrrman

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2009
    #25
    OP asked:
    "If I hook a thumb drive to my car via USB, will it have the ability to play these tunes, or do I need an interface like an iPod?"

    Unless the car is capable of playing Apple formats (I have no expertise with Apple's encoding formats because I DO NOT use them), your best solution would be to convert the files to a HIGH bitrate mp3 file. 256k would do.

    The car audio system may not be expecting mp4 files and probably won't know what to do with them.

    MP3 is universal, and high-bitrate mp3 is as good as any other format for "car listening".
     

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