Business decision--too bad it's not fair

[coolwater]

I yet to own an iPhone so I don't have to agree with any side.

IMO, cry babies or not, when this many people have the same issue with a company, the company cannot be blameless. This kind of a mass group anger toward the same company over the same issue is extremely rare, and the company must acknowledge the reality.

ATT/APPLE should have expected this to happen; whether crying customers are being reasonable or not, it is a reality and you can't just ignore the reality. Is it the company's fault they did not anticipate this to happen. They make billions of dollars and they should have spent some money on learning human psychology and consumer behavior.

I understand ATT (not sure about APPLE) does not have a good win/win solution to this problem, however, they should come up with a solution--ANY solution--to mitigate all this madness soon. Not doing anything is the worst decision they can make.

Yes, maybe all these angry customers are wrong, but that really doesn't matter. When you have tens of thousands of 'wrong' customers, you still have to try your best to reach a resolution nonetheless. That's how a smart company deals with 'unreasonable' customers. You simply cannot say "Be reasonable and grow up." to THAT many people. The burden of customer happiness is on the company's side. Not fair? Fairness argument does not apply here.

Then again, monopoly is a very powerful weapon and there may be a good chance the company can weather this thru without doing anything. But, I wouldn't recommend that.

I am very interested to know how would MBA professors advice ATT/APPLE on this debacle. This would make a good case study.

 

[sammich]

Oh my god.

Do we really need another thread? They are crybabies, they want something for free, but they won't get it, because they signed legally binding contracts.

So Yes, I agree. It's not fair to AT&T.

 

[coolwater]

Oh my god.

Do we really need another thread? They are crybabies, they want something for free, but they won't get it, because they legally binding adults.

So Yes, I agree. It's not fair to AT&T.

Did you even read my post?

 

[Eddyisgreat]

Yes, maybe all these angry customers are wrong, but that really doesn't matter. When you have tens of thousands of 'wrong' customers, you still have to try your best to reach a resolution nonetheless. That's how a smart company deals with 'unreasonable' customers. You simply cannot say "Be reasonable and grow up." to THAT many people. The burden of customer happiness is on the company's side. Not fair? Fairness argument does not apply here.

And you assume ATT and Apple are somehow immune to market forces? That they print their own money and pay the bills of companies that are only subsidiaries of themselves?

Tens of thousands? Wow. That sounds like an epic number. Proof?

If THAT many people have issues with, well, ATT in general, than THAT many people can throw their phones in the trash and tell ATT to F off. Complaining on twitter and blogs will do a great deal of nothing. There are idiots on ATT's own boards claiming that their "massive 125 dollar / month bill" makes them a huge customer to ATT whose account single handedly makes or breaks the books, and thats simply not the case. If it seriously is that much of an issue than these customers would have no problem shutting down the service , eating the ETF, and moving along to an alternative provider.

I know there is some confusion around how ATT actually handles upgrade pricing (although the community is uncovering some facts) which is the cause of a bit of unrest, but the majority of issues, as gathered from the countless threads already posted on these very boards, stem from the fact that 3g iphone customers demand that they receive yet another heavily subsidized phone, which is absolutely ludicrous. The company is allowed to set whatever terms they wish, and they wish to entice NEW customers with a cheap phone price and reap the profits in service fees. Why is that so hard to understand? Had I not known the dynamics of the situation and judged solely on the response on these boards without reading, I would have assumed AT&T did something to REALLY rip off customers, like announce a rate hike of 50%, demanding the purchase of accessories with a new iphone, or charging late fees on balances already paid in full. But I read the comments and it simply blows my mind. Existing customers are pissed off that they can't get in on an offer made exclusively for new customers. Wow.

When people really start demanding attention , by switching carriers, eliminating services and blowing up AT&T stores in any sort of tangable quantity, than change will happen. Anything less won't cut it.

 

[milk242]

I highly doubt the majority of att iphone customers are that angry with the upgrade price. What you see on forums are just a fraction of their customers. Just like when you saw all the people complained about the new mac pro price, they were still selling fine.

 

[coolwater]

I highly doubt the majority of att iphone customers are that angry with the upgrade price. What you see on forums are just a fraction of their customers. Just like when you saw all the people complained about the new mac pro price, they were still selling fine.

If that's true, then my assessment is not necessary.

I only assumed there are tens of thousands angry iPhone users out there.

 

[sammich]

Did you even read my post?

Yes I did. The fact of the matter is: has this really happened to any other phone? If you had the N73 and the N75 came out a year later, would you be complaining? Probably not, because the iPhone represents something far more popular, consumeristic.

 

[coolwater]

Yes I did. The fact of the matter is: has this really happened to any other phone? If you had the N73 and the N75 came out a year later, would you be complaining? Probably not, because the iPhone represents something far more popular, consumeristic.

The problem is, or the reality is, some iPhone users clearly think APPLE/ATT must let them have the latest iPhone at the same low price. Those people seem to apply that unique logic to iPhone only and not to other phones. Whether they are wrong or not, that is the reality. And, the company must have a solution for that reality. Maybe they should name iPhone: iPhone 08; iPhone 09; iPhone10 each year respectively. Perhaps, that will make some people to understand they are not entitled to a new iPhone after every iPhone launch.

 

[Night Spring]

The company is allowed to set whatever terms they wish, and they wish to entice NEW customers with a cheap phone price and reap the profits in service fees. Why is that so hard to understand?

Because they advertise the new iPhones as $199/$299 in BIG LETTERS, then say in the small print that that price is only for new customers. People get excited at the prospect of getting a new phone for the low price, then are disappointed when they find they aren't eligible. If the ads listed the higher price for existing customers in the same size letters and right next to the low price for new customers, fewer people would complain.

 

[deceptichop]

Good s h i t Coolwater!

 

[Michael CM1]

I highly doubt the majority of att iphone customers are that angry with the upgrade price. What you see on forums are just a fraction of their customers. Just like when you saw all the people complained about the new mac pro price, they were still selling fine.

AT&T Wireless has 78 million subscribers. Maybe 1/8 of that is iPhone users. The Twitter "petition" has about 4,000 people. If I hunt on the Internet long enough, I can find 4,000 people who agree with any statement (the Holocaust didn't happen, Barack Obama is a terrorist, Kobe Bryant isn't a whino).

The Internet is full of pockets of little fru-fru causes that an itty bitty percentage of people think is the biggest outrage on Earth. We used to call those people "the lunatic fringe." I don't know what we call them now, but they're still nuts. This is when Jon Stewart needs to hold up an AT&T contract from a year ago and just read it on "The Daily Show." ... "I agree to two years of service and will not be eligible for the best prices for upgrades until my contract is complete."

Just duh.

 

[Michael CM1]

The problem is, or the reality is, some iPhone users clearly think APPLE/ATT must let them have the latest iPhone at the same low price. Those people seem to apply that unique logic to iPhone only and not to other phones. Whether they are wrong or not, that is the reality. And, the company must have a solution for that reality. Maybe they should name iPhone: iPhone 08; iPhone 09; iPhone10 each year respectively. Perhaps, that will make some people to understand they are not entitled to a new iPhone after every iPhone launch.

These people can't comprehend a "two-year" contract. What makes you think they can add so well to get the hint of "iPhone 08, iPhone 09?"

 

[coolwater]

These people can't comprehend a "two-year" contract. What makes you think they can add so well to get the hint of "iPhone 08, iPhone 09?"

Again, it is the company's burden to come up with a solution that can make those people understand a 2-year contract is a 2-year contract. ATT & APPLE have clearly failed at that.

 

[vipergts2207]

Again, it is the company's burden to come up with a solution that can make those people understand a 2-year contract is a 2-year contract. ATT & APPLE have clearly failed at that.

ATT and Apple have no way of giving these people any sense, which is the only thing that will fix the problem. They're idiots. Nothing more nothing less.

 

[Eddyisgreat]

Because they advertise the new iPhones as $199/$299 in BIG LETTERS, then say in the small print that that price is only for new customers. People get excited at the prospect of getting a new phone for the low price, then are disappointed when they find they aren't eligible. If the ads listed the higher price for existing customers in the same size letters and right next to the low price for new customers, fewer people would complain.

Apple , during the keynote, said that the 199/299 price was for NEW and QUALIFYING customers.

The teeny tiny print in the sprint ad clearly states that a two year contract is required, including an *eligible* upgrade OR a NEW line activation.

The t-mobile 250 dollar rebate requires a NEW line activation and a data plan. Of course, you have to click on the "instant discount" link to get this information.

So your telling me existing customers are pissed off because ATT is doing exactly what every other company has been doing since the beginning of time?

Customers who read/hear the "new and qualifying customers only" part and still think they are getting a discounted phone are in the same group of idiots who make it so that companies are required to put "WARNING THIS IS HOT" on coffee cups.

P.S. sorry if you wern't defending the aformentioned idiots. Your post tone is relatively neutral

 

[sammich]

Again, it is the company's burden to come up with a solution that can make those people understand a 2-year contract is a 2-year contract. ATT & APPLE have clearly failed at that.

Again, to reiterate my original point:

It's not fair to AT&T.

/thread

 

[coolwater]

ATT and Apple have no way of giving these people any sense, which is the only thing that will fix the problem. They're idiots. Nothing more nothing less.

If your customer is an idiot, it's up to you to find ways to prevent that idiot customer from getting upset with you. You should know better than your idiot customer.

 

[iBlue]

It IS fair.

Just because there are thousands of snivelling little babies all upset because they can't get the latest gadget exactly when they want it because of their CONTRACTS, doesn't make them right. Nor is it the company's responsibility to satisfy these pampered whining brats and their yuppie-ass desires.

And did we really need ANOTHER one of these threads? FFS.

 

[vipergts2207]

If your customer is an idiot, it's up to you to find ways to prevent that idiot customer from getting upset with you. You should know better than your idiot customer.

ATT's solution would be to let them walk, as it should be, and they'll no longer be a customer. Why? Because they have, what is it, 78 million customers? If a few of them want to be jackasses, ATT doesn't have to care. They'll gladly let them go be jackasses to verizon or T-mobile or whoever they choose as a new provider because they all have the same exact practices. If I regularly shop at walmart and decide one day that the cashier will give me $1000 or I'll blow my brains out, it's not suddenly walmart's job to give me $1000 just to appease my ridiculous demands. The customer is NOT always right.

 

[Phil A.]

ATT's solution would be to let them walk, as it should be, and they'll no longer be a customer. Why? Because they have, what is it, 78 million customers? If a few of them want to be jackasses, ATT doesn't have to care. They'll gladly let them go be jackasses to verizon or T-mobile or whoever they choose as a new provider because they all have the same exact practices. If I regularly shop at walmart and decide one day that the cashier will give me $1000 or I'll blow my brains out, it's not suddenly walmart's job to give me $1000 just to appease my ridiculous demands. The customer is NOT always right.

QFT

If anything, ATT and the other carriers can't afford to give in to these whiners because if they do they're setting themselves up for all their other customers who have honored their contracts to start complaining about unfair treatment.

I'm sure the carriers are very well aware that these people complaining are not going to go anywhere else - at the end of the day these are people who are so rabidly in love with the iPhone that they simply must have the 3GS now and can't wait until the end of their contract. Any threats they make about going somewhere else and giving up the iPhone therefore come across as very empty...

 

[coolwater]

ATT's solution would be to let them walk, as it should be, and they'll no longer be a customer. Why? Because they have, what is it, 78 million customers? If a few of them want to be jackasses, ATT doesn't have to care. They'll gladly let them go be jackasses to verizon or T-mobile or whoever they choose as a new provider because they all have the same exact practices. If I regularly shop at walmart and decide one day that the cashier will give me $1000 or I'll blow my brains out, it's not suddenly walmart's job to give me $1000 just to appease my ridiculous demands. The customer is NOT always right.

Therefore, it will be ATT/APPLE's business decision to loose or keep those customers. Surprisingly, most companies still want to keep whining/idiot/jackass customers most of the time. Business is business. And, the decision to ditch a large group of customers is never simple.

 

[Phil A.]

Therefore, it will be ATT/APPLE's business decision to loose or keep those customers. Surprisingly, most companies still want to keep whining/idiot/jackass customers most of the time. Business is business. And, the decision to ditch a large group of customers is never simple.

Sometimes it's the right thing to do though when those customers are more pain than they're worth.

It would be hilarious if ATT decided to cut off everyone who had signed the petition because they no longer wanted them as a customer (they probably couldn't do it but it would be funny!)

 

[vipergts2207]

Therefore, it will be ATT/APPLE's business decision to loose or keep those customers. Surprisingly, most companies still want to keep whining/idiot/jackass customers most of the time. Business is business. And, the decision to ditch a large group of customers is never simple.

Yeah business is business, that's why ATT would let them walk. ATT is in a neutral/lose situation. Don't give the customers a new iPhone, they complain and then leave, ATT collects the ETF, but also loses out on monthly payments and life goes on. Or give in to customer demand and give them a cheap iPhone and then ATT loses money because they gave the customer another ~$300 subsidy when they haven't even paid off the first ~$300 subsidy yet. From a business and non-moron standpoint, the former option is better.

 

[sammich]

Therefore, it will be ATT/APPLE's business decision to loose or keep those customers. Surprisingly, most companies still want to keep whining/idiot/jackass customers most of the time. Business is business. And, the decision to ditch a large group of customers is never simple.

I hope this isn't feeding a troll. But here goes anyway...lose what customers? If AT&T stand by the current pricing, the existing contracted customers will either pay up to exit their contract (neither win, AT&T lose their monthly payments, customer loses up-front money) or continue to the end and don't sign up for a new contract (not likely ).

Second scenario (from poster above yours): they give the few misguided complainers a free contract termination, and what happens? EVERY SINGLE 3G CUSTOMER still on a contract will want said free exit too. AT&T will lose $200 for every customer who chooses this.

 

[Michael CM1]

Again, it is the company's burden to come up with a solution that can make those people understand a 2-year contract is a 2-year contract. ATT & APPLE have clearly failed at that.

78 million AT&T customers, plus numerous more on other carriers, figured out the simple math that a 2-year contract means a contract for two years. The whiners are stupid and probably either physically and/or mentally 15.