Buyers beware - Apple won't replace defective machines, even when they can't fix them

[CH12671]

In terms of testing by removing RAM, I would prefer not to do anything that involves cracking open the machine. I'm not expert at these matters and am concerned that I could further harm my efforts to get Apple to honor the warranty. And again, it should be possible for me to end up with the working machine that I paid for. Any repairs along those lines should be covered by the warranty, and executed by Apple (not a desperate newbie like me who doesn't know what I'm doing). Again, the RAM and everything else I'm using all shipped with the machine - I 've added nothing myself.


Thanks again for all the helpful comments.

I'm not sure anyone suggested that you take the RAM out and check it yourself. My suggestion was to run the apple hardware test yourself and see if anything comes up. I would assume that the geniuses did this, but you know what they say about assuming.....

If you don't know what the apple hardware test is, look it up.

 

[jaxhunter]

Keep taking it in to the Apple Store. Every time you tak it in make sure they document the repair and get copies of the repair order. make sure they check the logs and do not allow anyone to erase them before they are seen. Calmly talk to the store manager and explain the situation. They cannot just issue a replacement machine outside of the 30-day return policy and the store will have difficulty replacing a CTO machine. They can do it though, after a number of repair attempts and enough documentation to justify it. They must attempt to completely rebuild the machine first. I know it sucks but that is the case.

 

[FreemanW]

At this point, if the OP is courteous and good humored about it, I would think that one more visit for a problematic machine equals resistance to leaving the store with anything other than a brand new replacement to the clearly defective lemon that he received from Apple.

 

[kendall69]

I've been buying Mac products since the early 80's, can't count the number of computers, etc. Only had two issues, one a CD r/r in the desktop failed on arrival, next day an Apple service guy showed up replaced it, no charge.

2nd issue a laptop batter that was two years old was expanding, pushing out the battery door. I walked into the Apple store to purchase a new batter, they looked at my lap top and handed me a new batter - no charge. It was WAT out of warranty.

Lastly there are laws that cover manufacturers selling defective products. Go to the Apple store, explain the facts to them, if they refuse, then simply sue them in small claims court.

 

[Felasco]

The challenge in this case, and the so many others just like it, is that nobody is interested in solving these kinds of issues at their source.

As example, imagine that Apple could be convinced to pay customers within warranty for the time they invest in the repair process. This would solve most cases of this nature, because paying customers for their time would be too expensive, and thus the repair loop hell the OP is trapped in would be replaced by a more fair replacement policy. Thus, there would be no need for this thread.

The reason that effective solutions like this are never implemented is that everybody involved, from the victim to his fellow posters to the mods of forums and on to Apple, all insist on addressing such issues in the least effective manner possible, on a case by case basis.

This is most easily seen on the Apple support forum, where (unlike this forum) all threads are supposed to contain technical questions and answers, and discussion of Apple policies is officially discouraged or actually prevented.

We're all complicit in this, because this blind commitment to resolving problem like this in the least effective manner seems to be held by the entire Apple community. Everybody is focused on individual cases, instead of taking a broader systems approach, and focusing on solving the problems at their source, Apple quality control procedures and Apple customer policies.

Typically users feel powerless to affect such procedures and policies, but that is mostly because each of us thinks and acts as an individual, which makes us weak. We're doing it to ourselves.

Like all big corporations, Apple rules with a divide and conquer strategy. Apple successfully pits it's huge resources against isolated individuals, and thus is able to do the kind of unfair things being described by the OP.

Apple has $3000 of the OP's money, and the OP has less than nothing, given the time he has been forced in to donating to help Apple solve Apple's problems. He's essentially been blackmailed in to working for Apple for free.

I'm sure the OP very understandably hopes his particular situation will be resolved, but seen through a larger lens it doesn't really matter, because 2 hours from now somebody else will start a new thread that repeats basically the same story, and that will continue for years or decades to come.

And the reason is because everybody involved refuses to address these problems at their source.

 

[SaSaSushi]

It really sounds to me like you're dealing with a bad RAM issue. I understand that you don't want to crack open the machine, but the RAM on the 27-inch iMac is entirely user serviceable and very simple to access. You have absolutely no worries regarding voiding your warranty. Apple provides easy to understand directions that anyone can follow at this page.

You might find that by simply removing two of the four memory modules that the machine magically stops crashing. You'd also have a much more specific warranty claim to make. Maybe you could even just take the memory modules to the Apple Store and get them to swap them for new ones.

The challenge in this case, and the so many others just like it, is that nobody is interested in solving these kinds of issues at their source.

Again, here's my Applecare experience several times over the past 8 years through various Macs:

1) I called Applecare and explained my problems. They soon realized I had a problem that required service under warranty and arranged a courier pickup of my Mac. This is how it is done in Japan and also, I live 2 hours drive from the nearest Apple Store.

2) Within a day or two a courier picked up my Mac, took it to Apple's service center by the next day and shipped it back, usually that same day.

3) The next day the Mac arrived back at my home, problem completely resolved at its source.

I'm not exactly sure what it is you're advocating. Are you saying Apple should institute a no-questions-asked replacement policy for any and all warranty claims?? That is not the slightest bit logical, feasible nor would it be effective.

Of course all warranty claims need to be resolved on a case by case basis.

As example, imagine that Apple could be convinced to pay customers within warranty for the time they invest in the repair process.

The most time I've ever put in on a warranty claim was a phone call but in fact, I've read of several cases in these forums where users with particularly problematic "lemon" Macs were eventually replaced with newer, higher spec'd machines after several failed attempts at repair.

 

[Roller]

We're all complicit in this, because this blind commitment to resolving problem like this in the least effective manner seems to be held by the entire Apple community. Everybody is focused on individual cases, instead of taking a broader systems approach, and focusing on solving the problems at their source, Apple quality control procedures and Apple customer policies.

All products suffer from manufacturing defects or other problems. It would be practically impossible, or at least not economically viable, for Apple to sell iMacs or any other device that were defect-free. When there is an issue that is systemic, they eventually respond with a recall or similar program, although it sometimes takes longer than one would hope. I've taken advantage of several of those over the years myself.

I'm not saying that the OP isn't entitled to better in this case. However, Apple tends to be very highly rated for customer service. Again, from personal experience, I've seen them perform out-of-warranty repairs that they easily could have refused. The trick, as it is with all consumer issues, is to find the right person, be they at an Apple Store or elsewhere in the organization, and communicate with them politely but forcefully. I've done that with Apple and other companies on many occasions and usually gotten what I asked for.

 

[Fishrrman]

To the OP:

How have things been going since you got rid of Avast?
I tried that once, TERRIBLE software.

My advice to you:
Don't use ANY "anti-virus" software (and yes, that is a serious suggestion).

Have you run the Apple Diagnostics yourself, at home?

 

[ChrisA]

I ordered a new 27" iMac in January. ....

Why is it now out of warranty? The warranty is one year.

 

[Radiating]

OS X mavericks has not been tolerant at all of certain defective computer programs. I had the exact same issue as you and only fixed it after I uninstalled a few programs and updated to the latest operating system.

It sounds to me like either Avast or Firefox is to blame.

 

[ChrisA]

.....The only software I've added is Firefox and Open Office. And Chrome. And Avast anti-virus. Oh, and Postbox email program. ....

Why would you be running "avast"? I don't see any purpose in it and it might be the cause of your problems. This entire problem might be your own fault for installing this.

You should be able to drop the computer at the store and have them fix it for you. Tell them to run it for a day or so to verify that it is intact fixed.

 

[Felasco]

All products suffer from manufacturing defects or other problems. It would be practically impossible, or at least not economically viable, for Apple to sell iMacs or any other device that were defect-free.

Yes, mistakes will be made in any circumstance, agreed. The question is, who will pay for those mistakes? The vendor who made the mistake, or the customer? As we see in this thread, Apple is shifting the cost of quality control to the user.

Also, the fact that perfect perfection is not possible does not mean we can not continually strive for just that.

Honestly guys, do you know ANYTHING about Steve Jobs, the creator and driving force behind Apple??? Seriously, no ****, you aren't really debating me, you're debating the founder of Apple. All I'm doing is expressing his vision, a never ending highly inconvenient pain in the ass demand for perfection.

However, Apple tends to be very highly rated for customer service. Again, from personal experience, I've seen them perform out-of-warranty repairs that they easily could have refused.

Apologies, but this information does exactly nothing to help those who are suffering from such problems. I say this only because this point and anecdotal reports are offered in every thread of this nature, and none of it helps a bit.

The point here should be to PREVENT such problems from happening to the degree humanly possible, not rationalize a complacent mediocre status quo.

 

[Felasco]

It really sounds to me like you're dealing with a bad RAM issue. I understand that you don't want to crack open the machine, but the RAM on the 27-inch iMac is entirely user serviceable and very simple to access. You have absolutely no worries regarding voiding your warranty. Apple provides easy to understand directions that anyone can follow at this page.

The OP already completed the only responsibility he had in this transaction. His only job was to pay every single penny of the sticker price up front, which he has done 100% perfectly, or he wouldn't have possession of the Mac.

Every suggestion of the nature "the OP should do this, he should do that" are null and void, and express a profound misunderstanding of who is owed what.

The OP has already done everything he is supposed to do, and then quite a bit more. The OP is NOT in the business of fixing broken Macs, that's Apple's job.

Again, here's my Applecare experience several times over the past 8 years through various Macs:

Apologies, but your good experience is completely irrelevant, and contributes exactly nothing to assisting all those in this same situation.

Are you saying Apple should institute a no-questions-asked replacement policy for any and all warranty claims?? That is not the slightest bit logical, feasible nor would it be effective.

Apple already allows no questions asked refunds within 14 days. The company has not collapsed.

Apple could just as well allow no questions asked replacements for 90 days or the full year of the warranty.

Nobody is going to bring back a well functioning Mac only to replace it with another of the exact same model. What would be the point? A waste of time for the user, nothing in it for them. An exception can be made for Macs with obvious physical damage.

If the Mac does fail within warranty, it should be replaced. The customer should not be forced to pay full price for a refurb.

Please see this:

http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2014/04/23Apple-Reports-Second-Quarter-Results.html

The Company posted quarterly revenue of $45.6 billion and quarterly net profit of $10.2 billion

Net profit of over 10 BILLION dollars in just 90 days. Apple can afford to treat it's customers fairly and with respect, and should it choose to do so, it will make even more money.

 

[FreemanW]

The problems with these types of threads . . . . .

There is no accountability, no way of independently verifying the credibility of the OP, the behavior parameters (both Apple Representatives and OP) presented by the OP, and "factual" detail . . . . . . mis-stating warranty status.

Going by the statements from the OP, they are not without some computer knowledge and experience . . . . . and yet, we are to believe that they have allowed Apple service to thoroughly nuke-n-pave their new iMac more than once in what ultimately failed to be attempts at resolving issues that remain unsolved.

There are several red flags in this thread that make it (at best) difficult to accept and believe at face value.

 

[SaSaSushi]

Apologies, but your good experience is completely irrelevant, and contributes exactly nothing to assisting all those in this same situation.

Well, it certainly didn't help you and your agenda anyway.

Apple already allows no questions asked refunds within 14 days.

Exactly right, and the OP has already expressed their regret that they didn't act within this time period.

If the Mac does fail within warranty, it should be replaced.

Even better, an RMA within 14 days will get you a replacement or a full refund. Beyond that, if there is a problem with a Mac there is a one year warranty and a process for making claims within that warranty period. For those who want even more coverage, there is the optional Applecare coverage to extend that warranty for a full 3 years from the date of purchase. I buy it for every Mac and highly recommend it.

Believe it or nor, not all problems (nor I suspect even a majority of them) reported under Applecare turn out to be defective machines. Of those that are, not all claims require a full replacement. I've had crashed HDDs and LCD panels replaced. I've never had a full replacement machine, nor have I ever felt that I was entitled to one. Apple's responsibility in the warranty period is to determine where any defects exist and to repair them. Refer to my two posts above regarding the warranty claim process.

----------

There is no accountability, no way of independently verifying the credibility of the OP, the behavior parameters (both Apple Representatives and OP) presented by the OP, and "factual" detail . . . . . . mis-stating warranty status.

Not to mention the very real possibility of disgruntled users with personal agendas posting commiserating conversations with themselves using multiple user accounts, etc.

I'm not making any accusations in this particular thread but just pointing out that it is important to take anything you read online with major grains of salt.

 

[Sko]

Don't use ANY "anti-virus" software (and yes, that is a serious suggestion).

ClamXav is quite a save bet if it comes to AV-software. I'll rule out the rest, too. Sorry for being a little OT.

 

[joe-h2o]

Apologies, but this information does exactly nothing to help those who are suffering from such problems. I say this only because this point and anecdotal reports are offered in every thread of this nature, and none of it helps a bit.

The point here should be to PREVENT such problems from happening to the degree humanly possible, not rationalize a complacent mediocre status quo.

And the anecdotal evidence supplied by the original poster is gospel truth and a stick we can beat Apple's supposed "mediocrity" with, eh?

Why does the original commenter's anecdote get to be the gospel truth and a symptom of Apple's decline whereas other people's positive Applecare experiences are "unhelpful anecdotes"?

You can't have it both ways, kid.

 

[Roller]

Yes, mistakes will be made in any circumstance, agreed. The question is, who will pay for those mistakes? The vendor who made the mistake, or the customer? As we see in this thread, Apple is shifting the cost of quality control to the user.

Also, the fact that perfect perfection is not possible does not mean we can not continually strive for just that.

Honestly guys, do you know ANYTHING about Steve Jobs, the creator and driving force behind Apple??? Seriously, no ****, you aren't really debating me, you're debating the founder of Apple. All I'm doing is expressing his vision, a never ending highly inconvenient pain in the ass demand for perfection.

Steve Jobs strove for perfection in design and execution of Apple's products. However, never during his tenure do I recall that Apple achieved a zero defect rate. It's a worthwhile goal for a company to aim for that, but with the understanding that it can't be achieved economically. No matter how well a product like a computer is designed and tested, some components will fail after it reaches the consumer. The key is for the company to adopt a reasonable policy for repair and return. I agree that Apple shouldn't require customers to perform extensive investigation, but some troubleshooting isn't too much to ask, especially when software problems can make it seem that the hardware is defective.

Apologies, but this information does exactly nothing to help those who are suffering from such problems. I say this only because this point and anecdotal reports are offered in every thread of this nature, and none of it helps a bit.

The point here should be to PREVENT such problems from happening to the degree humanly possible, not rationalize a complacent mediocre status quo.

The point is that Apple already does a very good job of customer service compared to other vendors. Of course, that doesn't mean that the OP has received excellent service in this case. I've already offered advice on how he should deal with Apple.

 

[Felasco]

There are several red flags in this thread that make it (at best) difficult to accept and believe at face value.

Standard operating procedure in Apple culture, the user is always wrong.

While I agree that some complaint threads can be so incoherent that they lack credibility, to me the OP reads as intelligent, sincere, articulate, reasonable, sufficiently detailed and with no obvious agenda other than getting what he paid for.

Even if we were to discount this thread, there are so many others like it that any reasonable person would conclude there is a problem that needs addressing.

----------

Well, it certainly didn't help you and your agenda anyway.

Yes, and my agenda is that Mac users might try to stick together and help other fellow Mac users who are having a crisis. To me, this is done most effectively by addressing such issues at their source, so that such problems can be prevented, instead of responded to after the fact.

I realize that you are sincerely trying to be helpful too, I just think you don't understand the big picture well enough to do so effectively. If you are in your twenties, then it's entirely reasonable that you not understand some of these things, as none of us are born knowing everything.

----------

Steve Jobs strove for perfection in design and execution of Apple's products. However, never during his tenure do I recall that Apple achieved a zero defect rate.

We all agree that a zero defect rate is impossible. Where we don't agree is that most posters seem not to get that a zero defect rate can still be pursued with great enthusiasm nonetheless. And, a more fair and respectful manner of responding to the defects that do occur can easily be implemented.

The key is for the company to adopt a reasonable policy for repair and return.

Yes, agreed. As a start, I've proposed a no questions asked replacement policy for 90 days, or maybe the entire one year warranty.

Please observe the complete lack of interest in a proposal that would have solved the OP's problems, and so many others like it.

The point is that Apple already does a very good job of customer service compared to other vendors.

No, that's not the point.

The point is the existence of a significant number of unhappy customers who have been treated unfairly, an established pattern which damages both the customer and Apple's brand. However many people that may be, whatever the percentage is, no matter what other companies do or don't do, the point is to try and FIX IT.

----------

Why does the original commenter's anecdote get to be the gospel truth and a symptom of Apple's decline whereas other people's positive Applecare experiences are "unhelpful anecdotes"?

Other people's positive experiences, which are obviously the majority experience, are not helpful for one simple reason.

Please read this carefully...

Positive experience reports don't help the people who are having bad experiences.

Often such reports are used to state or imply that those reporting negative experiences must be some kind delusional inexperienced pathetic whiner perfectionist. As you can see, I'm fed up with reading such things, and am pushing back.

 

[SaSaSushi]

Even if we were to discount this thread, there are so many others like it

And while you never start the threads you seem to chime in on every one of them.

that any reasonable person would conclude there is a problem that needs addressing.

I believe that any reasonable person would understand how ludicrous it is to expect product owners to be eligible for billing hours for troubleshooting prior to making warranty claims. I further believe that any reasonable person would understand how incredibly ludicrous it is to expect said product manufacturer to issue automatic full replacements for any and all machines with warranty claims, regardless of what, if anything, is actually wrong with them.

But that's just me.

Yes, and my agenda is that Mac users might try to stick together and help other fellow Mac users who are having a crisis. To me, this is done most effectively by addressing such issues at their source, so that such problems can be prevented, instead of responded to after the fact.

We agree on this at least. My entire reason for existence in these forums is to help and be helped.

I realize that you are sincerely trying to be helpful too, I just think you don't understand the big picture well enough to do so effectively.

No offense, but I actually offered the OP constructive advice as opposed to your rabble-rousing.

If you are in your twenties, then it's entirely reasonable that you not understand some of these things, as none of us are born knowing everything.

Not that it's the least bit relevant, because it isn't, but I was in my twenties in the eighties. In spite of my relatively advanced age, I don't claim to be all-knowing. I'm still learning new things every day.

 

[SaSaSushi]

Please read this carefully...

Positive experience reports don't help the people who are having bad experiences.

Here's another relevant positive experience for you:

I bought my Late 2013 iMac in November with 16GB of RAM. I bought it configured this way so that I could just add 2x8GB modules to max it out at 32GB.

Well, I went through about 6 different brands of RAM and each and every time my iMac would experience random kernel panics, basically making the machine unusable. Much of my experience is documented in this thread.

I could have made a claim to Apple under warranty, and believe me I came close to doing so near the end.

As it turns out, if I had it would have been an exercise in futility. Even if they had given me a replacement. It would have come back and the exact same system instability would have occurred if I put the additional RAM back in.

With the kind assistance of the community here, and at Apple's and Crucial's forums I came to realize that the problem was the brand and in particular, voltage of the modules I was using. I switched to a recommended brand of 1.35V DDR3L just like the Apple stock RAM and have had a totally stable iMac with 32GB of RAM for the past 2 and a half months as a result.

One of the affected users I chanced to meet in a thread on this topic at Apple's discussion forums was having the exact same problems with 32GB of stock Apple RAM. With a full replacement of the RAM from Apple, his problems were resolved as well. A large majority of kernel panics are related to RAM. The rest are almost always issues with drivers. These are the KEXTs noted in kernel panic reports. What you really need to pay attention to is anything near the top of the list of KEXTs, since all third party drivers appear there.

In the OP's case:

System uptime in nanoseconds: 77438703593859
last loaded kext at 75252069261638: com.apple.driver.AppleIntelMCEReporter\t104 (addr 0xffffff7f853e9000, size 49152)
last unloaded kext at 75324745018750: com.apple.driver.AppleIntelMCEReporter\t104 (addr 0xffffff7f853e9000, size 32768)
loaded kexts:
com.avast.AvastFileShield\t2.1.0[COLOR="red"] <-- THIRD PARTY DRIVER[/COLOR]
com.avast.PacketForwarder\t1.4 [COLOR="Red"]<-- THIRD PARTY DRIVER[/COLOR]
com.apple.driver.AppleBluetoothMultitouch\t80.14

The first thing I would do is what several others in this thread have already recommended and immediately uninstall AVAST.

If that doesn't resolve the crashes then I'd be willing to bet big money that it's a RAM issue. I would also make a Memtest86 EFI boot disc and run it for a few passes. That's as easy as burning a bootable CD image from here and rebooting while holding C. (or a bootable USB thumb drive if you don't have an optical drive)

See, positive experiences can be quite helpful to others.

 

[Felasco]

And while you never start the threads you seem to chime in on every one of them.

Yes, that's correct. I enjoy defending my fellow Mac users, no apologies for that.

I believe that any reasonable person would understand how ludicrous it is to expect product owners to be eligible for billing hours for troubleshooting prior to making warranty claims.

Please explain why any customer should help diagnose and repair their still under warranty defective Mac, for free.

I further believe that any reasonable person would understand how incredibly ludicrous it is to expect said product manufacturer to issue automatic full replacements for any and all machines with warranty claims, regardless of what, if anything, is actually wrong with them.

If an automatic full replacement policy was in place for 90 days or one year, this would boost consumer confidence, and give Apple bragging rights over other companies which do not offer such a guarantee.

You've yet to explain how such a policy would hurt Apple. Who is going to request a replacement for a Mac that is working properly?

But that's just me.

If it was just you, I wouldn't engage. The problem is that it's not just you, but a great many Mac users on forums arguing against their own interests.

If you keep buying Macs throughout your life, sooner or later you too will lose the lemon lottery, and benefit from everything I'm suggesting here.

We agree on this at least. My entire reason for existence in these forums is to help and be helped.

Yes, I acknowledge your sincerity and good intentions. And I apologize for what may sometimes be excessive enthusiasm on my part, and ask you to understand that I'm often debating everyone else in such threads on my own. Even the OP appears to not be interested in agreeing with me, which is normal.

No offense, but I actually offered the OP constructive advice as opposed to your rabble-rousing.

Your advice was "the OP should do this, the OP should do that". My perspective is the OP has already fulfilled all his obligations, and then quite a bit more.

Not that it's the least bit relevant, because it isn't,

I'm sorry, but age is relevant. To argue otherwise is to argue that we don't plan on learning anything as we proceed through life. An older person is obviously not automatically right, but there is a meaningful difference between those who have been in business for 40 years, and those still in college.

In spite of my relatively advanced age, I don't claim to be all-knowing. I'm still learning new things every day.

Yes, me too, in this we are brothers.

 

[Felasco]

Here's another relevant positive experience for you:

Again, contributes nothing to a solution of such problems. Blah, blah, blah, who cares?

The first thing I would do is what several others in this thread have recommended and immediately uninstall AVAST.

If Apple judges AVAST to be a threat to the proper functioning of Macs, it should code OSX to prevent the installation of AVAST. At the least, a warning can be displayed. If a warning was displayed by OSX, and the user ignored the warning, then we would be in agreement.

Please recall that Macs have been advertised as being point and click simple for 30 years, and so they have attracted a customer base which is, on average, not technically savvy nerds. The "point and click simple" sales pitch places a responsibility on Apple to solve as many of such problems as possible behind the scenes.

This is an example of solving a problem efficiently at it's source, so it doesn't have to be very inefficiently addressed in an endless number of individual cases.
It's also an example of the value of prevention over cures.

The more such problems that can be prevented, the fewer unnecessary complaint threads there will be, leading to more happy customers, and an enhanced value of the Apple brand.

 

[SaSaSushi]

Again, contributes nothing to a solution of such problems. Blah, blah, blah, who cares?

Well, the OP, I would assume, might care if my similar experiences with a happy ending and advice led to a positive resolution of their own problems.

I meant to ask above where your advice to the OP was exactly in all the blah, blah, blah rabble-rousing. Please, by all means do point out one bit of constructive input that might lead to a resolution of the OP's problems that you've made in this thread thus far.

Your advice was "the OP should do this, the OP should do that". My perspective is the OP has already fulfilled all his obligations, and then quite a bit more.

And if it turns out, for example, that the problem was a poorly coded antivirus program that the OP installed of his own volition, would you still feel this way? Would you still think Apple is the problem for not having given the OP a no-questions-asked replacement machine?

If Apple judges AVAST to be a threat to the proper functioning of Macs, it should code OSX to prevent the installation of AVAST. At the least, a warning can be displayed. If a warning was displayed by OSX, and the user ignored the warning, then we would be in agreement.

Your unrealistic expectations and notions of liability go from the ridiculous to the preposterous. How can Apple or anyone else for that matter code an OS that is guaranteed not to crash under any circumstances as a result of third party software or drivers.

I'm going to respectfully bow out of this ridiculous exchange. Anyway, my presence in this thread was, and is, to help out the OP.

 

[gnasher729]

Please explain why any customer should help diagnose and repair their still under warranty defective Mac, for free.

Many problems _are_ caused by running problematic software, or by doing things that just don't do what you expect them to do, and so on. There's always a possibility of a misunderstanding that can be fixed in two minutes. And Apple repairing or replacing the Mac in such a situation wouldn't help, because there's nothing wrong with the Mac.

What's really bad is a situation where the problem will not and cannot happen at the store. You might have a broadband modem that is rubbish and causes problems - the problem will disappear and be impossible to find at the Apple Store. Worst situation, the power supply to your home is dodgy and your Mac gets shocked regularly. That can obviously cause crashes that can't be reproduced elsewhere. And replacing the Mac wouldn't help.

To get an idea how difficult it can be to diagnose a problem, google for "car allergic to vanilla ice cream".