Can the Mac Mini have Raid 0 Samsung 830 Pros?

Discussion in 'Mac mini' started by nemesis379, Apr 19, 2013.

  1. nemesis379 macrumors member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2012
    #1
    I'm looking at buying the base high end mac mini, and then adding two Samsung 830 Pro's, with some RAM of course.

    This will be my first Mac and was wondering if this was possible and how easy would it be.

    I know I need the data doubler from OWC, which I will buy and the two ssds, but what about setting up the RAID 0?, and reinstalling the OS?

    Thanks.
     
  2. onirocdarb macrumors regular

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    Feb 5, 2013
    #2
    I would install one ssd(drive 2) and clone the stock hd onto drive 2. Then once you have proven the installation went well and you can boot from it install the second ssd (drive 3) in place of drive 1. Once you have installed it successfully boot into drive 2 and go to raid utility and select raid 0
    Good luck!
     
  3. philipma1957, Apr 19, 2013
    Last edited: Apr 19, 2013

    philipma1957 macrumors 603

    philipma1957

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    #3
    WELL I think you mean 840 pro's in raid 0 / the answer is yes. buy the doubler kit from owc buy a cheap dock buy 2 ssds.


    http://eshop.macsales.com/item/OWC/DIYIMM11D2/


    http://eshop.macsales.com/item/NewerTech/U3S3HD/

    read how to pull the mini apart.


    http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=1568313


    this thread can help.

    once you have the 2 ssds in the mini and the dock attached with the pulled oem hdd use the dock to boot the oem hdd. then use the external oem hdd in the dock to set raid0 in the mini.


    At this point you can use ccc or superduper to clone the docked hdd to the raid0 in the mini. or you can boot with your fingers on command r then use internet recovery to do a new osx on the raid0.
     
  4. nemesis379 thread starter macrumors member

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    Dec 26, 2012
    #4
    I was looking at getting like a 320GB backup drive for the mini, so this will work also instead?
     
  5. philipma1957 macrumors 603

    philipma1957

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    #5
    yes;
    1) boot the mini with the 320gb external attached.
    2) use the oem internal hdd to format it.
    3)then boot with command - r keys pressed

    4) send a osx to the external once the recovery comes up, slow 1 to 4 hours depends on your connection
    5) once the external has a working osx boot test 1 or 2 times.
    6) power off strip the mini
    7) put the new drives in and assemble
    8)make sure the 320 drive with the osx is attached

    9) boot with your finger on the option key
    10) pick the external as the booter
    11) use the external to make raid0 with the 2 internal
    12) boot with command r keys pressed again
    13) do a internet install to the raid0
    14) boot with the option key pressed pick the internal as your booter.

    it should work
     
  6. onirocdarb macrumors regular

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    #6
    Can you do an Internet install on a fresh drive? I thought that was only if you had a recovery partition installed
     
  7. RoastingPig macrumors 68000

    RoastingPig

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  8. rw3 macrumors 6502a

    rw3

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  9. nemesis379 thread starter macrumors member

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    Dec 26, 2012
    #9
    Seems a bit excessive, could i not download ML put it on USB, then install os-x to both drives?
     
  10. philipma1957 macrumors 603

    philipma1957

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    #10
    you can download to the usb hdd and try to boot with the external usb hdd do it first make sure it boots. put it to the side.

    Then install the pair of samsung ssds.
    Boot with the usb hdd.
    Then format the samsungs as a raid0 .

    You can clone the usb hdd to the raid0 samsungs . Then go to preferences and pick the raid0 samsungs as your boot drive.

    It should boot but I have had cloned raid0 booters not boot more often then internet download to a raid0 as a booter. Why not try it your way and get back to us. Then let us know if it boots or hangs and does not boot.
     
  11. Giuly macrumors 68040

    Giuly

    #11
    That, or you could just replace the drives, boot it via Internet Recovery and then setup the RAID0 as well as install the OS from there.
     
  12. polyethyleneguy macrumors member

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    Jan 7, 2005
    Location:
    Florida
    #12
    People are making this sound too complicated and adding unnecessary steps.

    I've done this exact thing twice on two different mac minis.
    Just pop the two SSD's in the mac mini (you'll need that OWC kit) then just boot into recovery (internet connection needed). You can then set the RAID 0 in "Disk Utility" and install the operating system from the internet (in that order).

    No need for USB, cloning, downloading OSX to a flash drive, etc.

    It's very simple. :eek:
     
  13. willgreene99 macrumors regular

    willgreene99

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    #13
    The above sounds great. Although I thought that the recovery options do not install the recovery partition, which is required for some iCloud functionality - BTMM, FMM. There are workaround to restoring the recovery partition but read that it will not work with a raid configuration. I am interested in knowing if anyone has done this already.
     
  14. John Kotches macrumors 6502

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    Troy, IL (STL Area)
    #14
    I hope anybody who installs on raid 0 has a large Time Machine drive on non-stop backup duty. One hiccup and you're restoring from that backup.

    I'm going to ask what application requires that level of performance as I personally think it's an accident waiting to happen.
     
  15. philipma1957 macrumors 603

    philipma1957

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    #15
    while you need a tm a bootable clone is just as important and having 2 bootable clones is even better.
     
  16. rsmith4321 macrumors newbie

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    Dec 1, 2010
    #16
    Your making it sounds way more risky than it is. Think about it. It's twice as likely to fail as a single ssd. That's not very likely at all. You always need good backups even with a single drive. You really aren't adding any risk because any drive can fail and should have a backup. It's just twice as likely. As far as the speed your being silly. Of course you can use it.
     
  17. nathanjbrown macrumors regular

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    Apr 9, 2008
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    Boston, MA
    #17
    I know this is an old thread, but it just caught my eye. I didn't know this was possible on a Mac and I'm certainly interested.

    Am I to understand that two SSDs in a Mac Mini can be setup as a single volume - RAID 0 - with speed and performance greater than a single SSD would provide?

    e.g. 512GB SSD + 512GB SSD (RAID 0 / Striping) = ~1TB of speedy SSD goodness?

    Any clarification would be appreciated as well as pros & cons that others have experienced.

    Thanks!

    Nathan
     
  18. ElectronGuru macrumors 65816

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    Oregon, USA
    #18
    Yes. The theory goes something like: you need 5 pieces of data from the drive. With one drive, the data is pulled from a single drive and through a single interface sequentially, 1-2-3-4-5. With two drives, each having half the total data, there is likely hood that data can be pulled in parallel, 12-34-5, with drive one pulling 1 and 3 while drive two also pulls 2 and 4.

    But because data is split, if either drive fails, data on both drives is lost. And since there are now twice the failure points, the risk is doubled. So a mean time to failure is now half. That said, SSD is more reliable and you should be backing up regardless. It should also be noted that this only accelerates disk related tasks, so handbrake won't benefit much.
     
  19. analogkid macrumors regular

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    Savannah
    #19
    Although I am running a fusion drive now, I had very good results running a raid0 pair of Samsung 830 pros in my 2011 server. I dont see how reliability is a problem with modern ssd's combined with time machine backups and an off site clone.
    I will say the biggest problem i had was that OSX did not pass trim commands to raided ssd's. I built my raid pair using a third party application called Softraid... which is expensive to buy but allows you to to build volumes with the demo, so that you have a trim enabled raid pair even after the demo times out.
    I will say it was a strange experience dealing with the issue of trim in a raid volume. At the time people ignored it or said it couldnt be handled, so it was a pain to find the Softraid program. I would be interested to know if Mavericks handles trim to raid natively now, but even so Softraid was a pretty good disk utility suite.
     

    Attached Files:

  20. nathanjbrown macrumors regular

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    Apr 9, 2008
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    Boston, MA
    #20
    The trim issue is interesting. And disappointing. How do we determine whether or not Mavericks fixes the issue?

    I'll admit that I don't understand why trim and RAID would conflict...

    Is that image you attached the performance you saw with your RAID 0 setup?

    Thanks!

    Nathan

     
  21. analogkid macrumors regular

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    Savannah
    #21
    yes, that is my 2011 mini server (quad 2.0) with the raided pair of Samsung 830 pros. I went back in and changed it to a fusion drive with a 256 Samsung 840 Evo and a 1tb hd. I get similar performance and size on my MacbookPro as the raided pair so the Mini is back to being more of a server these days.

    I remember when I thought the 400k floppy on the 128k original Mac in 1984 was pretty fast.


    [edit] and yes, this thread should actually be about raiding 840's in this day and age
     
  22. crenz, Jan 2, 2014
    Last edited: Jan 2, 2014

    crenz macrumors 6502a

    crenz

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    #22
    That is surprising - so the fusion drive is on par with the SSD raid? That would mean it's not worth it to buy two large SSDs at all - after all the fusion drive is much cheaper. Is that really so?

    I am considering to get a Mac Mini and put a 840 1 TB SSD in it, but based on your report, that would seem a waste of money...
     
  23. analogkid, Jan 3, 2014
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2014

    analogkid macrumors regular

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    #23
    I am sorry. I see I worded that poorly- the 512gb PCIe ssd in my Macbook Pro is only marginally slower than the raided pair of 830's... and probably a good bit slower than 840's if you went that way. The fusion is fine for my media serving needs, and the mini now has a thunderbolt ssd for the "scratch" disk.

    Sorry for the confusion, but obviously a fusion drive isn't going to be that fast in benching or in practice.

    [edit] to sum it up, raiding ssd's in a mini is an obvious and fantastic upgrade. I'm all for it.
     
  24. talmy macrumors 601

    talmy

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    Oregon
    #24
    When I got my Mac mini Server 3+ years ago I immediately set it up in RAID 0 (I considered it really important for HDDs which would obviously be the system bottleneck). The advice at the time was not to do it because the software RAID in OS X was not considered reliable, especially for server use.

    Turns out the software RAID was fine, but one of the drives did fail (bad sector) under warranty. The the problem was that the Apple store couldn't determine which one had failed but wouldn't replace them both. I had to un-RAID the drives and run the system until a failure occurred again. Took over a week to sort things out, with several restores from backups. Now it runs without RAID and frankly, with load spread out among 6 drives (9 TB total), there is no apparent loss in speed anyway.

    Of course, there is no concern about warranties with the SSD installs, but just saying things might not be rosy!
     
  25. crenz macrumors 6502a

    crenz

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    #25
    Thanks for the clarification - I had understood the usage of your fusion drive the other way round. After the clarification, it all makes sense.
     

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