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I never heard of that process before.
Is it a pain to deal with and would it accomplish anything in the end?
What would the cost of that be?

http://www.wireless.att.com/cell-ph...reement&q_termsName=GoPhone+Service+Agreement

its at the bottom, I will paste just a little.

ARBITRATION AGREEMENT

(1) AT&T and you agree to arbitrate all disputes and claims between us. This agreement to arbitrate is intended to be broadly interpreted. It includes, but is not limited to:

•claims arising out of or relating to any aspect of the relationship between us, whether based in contract, tort, statute, fraud, misrepresentation or any other legal theory;
•claims that arose before this or any prior Agreement (including, but not limited to, claims relating to advertising);
•claims that are currently the subject of purported class action litigation in which you are not a member of a certified class; and
•claims that may arise after the termination of this Agreement.


It costs nothing at first except a certified letter, then if it does go to arbitration its only a few hundred dollars.
 
One last time in simple words:

1) I had an Unlimited Data plan. I used it one month to stream Pandora to external speakers via Bluetooth.
2) AT&T sent me a nastygram accusing me of using my data plan for Tethering. Tethering is NOT ALLOWED per their AUP UNLESS you pay for a TETHERING PLAN.
3) AT&T asked me questions about how I was "tethering" my phone. I said I wasn't, just streaming Pandora via Bluetooth. They pointed me to their AUP and said "That's Tethering" They forced a Tethering data plan on me, canceling my grandfathered Unlimited plan and replacing it with a Data + Tethering (limited) plan instead.
4) I researched it, saw they had every right to do what they did and canceled my AT&T contract, moved to Verizon.

You were right.....you are confused. You keep trying to defend your position with a quote from their TETHERING plan. I'm guessing you don't know the difference between an Unlimited Data plan and a Tethering plan. Tethering plans allow for, you know...Tethering. Choose whatever definition you want. Unlimited Data plans do not allow ANY Tethering.

As for lying....its often the case that the simple minded obfuscate their lack of knowledge by pointing fingers at the rational mind.

Try to be calm. You can do tethering through bluetooth, meaning your iPhone can connect to a laptop through bluetooth and have your laptop use your iPhone's data plan to go on the internet. That is tethering. Data to data. When you use Jawbone, it's not data to data, since it's a speaker. Your Jawbone is not connecting to Pandora via your iPhone. Instead, your iPhone is transfering music information to Jawbone, which does not use AT&T's data service.

If AT&T still considers that tethering, then any type of bluetooth transmission will be consider tethering, and everyone that uses bluetooth will be in violation.
 
Some of us have felt that the "throttling" issue is limited to certain users with grandfathered unlimited, namely dependent on your GEO location where their cellular network may not be as built up or strong as other places. Otherwise, every single grandfathered user would be caught by their logistics system and throttled, which isn't happening... their simply picking and choosing. You could have two people, one uses 4 or 5gb and another 10gb, and somehow only the 4-5GB user will get throttled. Only answer has to be something with GEO location.

I've gone over 5gb plenty of times with no warnings or anything, even this month I'm already at almost 5, usually avg 3-4. People I know with grandfathered unlimited down here still, South FL, no throttling. I actually had to have them put it back on my account after switching to the i777 GS2 since it doesn't transfer to new phones and you have to go through high up level at at&t to get it back, during that time frame they could easily see my usage, yet no problems.
 
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; CPU iPhone OS 5_0_1 like Mac OS X) AppleWebKit/534.46 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.1 Mobile/9A405 Safari/7534.48.3)

aluren said:
One last time in simple words:

1) I had an Unlimited Data plan. I used it one month to stream Pandora to external speakers via Bluetooth.
2) AT&T sent me a nastygram accusing me of using my data plan for Tethering. Tethering is NOT ALLOWED per their AUP UNLESS you pay for a TETHERING PLAN.
3) AT&T asked me questions about how I was "tethering" my phone. I said I wasn't, just streaming Pandora via Bluetooth. They pointed me to their AUP and said "That's Tethering" They forced a Tethering data plan on me, canceling my grandfathered Unlimited plan and replacing it with a Data + Tethering (limited) plan instead.
4) I researched it, saw they had every right to do what they did and canceled my AT&T contract, moved to Verizon.

You were right.....you are confused. You keep trying to defend your position with a quote from their TETHERING plan. I'm guessing you don't know the difference between an Unlimited Data plan and a Tethering plan. Tethering plans allow for, you know...Tethering. Choose whatever definition you want. Unlimited Data plans do not allow ANY Tethering.

As for lying....its often the case that the simple minded obfuscate their lack of knowledge by pointing fingers at the rational mind.

Try to be calm. You can do tethering through bluetooth, meaning your iPhone can connect to a laptop through bluetooth and have your laptop use your iPhone's data plan to go on the internet. That is tethering. Data to data. When you use Jawbone, it's not data to data, since it's a speaker. Your Jawbone is not connecting to Pandora via your iPhone. Instead, your iPhone is transfering music information to Jawbone, which does not use AT&T's data service.

If AT&T still considers that tethering, then any type of bluetooth transmission will be consider tethering, and everyone that uses bluetooth will be in violation.

Simple words for you:

AT&T considers Bluetooth streaming to external speakers tethering. If you are paying for a tethering plan, no problem. If you are only paying for a data plan, they have clearly stated in their AUP that streaming data to any device is not permissible WITHOUT a Tethering plan.

Read their AUP. Your definitions and opinions are irrelevant. Only theirs matters in this issue.

Regardless I'm no longer an AT&T customer and never will be again.
 
I got the definition of tethering from ATT. I showed you where it states that tethering is using your phone as a modem.

Please show me where it states that using a bluetooth speeker is tethering. All I am asking is for you to show where it says that in writing.

You need not respond with anything more than a link. should you not want to.

I just read the ATT AUP and it is not in there, sorry but the rep you spoke to miss informed you.

http://www.corp.att.com/aup/

There is the link if you can find what your talkking about I would love to read it.

This is the only thing you have shown so far,

This means, by way of example only, that checking email, surfing the Internet, downloading legally acquired songs, and/or visiting corporate intranets is permitted, but downloading movies using P2P file sharing services, redirecting television signals for viewing on Personal Computers, web broadcasting, and/or for the operation of servers, telemetry devices and/or Supervisory Control and Data Acquisition devices is prohibited."Furthermore, plans (unless specifically designated for tethering usage) cannot be used for any applications that tether the device (through use of, including without limitation, connection kits, other phone/smartphone to computer accessories, BLUETOOTH® or any other wireless technology) to Personal Computers (including without limitation, laptops), or other equipment for any purpose. "

But you again MISS READ IT. It clearly says

Furthermore, plans cannot be used for any applications that tether the device to Personal Computers or other equipment for any purpose.

The important word here being "tether", so please find me a definition of tether, not just what you think, or what the rep said. I found tether on the ATT website, and here is what it said.

An overview of device tethering

Tethering lets you use your smartphone as a wireless modem or mobile hotspot for your PC or Wi-Fi-capable device. With a qualified data plan that includes tethering, you get full access to the Internet and your email when you connect your device to your laptop via Bluetooth or USB cable.


http://www.att.com/esupport/article.jsp?sid=KB102856#fbid=R6OtCjImfV2

While this may not be important to you, I think it may help another indavidual in your position to be better prepaired for that laim excuse from ATT.

Although they may have some valid examples or excuses, the one they used with you, using your device with a bluetooth headset or speekers is not tethering. (period)

Here is another example from the ATT website, on this one they are telling you what devices tether and how to do it.


AT&T offers a number of data-capable handsets that can be used as wireless modems. Click here for a list of devices compatible with AT&T's tether solution.

So they are saying, that a device used as wireless modem, is tethering.
http://www.wireless.att.com/busines...nkName=HandsetsAsModems&wtLinkLoc=LN&WT.svl=1

I can come up with examples all day long. Please just show me one.

Here is a link to a thread on ATT about this very topic, and the ATT rep gave the same lame lie, and used the same info to try and back it up with. However the reps are miss intererating the information. Here is the last line of the thread, and he is right.



Well kiddies, we're screwed. AT&T has worded it the following way:



"Furthermore, plans (unless specifically designated for tethering usage) cannot be used for any applications that tether the device (through use of, including without limitation, connection kits, other phone/smartphone to computer accessories, BLUETOOTH® or any other wireless technology) to Personal Computers (including without limitation, laptops), or other equipment for any purpose. "



Unfortunately "other equipment" is an extremely ambiguous term.



The way this is written, if we link our smartphones to an blue tooth head phone (other equipment) or connect it to a headset via a cable (again other equipment), or we use whatever means available to connect it to our vehicle (other equipment) or use Wifi to remotely control a computer, it is ALL considered tethering by AT&T.

However that is only in regard to data use, and self-refers to tethering in the definition.....


http://forums.wireless.att.com/t5/Apple-iPhone/Definition-of-Tethering/td-p/2765195/page/2


Any way Really big feet, I am sorry ATT treated you like that. Great job firing them. I fired them last month myself. I dont want to give you a hard time. You are the victim here.
 
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You will not find enough people to do this when you consider the sheer number of users on AT&T. They will not even know it is happening! If it make one feel better, go for it. Just beware that AT&T could find a way to kick YOU in the same place!:p

Att will find another way to get you to stop. Are you SURE its happening to people using 2 gigs? I used 4 to 5 gigs some months, and have never been throttled. I remember last year I went up to 8 gigs, and never tethered. I would watch video podcasts on my hourly commute to work (and back), and just that was enough I guess to push me to that level of usage.

I dont like the idea of data throttling either, but if they wanted to, they could have taken unlimited data off all our phones as soon as we upgraded, since we were signing a new contract, so I kind of consider this the lesser of two evils. I have a tethering app on my phone now too, but I have it there for emergencies or the once a year I go out of town and need wifi at the hotel to check something. People who abuse the unlimited data by tethering all the time on all their devices are making it worse for the rest of us. Im not on ATT's side, but at the same time, I can see why something needs to be done.

Data requires bandwith, resources, towers, etc. It is not an unlimited resource as far as how much we can use. Pretend its water. If your neighbor is watering his lawn 24/7, and all of a sudden your faucet only comes out in a drizzle, you are going to suffer. And be pissed. I guess I see both sides of the coin. Having said that, the paid data plans they have now do NOT meet my needs. The iphone is made to use tons of data, there is no way Im sticking to 2 gigs a month, and I dont know if I can afford paying for more at their prices... Sigh

----------

Some of us have felt that the "throttling" issue is limited to certain users with grandfathered unlimited, namely dependent on your GEO location where their cellular network may not be as built up or strong as other places. Otherwise, every single grandfathered user would be caught by their logistics system and throttled, which isn't happening... their simply picking and choosing. You could have two people, one uses 4 or 5gb and another 10gb, and somehow only the 4-5GB user will get throttled. Only answer has to be something with GEO location.

I've gone over 5gb plenty of times with no warnings or anything, even this month I'm already at almost 5, usually avg 3-4. People I know with grandfathered unlimited down here still, South FL, no throttling. I actually had to have them put it back on my account after switching to the i777 GS2 since it doesn't transfer to new phones and you have to go through high up level at at&t to get it back, during that time frame they
could easily see my usage, yet no problems.

you are spot on. Im in south florida too, and ive never been throttled. (and i have unlimited data). You are right
 
This thread NEEDS to be closed as it serves no relavant discussion to the iPhone.

This is like the 100th thread on AT&T. OMG people give it a rest.
 
Bastard ATT..

i got one of those stupid messages today, stating that i was close to reaching the 5% of users that use to much data. I looked at my last billing cycle and my data usage didn't even reach 2gb. I merely used 1.7gb of data ... i find this unfair that they are sending me this crap . Especially because a person that pays $25 a month gets 2gb of data already with steady speeds. I pay $30 for an unlimited plan and i only used 1.7gb of data ...that is whore crap.
i called customer care asked them what was the data cap... they didn't tell me what it was or what was the limit. All they could tell me that i was one of the 5% of users who uses to much .. what is to much ... I at least got 30 bucks of my billing cycle , but i think they should at least state what is the cap where they start reducing speeds ...
These corporate guys are gonna get an e-mail about this for sure ...
especially with a customer who has been with them from the cingular days!!!! :mad::mad::mad::mad::mad:
:apple::apple::apple: MBP 17" SSD 8GB . MBP 15" SSD 8G . iPAD 3G 32gb . apple tv. iPhone 4s 32gb
 
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The issue with being in the "Top 5%" is that with most of us being forced to tiered plans or into leaving AT&T altogether, that Top 5% changes every month. And most likely, it moves to lower levels of usage.

I think the bigger issue is how this clearly demonstrates AT&Ts concerns about their own network capacity and capabilities. They must be close to the breaking point for capacity.
 
AT&T should just nuke all the grandfathered plans. I'm sick of hearing people go "I suck 72TB of data a month why am I getting throttled and AT&T sucks because they should be able to deliver 72TB to everyone at the same time!!!".
 
i got one of those stupid messages today, stating that i was close to reaching the 5% of users that use to much data. I looked at my last billing cycle and my data usage didn't even reach 2gb. I merely used 1.7gb of data ... i find this unfair that they are sending me this crap . Especially because a person that pays $25 a month gets 2gb of data already with steady speeds. I pay $30 for an unlimited plan and i only used 1.7gb of data ...that is whore crap.
i called customer care asked them what was the data cap... they didn't tell me what it was or what was the limit. All they could tell me that i was one of the 5% of users who uses to much .. what is to much ... I at least got 30 bucks of my billing cycle , but i think they should at least state what is the cap where they start reducing speeds ...
These corporate guys are gonna get an e-mail about this for sure ...
especially with a customer who has been with them from the cingular days!!!! :mad::mad::mad::mad::mad:
:apple::apple::apple: MBP 17" SSD 8GB . MBP 15" SSD 8G . iPAD 3G 32gb . apple tv. iPhone 4s 32gb

Such anger... I'm just curious where all the outrage was last July when AT&T made it clear that this was their ultimate plan.

I love how so many people here kept thinking, "I don't tether or use 100GB a month, so AT&T certainly can't be talking about me" even though the writing was clear.
 
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AT&T should just nuke all the grandfathered plans. I'm sick of hearing people go "I suck 72TB of data a month why am I getting throttled and AT&T sucks because they should be able to deliver 72TB to everyone at the same time!!!".

I have the unlimited plan and I agree with you. Come June 2012 everyone will have had it for at least 2 years. I think it would be the perfect time for AT&T to axe it when the LTE iPhone hits. However, I don't know if they would be willing to loose quite a few customers to Verizon if they made that move. People say they'd leave but would they really if their precious unlimited plan was yanked from them? Not as many as you think.

All aside, these threads are getting really really pointless!!!
 
Happy with ATT and have no intention of kicking them in the nuts.

Are you 12?
 
AT&T should just nuke all the grandfathered plans. I'm sick of hearing people go "I suck 72TB of data a month why am I getting throttled and AT&T sucks because they should be able to deliver 72TB to everyone at the same time!!!".

I would agree if its TB's of data or even 5GB's plus.
But people start getting slower than 2G speeds hitting 1.7GB and 2GB.
That doesnt make sense.
And with that slow down the top 5% might drop down to 1GB a month.
And then what? People pay $25 for 2GB and the $30 "unlimited" start getting capped at 1 and 1.5GB?
You're sick of hearing it then dont click on a similar thread. Its a valid arguiment and it seems like unfair treatment to unlimited data users.
 
I would agree if its TB's of data or even 5GB's plus.
But people start getting slower than 2G speeds hitting 1.7GB and 2GB.
That doesnt make sense.
And with that slow down the top 5% might drop down to 1GB a month.
And then what? People pay $25 for 2GB and the $30 "unlimited" start getting capped at 1 and 1.5GB?
You're sick of hearing it then dont click on a similar thread. Its a valid arguiment and it seems like unfair treatment to unlimited data users.

It makes perfect sense. 6 months ago, AT&T made their plan very clear.
With the top 5% being targeted, it was obvious that they wanted to throttle at, or before, the 2GB point.

They don't care what people pay, they just want everyone off the Unlimited Plan and they feel this is the easiest way to make everyone switch to a tiered plan.
 
It makes perfect sense. 6 months ago, AT&T made their plan very clear.
With the top 5% being targeted, it was obvious that they wanted to throttle at, or before, the 2GB point.

They don't care what people pay, they just want everyone off the Unlimited Plan and they feel this is the easiest way to make everyone switch to a tiered plan.

And you find that perfectly fine and fair huh?
 
A2DP Bluetooth audio streaming is not tethering and if it was they would be charging anyone who turned Bluetooth on tethering fee and it would be monitored in the iOS software

Your dumb for telling them the medium you listened to pandora through should have just said you listened to it on the phone

ZigBee devices have Mac addresses and don't connect to outside networks

I would have raised hell and got out of the contract for free, you bent over and took it
 
I have the unlimited plan and I agree with you. Come June 2012 everyone will have had it for at least 2 years. I think it would be the perfect time for AT&T to axe it when the LTE iPhone hits. However, I don't know if they would be willing to loose quite a few customers to Verizon if they made that move. People say they'd leave but would they really if their precious unlimited plan was yanked from them? Not as many as you think.

All aside, these threads are getting really really pointless!!!

I think all this "I'm going to switch" stuff is largely over-hyped. People say they will do things, and they don't. Even if they lose a few customers, streamlining all the plans would have a net benefit, as well as getting data hogs off the network.

Either that or they should offer unlimited again, with a strict and well-disclosed throttle point (i.e. after the first 3GB, your speed will be reduced to 200kbps), basically the same as metered, but without the overages. I think that would be the most fair thing to do, and move everyone to that, and then offer them an opt-in upsell for more full-speed data.

I would agree if its TB's of data or even 5GB's plus.
But people start getting slower than 2G speeds hitting 1.7GB and 2GB.
That doesnt make sense.
And with that slow down the top 5% might drop down to 1GB a month.
And then what? People pay $25 for 2GB and the $30 "unlimited" start getting capped at 1 and 1.5GB?
You're sick of hearing it then dont click on a similar thread. Its a valid arguiment and it seems like unfair treatment to unlimited data users.

Then switch to 3GB/$30 if you're so unhappy with unlimited.
 
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