Chinese Factory Shutdown May Affect Apple Notebook Supplies

[lukarak]

Just some thoughts ...

The question is, do we need to own so much technology, and even more important resource-wise to replace it every year? There are enough resources, they are just not evenly distributed. More or less it's been like this for centuries.

I'd gladly pay 10.000+ for a computer that lasts for 20+ years (with new software), but I can't because no one sells something like this. Why is it that the only thing an average consumer cares about is price, and not quality?

There sure was/is a lot of advertisement/social engineering going on to create something like this:

There is no problem with a computer lasting 20 years. I have many of them, ie my Atari which is almost as old as i am, got it preschool. Still works like the first day, and it's not from lack of use. But the problem is what i can do with it.
I' don't belive that the world could sustain the western standard of living for 6 or 7 billion people.

 

[JHankwitz]

I hope someday they can bring production to the states.

Made and Designed in California

That would be nice, if ouly we would be able to afford paying for it. People are already complaining that Apple equipment costs too much. Moving production back to the states would more than double the cost, and sales would tank. Without all the sales, they wouldn't be able to pay for all their innovation and the company would die.

 

[guzhogi]

Unfortunate timing?

These are the factories we've read about where workers are constantly inhaling aluminum dust, getting sick, and even dying. The fact that authorities in China have shut it down tells you it's a pretty bad situation. What's unfortunate is that people are sick from factory work.

When the Foxconn factory exploded, there were reports that workers there too were inhaling aluminum dust and they found a lot of huge safety violations.

This factory is only finally getting attention because the smell was so bad it was bothering neighbors near the factory--imagine what it's like inside.

There is a precedent for this situation: late 19th century/early 20th century United States. It was a moral tragedy. And it was for the sake of greed. And saying the timing is unfortunate now because you are worried an unannounced, very slightly speed bumped MBP will be delayed is also greedy.

I'm afraid more stuff like this will happen if all those right-wingers who want less regulation get their way. Who cares about the workers as long as you make record profits? [/cynicism]

I think I've spent too much time on the PRSI forums.

 

[shompa]

I bought a 13 MBP last month . Filed a return on amazon this morning because of the rumors of the late 2011 refresh. Now what? lol. I only have 30 days to return...

Why bother?

The refresh will only be a small speed bump. (Intel releases 100 mhz faster processors)

 

[Thomas2006]

It could always be much worse than having China make Apple's products. It could be made in Great Britain, and that is really, really scary.

What do you mean? Does Great Britain produce shoddy products or can businesses abuse workers without consequence?

 

[JHankwitz]

I hope someday they can bring production to the states.

Made and Designed in California

Most of the increased costs related to manufacturing in the states is the unbelievable 35% fine, tax, investment, levey, or whatever you want to call it imposed by our government on US made products. Business will continue moving and staying off-shore as long as our government provides incentive to do so.

 

[dmunz]

I hope someday they can bring production to the states.

Made and Designed in California

"No mass production or overseas workforce. WaterField bags are designed and made in San Francisco, where rent is high, labor is expensive and competition is intense. We wouldn’t go anywhere else!"

There are some things you can buy local. I've bought four bags from these guys and they are truly well made (and more expensive).

Start with the things you can get from here and show the powers that you care. Baby steps people.

FWIW
DLM

 

[anthonylambert]

It could always be much worse than having China make Apple's products. It could be made in Great Britain, and that is really, really scary.

Gooord Blimey.... It would be the perfect partnership! I can see the box label now.


"Designed in California by a Brit, made in the UK by some more Brits."

 

[Steve's Barber]

Greed, in terms of the profits demanded by corporations & shareholders, & the desire for cheap products demanded by consumers is the enemy of morality in business.

Let's not forget the demands of union labor built into consumer goods. Free daycare, full dental and 37 paid holidays off (including groundhog day).

 

[applesith]

I hope someday they can bring production to the states.

Made and Designed in California

Yeah, not gonna happen. Macs are expensive enough.

 

[Thunderhawks]

The labor cost is only one factor, and not as much as a lot of people think. The Japanese have high labor cost, yet they've managed to be extremely competitive building automobiles and computers.

Apple can still source some parts from Taiwan and Korea, and move assembly back to the states, and take advantage of robotics like the Japanese do. This would provide skilled jobs.

The increased labor costs would also be offset somewhat by cheaper shipping.

The "make it in America" is a simplified mantra and ignores the fact that we live in global markets.

Since everything is driven by money, USA government at all levels , especially state, needs to change it's business unfriendly tax structure.

That is only the beginning.

The amount of labor the assembly needs (even with robotics) is not available in the US, which is why we have lots of foreign workers doing simple jobs.
Using robotics is a simple job and thus would not be highly paid.

Also, as long as you can get paid unemployment and welfare money that is higher or close to minimum wage why work.

Add to that the dumbing down of America in education (We lower the bar until everybody passes) and you have an environment where Make it in USA is an adventure!

Why would Apple want the headache of running a factory with all it's regulations and government interference.

So much easier to just order from Foxconn etc.

Consumers won't pay extra for Made in USA!

 

[chaosbunny]

There is no problem with a computer lasting 20 years. I have many of them, ie my Atari which is almost as old as i am, got it preschool. Still works like the first day, and it's not from lack of use. But the problem is what i can do with it.
I' don't belive that the world could sustain the western standard of living for 6 or 7 billion people.

I know I still have my C64 and Amiga500 from the 80ies. They are still working too. That's why I added "with new software" in my post.

And for the other thing, just look at how much stuff is thrown away in its original box. There is so many production that goes directly to the dump. The problem is not limited resources, the problem is uneven distribution by politics and corporations.

As an example, most 3rd world countries get nothing back from selling their labour and resources. All the taxes and wealth that is generated go directly into the hands of some dictator there, organisations like the world bank (paying back debts) and ultimately the global corporations can get their profits multiple times. Africa has oil, diamonds and many valuable resources, yet the poorest general populace on the planet. The sad thing is, global politics, banks and corporations don't want to raise everyones standard to ours.

 

[TimTheEnchanter]

About the "ODOR"

I've been to China, so I know first hand... if they're complaining about a strange odor in an urban area, then it's got to be REALLY funky. Taking the overnight train from Beijing to Shanghai, you get to see what's out there beyond the regular tourist sights and let me tell you I saw factory smoke of almost ever color along the way. Worse on was a dual stack of jet black with an almost fluorescent yellow smoke. God knows what that was.

 

[daxomni]

Taiwanese company Catcher Technology has had to temporarily close down a factory in eastern China due to complaints of a "strange odor" coming from the building. The timing is unfortunate as we've been hearing rumors that Apple was planning on a small MacBook Pro refresh as early as this week. Rumors had suggested a processor bump was due late this year, and new part numbers have suggested an imminent launch.

If the "odor" is enough to close a factory in China it's probably a lot worse than just a bad smell. And it's not like nobody has suffered long-lived health effects from chemicals used in the production of Apple hardware. But yeah, let's pretend the only story here is how it affects the speed of the next processor bump for people thousands of miles away.

 

[guzhogi]

Most of the increased costs related to manufacturing in the states is the unbelievable 35% fine, tax, investment, levey, or whatever you want to call it imposed by our government on US made products. Business will continue moving and staying off-shore as long as our government provides incentive to do so.

Honest question: what's the tax rate in other countries?

Let's not forget the demands of union labor built into consumer goods. Free daycare, full dental and 37 paid holidays off (including groundhog day).

Another honest question: how much does daycare, dental & paid holidays cost compared to stuff like CEO salaries and other compensation? I'm not saying people should be paid to get, what I feel, is something trivial like groundhog's day off, but what's so bad about getting free dental or daycare? I've met a few people in the US who had jobs but didn't get medical insurance. Something came up, out of their control, and they got hurt & couldn't get treated properly.

Plus, do the CEOs and other corporate executives get health insurance and day care? If so, why do they get it and not the workers? I remember a year or two ago this new senator was complaining about how he had to wait a few months for his government provided health insurance to kick in. However, he was also against having the Obamacare package. I find it a little hypocritical that executives and other people in power want all of these services provided to them, but not to their workers.

 

[ericinboston]

I hope someday they can bring production to the states.

Made and Designed in California

Exactly. I can't stand that sticker on the back of Apple products. Who are they trying to impress????!!! And "assembled in China" implies, well, that it was "assembled"...who MANUFACTURED all the pieces?! Yeah, doubt it was folks in the USA.

90% of the stuff folks by in the USA is "designed" in the USA but created and/or assembled outside the USA. This is part of the reason why USA has been suffering so long (at least 10 years) in unemployment...because there are extremely few jobs in the USA where something is actually built.

 

[bpaluzzi]

This is part of the reason why USA has been suffering so long (at least 10 years) in unemployment...because there are extremely few jobs in the USA where something is actually built.

Right, because the unemployment rates in the BRIC countries is so much better than the US

Those manufacturing countries have much higher unemployment rates than the US. Bringing large-scale manufacturing back to the US will either lead to massive price increases (if unionized US workers get the jobs) or more jobs taken by illegal immigrants (the more likely scenario) and more bellyaching.

 

[gnasher729]

If the "odor" is enough to close a factory in China it's probably a lot worse than just a bad smell. And it's not like nobody has suffered long-lived health effects from chemicals used in the production of Apple hardware. But yeah, let's pretend the only story here is how it affects the speed of the next processor bump for people thousands of miles away.

Past history shows that risking the health of employees leads to loss of contracts with Apple when found out.

 

[Les Kern]

Don't like the smell, then take some of that 80BN and build a plant here.
Otherwise I don't ****** care.
Flat-earthers are fools, and corporatists are just plain scum.

 

[nylonsteel]

re original article - "strange odor"

"...due to complaints of a "strange odor" coming from the building..."

I wouldnt worry about it if it smelled like pungent garlic and hints of fish sauce

 

[kiljoy616]

I'm sure apple will demand the dead bodies removed from the factory.
In my opinion the factory ought not overwork their employees to the point of death, but who am I really?

And why should they not work their employee to death? You make it sound like that a bad thing in our little world of Capitalism. Better than all the poop on wall street messing up good old NYC.

 

[ed724]

Unfortunate timing?

These are the factories we've read about where workers are constantly inhaling aluminum dust, getting sick, and even dying. The fact that authorities in China have shut it down tells you it's a pretty bad situation. What's unfortunate is that people are sick from factory work.

When the Foxconn factory exploded, there were reports that workers there too were inhaling aluminum dust and they found a lot of huge safety violations.

This factory is only finally getting attention because the smell was so bad it was bothering neighbors near the factory--imagine what it's like inside.

There is a precedent for this situation: late 19th century/early 20th century United States. It was a moral tragedy. And it was for the sake of greed. And saying the timing is unfortunate now because you are worried an unannounced, very slightly speed bumped MBP will be delayed is also greedy.

----------

So, because a US company is having it's products manufactured in China, and the they don't have stringent safety protocols in place (by their choice) Apple should tell them to take a hike ? I suppose there's some merit to that argument, but in the real world, we know that's not going to happen. Of course people could just stop buying Apple products too. We know that's not going to happen. Or, the Chinese factories could revamp, raise the cost of the supplies to Apple, Apple raises the price of its products, sales go down, then everybody get laid off. Of course Apple could take some it's profits and offer to update the factory, but ultimately would have no 'real' control of the process and basically be throwing money down the drain. So, as long as the demand exists, and people want work due to the demand, and there's huge profits to be made. It's not going to change. Ultimately IMO, the factory making products is solely responsible. It's up to it's owner/operators to do the right thing. If the government over there has to get involved, so be it. Saying it's "Greed" is ridiculous. It's more like "human nature". You might, just might find a handful of people that when having the opportunity to become wealthy, would consider all the ramifications and possibly turn that opportunity down.

 

[kiljoy616]

Past history shows that risking the health of employees leads to loss of contracts with Apple when found out.

Not sure now, but there was something about Steve and he did not like when the workers where not looked after. I Just don't remember where I read it.

So a few days maybe a week of delay like that matters any more but then that just my opinion, don't know about the Otaku fanclub.

----------

So, because a US company is having it's products manufactured in China, and the they don't have stringent safety protocols in place (by their choice) Apple should tell them to take a hike ? I suppose there's some merit to that argument, but in the real world, we know that's not going to happen. Of course people could just stop buying Apple products too. We know that's not going to happen. Or, the Chinese factories could revamp, raise the cost of the supplies to Apple, Apple raises the price of its products, sales go down, then everybody get laid off. Of course Apple could take some it's profits and offer to update the factory, but ultimately would have no 'real' control of the process and basically be throwing money down the drain. So, as long as the demand exists, and people want work due to the demand, and there's huge profits to be made. It's not going to change. Ultimately IMO, the factory making products is solely responsible. It's up to it's owner/operators to do the right thing. If the government over there has to get involved, so be it. Saying it's "Greed" is ridiculous. It's more like "human nature". You might, just might find a handful of people that when having the opportunity to become wealthy, would consider all the ramifications and possibly turn that opportunity down.

Your making good sense, way to much, most of it will sail over poster head. Still nice try.

 

[lifeinhd]

I hope someday they can bring production to the states.

Made and Designed in California

It can't happen. Why? Simple economics. All countries have a comparative advantage in producing goods for which it has the lowest opportunity cost. This means there is no incentive in the Unites States to produce unibody enclosures when our opportunity cost is, say, research and development of software that is potentially worth billions. Looking at this another way: let's say it takes the United States one unit of labor to produce a unibody enclosure, and one unit of labor to do software research and development. Let's say it takes China 2 units of labor to create a unibody enclosure, and 12 units of labor to do the same software R&D. Let's say each country has 24 units of labor. If the United States were to allocate half its resources to developing unibodies, the opportunity cost is 12 softwares. If China allocates half its resources to producing unibodies, its opportunity cost is 1 software-- not as large of a missed opportunity as the United States. The idea is for each country to focus on producing in the area with the least opportunity cost, and trade for items with the highest opportunity cost.

So I guess that's the long-winded explanation of why the manufacturing of unibodies won't be coming to the States.

 

[hobo.hopkins]

90% of the stuff folks by in the USA is "designed" in the USA but created and/or assembled outside the USA. This is part of the reason why USA has been suffering so long (at least 10 years) in unemployment...because there are extremely few jobs in the USA where something is actually built.

So...what's your point? In principle, you won't find a single person who disagrees with you. Everyone would love more American factories and jobs. Unfortunately, the current tax policies incentivise companies to move overseas. That's just the unfortunate reality. Until that changes, you won't see companies moving manufacturing into America.