talking about marriage and you havent' even met her in person?
whatever floats your boat I suppose...
whatever floats your boat I suppose...
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Chinese fiancee -- Visa application and other advice sought
- Thread starter bobber205
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talking about marriage and you havent' even met her in person?
whatever floats your boat I suppose...
What he said, green card or not.
This coming from someone who has met a few friends online and even flew half way around the world to meet someone (it wasn't just for her though).
I would suggest trying to find a way to move to china and work for a while while learning the customs/building your relationship if possible. If only for a few months while you compile paperwork and then bring her back. It's a lot of paperwork immigrating to another country, especially the US. Speaking of which I think I have some more paperwork to finish.
I have personal experience "getting someone" here to the US from the UK. First we attempted the paperwork process on our own twice and twice were turned down. We then ended up having to hire an attorney which was costly to us. That was a failure but then some status changes took place and through an attorney we were successful. It was a long process, a process that was not cheap and his ability to work was absent in all of this so my income was the only income. It was difficult but it was necessary. Eventually it all worked out, it took about 3 years total.
I assume things are even harder now, this was from 1997 - 2000. They could be easier, I'll never know because I won't do it again myself but I wish you all the best of luck.
You could get married and the process will still suck but you won't have any real failures but no matter how mature you think you are today, you won't know whether marriage is right until you meet her face to face and spend a substantial amount of time with her.
I assume things are even harder now, this was from 1997 - 2000. They could be easier, I'll never know because I won't do it again myself but I wish you all the best of luck.
You could get married and the process will still suck but you won't have any real failures but no matter how mature you think you are today, you won't know whether marriage is right until you meet her face to face and spend a substantial amount of time with her.
I guess I probably wrote a poor introduction post.
Of course we're going to spend some quality time together before deciding on something like this
If we DO decide that it's something we want to do after we've meet in person, I wanted advice on how we could prepare in the meantime.
It's a complicated issue and obviously something I don't have experiencing making a decision on.
As to her intentions I can say this:
My mom basically said all the things you guys are saying about her intentions. She was suspicious.
A couple months ago I visted my family. She met my family over skype and talked for a good 3 to 4 hours with my mother (and myself beside my mom for about half of that time).
After that encounter, she was 100% on board and actually said she would be disappointed if we didn't get married.
That's how impressed she was.
Of course I don't need to justify our relationship to a bunch of online anonymous strangers to make it legitmate to me, but I
wanted to lessen any fears some members on here might have.
Of course we're going to spend some quality time together before deciding on something like this
If we DO decide that it's something we want to do after we've meet in person, I wanted advice on how we could prepare in the meantime.
It's a complicated issue and obviously something I don't have experiencing making a decision on.
As to her intentions I can say this:
My mom basically said all the things you guys are saying about her intentions. She was suspicious.
A couple months ago I visted my family. She met my family over skype and talked for a good 3 to 4 hours with my mother (and myself beside my mom for about half of that time).
After that encounter, she was 100% on board and actually said she would be disappointed if we didn't get married.
That's how impressed she was.
Of course I don't need to justify our relationship to a bunch of online anonymous strangers to make it legitmate to me, but I
wanted to lessen any fears some members on here might have.
of course you don't.......but one thing you should take away from the comments here is that the process is going to be full of skeptical officials who you're going to have to convince.
Good luck
That's right, you just have to justify the relationship to an online anonymous stranger.
And that is the bottom line.
If you think the MacRumors folk are giving you a hard time… wait till you get your file tossed back at you. Interview terminated. I speak from experience.
Give this your best shot — and make it as legit appearing as possible. A few days visit and Skype chat histories don't cut it anymore.
Immigration is not sentimental. And in this age of *cough* Homeland Security even less so.
Good luck.
I think you should cut him some slack. We're not in his shoes.That's right, you just have to justify the relationship to an online anonymous stranger.
I am. I have a million different stereotypes I've refrained from throwing into this discussion.
Stories like this seem to have several common themes. None of which are particularly 'flattering'.
And that is the bottom line.
If you think the MacRumors folk are giving you a hard time wait till you get your file tossed back at you. Interview terminated. I speak from experience.
Give this your best shot and make it as legit appearing as possible. A few days visit and Skype chat histories don't cut it anymore.
Immigration is not sentimental. And in this age of *cough* Homeland Security even less so.
Good luck.
I think you should cut him some slack. We're not in his shoes.
Curious: We were planning in the next 6 months or so during a visit, I go to her parents village and formally meet them. How much of a difference would that make to the embassy? Should we not even START the immigration process until after that has happened?
I would think that the longer you two maintain a relationship before applying for anything, the better. Make sure you document everything you have done so far. Go back and look at the "skeptical" comments again, and think about how you would counter them. You may need those arguments when you go before an official - whose is being paid to be skeptical, and to believe that at least one of you is has dishonourable motives. Remember that their job is not to make this work out for you, their job is to prevent unqualified people from coming into the US.
It can be done, but you will have to work for it.
It can be done, but you will have to work for it.
Meet her and her culture first
You need to meet her and her culture first, then you have to think where and how you want to live. I don't want to sound negative, I just want to share my personal experience with you.
I'm on my second marriage, and both partners were/are Asian. My first marriage was a painful failure, I just jumped into it to fast. Then we had kids and I finally made the decision to part. Looking backwards, I could have spared myself and my poor kids a lot of pain if I had taken more time and more learning of cultural details first, before making the decision.
My second (and current) marriage is the total opposite. It is heaven on earth, pure. But both of us went trough bitter experience and learning, and we took a year of living close together before getting married. When we got married, we lived in Germany (she is from China), and the lack of an Asian community (and trivial-soundign things like the lack of Asian supermarkets) put a visible strain on her. Now we live in New England, with a Chinatown in reach, which solved many of these problems. But she still has problems to make friends, needs support when dealing with authorities, etc. She was professor in China, so it is not a matter of education, it is a matter of cultural difference.
I'm writing this to tell you what you have to expect, and what you have to commit to. If you are ready for this, and you are really a "good fit of souls" you may have a bright future together. Therefore, follow what others have already advised, go to China for a couple of months, experience the culture, the isolation, the difficulties, the dependency on the partner for all kind of silly things. That will help you to understand her better when she lives with you. Then get her to your place as a tourist for a couple of months, to see if she can master the real life in the US. Then, if you two are still determined go for the papers.
It is a serious decision, don't take it lightly, BOTH of you.
Good luck,
Manfred
You need to meet her and her culture first, then you have to think where and how you want to live. I don't want to sound negative, I just want to share my personal experience with you.
I'm on my second marriage, and both partners were/are Asian. My first marriage was a painful failure, I just jumped into it to fast. Then we had kids and I finally made the decision to part. Looking backwards, I could have spared myself and my poor kids a lot of pain if I had taken more time and more learning of cultural details first, before making the decision.
My second (and current) marriage is the total opposite. It is heaven on earth, pure. But both of us went trough bitter experience and learning, and we took a year of living close together before getting married. When we got married, we lived in Germany (she is from China), and the lack of an Asian community (and trivial-soundign things like the lack of Asian supermarkets) put a visible strain on her. Now we live in New England, with a Chinatown in reach, which solved many of these problems. But she still has problems to make friends, needs support when dealing with authorities, etc. She was professor in China, so it is not a matter of education, it is a matter of cultural difference.
I'm writing this to tell you what you have to expect, and what you have to commit to. If you are ready for this, and you are really a "good fit of souls" you may have a bright future together. Therefore, follow what others have already advised, go to China for a couple of months, experience the culture, the isolation, the difficulties, the dependency on the partner for all kind of silly things. That will help you to understand her better when she lives with you. Then get her to your place as a tourist for a couple of months, to see if she can master the real life in the US. Then, if you two are still determined go for the papers.
It is a serious decision, don't take it lightly, BOTH of you.
Good luck,
Manfred
If the biggest portion of this is proving our love for each other, then
Willing to wait as long as it takes. Do whatever it takes. <3
^^^Perhaps, but it's hard to prove a relationship between 2 people who haven't met.
Also, you want to be together, but what I'm hearing is actually, "I want to be with her by bringing her into the US." Would you be equally willing to move to China? If you're willing to do anything to make it all work out in your favour, then perhaps you should rethink your plan.
People in China can only have 1 child, and that child is often responsible for taking care of the parents (somewhat) when they get old. This includes financially. It's also not totally uncommon for the parents to live with you under the same roof. There's no tax-free government program where they
Also, you want to be together, but what I'm hearing is actually, "I want to be with her by bringing her into the US." Would you be equally willing to move to China? If you're willing to do anything to make it all work out in your favour, then perhaps you should rethink your plan.
People in China can only have 1 child, and that child is often responsible for taking care of the parents (somewhat) when they get old. This includes financially. It's also not totally uncommon for the parents to live with you under the same roof. There's no tax-free government program where they
Couple of points this:
1) She has never expressed any interest in us living together in China.
2) If she wants to support her parents in their old age, she would much more likely to be able to do that on a dual american salary.
3) She has a younger brother.
4) Her parents have told her they are ok with her moving to the US.
5) I plan on visiting this October.
There's nothing for you to justify to us here. You are the one who is in this long distance relationship not us, and it's your life. You may feel insulted at what some people have to say about all of this, however you asked for advice. I don't think any comments/ advice here are an attack on your relationship. I really think allot of the posts here are just information that people are giving you to help you the best that we possibly can.
As much as you don't want to hear it your mom has some valid advice and concerns for you and doesn't want you to get hurt. Even though it may bother you to hear negative feedback from her, facts are; shes a woman, she grew up making friends with other girls, and she knows the games women play, so she may have good advice for you.
Love is an awesome and wonderful journey, full of all kinds of things. I seriously hope that it all works out for both of you.
As much as you don't want to hear it your mom has some valid advice and concerns for you and doesn't want you to get hurt. Even though it may bother you to hear negative feedback from her, facts are; shes a woman, she grew up making friends with other girls, and she knows the games women play, so she may have good advice for you.
Love is an awesome and wonderful journey, full of all kinds of things. I seriously hope that it all works out for both of you.
Just to clarify - I do want this to work out for you. So, hope for the best - but plan to convince a mean SOB bugger of an INS interviewer. And to do that you have to think of every reason they will want to deny your request, and then have an answer. Part of that is going to be showing your correspondence. So, while Skype is nice.... unless you've been recording your sessions it means nothing in terms of documentation. Start writing letters (real letters!) and emails, and keep them. Go and visit (I know you are planning to already, but do it again) and get pictures of you with her, with her family, with her friends, etc etc. Go on holiday in different parts of China. Keep your travel receipts, and get photos.
Go on holiday together to a 3rd country. Get photos. Start keeping a diary, and get gushy in it.
Send presents back and forth. Document them in your diary. Have her start one too, even in Chinese.
Take Chinese lessons (whichever dialect is appropriate for her family). Learn to cook chinese food for her (and document the lessons). Etc etc
and good luck, eh?
Plans to do most of that already. Meeting her parents etc. Pictures. Keep a meticulous record. Will also have our thousands and thousands of instant messages. Could print hundreds of emails as well now, let alone with the interview finally takes place.
Not offended by anything here. Enjoying all the advice.
While my mom WAS hesistant about our relationship, after meeting her, she's 100% on board.
Just some comments for what it's worth:
Just some things I've learned over 25 years of living abroad.
Hope things work out for you!
- While Skype is useful, it really doesn't convey what she is really like since you have not met her. Off camera, she could be different.
- Always get to know the culture that you are marring into. Not what you see on TV/Movies or possibly a Chinatown. Spend a year or two in her country. Enjoy learning her culture.
- What religion will she observe? Doesn't it matter to you? If you have kids, what religion will they observe?
- Women tend to want to live near where they grew up. So be prepared to live in China someday. Or possibly, have her parents immigrate to the US with you as their sponsor.
Just some things I've learned over 25 years of living abroad.
Hope things work out for you!
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Just some comments for what it's worth:
- While Skype is useful, it really doesn't convey what she is really like since you have not met her. Off camera, she could be different.
- Always get to know the culture that you are marring into. Not what you see on TV/Movies or possibly a Chinatown. Spend a year or two in her country. Enjoy learning her culture.
- What religion will she observe? Doesn't it matter to you? If you have kids, what religion will they observe?
- Women tend to want to live near where they grew up. So be prepared to live in China someday. Or possibly, have her parents immigrate to the US with you as their sponsor.
Just some things I've learned over 25 years of living abroad.
Hope things work out for you!
First two points, very much agreed.
She's atheist as am I so point 3 is already take care of.
Point 4, not sure at this point.
I think you're making Krafty very jealous right now.
I have no advice for you besides the fact that despite how westernized and easy-going she may seem, you need to understand that the Chinese have a very proud, strong culture, and her parents may value tradition far more than progressiveness. Take it slow. I second the idea of living in China for at least a few months to a year. If you haven't mentioned the possibility of marriage to her parents yet, I would continue to refrain from doing so until you've really gotten to know both her, her family, and her family's customs well. Make sure there is not only understanding, but knowledge, on behalf of both parties. I only speak on experiences with my own family, so take it with a grain of salt. My parents have been Canadian citizens for 25 years, and they're still wary (and show it) every time I tell them I'm seeing a non-Asian. It's not xenophobia, it's not bigotry, it's just what they're used to. You're not only a westerner, but a westerner they've never met and barely know (I'm being blunt here). Tread lightly. But of course, best of luck!
I have no advice for you besides the fact that despite how westernized and easy-going she may seem, you need to understand that the Chinese have a very proud, strong culture, and her parents may value tradition far more than progressiveness. Take it slow. I second the idea of living in China for at least a few months to a year. If you haven't mentioned the possibility of marriage to her parents yet, I would continue to refrain from doing so until you've really gotten to know both her, her family, and her family's customs well. Make sure there is not only understanding, but knowledge, on behalf of both parties. I only speak on experiences with my own family, so take it with a grain of salt. My parents have been Canadian citizens for 25 years, and they're still wary (and show it) every time I tell them I'm seeing a non-Asian. It's not xenophobia, it's not bigotry, it's just what they're used to. You're not only a westerner, but a westerner they've never met and barely know (I'm being blunt here). Tread lightly. But of course, best of luck!
I posted all this (and who's the idiot who voted it down, wtf?), and this is your response?
None of those points mean anything, nor address anything I posted above. Her speaking English smooths over culture fatigue and absolves you from not knowing anything at all about her culture or where she's from? You're going to have one interesting adventure in interpersonal communication and personal discovery when the proverbial hits the fan.
You're getting that advice, and not listening to it.
Absolutely zero difference. So you go to immigration and say, "Oh yeah bro, I met the old man and his lady, they are cool dude." The immigration guy is going to ask you how that's relevant to her not becoming a public charge in America and look at you like you have three heads since generally people who are married have met the parents; if that's your encore in the interview, you're in big trouble. I'd call meeting the parents assumed and unworthy of mention, because it isn't worth mentioning--it's a given.
It's not the biggest hurdle.
Immigration wants three main things:
1) A genuine relationship
2) Financial support
3) Proof of US domicile (does not necessarily mean place to live as much as ties to the US, be it financial accounts, etc.)
Since you're in the US, #3 should be pretty easy, and hopefully #2 is also, but they are still hurdles you have to clear. If you can't clear #2 on your own and meet their requirements, you will need a joint sponsor. Also in reference to #2, when you petition to bring an immigrant relative over (again this is an I-130 process thing but I'd bet it's the same for a K-1), you are entering into a contract to financially support them, as is the joint sponsor, if applicable. Even if they divorce you, your duty to be financially responsible for her does not end until she has put in 40 quarters of work in the US (10 years). That means if you get divorced, and she goes on welfare, you're responsible for the welfare funds for the first ten working years of her life in the US.
Sidenote, this policy is no longer in effect AFAIK. It was a 1979 Deng Xiaoping policy which has fallen by the wayside.
Doesn't mean anything. I swore up and down I'd never want to go back to America when I left a few years ago, and now I've got one way plane tickets for September 6th. Culture fatigue (not culture shock, long-term culture fatigue, rears it's ugly head quite a bit even after a few years).
bobber205 said:
Yeah, you're completely missing the point here and are completely blind to her cultural values. Supporting her parents in old age has almost nothing to do with money. At this point, I do seriously doubt your maturity; this shows extreme naivete.
bobber205 said:
Has she ever even been to the US? If you guys are planning on living in the US, would it not make better sense for her to visit you in the US?
Point 4, not sure at this point.
Better figure that one out pronto, because it will come up.
Seriously, there are many people in this thread who've been through immigration, myself being the most recent as I just finished the process literally four weeks ago and am in the preparation stages of moving to America less than nine weeks from now. You would be wise--very, very wise--to heed some of the advice.
I also haven't seen you make any iota of a mention of willing to learn her language. That will wear down both of you; you can't gripe to her at a native English level (as much as you think you can, trust me), but it's especially hard for her because she can't gripe to you at all in her native language. I spent a bit of time learning Japanese before coming here, have spent a few years here and my speaking is ok (though my wife's English is still substantially better), but there are still occasional times where we are both a bit frustrated by communication. Our communication is quite good, and has what I would consider minimal barriers, but the fact remains neither of us are or ever will be native speakers of the others' language. It becomes most apparent when you do hang out with your own native speakers and realize how much easier/more careless you can be in your speech and know that every word was understood exactly.
Again, just things to think about. I wouldn't touch an international marriage until one of you has at least lived in the other's country for a while and you both have at least visited each other's country. My wife has been to LA/Las Vegas twice, for a month each time, on her own, but a month long trip to LA is a lot different than starting a life in the Minneapolis suburbs. But, at least she has an inkling of what the society is like, however small. However, she isn't the slightest bit prepared for -40*F windchills and a meter of snow on the ground that drags out till early April. Her first winter will be interesting, and a learning experience for both of us.
EDIT: I also want to comment on the interviews. The interviews are rather straightforward, because they've already verified that you have met their criteria by the second interview, sans possibly the financial documents. At least in the I-130 process, there are two interviews. One for me, one for her. The financial documents are not due until her final interview, but we were able to submit them at my interview. Thus, by the time her interview came around, they already had approved the financial stuff and had all the paperwork. In other words, barring her duffing a few answers to simple questions about our marriage, the decision had been made prior. Even if the financial docs weren't submitted until her interview, they just compare them to their guidelines and do that in a few minutes. The interviews in Tokyo are scheduled every 20 minutes, and most of them average less than 10 minutes. For the most part, it's a final quiz on the genuineness of the relationship and your plans. My interview was the harder of the two, but it was still a ten minute deal where they asked mainly about why I was in Japan, how we met, what our plans were, where we would live in the US, etc. Pretty general. You'll know if you meet all of the requirements or not, and it will all be reflected in the paperwork. At that point, the interviews are primarily formalities IME.
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