Chip and pin is painful

Discussion in 'Community Discussion' started by ericgtr12, Nov 13, 2015.

  1. ericgtr12 macrumors 6502a

    ericgtr12

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2015
    #1
    I get that it's more secure but it takes so much longer to use than simply swiping and entering your pin, instead we have to now wait for a minute, then enter the pin. At Home Depot I pulled it out early because it appeared that it was done but was in a lull while it was reading, which caused the system to subsequently reject my card from any other terminal, they needed to key in my card manually to undo the error. What a terrible system.

    This seems like a step back, not forward and none of it can compare the the ease of use and convenience of Apple Pay, I just wish it were more widely available. First world problems I know, but still.
     
  2. gsmornot macrumors 68030

    gsmornot

    Joined:
    Sep 29, 2014
    #2
    Chip and pin would be a better system but what we have is Chip and Sign. You may be putting your debit pin in to pay but its not the same as the EU chip and pin system. You will at times put your card in, pay as if its credit and sign nothing but the overall wait is the same. The process is slower but is supposed to be more secure at the transmission level.
     
  3. tmiw macrumors 68000

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2007
    Location:
    San Diego, CA
    #3
    It's working out to be another stupid card fee fight: http://www.nytimes.com/2015/11/17/b...etailers-another-grievance-against-banks.html. I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of places keep NFC disabled even after turning on chip to get people fed up enough to go back to cash.

    Seriously guys, just impose a $10 minimum and charge extra for credit cards if you hate them that much. Small businesses already do that since it's allowed by law now.
     
  4. Julien macrumors G3

    Julien

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2007
    Location:
    Atlanta
    #4
    Actually you are looking at the same amount of approval time. It is just that waiting to remove the card turns into 'elevator' waiting time. With swiping you don't think about the approval process, but with Chip you are looking for the OK screen to remove the card.
     
  5. tmiw macrumors 68000

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2007
    Location:
    San Diego, CA
    #5
    Nope. Take Target for instance: before you'd swipe and your card would be instantly approved. Now, it's a ~10 second wait.
     
  6. BrianBaughn macrumors 601

    BrianBaughn

    Joined:
    Feb 13, 2011
    Location:
    Baltimore, Maryland
    #6
    It's probably crappy first-generation stuff that will improve.

    The lag at Target is noticeable. Worth the wait for the extra security considering their history.
     
  7. tmiw macrumors 68000

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2007
    Location:
    San Diego, CA
    #7
    By how much though? Walgreens has one of the faster chip implementations and it still takes 3-4 seconds. On the upside, Apple Pay takes less than a second there.
     
  8. ericgtr12 thread starter macrumors 6502a

    ericgtr12

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2015
    #8
    I sat there for close to a minute while it processed and was unable to touch my card. Whenever I go to a restaurant, they put it in, leave it and go about other business as they wait. While it may not be THAT much longer, it's definitely increased and noticeable.
     
  9. Peepo macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2009
    #9
    It's not the same amount of time. In Canada we have been using it for years and are used to it.

    I remember going to the US for trip couple years ago... there was a huge line of people waiting to pay for some attraction (think it was roller coaster in vegas) and a woman was going crazy swiping credit cards from each customer in line to accept their payment. She would take a card, swipe and then almost instantly hand back a receipt/ticket. I though to myself how slow would it be if everyone had to use chip and pin like we do in Canada.
     
  10. Nermal Moderator

    Nermal

    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2002
    Location:
    New Zealand
    #10
    It seems to be down to the individual terminal. Over here, a properly-configured terminal will prompt for the PIN immediately, and then return "approved" within a second. Unfortunately, many terminals are not configured correctly and sit there for several seconds. I tend to use Paywave instead whenever possible, since it's always quick.
     
  11. tmiw macrumors 68000

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2007
    Location:
    San Diego, CA
    #11
    A lot of retailers here have their terminals integrated with their POSes; some of them are using pretty old POSes too. That's why I'm not sure if it'll ever get much better than 10-12 seconds at some of them.
     
  12. Tech198 macrumors G4

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2011
    Location:
    Australia, Perth
    #12
    we have those credit cards with the chip in.. but its down to weather the ATM reads this or still the magnetic stripe..

    I would still say its more secure rather than the stripe, but which ATM's scan the chip now-days ?

    Just like anything which is not widely supported yet, its a 'hot & miss' approach.
     
  13. Peepo macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2009
    #13
    Yes, some are quicker than others.
    But I think the main reason people believe is much slower is that with chip and pin, the card must be left inserted in the machine during the entire transaction. This adds to perception of being slower.
     
  14. tmiw macrumors 68000

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2007
    Location:
    San Diego, CA
    #14
    The chip is definitely slower than swiping in real terms. Here's a video I made of such a transaction:



    (It takes something like 5 seconds just to show the PIN prompt. This was at Target, where the screen used to say "Approved" the instant you swiped.)
     
  15. ericgtr12 thread starter macrumors 6502a

    ericgtr12

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2015
    #15
    That's still twice as fast as it's taken me at Home Depot and local restaurants.
     
  16. tmiw macrumors 68000

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2007
    Location:
    San Diego, CA
    #16
    Target is one of the faster implementations, unfortunately, which doesn't bode well for other stores that haven't turned on support for it yet.
     
  17. bushido Suspended

    bushido

    Joined:
    Mar 26, 2008
    Location:
    Germany
    #17
    i am in the US right now and swiping still blows my mind 3 weeks later. so insecure especially when they walk away with your credit card in a restaurant like wtf!

    i also get irritated when the atm tells me to pull out the card right away instead of leaving it in til u get the money
     
  18. Nermal Moderator

    Nermal

    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2002
    Location:
    New Zealand
    #18
    That really "got" me when I was over there too. How do I know that they're not copying down my card number when it's out of my sight? :eek:
     
  19. lah macrumors regular

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2010
    #19
    I'd rather wait the extra minutes to ensure a secure transaction, than have to go through the whole routine of getting a new card since something has been breached. Hate advising online billing of a new card...
    My hope is that more people adopt Apple Pay - the vendors are what's holding it back here really. Last week tried using it twice at Pret A Manger and both times the cashier said it wasn't working.
     
  20. RenoG macrumors 65816

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2010
    #20
    Then that's sad because I hate using the chip feature at target because it's slower then it needs to be considering the tech.
     
  21. repete7 macrumors member

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2010
    #21
    That does happen. I like the card readers in Europe that they bring to your table. I was excited about the chip cards in the US until I found out they weren't chip and pin. I'd never heard of chip and sign.
     
  22. tmiw macrumors 68000

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2007
    Location:
    San Diego, CA
    #22
    I get why we went that route but it's still unfortunate that restaurants probably won't change how they do things as a result. With a few exceptions of course.
     
  23. jbachandouris macrumors 68040

    jbachandouris

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2009
    Location:
    Upstate NY
    #23
    I am working a contract job repairing POS registers and the chip readers themselves are the bane of my existence. We are constantly replacing debit readers for them not being able to read chips. To make matters worse, getting a replacement can be equally frustrating as they are on backorder. I ordered 3 'next' day and received 1...3 days later.
     
  24. iGeek2014 macrumors 68000

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2014
    Location:
    === Nowheresville ===
    #24
    Wireless Chip and PIN readers are fine when they are within a good signal range. Some of the places I've frequented the member of staff has had to wave their arms around (like they're trying to get a signal on their phone, haha) just to connect to the card merchant.

    Luckily where I work our Chip and PIN processing takes seconds. The only real time there's a delay is when a lot of people are out making payments (i.e Christmas shopping) or one of the card schemes (i.e Visa) are having troubles.

    Having said that I always find Sainsbury's takes a while to process the transaction as do Asda with their Pay at Pump facility.
     
  25. JoeG4 macrumors 68030

    JoeG4

    Joined:
    Jan 11, 2002
    Location:
    Bay Area, Ca.
    #25
    Target kinda goes back and forth with good and bad pinpads. When they had the wedge shaped machines that held your card and ejected it, they were pretty fast - until they came out with the oval shaped red machines. Suddenly they updated the firmware and the wedge shaped machines became unbearably slow.

    The oval shaped ones were fine for the longest time too - at the start of the transaction, you could swipe, put in your pin, hit OK, choose cash, and then do a "blank check" OK to a blank amount, and the register would automatically close out your transaction when the cashier hit okay.


    I miss that. The new pinpads are so dang slow. It's made shopping at Target about as bad as shopping at Walgreens, which has the most awkward pinpad system in the world.

    There's also that ARGNGNGH ARARANGGH NARRNGHG noise they make when you need to take your card out. lol.
     

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