Coming up to 1000 Cycle

[Moriarty]

I have no idea what I have done wrong, how were you able to keep your cycles down?

Dude, you should only run the laptop from the battery if you need to.

If you're sitting at a desk or near a power outlet, just plug it in and leave it plugged in. Don't unplug the computer just because the battery is charged. Unplug it only when you need to use it away from a power outlet.

The biggest killers of batteries are heat and charging / discharging. It's true that batteries do degrade faster when kept at 100% than when they're kept at 50%, but there's no way to keep the laptop at 50% without constantly charging / discharging the battery – and doing that is even worse than keeping it at 100%.

With older models that have a removable battery, you can partly discharge the battery and then remove it from the laptop while you're using it at your desk. You can't do that any more, and so the next best thing is just to leave it plugged in as much as possible when you're using it.

 

[casperes1996]

Well, it was plugged in most of the time with an external monitor and also I wasn't using it for about a year.

Pro tip (from Apple's documentation). If you want to store a Li-Ion battery equipped device long term, such as a yeah, it is recommended to keep the battery at around 50% at the time of storage, and keep it in cold (not freezing) conditions, such as a basement or similar.

 

[malikkamran]

I couldn't get 800 cycles on 2012 MacBook pro how you got such high number with such long battery life

 

[DjWindows98]

Dude, you should only run the laptop from the battery if you need to.

If you're sitting at a desk or near a power outlet, just plug it in and leave it plugged in. Don't unplug the computer just because the battery is charged. Unplug it only when you need to use it away from a power outlet.

The biggest killers of batteries are heat and charging / discharging. It's true that batteries do degrade faster when kept at 100% than when they're kept at 50%, but there's no way to keep the laptop at 50% without constantly charging / discharging the battery – and doing that is even worse than keeping it at 100%.

With older models that have a removable battery, you can partly discharge the battery and then remove it from the laptop while you're using it at your desk. You can't do that any more, and so the next best thing is just to leave it plugged in as much as possible when you're using it.

I'm going to keep it plugged in from now on then, would I be able to go back to using Google Chrome or would it cause the mac to heat up more?

 

[Mlrollin91]

My battery habits are the following:
Never let the battery go below 10%. Thats it. Here is my 2012 MBA. 1200+ cycles and still 85% and going strong

 

[Moriarty]

I'm going to keep it plugged in from now on then, would I be able to go back to using Google Chrome or would it cause the mac to heat up more?

Being plugged or unplugged doesn't have a big effect on how hot the computer gets. The battery can get a little warm while it's charging, so the computer can even be a little cooler when it's fully charged. But it's not a big difference.

Mostly, it's what apps you use. Chrome is very resource hungry, so if you want a faster / more efficient browser, stick to Safari. Things such as photo / video editing and games, of course, heat things up more – but don't worry too much about that. Just use it however you want to.

By far the worst thing you can do to the battery is use it unnecessarily – stay plugged in whenever you can. Alas, that damage is done. When the battery life is too short, you'll just have to get it replaced.

 

[Mlrollin91]

I'm going to keep it plugged in from now on then, would I be able to go back to using Google Chrome or would it cause the mac to heat up more?

Keeping your battery plugged in 24/7 is actually the worst thing you can do for it. Batteries need to be used in order to keep their health. By keeping it at 100% and never letting it drain down, the health will fade on its own. Use the battery, just don't let it drop below 10%.

 

[Moriarty]

Keeping your battery plugged in 24/7 is actually the worst thing you can do for it. Batteries need to be used in order to keep their health. By keeping it at 100% and never letting it drain down, the health will fade on its own. Use the battery, just don't let it drop below 10%.

I disagree.

Keeping it at 100% isn't really good for it. But it's even worse to continually charge / discharge the battery.

If you only occasionally use the laptop (say, a few hours light usage a day), then best to run it off the battery all the time and try to maintain its charge between say 30% and 80%. The number of cycles it goes through will still be relatively low.

However, it's clear that the OP uses it for most of the day, every day. They've done about 1.5 cycles per day! In this case, it's much better to keep it plugged in. Being fully charged is bad, but the alternative is very heavy cycling, which is even worse.

 

[DjWindows98]

Keeping your battery plugged in 24/7 is actually the worst thing you can do for it. Batteries need to be used in order to keep their health. By keeping it at 100% and never letting it drain down, the health will fade on its own. Use the battery, just don't let it drop below 10%.

I will unplug it when I have finished using it, it won't be 24/7, probably around 12 +/ hours a day.

 

[Moriarty]

I will unplug it when I have finished using it, it won't be 24/7, probably around 12 hours a day.

That's the best compromise for a heavily-used computer.

Well, the best thing to do is to actually remove the battery when you're not going to need it for a while, but it's been a long time since you could easily do that with a Mac.

 

[Mlrollin91]

I will unplug it when I have finished using it, it won't be 24/7, probably around 12 +/ hours a day.

What good is unplugging it if you are no longer using it? Thats still not using the battery.
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I disagree.

Keeping it at 100% isn't really good for it. But it's even worse to continually charge / discharge the battery.

If you only occasionally use the laptop (say, a few hours light usage a day), then best to run it off the battery all the time and try to maintain its charge between say 30% and 80%. The number of cycles it goes through will still be relatively low.

However, it's clear that the OP uses it for most of the day, every day. They've done about 1.5 cycles per day! In this case, it's much better to keep it plugged in. Being fully charged is bad, but the alternative is very heavy cycling, which is even worse.

I have heavy cycled my battery with zero issues. I'm over 200 cycles above design capacity and its still going really strong. There are some days I put 3 cycles on my battery, and some days I put .25 cycle. But I never leave it plugged in all the time. I have had a couple MacBook batteries that did not even last 1/4th of the rated life because I always kept it plugged in. Batteries must be used.

 

[Newtons Apple]

I just always fully charged then unplugged, I did use Chrome a lot which drained it.

If power is available PLUG IT IN! You are running up cycles faster than Trump can tweet!

Chrome is not near as bad as your habits in taking care of your battery

 

[DjWindows98]

If power is available PLUG IT IN! You are running up cycles faster than Trump can tweet!

Chrome is not near as bad as your habits in taking care of your battery

It's my first Mac, I didn't really take any notice when I was using Windows laptops etc, I was just being cautious, not wanting to over charge etc, we live, we learn!

 

[Moriarty]

What good is unplugging it if you are no longer using it? Thats still not using the battery.
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I have heavy cycled my battery with zero issues. I'm over 200 cycles above design capacity and its still going really strong. There are some days I put 3 cycles on my battery, and some days I put .25 cycle. But I never leave it plugged in all the time. I have had a couple MacBook batteries that did not even last 1/4th of the rated life because I always kept it plugged in. Batteries must be used.

Well you must do a lot of partial charge / discharge cycles, which are nowhere near as bad for the battery as deeply discharging then fully charging it. I simply can't be bothered monitoring my battery that closely throughout the day.

It's clear that in the OP's case, it's frequent (and deep) cycling that has caused his battery to degrade so quickly.

There's plenty of good info here on what things affect lithium batteries: http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/how_to_prolong_lithium_based_batteries

I wish Apple would implement the ability to set a maximum charge level – i.e., I could choose to tell my Macbook Pro to stop charging at 60%. Once the battery is charged to that level, it could stop charging and just run off the power adapter. When I know I need the extra portability, I could choose to fully charge it. That would avoid both keeping the laptop at maximum charge, and continuous cycling of the battery. That's two of the three biggest killers of batteries (the other being heat) dealt with!

 

[Mlrollin91]

Well you must do a lot of partial charge / discharge cycles, which are nowhere near as bad for the battery as deeply discharging then fully charging it. I simply can't be bothered monitoring my battery that closely throughout the day.

It's clear that in the OP's case, it's frequent (and deep) cycling that has caused his battery to degrade so quickly.

The OP is at almost 1000 cycles and is still at 83.7%. The battery is rated for 1000 cycles at 80%. He is well above the rated usage of the battery. Therefore, his battery has not "degraded quickly". It's doing better than where it should be. I'm willing to bet keeping the device charged at or near 100% for almost 2 years would prevent the battery from ever getting near 1000 cycles before dropping to 80% health. I've done that method. It failed for me. I got to about 500/1000 cycles. Meanwhile the opposite has gotten me to 1211/1000 cycles with 85%.

So the fact that the OP is now going to keep the device plugged in while using it will deteriorate the battery further and more quickly per charge cycle now. Batteries must be used to maintain health.

 

[Moriarty]

The OP is at almost 1000 cycles and is still at 83.7%. The battery is rated for 1000 cycles at 80%. He is well above the rated usage of the battery. Therefore, his battery has not "degraded quickly". It's doing better than where it should be. I'm willing to bet keeping the device charged at or near 100% for almost 2 years would prevent the battery from ever getting near 1000 cycles before dropping to 80% health. I've done that method. It failed for me. I got to about 500/1000 cycles. Meanwhile the opposite has gotten me to 1211/1000 cycles with 85%.

So the fact that the OP is now going to keep the device plugged in while using it will deteriorate the battery further and more quickly per charge cycle now. Batteries must be used to maintain health.

My rMBP is 5 years old, 550 cycles, battery at ~75%.

It's been plugged in and at 100% charge almost all of the time, running two external displays. It gets hot.

If I had used the battery most of the time, I would have gone through about 5,000 cycles by now. That battery would be dead.

Contrast that to the OP's life after 1.5 years, and tell me that my way of using it is worse than his...

There is no perfect solution, the best compromise depends entirely on how you use the computer.

 

[Mlrollin91]

My rMBP is 5 years old, 550 cycles, battery at ~75%.

It's been plugged in and at 100% charge almost all of the time, running two external displays. It gets hot.

If I had used the battery most of the time, I would have gone through about 5,000 cycles by now. That battery would be dead.

There is no perfect solution, the best compromise depends entirely on how you use the computer.

You just completely illustrated my point though. You got 550/1000 cycles and is at 75%. So you are less than half of where you should be. You could have at least used the device until 1200-1400 cycles before it hit 75% then use the method you are describing and it would not be dead, but you would have gotten 2-3x the usage.

 

[Moriarty]

You just completely illustrated my point though. You got 550/1000 cycles and is at 75%. So you are less than half of where you should be. You could have at least used the device until 1200-1400 cycles before it hit 75% then use the method you are describing and it would not be dead, but you would have gotten 2-3x the usage.

No.

If I had always used the battery, I would have gone through AT LEAST 5000 cycles by now. It would be very dead.

My MBP is always pulling at least 30 W.

 

[Mlrollin91]

No.

If I had always used the battery, I would have gone through AT LEAST 5000 cycles by now. It would be very dead.

My MBP is always pulling at least 30 W.

You just completely missed what I said. I said you could have used it normally until 1200-1400 cycles, then you could have changed to the method you use now. Giving yourself an extra 2-3x the battery usage. But instead you only made it to 500~ cycles before dropping below the 80% mark.

Your method has consumed the battery prematurely, because it had not been used enough.

 

[Moriarty]

You just completely missed what I said. I said you could have used it normally until 1200-1400 cycles, then you could have changed to the method you use now. Giving yourself an extra 2-3x the battery usage. But instead you only made it to 500~ cycles before dropping below the 80% mark.

If I had done that, the battery's capacity would now be well below the current 75% mark.

 

[Mlrollin91]

If I had done that, the battery's capacity would now be well below the current 75% mark.

But it would not be. I've had enough MacBooks to know that. My current is 5 years old, with 1211 cycles, 85% health. Thats better than "average" but at least double where you are at. If you waited until at least 1000 cycles to start leaving it plugged in all the time, you would have at least gotten your money's worth out of the battery. But now it prematurely "died" from health deterioration. You are 450-500+ cycles behind in health. Like I've said a bunch of times now, batteries must be used or their health degrades early.

 

[ZapNZs]

Keeping your battery plugged in 24/7 is actually the worst thing you can do for it. Batteries need to be used in order to keep their health. By keeping it at 100% and never letting it drain down, the health will fade on its own. Use the battery, just don't let it drop below 10%.

Deep discharges are arguably worse than keeping at the surge voltage, although I agree that constantly being at 100% (presumably near the 4.2v mark) does cause wear in and of itself, and periodic light discharges (let's say less than 40% of total capacity) can prolong life.

Apple (and virtually all consumer-level electronic makers) do not give us the tools needed to keep their lithium batteries at optimal health for maximum time, likely because most consumers would not accept the tradeoffs & many of these devices are not engineered to last for so long that the Makers are thinking about reaching a 5,000-10,000 cycle service life. This would entail being able to:

• reduce the charging voltage (consequently, reducing the speed of charging),
• terminate charging at a certain capacity (around 3.9v would eliminate the voltage-caused stress that you have mentioned, but, consequently, IIRC 3.9v means only around 65-75% stored energy capacity compared to the same cell at 4.2v, so that means shorter runtimes)
• set our own thermal throttling levels based on the permanent capacity loss that heat can cause to LiCo's (consequently reducing CPU/GPU performance), and
• having the computer shut down after expending a certain amount of total capacity.

While this would dramatically prolong service life, with such considerable modifications to usage patterns that would arguably make a laptop less useful as a portable device for productivity, it may be hard to justify...especially since if the OP has AppleCare+, they get a free battery in a few months when they hit 80% capacity.

 

[melodrake]

From my own experience, I have kept my Macbook Pro 2011 plugged in almost 100% of the time the last few years. 2402 days old, 339 cycles, 87% design capacity. I might be wrong but I was always under the impression that it is running off the power adapter, as coconut battery says 'charging with 0.0 watts' and under apple system information it says 'charging: no'. I did read somewhere ages ago that it constantly discharges to 97% and up again?

 

[Mlrollin91]

From my own experience, I have kept my Macbook Pro 2011 plugged in almost 100% of the time the last few years. 2402 days old, 339 cycles, 87% design capacity. I might be wrong but I was always under the impression that it is running off the power adapter, as coconut battery says 'charging with 0.0 watts' and under apple system information it says 'charging: no'. I did read somewhere ages ago that it constantly discharges to 97% and up again?

Just because it discharges to 97% and then back to 100% does not count as "using the battery". Your battery, just like Moriarty, has died prematurely. Your battery is rated for 1000 cycles at 80% health. You are at 339 at 87% health. At that rate, it would be almost impossible to hit 1000 cycles before dropping below 80%.

So that is at least 2 examples of why I am saying keeping it plugged in 24/7 is really bad. Batteries must be used in order to maintain health.

As to your question. When the laptop reaches 100%, it stops charging and the unit runs off the power adapter. But the battery naturally loses charge on its own. Once it reaches 97%, it charges back to 100% then goes in "stand-by" mode again.

 

[throAU]

How on earth did you get so many cycles so fast? I have an early 2015 and have I think 112 cycles on it.

If you use on battery a lot, (i.e., almost exclusively) then if you're pushing the performance a bit it's not unrealistic to kill the charge in say 5 hours if you're running something a little CPU/GPU intensive.

5 hours 2-3 times per day is 1000 cycles in 12-18 months.

Personally i tend to do maybe 70-100 cycles per year, but if you really push things on battery a lot, 1000 cycles in 2 years would be pretty easy to clock up.

If you NEED to use it on battery, do so. But yeah, as per above, if you don't need to, use it on AC. And yeah, try to keep from draining the battery all the way down... it hurts them.