Comparing CPU / GPU Performance Numbers - nTB vs TB. What Are We Paying For ?

[JohnnyGo]

Since specs suck already when compared to windows alternatives, I would say the touch bar version has better resale value.

These Skylake chips are a year old already, prices will drop fast during next refresh.

The same price drops that we saw for the Mac Mini ??? /s
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I went from a 13" touchbar 8/512 to a non-touchbar 16/256 after 3 weeks..

Overall I am happy with my decision. This time I did not jump into generation one apple tech (looking at you still slow Apple Watch). I DO hope the touchbar starts to shine, but I get it will be for multi-touch gesture when it expands in size a bit, or gets haptic feedback, or "rises" to act as a button. In a few generations, also hoping Intel gets its act together, I'll jump in then. For now, I have ridiculously solid machine.

You are the typical "PRO" user Apple has been catering for the last couple of years (and that is a good thing). The success of the rMB (and its sales) are a proof that most users do not need "extra" performance (if that gain is only 5-10-15%) to run their usual workload.

As @sn0warmy proves, there are exceptions and thus there is a need for a quad-core more powerful machine (the 15" MBP). Intel, unfortunately, did not gave the Skylake chips the ability to run 32Gb of LPDDR3/4. As soon as such a CPU is available, Apple will certainly upgrade the 15" MBP.

 

[Scott G.]

I went from a 13" touchbar 8/512 to a non-touchbar 16/256 after 3 weeks. I was able to put 10.2.2 on the touchbar model before I returned it, which did fix many of the graphical glitches I was experiencing.

I, personally, did not like the touchbar. I tried for 3 weeks to get used to it and not once was I glad I had it. I didn't experience a single delightful "oh now I get what Apple is going for" moment - Calendar month jumps came the closest. However every time I returned to my external keyboard I was happy it had keys I could hit without looking.

I understand the 16GB on the non touchbar might be skewing results, however it does have a stat-wise step down in processor, and step down in GPU.

PROS going from touchbar to non-touchbar:
- I simply am not noticing a difference in speed overall. I have 8 apps open, 3 which are considered "professional" (Xcode, Coda, Sketch). I can dive into mission control, or space over, and start using the apps without any concern.
- physical keys are nice. As I can do real work and not constantly stare down at my keyboard. What a bizarre user interaction. Seriously, who the hell looks at their keyboard constantly as a positive experience to get work done ?
- I saved over $400CDN (I'll use half of this on a wifi connected 4TB storage solution. The other half ? Filet Minion perhaps? )
- Personally, I have yet to miss the two extra ports. SIRI works fine even though apparently it has one less microphone. Not noticing any WIFI slowdown either.

CONS :
- There is definite drop down in performance when compiling or starting the iPhone simulator thru Xcode. Nothing I won't get used to, but it is slower. To me this says it all, folks doing sustained processor / GPU work will likely notice a difference.


Overall I am happy with my decision. This time I did not jump into generation one apple tech (looking at you still slow Apple Watch). I DO hope the touchbar starts to shine, but I get it will be for multi-touch gesture when it expands in size a bit, or gets haptic feedback, or "rises" to act as a button. In a few generations, also hoping Intel gets its act together, I'll jump in then. For now, I have ridiculously solid machine.

You can hit all your Favorite keys without looking? After years and years if typing, I still don't have the muscle memory to hit those without looking.

 

[jozero]

You can hit all your Favorite keys without looking? After years and years if typing, I still don't have the muscle memory to hit those without looking.

Yes because I can put my fingers down, I know the 4th one is mission control. On the right side fingers down one over is play pause, and volume is under the fingers. Even if I do have to look for another key, I know its not a mystery, it will be a physical large key.

To summarize Apple's beliefs on what makes a pro :

iPad *PRO* : Smart Cover with physical real keys
MacBook *PRO* : Touchbar with flat touchscreen no "keys"

yerp

 

[MH01]

Not sure what you're referring to, looks like you barely glanced at the article.
Glad you raised your claim from 5 to 10% though.
If you'd actually done the comparison though, there are tons of scenarios where the TB outdoes the nTB by significantly more than 10%.

Overwatch:
TB: 86fps - 21% increase
nTB: 68fps

Deus Ex:
TB: 26fps - 23% increase
nTB: 20fps

Bioshock:
TB: 48fps - 16% increase
nTB: 40fps

Tomb Raider:
TB: 22fps - 23% increase
nTB: 17fps

Far Cry:
TB: 27fps - 15% increase
nTB: 23fps

Battlefield:
TB: 50fps - 14% increase
nTB: 43fps

Farming Sim
TB: 93fps - 18% increase
nTB: 76fps -

Titanfall
TB: 65fps - 15% increase
nTB: 55fps

Look, prefer whatever laptop you want, but don't make stuff up.

You mean gaming only scenarios ? They are talking about CPU performance . The 550 is better than the 540.

 

[EIdoradoSZ]

Since specs suck already when compared to windows alternatives, I would say the touch bar version has better resale value.

These Skylake chips are a year old already, prices will drop fast during next refresh.

If you saw the iffix teardown article about the MBP TB and aware the fact that they are literately extremely unrepairable, totally none replacement parts. even SSD are soldered on the motherboard. This may let the resale value down because the SSD cannot be replaced, the remain SSD life span will be an issue. There's a dilemma situation here though, the nTB version's ssd is indeed removable but it's an NVMe driver and has an Apple-designed controller. So the possibility of the future 3rd SSD replacement is still uncertain. For the bright sight, you got bettery batteray, almost same profermance, relitivly easy repair internal structure, the possibilty of future upgrade or replacement of ssd dirve. And a more practicle and predicable physical function keys. The only thing i will miss is the touchID.

 

[mrex]

Im pretty sure that some other component will fail before ssd reaches its lifespan.

 

[iasix]

These discussions, ugh. It's such a dilemma.

Seriously, I went from a nTB to a TB and am considering the nTB again.

I don't notice an improved speed of the TB at all, but I do love the TB itself.
However, I went from 11+ hours of battery life to 6- (yes, with the same usage).

I still have 2 weeks to return the TB, but just don't know if I should or if I shouldn't.
This battery life is driving me nuts and I highly doubt a software update will be able to add two more hours to it.

 

[JohnnyGo]

These discussions, ugh. It's such a dilemma.

Seriously, I went from a nTB to a TB and am considering the nTB again.

I don't notice an improved speed of the TB at all, but I do love the TB itself.
However, I went from 11+ hours of battery life to 6- (yes, with the same usage).

I still have 2 weeks to return the TB, but just don't know if I should or if I shouldn't.
This battery life is driving me nuts and I highly doubt a software update will be able to add two more hours to it.

Frustrating indeed.

Try:
- erasing cache folders
- using adblock/ghostery to eliminate ad trackers
- fetch vs push email
- turn off TimeMachine on battery mode
- turn off auto brightness

My experience with base model TB is more like 8-10h and I'm sure ghostery has a huge impact. Wifi (more data) and CPU use by ads/trackers/etc has a large impact on battery life.

 

[iasix]

Frustrating indeed.

Try:
- erasing cache folders
- using adblock/ghostery to eliminate ad trackers
- fetch vs push email
- turn off TimeMachine on battery mode
- turn off auto brightness

My experience with base model TB is more like 8-10h and I'm sure ghostery has a huge impact. Wifi (more data) and CPU use by ads/trackers/etc has a large impact on battery life.

Thanks for your advice.

- I just installed adguard.
- I want my e-mail to push, not fetch (I have a very high e-mail volume for work and would rather know immediately than every 5 minutes).
- TM is always off
- I enjoy auto brightness and do not want to turn it down.

The reason I don't want to 'compromise' on some of these is because this is just how I have always used my MacBook (for the past decade) and I don't think a new MB should require me to use it more efficiently but less practically just so that the battery can keep up with it's 4 year old precessor.

I wonder how much battery the adguard will save me. But I'm afraid, sincerely, that Apple's poor design choices are forcing me to use the nTB model. I hate it because I truly enjoy the TB, but this battery capacity is just unworkable for me.
I'm so disappointed in Apple.

 

[ipodlover77]

Contemplating the move as well.

Problem is, if its only an hour difference between the nTB and TB, I rather just keep the TB. I'm having a lot of trouble finding sites that actually has extensive battery comparison between the two models.

I have the base tB with 16gb and 512. I would be switching to the i7 nTB so the price is identical. I do know that the nTB uses inferior parts like the wifi chip, ram, and even the DAC seems to be a different model from the ifixit teardown. If the battery life I gain is like 2 1/2 hours more then I would strongly consider it but if I'm only getting 1+ more from Spotify streaming then I just don't think its worth the downgrade.

 

[JohnnyGo]

Streaming (wifi+CPU) seems to be one of the culprits of bad battery life for some users. Have you tried streaming through iPhone instead of your MacBook?

 

[iasix]

Streaming (wifi+CPU) seems to be one of the culprits of bad battery life for some users. Have you tried streaming through iPhone instead of your MacBook?

Come on though. Shouldn't a laptop be able to use it's normal functions (such as streaming music on the background) without only having 5 hours of battery life in 2017?