Carrier [Confirmed] Verizon Unlimited Loophole

[jbromer]

Clarification

Maybe I am missing something, but is there a difference between "transferring an upgrade" and transferring a phone to a different line?

What I wanted to do was USE the upgrade on a line that has the UDP and revert to 2GB data on that line. Then I would swap the phone back to my other line which ALSO has a UDP. I am not transferring the upgrade, just the phone...

What am I missing?

 

[Cozmo85]

Maybe I am missing something, but is there a difference between "transferring an upgrade" and transferring a phone to a different line?

What I wanted to do was USE the upgrade on a line that has the UDP and revert to 2GB data on that line. Then I would swap the phone back to my other line which ALSO has a UDP. I am not transferring the upgrade, just the phone...

What am I missing?

Whatever line uses its upgrade loses unlimited. Just changing the phone on a line will not do it

 

[jbromer]

Whatever line uses its upgrade loses unlimited. Just changing the phone on a line will not do it

Right, so if I have TWO grandfathered lines, I can upgrade on the first at subsidized pricing and lose the UDP, then switch the phone to the other line, and keep the UDP on the other line, as long as I never do a subsidized upgrade on that line. I feel like there are two different camps on this thread that seem to be contradicting each other on this...

 

[REDTAZ]

Anybody know of a loophole to get around the $30 upgrade fee?

 

[spacebetween]

Right, so if I have TWO grandfathered lines, I can upgrade on the first at subsidized pricing and lose the UDP, then switch the phone to the other line, and keep the UDP on the other line, as long as I never do a subsidized upgrade on that line. I feel like there are two different camps on this thread that seem to be contradicting each other on this...

No, I think it's been pretty consistent.

You can either: use the Upgrade on the UDP phone for a 4G phone, and that includes transferring the upgrade to a different phone, and you will lose UDP on that line.

OR

You can use an upgrade from a phone that doesn't have UDP or will no longer have UDP, activate, deactivate and then activate it on the UDP line and not lose UDP. It does not matter if the none UDP line is on the same account or a different account.

 

[Appl'd]

I understand that this is a transfer of your upgrade. Everything I've been told by several Reps and what I've seen and read here states that you cannot transfer your upgrade on an Unlimited Data Plan and purchase a 4G phone with it, transfer or not. Verizon will consider this you using an upgrade on your UDP account and cancel out your UDP. Good luck to you if it works, but someone else here did the same thing and found it did in fact cancel out their UDP.

Quoted for truth. I tried exactly this online. I transferred the upgrade from line ending -0721 (which has Unlimited data) to line ending -3847 (which has 2GB plan). All the plan selection screens had the -3847 line on it, so it looks like you're renewing the terms of that line's contract, and convincingly so:

Complete checkout and all that, and get this email receipt right after:

Dude, it's shady. A rep told me they know of problems with the online Transfer Upgrade utility, but several conversations since then and they refuse to accept a contract extension for the transfer recipient, adamantly insisting that the originally upgrade-eligible line will be losing its Unlimited data, despite what the

 https://preorder.verizonwireless.com/iconic/iconic/secured/screens/IconicFeatures.do

page says during the checkout process.

It's downright deceptive and might have just killed my unlimited plan for good, but how am I going to fight this battle against Verizon? I've tried standing my ground but they are not gonna let me get away with that upgrade and keep unlimited on the line the upgrade was transferred from. My next call is to beg them to let me cancel the transaction and keep unlimited on that line and just buy a 4S for $200 instead.

Hope the screenshots help.

 

[spacebetween]

Quoted for truth. I tried exactly this online. I transferred the upgrade from line ending -0721 (which has Unlimited data) to line ending -3847 (which has 2GB plan). All the plan selection screens had the -3847 line on it, so it looks like you're renewing the terms of that line's contract, and convincingly so:

Image

Complete checkout and all that, and get this email receipt right after:

Image

Dude, it's shady. A rep told me they know of problems with the online Transfer Upgrade utility, but several conversations since then and they refuse to accept a contract extension for the transfer recipient, adamantly insisting that the originally upgrade-eligible line will be losing its Unlimited data, despite what the

 https://preorder.verizonwireless.com/iconic/iconic/secured/screens/IconicFeatures.do

page says during the checkout process.

It's downright deceptive and might have just killed my unlimited plan for good, but how am I going to fight this battle against Verizon? I've tried standing my ground but they are not gonna let me get away with that upgrade and keep unlimited on the line the upgrade was transferred from. My next call is to beg them to let me cancel the transaction and keep unlimited on that line and just buy a 4S for $200 instead.

Hope the screenshots help.

Is there not a way for you to cancel your order online? When I check the status for a Verizon order, on the right hand side it has a button that says, "cancel order." Have you tried that?

 

[REDTAZ]

Quoted for truth. I tried exactly this online. I transferred the upgrade from line ending -0721 (which has Unlimited data) to line ending -3847 (which has 2GB plan). All the plan selection screens had the -3847 line on it, so it looks like you're renewing the terms of that line's contract, and convincingly so:

Image

Complete checkout and all that, and get this email receipt right after:

Image

Dude, it's shady. A rep told me they know of problems with the online Transfer Upgrade utility, but several conversations since then and they refuse to accept a contract extension for the transfer recipient, adamantly insisting that the originally upgrade-eligible line will be losing its Unlimited data, despite what the

 https://preorder.verizonwireless.com/iconic/iconic/secured/screens/IconicFeatures.do

page says during the checkout process.

It's downright deceptive and might have just killed my unlimited plan for good, but how am I going to fight this battle against Verizon? I've tried standing my ground but they are not gonna let me get away with that upgrade and keep unlimited on the line the upgrade was transferred from. My next call is to beg them to let me cancel the transaction and keep unlimited on that line and just buy a 4S for $200 instead.

Hope the screenshots help.

Just call and COMPLETELY cancel the order. Nothing in your plan will change until you activate the phone so call ASAP and cancel the order.

 

[kilj0y]

If you read these threads at all why would you try anyway? Just seems stupid on your part.

 

[mac.cali]

Just call and COMPLETELY cancel the order. Nothing in your plan will change until you activate the phone so call ASAP and cancel the order.

If that doesn't work, refuse the delivery. The contract begins ONLY with activation.

 

[REDTAZ]

If that doesn't work, refuse the delivery. The contract begins ONLY with activation.

Exactly, just REFUSE, REFUSE, REFUSE. I'm personally getting fed up of Verizon and all there ridiculous new rules and fees.

 

[mac.cali]

Exactly, just REFUSE, REFUSE, REFUSE. I'm personally getting fed up of Verizon and all there ridiculous new rules and fees.

You know very well in order to keep unlimited data you have to purchase the phone at retail price. However your trying to side step that by purchasing it on a non smart phone line and swapping the device to the unlimited line. So don't act like its their fault. This on is all you buddy.

 

[Appl'd]

Right, so if I have TWO grandfathered lines, I can upgrade on the first at subsidized pricing and lose the UDP, then switch the phone to the other line, and keep the UDP on the other line, as long as I never do a subsidized upgrade on that line. I feel like there are two different camps on this thread that seem to be contradicting each other on this...

I see what you're saying. You want to keep UDP on one specific line of the two on your account. Then yes, as long as you're willing to lose UDP on the other line then you can attach the new device to either of your MTNs, including the one that will retain UDP (as long as you execute the upgrade on the line for which you're willing to lose unlimited data).

I believe the 'other camp' you're referring to are those people with a non-UDP line in the mix which is eligible for an upgrade. This lowers the effective cost of upgrading your handset substantially relative to the effective cost of an upgrade on a UDP line. If you had a third handset attached for grandma or something, you could compel her to upgrade to an iPhone 5, snag it from her, and put her back on her old phone and old plan none the wiser.

In fact, I'd go so far as to say that the 'dumb phone' line doesn't even need to be part of your account. The money part here is finding someone who is eligible for an upgrade but doesn't care to have a new device. There's an implicit value in having upgrade eligibility when you don't have an unlimited data plan, and everyone ITT is trying to extract that value from someone who isn't using it. This entire thread can be summarized as a discussion of the method by which an individual can appropriate the implicit value from an upgrade-eligible non-unlimited user for his or her own upgrade benefit.

 

[Cozmo85]

I cancelled my preorder and reordered on a new line so I can keep unlimited. I'm afraid ill easily go over 2gb once I have LTE. Worth $10 a month

 

[spacebetween]

In fact, I'd go so far as to say that the 'dumb phone' line doesn't even need to be part of your account. The money part here is finding someone who is eligible for an upgrade but doesn't care to have a new device. There's an implicit value in having upgrade eligibility when you don't have an unlimited data plan, and everyone ITT is trying to extract that value from someone who isn't using it. This entire thread can be summarized as a discussion of the method by which an individual can appropriate the implicit value from an upgrade-eligible non-unlimited user for his or her own upgrade benefit.

This is correct. I know people who are using a friend's/relatives/co-worker's upgrade and swapping and Verizon Reps have said this is a completely acceptable practice to them.

 

[Appl'd]

Wow, thanks for all the support guys!

Is there not a way for you to cancel your order online? When I check the status for a Verizon order, on the right hand side it has a button that says, "cancel order." Have you tried that?

I can't check the order online, it's a business account with several words in the name and the online order status requires a Last Name in addition to the order number. I've tried every combination of words for the Last Name field and none of them took. I'm going to head in to a retail store here in a minute to get it all sorted out.

Just call and COMPLETELY cancel the order. Nothing in your plan will change until you activate the phone so call ASAP and cancel the order.

Exactly, just REFUSE, REFUSE, REFUSE. I'm personally getting fed up of Verizon and all there ridiculous new rules and fees.

If that doesn't work, refuse the delivery. The contract begins ONLY with activation.

Thanks guys, the rep did confirm this as well, no changes will take effect until activation. She said I'm scheduled for shipping on the 18th so I'm gonna get it taken care of today.

If you read these threads at all why would you try anyway? Just seems stupid on your part.

A response to this particular 'Transfer Upgrade' attempt to use a UDP line's upgrade eligibility by transferring didn't come up until Dingo23's post at 1:12 PM on Friday, I had ordered mine at 3:00 AM.

Also, there were prior suggestions by Verizon reps that this actually would work. Per a chat log posted by 'crownjbl' on droidforums.net on 9/12 7:03AM (http://tiny.cc/431qkw):

info: Please hold for a Verizon Wireless sales representative to assist you with your order. Thank you for your patience.
info: You are now chatting with 'Stephanie G'
Stephanie G: Hello. Thank you for visiting our chat service. May I help you with your order today?
You: Hello, I actually had a question about upgrading if that's ok.
Stephanie G: I'd be happy to assist you.
You: I am on a family plan (with two lines) and I have unlimited data. I was wondering, if I transfer my upgrade (which I am eligible for tomorrow) to the other line and get a subsidized phone on that line, can I then swap phones with that line to retain my unlimited data with a new phone?
Stephanie G: Does the line you'd be "transferring" it to have unlimited data?
You: No, it does not. The other line is on a 2Gb plan.
Stephanie G: Okay perfect. Yeah, just transfer it to that line and then you can activate the phone on your line to keep the unlimited data!
You: Thank You!
Stephanie G: You're welcome! D
Stephanie G: It has been my pleasure to chat with you today! Please feel free to re-open the chat session if you need further assistance . Thank you and have a great day!

Based on that information I decided to explore the idea by navigating the upgrade pages on Verizon's website. I initiated the transaction in the way that the verizon rep above suggested, and as you can see from the screenshots, it was actually very convincing at the time that the contract extension would apply to the recipient of the upgrade transfer. I mean, don't you agree that first screenshot taken mid-way through the upgrade process tends to imply that the changes I was making were to the plan that already had 2GB on it? It was only because of this strong visual affirmation that the verizon rep's advice was correct that I chose to complete the final steps of the transaction. Not until I received the email receipt did I EVER see the original line's MTN since I had initially made the 'Transfer Upgrade' election on the 'Upgrade Device' splash page.

I understand that the entire concept of these alternate upgrade paths is somewhat opportunistic, that's why I'm willing to take my medicine and forego the iPhone 5 and be thankful I didn't just ruin my brother's unlimited data plan.

 

[TraceyS/FL]

So i'm happy because we have 5 phones, 2 iP4 with unlimited, 2 dumb, and 1 smart without data grandfather (which, mine was also before I got my iP4 - and I could have apparently paid full price and kept no data. Sigh. He told me this after he did the upgrade.)

Anyway, we have 2 upgrades available and can move the phones around and be all happy.

EXCEPT, wait. If the grandfathered no-data gets my iPhone as is then we won't have to have data on it? So I could make my teenagers day but avoid data??

Which leaves me back to paying full price for the phone.

Hmmmm.......

 

[Appl'd]

This is correct. I know people who are using a friend's/relatives/co-worker's upgrade and swapping and Verizon Reps have said this is a completely acceptable practice to them.

Heck you might as well start asking everyone you see and offering $100 cash and pay for the upgrade if they're not gonna use it. Get brand new 16GB iPhones for $350 total, resell for $600 and pocket $250 a pop.

You could even conceivably make a secondary market for upgrades online, by which upgrade-holder and upgrade-taker strike a deal in the middle. Gramma gets $200 for keeping her flip phone, savvy user gets new iPhone for $450 and keeps unlimited data. Ok make it $150 and $500 and we keep $100 per transaction for market-making and escrow services. I'm busy with an econ dissertation so to you guys with programming skills and no job there ya go.

 

[spacebetween]

Wow, thanks for all the support guys!



I can't check the order online, it's a business account with several words in the name and the online order status requires a Last Name in addition to the order number. I've tried every combination of words for the Last Name field and none of them took. I'm going to head in to a retail store here in a minute to get it all sorted out.

Which link are you using to check your order? I know the one that's included in the email confirmation doesn't seem to work. Try using this one, it's different from the one in the email in that it will ask you for your last name OR the Business Name:

https://preorder.verizonwireless.com/iconic/iconic/screens/IconicSearchInit.do

 

[DrakeMcEachern]

Quoted for truth. I tried exactly this online. I transferred the upgrade from line ending -0721 (which has Unlimited data) to line ending -3847 (which has 2GB plan). All the plan selection screens had the -3847 line on it, so it looks like you're renewing the terms of that line's contract, and convincingly so:

Image

Complete checkout and all that, and get this email receipt right after:

Image

Dude, it's shady. A rep told me they know of problems with the online Transfer Upgrade utility, but several conversations since then and they refuse to accept a contract extension for the transfer recipient, adamantly insisting that the originally upgrade-eligible line will be losing its Unlimited data, despite what the

 https://preorder.verizonwireless.com/iconic/iconic/secured/screens/IconicFeatures.do

page says during the checkout process.

It's downright deceptive and might have just killed my unlimited plan for good, but how am I going to fight this battle against Verizon? I've tried standing my ground but they are not gonna let me get away with that upgrade and keep unlimited on the line the upgrade was transferred from. My next call is to beg them to let me cancel the transaction and keep unlimited on that line and just buy a 4S for $200 instead.

Hope the screenshots help.

I think the problem is the "preorder" page. I tried what everyone is doing for a GS3 without a hitch.

 

[jbromer]

I see what you're saying. You want to keep UDP on one specific line of the two on your account. Then yes, as long as you're willing to lose UDP on the other line then you can attach the new device to either of your MTNs, including the one that will retain UDP (as long as you execute the upgrade on the line for which you're willing to lose unlimited data).

This is exactly what I meant, and am trying to do.

I believe the 'other camp' you're referring to are those people with a non-UDP line in the mix which is eligible for an upgrade. This lowers the effective cost of upgrading your handset substantially relative to the effective cost of an upgrade on a UDP line. If you had a third handset attached for grandma or something, you could compel her to upgrade to an iPhone 5, snag it from her, and put her back on her old phone and old plan none the wiser.

Got it.

In fact, I'd go so far as to say that the 'dumb phone' line doesn't even need to be part of your account. The money part here is finding someone who is eligible for an upgrade but doesn't care to have a new device. There's an implicit value in having upgrade eligibility when you don't have an unlimited data plan, and everyone ITT is trying to extract that value from someone who isn't using it. This entire thread can be summarized as a discussion of the method by which an individual can appropriate the implicit value from an upgrade-eligible non-unlimited user for his or her own upgrade benefit.

Yes, I think you hit it exactly right here. The smartphone/dumbphone line is not the point, the point is that to get a subsidized iPhone 5 (or any 4G phone) and maintaining grandfathered unlimited data requires:

1) a National Access family plan
2) having a line that is eligible for an upgrade that is NOT the line you want to keep unlimited data
3) Being willing to otherwise forego an upgrade on that line

 

[patton4549]

Ok so I got how the loophole works just fine. Has it been answered yet officially when we get the iPhone 5 from another line can we call Verizon and have them activated on unlimited line direct or do we have to activate then deactivate then move to unlimited line? I read the whole post and have read different answers from people who talked to Verizon

 

[spacebetween]

Ok so I got how the loophole works just fine. Has it been answered yet officially when we get the iPhone 5 from another line can we call Verizon and have them activated on unlimited line direct or do we have to activate then deactivate then move to unlimited line? I read the whole post and have read different answers from people who talked to Verizon

Activate it on the non UDP line, Deactivate. Take it into store to activate it on the UDP Line.

 

[skywalkerr69]

Right, so if I have TWO grandfathered lines, I can upgrade on the first at subsidized pricing and lose the UDP, then switch the phone to the other line, and keep the UDP on the other line, as long as I never do a subsidized upgrade on that line. I feel like there are two different camps on this thread that seem to be contradicting each other on this...

I would wait until these people actually get the phones and try this to see if it works.

 

[imazu]

1grandfather account

i have 1 grandfather account. my upgrade eligibility is not until Oct 2013. I went to Verion today to ask my options. He explained to me that the only way for me to keep the unlimited is to buy iphone 5 or 4s at full retail price. my pre-order with apple is Preparing for Shipment already so I guess I will need to just return it and wait unil they offer unlock phone.