Critical state of Apple video

[Black_Mage]

The title of the video made me mad, but I thought he had a lot of valid points by the end of the video. However, the problem isn't greed. The problem is who Tim Cook is prioritizing. Tim Cook needs to prioritize the customer instead of the shareholders and wallstreet. What do you think? Are the criticisms of Apple and Tim Cook legit or is this just a long-winded way of admitting he misses Steve Jobs?

 

[Basic75]

Tim Cook needs to prioritize the customer instead of the shareholders and wallstreet.

That's not how capitalism works.

 

[AlexESP]

I don’t want to dismiss everything he said, but I think it’s mostly based on feelings and not facts. Actually, I think he’s not unhappy about greediness, but the opposite: about stagnation.

The iPhone ASP hasn’t increased a lot when taking into account inflation: $80 since 2016. And in fact, Apple’s biggest “booming” periods have happened when iPhone prices have increased. They’ve kept prices the same for the last 5 years. There’s basically no historical correlation of increased prices = worse Apple performance — maybe the other way around.

Also, there are smaller points, like cherry-picking the graph about release times since introduction. He mentions the Apple Intelligence delay, but not the difference between macOS announcement-release in the past and now. He also mentions the 2019 Mac Pro, but not other Mac redesigns that are launched much faster today.

And in general, while it’s true that Apple’s growth has slowed down a lot compared to previous years, it’s completely wrong to paint it the way he does.

As I said at the beginning, I think the *problem* many of us have with Apple is the opposite: they’re now very focused on making affordable iPhones, iPads, Macs, etc. Probably it’s the best strategy, but it’s sad compared to when we had things like diamond cut chamfered edges, regardless of cost.

 

[maflynn]

I saw this video yesterday and I was thinking posting it myself. I think @Black_Mage beat me to the punch

I agree with the points that the YTer has on Apple's short comings and what their future looks like. I do think however apple has been innovating, they produced apple silicon, and seismically altered laptops in the industry. Its taken the PC industry 5 years to produce a similar laptop in efficiency and power

I think Apple's focus, like 99% of corporate america is more interested in profits and investor value and not on products.

Apple is heading into some strong headwinds, both regulatory, and changing environments, their response to changing conditions has been slow, AI is a prime example, they finally rolled out their vision of AI, stating Apple Intelligence will be released soon, 2025 WWDC they've had to apologize on their failure - They over promised apple intelligence and completetly under delivered it.

Apple isn't doomed, but they're not leaders in a number of tech categories, and where they are leaders, they're facing lawsuits, i.e., app store dominance and other issues.

 

[Plutonius]

The title of the video made me mad, but I thought he had a lot of valid points by the end of the video. However, the problem isn't greed. The problem is who Tim Cook is prioritizing. Tim Cook needs to prioritize the customer instead of the shareholders and wallstreet. What do you think? Are the criticisms of Apple and Tim Cook legit or is this just a long-winded way of admitting he misses Steve Jobs?

Apple as a company exists for the shareholders and Wallstreet.

Change will only occur when people stop spending their money on Apple products.

 

[chrono1081]

Sadly a really ****** ruling back in the 20's or 30's (I forget the name if anyone knows chime in) made it law that CEOs are beholden to the share holders vs employees and customers. Ford ran afoul of this law when they were doing things like boosting employee pay back when Henry Ford was still in charge.

 

[theluggage]

That's not how capitalism works.

...for a given definition of "works" that includes periodic massive stock market crashes when all of the money games come unstuck.

"Focussing on products and customers" and "Increasing shareholder value" shouldn't be mutually exclusive. The video shows how Jobs dramatically increased the share price with his product-focussed approach, by making new products that customers want - or (what Jobs was good at) that they didn't know they wanted until they saw them. Cranking up profit margins, stock buybacks, dividend hikes etc. only works for so long - and again, the video shows that Apple has been spending more on buybacks & dividends relative to R&D even compared to such famous anti-capitalist pinko commie outfits as Google, Amazon and Meta...

The iPhone ASP hasn’t increased a lot when taking into account inflation: $80 since 2016.

Taking into account general inflation that includes groceries, fuel, housing isn't really relevant to the tech sector, beyond a fun factoid. The specific rate of inflation for consumer electronics and IT kit has been zero or negative for the last 50 years. Massively negative if you look at bangs-per-buck based on how specifications have increased, rather than categories like "midrange smartphone" or "entry-level desktop".

E.g. for an entry level Mac desktop:

iMac 1998: $1299
iMac 2006: $1299
iMac 2025: $1299...

...but it's not just Apple, you'll find the same for everything from PCs to large-screen TVs to, yes, phones. Dollar price points don't go up much - and may even go down - while specs increase exponentially. Yet, for an iPhone, the cheapest "economy" 16e now costs nearly as many dollars as the flagship iPhone did back when it launched as the latest thing. Today, the "latest thing" in iPhones now costs double that number of dollars - and cheaper options are usually old models. C.f., say, Google Pixel who alternate every 6 months between launching "flagship" $800 models (e.g. Pixel 9) and "value" $500 models (e.g. 9a) - with maybe a cheaper display, lower-res camera, more plasticky case... but otherwise up-to-date electronics. Samsung have - like Apple - released $1000++ flagship models - but they also do a huge range of lower-end models. You can now get a perfectly good Android phone, that has all of the trimmings of a modern smartphone, for $200 - pretty sure that if you run the stats the "mid point" price of non-Apple smartphones has fallen or stayed the same while the iPhone mid-point has risen.

I agree with the points that the YTer has on Apple's short comings and what their future looks like. I do think however apple has been innovating, they produced apple silicon, and seismically altered laptops in the industry.

Yes, Apple Silicon is kinda the jewel in the crown... but I'm sure that it wouldn't have happened if it wasn't cheaper - medium term - for Apple than continuing with Intel.

 

[NT1440]

I know people don’t like it, but capitalism requires quarterly profit growth. It’s a self enforcing system so the board would remove anyone who doesn’t follow that rule with their business plans.

It’s unsustainable, grotesque, and will have consequences for all of us at some point, but that’s the system (currently).

 

[maflynn]

I know people don’t like it, but capitalism requires quarterly profit growth.

Something shifted in capitalism, between the time I entered the workforce (1980s) and I think the video highlights some of that shift. When executives focus more on placating the investors, and worrying about stock prices, they take their eyes off of making insanely good products. Is Apple's priority the customer or the investor? I think we can make an argument that when Jobs was running Apple its focus was on the customer, now I it seems they're focusing more on the shareholders/investors.

 

[NT1440]

Something shifted in capitalism, between the time I entered the workforce (1980s) and I think the video highlights some of that shift. When executives focus more on placating the investors, and worrying about stock prices, they take their eyes off of making insanely good products. Is Apple's priority the customer or the investor? I think we can make an argument that when Jobs was running Apple its focus was on the customer, now I it seems they're focusing more on the shareholders/investors.

Law of big numbers. Apple isn’t the scrappy turnaround story anymore that it was under Jobs’s return.

Frankly, the best thing that could happen to Apple (but simply can’t) would for it to go private and focus again squarely on customers.

 

[maflynn]

Law of big numbers. Apple isn’t the scrappy turnaround story anymore that it was under Jobs’s return.

To be sure, but that's not the point I was trying to make, nor the videos. Its not that Apple is too big and slow, but when Steve was running the show, his focus was products and customers. The video makes a good argument one of the issues facing apple is that its paying more attention to shareholders.

 

[Happy_John]

To be sure, but that's not the point I was trying to make, nor the videos. Its not that Apple is too big and slow, but when Steve was running the show, his focus was products and customers. The video makes a good argument one of the issues facing apple is that its paying more attention to shareholders.

The problem with your point is the question "Why was it different when Steve was running the show?". The most likely answer is the factor you're deflecting from: that Apple, as a corporation, is massively bigger now than during Job's times as company leader. The focus on shareholder is due to Apple's size. If you don't think that is the reason why, you have to put forward a different reason.

 

[theluggage]

I know people don’t like it, but capitalism requires quarterly profit growth.

...you can get quarterly profit growth by making better products and attracting more customers.

Share buybacks and dividend hikes at the expense of R&D (as highlighted in the video) aren't about quarterly profit growth, they're hacks to drive up the share price.

Apple sales are doing ok but what could they be if Apple put their back into winning more customers? People hate Windows, forced updates, ads in the start menu etc. but Apple are still pricing themselves out of most of the market. Show a Windows users a Mac and evereything is rosy until they find that getting 32GB/1TB whacks the price up by 30-100%. iPhone is slicker and more consistent than Android, integrates nicely with Apple's services, but where's the $400 iPhone with attractive new features (not a special price on a 2-year-old model) to start growing the iPhone market share?

They're trying with the Next Big Thing along the lines of iPod/iPhone, but they've now struck out a few times. They tried cars, even after it was obvious that Tesla had already done the Apple "weren't first but made the first really attractive product". Apple Vision Pro needed hardware that doesn't exist yet (light, comfortable goggles with long battery life that you can use all day in the office or while walking down the street) and, without that, it has "Newton 2.0" written all over it. They might have to resign themselves to the realisation that, yes, Jobs may have been a genius, but he was also a lucky genius who happened to be in the right place at the right time (surrounded by the right people) on 3-4 occasions. There might not be a "new iPod" coming so they'll have to resort to growing the iPhone and Mac...