Dell Mac OS Drivers?

[grockk]

In a few months (well, ok, a little over half a year), anyone will be able to order, from store.apple.com, Amazon.com, smalldog.com, or a host of other sites, a DVD that will include every binary that makes up a complete Intel Mac OS X installation.

It might be encrypted, it might be that the installer is designed to prevent installation on any machine other than a genuine, certified, Apple Macintosh, but the DVD itself will exist and be sellable over the counter. There's no other way to get a multi-gigabyte operating system update to existing Mac mini, MacBook, MacBook Pro, and iMac Intel users (not to mention Mac Pro and Macserve users.)

And once that DVD's on sale, it will, if it doesn't already enable installation on non-Macs, be cracked. Someone will find a way of getting that disk to work as the base of an install for any compatible PC. It will no longer be necessary to spend a few days (I just downloaded the Debian DVD images, that's two DVDs, and it took nearly a week with BitTorrent) downloading from various dodgy, likely-to-go-down-at-a-moment's-notice, sites and figure out how to get that burnt to DVD and booted. The "installer" will be so small it'll be mirrored all over the world.

There is already a 10.4.6 install disc that works on non-apple hardware. It requires a little help to get sound, airport, and graphics working but it all works...

seriously, you can buy certain dell configurations that will run OS X and all the goodies too.

so that time is now.

 

[itguy06]

Eww, that's just dirty.

Dell makes the biggest POS's on the planet - If Apple goes the OSX licensing route, they better pick a QUALITY partner, not Dell.

If this happens, I'm out of the Macs for good - Dell is the epitome of all things wrong with the PC industry - from poor quality to poor performance to no support.

Dell should just close up shop and give the money back to the shareholders. They are truly worthless as a company.

 

[KEL9000]

There is already a 10.4.6 install disc that works on non-apple hardware. It requires a little help to get sound, airport, and graphics working but it all works...

seriously, you can buy certain dell configurations that will run OS X and all the goodies too.

so that time is now.

How do you get airport on a non-apple computer and where did you see this 10.4.6 install disk?

Just to summarize reallity:

Apple is:

A computer maker.
A direct competitor of Dell
A pmp maker
Making lots of money off hardware Mac + iPod

Apple is not:

An OS supplier
A competitor of microsoft
A seller of cheap, low margin computers
making lots of money off software OSX + iLife + iWork + ProApps


In the event Apple sells OSX to run on different hardware your seatback can be used for a floatation device.

 

[Squire]

If this happens, I'm out of the Macs for good

I wish I had an iPod nano for every time I read that before the Intel switch.

I think Apple has a lot to gain by offering their OS to Dell. I have not always felt that way, however. First of all, as others have mentioned, Apple still has competitively priced machines. In other words, a lot of people would still buy Macintoshes. Secondly, OS X is a solid operating system and I'm of the opinion that good products will eventually be adopted by the public... especially if "experimenting" with it only adds $120 to the price of a Dell.

-Squire

 

[Squire]

How do you get airport on a non-apple computer

Check the following site:
http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=75422

Also, what if Apple has another kickass product in the pipeline...one that will require syncing with OS X? Perhaps they're seeing the operating system sales as a simple means to an end.

Just hypothesizing.

-Squire

 

[TallShaffer]

Why does everybody here only talk about dell for pc makers? How about HP, Gateway, Sony, Acer...etc?

Also, how is it possible to boot an OS that requires EFI when all these manufacturers are still using BIOS?

 

[EricNau]

I disagree. All the Mac models are highly competative with their PC counterparts. Look at the Mac mini and the AOpens mini PC. Look at the iMac and other all-in-ones, look at the MacBook and the PC Core Duo laptops. Even the PowerMacs are in the same price range as PC workstation counterparts.

Dell has a Core Duo laptop nearly identical to the $2000 MacBook Pro for $1300. Would you be willing to spend an extra $700 for the Apple if you could install OS X and iLife on the Dell?

Didn't think so.

 

[gekko513]

Dell has a Core Duo laptop nearly identical to the $2000 MacBook Pro for $1300. Would you be willing to spend an extra $700 for the Apple if you could install OS X and iLife on the Dell?

Didn't think so.

I think that model has been discussed before, and it's not identical at all. I just configured a Dell Inspiron 6400 to be as similar to the MacBook Pro as possible and it came out at $1772 and that is still with just a 1280x800 display and just a X1300 GPU. On the up side, it did have 1GB RAM as its minimum config and had a double layer DVD burner. Oh, and its large and heavy compared to the MBP.

 

[KEL9000]

Dell has a Core Duo laptop nearly identical to the $2000 MacBook Pro for $1300. Would you be willing to spend an extra $700 for the Apple if you could install OS X and iLife on the Dell?

Didn't think so.

that's why apple will never sell OSX for other manufacturers

 

[KEL9000]

Check the following site:
http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=75422

Also, what if Apple has another kickass product in the pipeline...one that will require syncing with OS X? Perhaps they're seeing the operating system sales as a simple means to an end.

Just hypothesizing.

-Squire

that is for the basestation management software. The end you speak of is selling Macs. Let's take a little journey to economics land.

Apple sells a Computer for $2000 with a profit margin of +20% that is $400 of profit. Apple sells OSX for $129 with the same margin of 20% that gives us a profit of $26. Just speculation but I would image that they are not making any profit on OSX and soley rely on hardware sales. This means that for every Dell someone buys instead of a Mac, apple would have to sell ~20 copies of OSX.

Don't you think it is interesting that there is no CD Key with OSX? They don't care how many times you use it, because they already have your hardware money.

Do you think that Microsoft would stand by silently? I would guess that within minutes of the announcement MS would cease support for all OSX products, similar to the way they support linux. If you think for a minute that MS Office would run on a direct competitor's OS you are strongly mistaken. And we all know the power of Office.

 

[dagger01]

Won't happen...ever.

Apple will never, ever allow the tight integration of their hardware with their OS to break down by diluting the market with hackneyed hardware configurations running Mac OS X. There is no one in Apple's management from Stevsie on down that would even think of allowing something like that, no matter what the repercussions on market share might be. Just flat out not gonna happen. They tried it in the 1990s and it didn't work, almost killed them.

You will see Mac OS X running in the wild on Intel boxes other than Apple's. I'm sure it will happen, but it won't be something Apple supports, condones, or even thinks about allowing to happen as a business move. It would be against everything they stand for; a machine that works right out of the box, period. They'll remain a niche market player forever before they'll do that.

I know, I know, things change over time and who can prognosticate something so certain given the fluidity of technology and the personal computing/consumer electronics market? Trust me on this one. Not gonna happen as long as Apple exists as a company unto itself, and I don't think they'd get taken over any time soon. Although, I'm still reeling from the Pixar buyout. As a shareholder I'm still not too pleased at that decision, nor the crappy Disney stock I'm going to get for my Pixar shares. GACK! Now I feel dirty....

 

[dagger01]

Do you think that Microsoft would stand by silently? I would guess that within minutes of the announcement MS would cease support for all OSX products, similar to the way they support linux. If you think for a minute that MS Office would run on a direct competitor's OS you are strongly mistaken. And we all know the power of Office.

Are you nuts?!?! Microsoft has a much more captive market for their Office products on the Mac than they do on their own OS. They won't kill that market. It's why they bought Virtual PC; that and so they can make one version of Office that will run in both worlds.

The MS Mac BU is doomed anyway, especially after the Intel switch. I'll throw a whacky prediction out there to contemplate. Apple and Microsoft will be collaborating on the Yellow Box for Windows and Red Box for Mac OS X, a joint project to bring Mac OS X APIs to Windows and Windows APIs to Mac OS X. Sound crazy? Not when you think of the software sales opportunities such a collaboration would create. Apple could sell their high-end Pro apps to Windows customers and Microsoft would save money and kill the Mac BU for single app fork development. Apple makes a ton more money off software than they do hardware. This would also be a kick in the balls to Linux, which MS would also enjoy. Think I'm crazy? Well, we'll see won't we. 2007 is going to be a VERY interesting year for Apple.

 

[dagger01]

Apple sells a Computer for $2000 with a profit margin of +20% that is $400 of profit. Apple sells OSX for $129 with the same margin of 20% that gives us a profit of $26. Just speculation but I would image that they are not making any profit on OSX and soley rely on hardware sales. This means that for every Dell someone buys instead of a Mac, apple would have to sell ~20 copies of OSX.

BTW, you're about dead on for hardware margins, but the software margins are much higher. Don't have the figures in front of me, but software profits are always significantly higher than hardware. The only thing they may be treading water on is the iLife and iWork apps, but the OS and Pro apps are generating mucho profits. Hell, look at MS as an example! MS sells the Xbox at a loss BECAUSE they make ass loads of money off their software. Apple only makes hardware so they have the integration and know everything works out of the box. They are not making tons of money off computing hardware, or even the iPod. That's sheer volume, like the VHS business model. Apple only makes about $50 an iPod (video, not nano or shuffle) at retail prices. But, they sell 6 - 8 million of the little buggers every three months!

 

[KEL9000]

df is more articulate than my self.

http://daringfireball.net/2006/04/asinine_and_or_risky_ideas

 

[dagger01]

Check the following site:
http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=75422

Also, what if Apple has another kickass product in the pipeline...one that will require syncing with OS X? Perhaps they're seeing the operating system sales as a simple means to an end.

Just hypothesizing.

-Squire

You're missing the fact that Apple makes consumer electronics products AND computing products. Apple is not going to require Mac OS X syncing exclusively for a consumer electronics product. That would be foolish given the market penetration they've achieved with the iPod, especially on the Windows platform. The example you point to of the Airport drivers for Windows is an example of wireless music streaming features and how they have become part of their consumer electronics strategy. The Windows drivers for the Airport Express make sense given how successful iTunes and iPod may drive people to buy Airport Express base stations for the wireless streaming features. Airport is really another consumer electronics product. It's a standard 802.11a/b/g device with some specific special features that integrate with both the computing and consumer electronics products Apple produces. But, it will work with ANY computer. I have Linux boxes that use Apple Airport base stations for wireless access. The drivers for Windows are for the iTunes features more than anything else.

 

[BenRoethig]

The only, ONLY reason i wouldn't hate a dellmac is that 30% of computer users are idiots who buy new dells every 15 years and never buy anything else and don't know anything about windows or osx. Otherwise, the Dellmac is a stupid idea. Dellmacs are for the people who still think the blue e (internet explorer logo) stands for the internet. I think its hilarious to see users come to the school Mac lab, look for the blue E, click it, then wonder why their page looks messed up. Dellmacs are for the idiots who think that their CD tray is a cupholder (but doesnt it auto-retract in like 5 minutes??). Basically, Dellmacs are for PC users.

And you guys accuse PC users to sticking to stereotypes. Believe it or not there are other groups besides the computer novices and those in the creative fields.

A computer maker.
A direct competitor of Dell

They are a computer maker, but they competed with Dell as much as Alienware did. Beleive it or not, the iMac and Mac Mini do not have universal appeal. They appeal to different segments of the market.

Apple will never, ever allow the tight integration of their hardware with their OS to break down by diluting the market with hackneyed hardware configurations running Mac OS X. There is no one in Apple's management from Stevsie on down that would even think of allowing something like that, no matter what the repercussions on market share might be. Just flat out not gonna happen. They tried it in the 1990s and it didn't work, almost killed them.

Apple and the PCs are running the same exact hardware. There are no dedicated mac motherboards anymore.

 

[zweigand]

Apple only makes hardware so they have the integration and know everything works out of the box. They are not making tons of money off computing hardware, or even the iPod.

http://images.apple.com/pr/pdf/q206data_sum.pdf

Looks like they make a LOT of money off of their hardware. Doesn't say much for the software either... I'm assuming that includes iLife, iWork, OS X, and all the pro apps like Aperture, Logic, FCP, Motion, Shake, etc.

Hardware is their business...

 

[BenRoethig]

I think that model has been discussed before, and it's not identical at all. I just configured a Dell Inspiron 6400 to be as similar to the MacBook Pro as possible and it came out at $1772 and that is still with just a 1280x800 display and just a X1300 GPU. On the up side, it did have 1GB RAM as its minimum config and had a double layer DVD burner. Oh, and its large and heavy compared to the MBP.

Agreed. The Inspiron E1505 is a consumer 15". The Macbook is a professional thin and light. Compared to the Dell, the MBP is faster, lighter, and thinner. The Dell has 64mb of dedicated video memory and the rest is shared. Those buying the Dell will not be buying the MBP reguardless.

 

[kahos]

Why does everybody here only talk about dell for pc makers? How about HP, Gateway, Sony, Acer...etc?

Also, how is it possible to boot an OS that requires EFI when all these manufacturers are still using BIOS?

OS X 86 works fine on computers using BIOS (with some slight modifications I guess).

I wouldnt mind dell selling os x on a few select computers, at least the "gamer" models since apple doesnt look like its going after that market right now.

 

[KEL9000]

They are a computer maker, but they competed with Dell as much as Alienware did. Beleive it or not, the iMac and Mac Mini do not have universal appeal. They appeal to different segments of the market.

I was simply illustrating that apple's current strategy is integrate software and hardware just like Dell and not at all like Microsoft. And if they aren't competitors why does everyone compare their systems so much?

 

[Core Trio]

Dell has a Core Duo laptop nearly identical to the $2000 MacBook Pro for $1300. Would you be willing to spend an extra $700 for the Apple if you could install OS X and iLife on the Dell?

Didn't think so.

To get that dell up to the specs of the MBP (as close as possible) pretty much closes a large chunk of that $700 gap...and then account for the fact that the dell is ugly thick and heavy, and has a lower screen res.

 

[Core Trio]

OS X 86 works fine on computers using BIOS (with some slight modifications I guess).

I wouldnt mind dell selling os x on a few select computers, at least the "gamer" models since apple doesnt look like its going after that market right now.

And game developers dont really seem to be biting down into the Mac gaming market either...so that would be utterly pointless without a dual booting option. If you're buying a computer to play games, why would you be buying a mac..err uhm...dell with OS X

 

[yellow]

Seriosuly. Humor... should be humor. Because that's all it is.
I'm surprised it wasn't called "Apple MAC OS".

 

[BenRoethig]

And game developers dont really seem to be biting down into the Mac gaming market either...so that would be utterly pointless without a dual booting option. If you're buying a computer to play games, why would you be buying a mac..err uhm...dell with OS X

They don't bite because there isn't a whole lot of fish in the pond yet and there really isn't a mac conducive to gaming.

 

[danielwsmithee]

Economics

...Apple sells OSX for $129 with the same margin of 20% that gives us a profit of $26. ...

Your understanding of software profits is amazing. Software profits are almost 100% once the development costs are paid for. There is not a set ratio of % profit sails. If the R&D effort has not been paid for profits are ZERO or negative. If enough units have sold the profit margin on each unit sold is 100%. You can create a sudo profit margin based a forcasted number of units sold! There is plenty of profit to be made by only selling software!

I am sure that Apple has looked at the numbers, but I doubt they have any confident estimates of how many copies of OS X would sell if they opened it to all PC's. Look for Apple to come up with some method of "testing the water" without canabalizing their hardware sales.