Dell to Try to Take on Apple's Online Music Dominance?

[Rot'nApple]

it is indeed unfortunate if this was indeed true. i'd never wish such a condition on anyone. it's a tough battle and it could happen to anyone. nevertheless, whether what some people have said of Mr. Bucher, or what he said of Apple was true or not, it's unfair for anyone of us to draw any conclusion because we don't know the history and the current facts. so it's quite pointless.

anyway, if a business was setup to compete primarily on the grounds of revenge, then it's doomed to failure because most of your business decisions maybe emotionally influenced. but we don't know this for sure. we shall see what will happen with this business venture. frankly, i really doubt it'd succeed. at least "zing" is not as highly unflattering as "squirt" for Zune. nevertheless, i think they're both asinine marketing verbs.

Of course there are two sides to the story.

I guess we will never know, due to confidentiality, of Apple's reasons for letting him go.

But if he was let go because of a perceived mental illness and filed suit, I must of missed it among all the other suits reported on over the past few years. Is the suit still working its way through the courts or did it get settled, thrown out, etc?

Of course I think Dell's Board is delusional if they think they can create a universal service to topple Apple's. They can possibly create a service that will have a small base of users, compared to Apple or Amazon, just like all the other iPod/ITMS killers that have tried and failed to topple Apple but have their own little following.

 

[sebimeyer]

moderate fail

Dell may stand a chance because the recording industry seems to think Apple is too powerfull (read: more powerfull than them).

That said, I doubt very much that what they have in store (pun intended) come anywhere close to the polished, easy to use stuff that Apple is now known for.

 

[Dmac77]

Winner of the Best Comment Award for this thread. lol

Thank you sir, thank you!

Don

 

[Trajectory]

Apple was the first to do this successfully, and as a result has great brand recognition and loyalty in the digital music market. So, it's going to be tough for any competitor to make a significant dent, unless Apple fumbles one too many times in the next few years.

It will be fun to watch them try!

 

[Small White Car]

Why?

I really do not expect Dell to approach this from a heavily-DRM'd standpoint

Well, here's their basic pitch: You can take the music they offer and play it on all sorts of devices.

Well, an MP3 can pretty much do that today. So what's different?

Central to Dell's plan is software acquired a year ago when it bought Zing, the company Bucher founded after leaving Apple. The software handles behind-the-scenes translations so that content can be "zinged" between computers and other compatible devices.

Well, lookie here! Special software that LETS you move the files around. Interesting, isn't it? The obvious "read between the lines" part of this is that without this software you AREN'T allowed to "zing' the files around.

This = DRM

In fact, correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't it sure look like "Zinging" means I move the song from the computer to the player. "Move" as in "no longer on my computer." This is what I mean when I say it will likely be worse than iTunes.

 

[Cleverboy]

Dells purchase of Zing makes it sound like they are still stuck thinking just about music.

Dell will have to figure out how to deliver not just Music but TV, Movies, Podcast, Audiobooks and Apps BETTER than Apple for them to have any chance of competing.

Should be interesting - all I hope is that Dell doesn't create another DRM 'standard' thats incompatible with non-Zing players/software.

Edit: After looking at their site it looks like Zing is more into online streaming to DAPs? Does anyone know what they really do?

I've been reading it, and I've come across at least one vomit-inducing quote that Dell Marketeers spoon-fed to Robert Enderle, "Apple wants to lock you in...Dell wants to lock you in to choice." Ugh!
[-SNIP-]
However, this kind of service will only succeed if one of the following happens...

1. Customers by all new HW that is Zing-compliant
2. Wait for Internet-browsing car stereos to pick up steam and distribute all this content via the Web.
3. (Most likely) Dell creates a magical FM-Transmitter\Base Station\Portable Web Server Combo Device that you carry around with you to stream to your devices.

Exactly. Most of the people in this thread just seem to be randomly DUMPING on Dell for little good reason. If you're going to dump on Dell for this service offering, there are PLENTY of GREAT reasons! I just went to their website ( www.zing.net ), and I'm pretty underwelmed. It's the same gooey marketing jargon all over the place with absolutely NO substance. ("CHANGE... blah, blah... VISION... blah, blah... HOT... blah, blah... INTERNET!") I tried really really hard to decipher it, but...

Mountain View and the D4 Conference in Carlsbad, CA — 06.01.06 — ZING, a new consumer technology company, is building an audio and entertainment engine to drive a new generation of always-connected, mobile digital devices. Today, they took the wraps off the company’s identity and unveiled plans to work with leading brands–both online and in consumer electronics–to develop audio and entertainment experiences that give people the benefits of live, always-on digital streams.

“With one notable exception, the digital music market is tremendously fragmented, and this fragmentation has confounded music lovers and severely limited market growth and opportunity. There is a lot of room for innovation in this market and plenty of opportunity for other players to participate more successfully in the market, but only if they can deliver a complete, easily adopted, integrated experience. If Apple has taught us anything, it is the value of an end-to-end solution,” said industry analyst Chris Shipley of the Guidewire Group. “The ZING approach is the only solution to fix this problem.”

ZING Fully Integrated Experiences

ZING provides the framework for an always-connected, fully integrated audio and personal entertainment experience that spans from the device to services. The ZING solution allows its partners to choose from:

* core content management software and services
* ZAP — the extensible ZING Application Platform
* a rich user interface design
* a hardware reference platform
* a networked service center

It's disturbingly laughable is what this is. Disturbing, because this is the same road attempted by Microsoft, Real, and others. It seems as if the main term missing from Zing's vocabulary is "rights management". Clearly, someone in PR is advising them to steer clear of this word. There was a consortium on attempting to unify the various DRM schemes, but this seems to have fallen apart. Having YET ANOTHER scheme step onto the market is no where NEAR what consumers want. Consumers want content providers to allow content to appear in more venues. I think media channels like YouTube and Hulu are a good start. Both services need to EXPAND their media delivery systems to be more rich. For instance, I believe YouTube will be getting into Podcasts (excellent), and is already bringing itself to 3rd party devices and mobile media players. iTunes already appears (albiet partially) on computers, iPhones, iPod Touches, and Apple TVs. Even Netflix is attempting to become a next generation distribution point, and is already appearing on 3rd party media players.

"Zing" is a joke, if it thinks it will not ONLY acquire media, but somehow do what Microsoft, Netflix, and Real player are failing to do, simply by saying so... and having Dell in its corner. Honestly. What are they smoking. I thought the Mac Rumors article was missing critical information. Come to find out... no... the Business Week article was not worth writing. A link to Zing.net would have sufficed. The "personal" angle to the story was weak and transparent.

~ CB

 

[macdade]

It's clear Tim has an issue with manic-depression. It's just sad.

If your diagnosis of manic-depression is based upon this macrumors report then it is diagnonsense.

Manic-depression, a.k.a. bipolar disorder is more prevalent than many folks think, and many bipolars are productive, socially appropriate and creative. In fact, a large percentage of bipolars are employed and often out-perform their colleagues.

Firing someone for being bipolar is wrong. Firing someone for poor performance is right. I don't know that Jobs fired this gentleman for being bipolar or whether he simply spouted off inappropriately while firing him for legitimate reasons. There's a reasonable burden of proof that this article fails to meet.

peace and happy neurons,
bill

 

[OrangeCrush]

Dell = Innovation?

Steve Jobs likes to joke "Redmond, start your copiers." But really, everytime anything is announced by any computer company it should be "Austin, start your copiers." Problem is, it always takes a year for the latest stuff to make it into Dell boxes because they don't do R&D, have never had an original idea yet, and are nothing more than the original branded white-box PC. Dell's R&D department can't be much more than a bunch of 15-year olds who like to slap systems together with random parts.

Dell is nothing more than a leach on the industry. They let HP, Apple, Microsoft, Toshiba, etc. all do R&D then they do cheap knock-offs and force lower prices, resulting in fewer R&D dollars at other companies which stiffles innovation throughout the industry. Dell has single-handedly slowed the computing industry down by a good 5-years.

Someone, please name me anything original Dell has done.

 

[nick9191]

I'll bet they handle it in the same way Microsoft handled it. By getting on their hands and knees, accepting whatever the industry told them, to negotiate the music at the lowest possible price. And now Microsoft certified (or whatever it was called) music does not even work on their own music player thanks to good ol' DRM.

Apple actually gave a toss about the customer, and made sure that both the artist and the end user get a very fair deal.

 

[SPUY767]

I LOL'd.

 

[mdriftmeyer]

Lol Funny, i could so see Steve saying that.

He wouldn't say that. He'd ask him what the f*** is going on and he's that way when it reaches his desk. He then would watch your performance at the executive level since he would be working directly within Steve's tier.

He wouldn't mock someone's mental capacity that is clearly something which would be a massive lawsuit Apple and Steve couldn't defend.

I knew people at Apple on medications. They were never mocked nor called out in such a callous manner.

 

[Trajectory]

Someone, please name me anything original Dell has done.

Well, if you knew the history of Dell, you'd know that they had a huge impact on the PC industry in the late 80s and early 90s when their customer service was the best in the industry, and their PCs were well-designed and reliable. I bought about 7 different Dell computers during that time period, and they were all pretty good computers. But times have changed.

I switched to Macs about 10+ years ago when I saw that Dell was catering more and more to the consumer market, and I'm SO glad I did. I prefer Apple's hardware and software over any other I've used over the years.

 

[Cleve]

MobileMe to take up global music DB

One analyst suggests that Apple will counter by using MobileMe to keep a DB of a users music. Also, Dell has no chance...


http://feeds.computerworld.com/~r/C...fter_itunes_ipod_ecosystem_with_openness_fail

 

[winterspan]

It's clear Tim has an issue with manic-depression. It's just sad.

If that is true, it's odd that he would 1) be able to have gotten that far in his career without treatment and 2) not have recognized and sought treatment for his illness. Modern medicine does quite well in controlling bi-polar disorder. I guess there are always those people who live in denial out of pride or whatever and don't seek treatment. Sad, really...

 

[thecartoonguy]

Dell could never be a threat to Apple's music industry...and the whole "revenge" thing is really dumb.

You took the words right out of my mouth

 

[Wharrgarbl]

I hope that Dell starts building H.264 decoder/encoders into everything it sells. Because without being able to "Zing" HD video around, this won't hold a prayer against Apple.

Every time someone readies a worthy Apple competitor, Apple announces a new move that puts them 2 years ahead of the curve. Like the launch of the Zune coming right before the launch of the iPod touch!

Zing will try to do *something*, but it won't be anywhere near what Apple is about to do with H.264 and HD video everywhere.

It'll be interesting to watch, anyway.

 

[mklos]

Apple pretty much has the market nailed. They have people going to iTunes for everything they need, music, movies (rented or bought), audiobooks, and now iPhone apps.

So I guess Dell is depending on people to just stop using iTunes (or Amazon for that matter) and start using their service? If people were going to leave iTunes by now, they wouldn't have already done it. They can easily go to Amazon (and some have done so), or some other service. When people are in a paradigm, such as always going to iTunes for music, movies, audiobooks, and now iPhone apps, they will most likely always do this until something else spectacular comes out. So Dell will have to do something pretty earth shattering to get people to go away from iTunes. Just releasing a store, even with all non-drm songs won't make people automatically skip iTunes for a Dell music store.

 

[ivladster]

umm

I hope this guys know that Apple will sue him for telling Apple's Trade secrets and practices to Hell...I mean Dell.


Good luck buddy

 

[CWallace]

Well, here's their basic pitch: You can take the music they offer and play it on all sorts of devices.

Well, an MP3 can pretty much do that today. So what's different?

With iTunes you can play a music file on multiple computers, an iPod, an iPhone, an tv, and stream it to a stereo via an Airport Express and AirTunes. It is an integrated, end-to-end solution.

Perhaps Dell wants to offer that level of integration / solution? You store the music on your Windows Media Home Server. You share it with your Windows (and Windows Media) PCs, X-Boxes, Windows Media Center extenders, and "DellPods" all through a single, common library interface like iTunes does.

Perhaps Dell develops their own WiFi streaming system ala AirTunes that not only works with a stereo connected to a router, but perhaps your "DellPod" as well?

I believe it has been said Apple is working on offering this with the iPod/iPhone so you can access your entire music library without having to pre-load your entire music library.

 

[OrangeCrush]

Well, if you knew the history of Dell, you'd know that they had a huge impact on the PC industry in the late 80s and early 90s when their customer service was the best in the industry, and their PCs were well-designed and reliable. I bought about 7 different Dell computers during that time period, and they were all pretty good computers. But times have changed.

I switched to Macs about 10+ years ago when I saw that Dell was catering more and more to the consumer market, and I'm SO glad I did. I prefer Apple's hardware and software over any other I've used over the years.

I won't dispute that Dell set up a great supply chain model with everything from ordering, to inventory management, to delivery being well designed. And before they sent customer service to India, they were respected there. However, Dell took the supply chain model from Toyota and used it to deliver computers. It was a fantastic success and that can't be argued; but not original. Actually, I'm glad to see Dell trying to innovate, I just don't think they have the background, or the fortitude, to be successful in trying to do something new, different, or better than anyone else. They've always been followers and have proven you can be successful by copying somebody else's widget.

 

[PinkyMacGodess]

Exactly...

I've always seen Dell as a reseller and not an innovator.

Exactly. Dell is like McDonalds who famously said that they were 'too big to fail' and that even if they quit TODAY, their real estate holdings would be enough to keep them profitable to many years.

But you have to realize that insanity breeds intelligence. Some of the most craziest people are the most intelligent.

People are happy with iTunes and apple and are not looking for an alternative.

Don't count them out, yet. People are willing to switch, if they perceive that they gain by the change. I use Amazon now almost exclusively for music. Why? The price option has disappeared on a per song basis but there is no DRM AND the double CD price is often a few bucks below itunes.

But Amazon doesn't do movies (that I'm aware of) and I still have used itunes for a few movies. But I'm willing to change, "if it's compatible". Where Dell screwed up is making their player incompatible with itunes tracks. But now the Zune appears to be doing fine and it's incompatible with 'itunes' tracks.

But, never underestimate the stupidity of the average person. After nearly eight years of Bush (and the economic and social mess), people are still willing to vote for four more years under McCain and 'Cindy'... I've got a Zune. The thing sucks but evidently not enough to keep people from buying it. The whole wireless thing is an interesting 'feature' to me and nothing more then that.

Point is: Don't count Dell out, yet. They may create enough rope and hang themselves, or create enough rope and hang Apple. It is possible. Not likely, but possible...

 

[Cormac]

As a Dell employee, I really think that Mikey should be more concerned with keeping the company profitable than a second revenge try at a MP3 player.

 

[ryanwarsaw]

if they do it in a userfriendly way and bundle the service with mp3 players, free music and dell notebooks it could be a real threat to apple.


this could cost apple some market share. the zune failed because there was no reason to choose a zune over an ipod.
but dell sells 30% of all computers and if my dell notebook comes with a dell mp3 player and some free music in a bundle why would i buy an ipod?

There is no reason not to. Don't be shy run out and do it.

 

[PinkyMacGodess]

Whatever.

My point was that just because someone is labled as being 'crazy' doesn't mean that they can't pull off an upset. I used politics because that's what is current with the election coming up.

Does Dell have a chance? Through having the right advertising and PR campaign they have stayed in business. People actually believe that they have 'world class support' and that they care about their customers. The truth is rarely like the illusion created with money and a lot of polish. Perhaps their biggest deception is that they have 'cutting edge products'. They are the McDonalds of the computer industry. Every body does hamburgers. It was the 'Happy Meal' that put McDonalds on the map. It's only lately that Dell has seen the benefit of introducing color and innovation into their products, and even then it's been mostly a cover...

Do they have a chance? Sure. That doesn't mean that I'll be owning a new Dell player in 5 years.

 

[ezekielrage_99]

It's clear Tim has an issue with manic-depression. It's just sad.

It's not manic, it's just plain stupid. I'm sorry but there's no medical/psychological diagnosis for stupidity....


Microsoft tried and fails so I think it's safe to say Dell wont make much of a ripple either....