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Oh, thats for the link! I didn't know about that laptop. I was indeed quite sure that these CPUs were not actually shipping (despite being listed as available).

Are you thinking about the Skylake models maybe, as in the 6[7-9]70HQ that are "Launched" but only apparently available in the NUC?
 
Are you thinking about the Skylake models maybe, as in the 6[7-9]70HQ that are "Launched" but only apparently available in the NUC?

Both Skylakes and Broadwells, as I never saw any in the wild. But again, it seems that I was wrong and that there are products with at least some of Broadwells shipping. I wonder though why not more laptops use them and also what happened to the Apple thing. Maybe Intel was not able to deliver high enough quantities? Questions, questions.
 
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Hoping Apple can turn things around.

Until someone takes the crown away from Apple and they are forced to go back to the drawing board I wouldn't count on it. This is just how it is. Apple has grown an enormous customer base and are at risk of alienating the everyday (non-hardcore) user. This is the same position Microsoft was in for years. Look at Microsoft now. I highly doubt we'd have anything as cool as Windows 10 or Surface if Apple hadn't put a serious dent in their business. I'm along the same lines as you, slowly working my way back to Windows and leaving the mac around for media.
 
Make sure you do plenty of research if you plan on buying that Dell. I was going to pick one up until I learned all about issues people are having with quality control and quirks unique to this model like coil whine.

There's always going to be issues with quality control. Apple has plenty of them too. Staingate anyone?

Are you thinking about the Skylake models maybe, as in the 6[7-9]70HQ that are "Launched" but only apparently available in the NUC?

That's because Windows laptops with Iris Pro are very rare. Most of the performance Windows laptops already have dGPU so the don't need Iris Pro.

Both Skylakes and Broadwells, as I never saw any in the wild. But again, it seems that I was wrong and that there are products with at least some of Broadwells shipping. I wonder though why not more laptops use them and also what happened to the Apple thing. Maybe Intel was not able to deliver high enough quantities? Questions, questions.

Most performance Windows laptops have dGPU so they don't need Iris Pro.

In fact, Windows laptops with Iris Pro are very rare.

But it's a Dell...

And?
 
When was the last time you looked at a Dell? They are not the Dell of yesteryear. I think a lot has changed since Michael took back over..

July is the last time I shoved a Dell from my desk.
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A lot of people are giving them very good reviews. At least some parts are user-upgradable.

We have an XPS 15 and you can upgrade the memory and M.2 SSD with one screwdriver.

I'll give you the upgradability aspect. They are user-friendly for that unlike the Apple laptop sealed boxes.
 
A lot of people are giving them very good reviews. At least some parts are user-upgradable.

We have an XPS 15 and you can upgrade the memory and M.2 SSD with one screwdriver.

Agree Dell is getting much better, although I am still sceptical. XPS is now certainly one of the better reasonably priced PC notebooks. If pushed and had choose between the current 15" rMB & XPS 15 I think the Dell would be the win for many needs.

Q-6
 
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Some Latitude machine.

If the typical corporate box no surprises, the basic systems are built to a low budget, and fail to impress. Step up to a Precision or now the new XPS very different hardware.

Personally I never had a corporate issued Latitude last beyond, 18 months before developing some issue, equally I don't remember anyone with a Precision having any serious issue.

Q-6
 
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And a lot use windows and linux. Most people developing web apps don't really care and it does not matter. The tools you need are on any platform. There is nothing special about a Macbook, but there is nothing wrong with it. Its a computer.

No. Just no. Stop saying that because from your statement, it's obvious that you are neither:
  1. A developer, professionally.
  2. Someone who knows a lot about the professional climate of developers.
I'm a full time software developer. Me, all my coworkers, all the guys at my last company, all the guys at every company I've interviewed with, and 70+% of the developers at conferences (web or general CS) are on MacBooks.
Mac OS is an out of box, retail operating system with a Unix terminal, that can run production third party software like the full Adobe suite, Microsoft Office, almost any IDE you want.
I've tutored courses where a PhD in computer science literally tells his students, "Get a Mac or plan on spending 2~3 hours figuring out why your build isn't working in Windows, but we will not wait for you."
I've had to deal with people who swore up and down that anything you can do on a Mac, you can do on Windows, who destroyed their entire local repository because Ruby rvm commands some times have serious problems on a Windows machine due to the lack of a real terminal.
Oh Windows 10 anniversary deluxe titanium director's cut edition comes with a power shell? Welcome to 2007, Microsoft.
The bottom line is, if you want retail software, an easy experience (sorry Linux, and don't try to disagree with this, you can never under any circumstance swear emphatically that Linux offers out of box experience like Windows/OSX do), a Unix terminal along with being able to deploy and test on every platform, you go MacBook or you're uninformed.
Mac is the only machine, period/end of discussion, that can triple boot Linux, Windows and Mac OS with full hardware support.

That being said, I'm still disappointed in Apple's decisions with MacBook hardware. My work provided me with a 15" Pro with 512GB storage, but I want to pick up a personal machine for my own personal projects to avoid IP issues using a work computer and I literally can't buy anything. I refuse, professionally and as a consumer, to spend $1800 on a "Pro" 15" computer that has a three year old processor and integrated graphics. You think I don't need extra hardware? Well you're not me, so stop trying to tell me what I should or should not want in a computer.

The bottom line is, an $1800 (I usually get $200 off using my alumni Apple education portal or a Best Buy coupon) notebook that has integrated graphics and a three year old processor is an absolute worst buy. It's probably the most insulting value of any Apple product since they had 16GB $649 phones. It's actually more insulting than that.

iOS development is a staple of my career and one of the platforms that I most often work in and I'm seriously considering abandoning the iOS ecosystem and moving on to greener pasture.
 
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No. Just no. Stop saying that because from your statement, it's obvious that you are neither:
  1. A developer, professionally.
  2. Someone who knows a lot about the professional climate of developers.
I'm a full time software developer. Me, all my coworkers, all the guys at my last company, all the guys at every company I've interviewed with, and 70+% of the developers at conferences (web or general CS) are on MacBooks.
Mac OS is an out of box, retail operating system with a Unix terminal, that can run production third party software like the full Adobe suite, Microsoft Office, almost any IDE you want.
I've tutored courses where a PhD in computer science literally tells his students, "Get a Mac or plan on spending 2~3 hours figuring out why your build isn't working in Windows, but we will not wait for you."
I've had to deal with people who swore up and down that anything you can do on a Mac, you can do on Windows, who destroyed their entire local repository because Ruby rvm commands some times have serious problems on a Windows machine due to the lack of a real terminal.
Oh Windows 10 anniversary deluxe titanium director's cut edition comes with a power shell? Welcome to 2007, Microsoft.
The bottom line is, if you want retail software, an easy experience (sorry Linux, and don't try to disagree with this, you can never under any circumstance swear emphatically that Linux offers out of box experience like Windows/OSX do), a Unix terminal along with being able to deploy and test on every platform, you go MacBook or you're uninformed.
Mac is the only machine, period/end of discussion, that can triple boot Linux, Windows and Mac OS with full hardware support.

That being said, I'm still disappointed in Apple's decisions with MacBook hardware. My work provided me with a 15" Pro with 512GB storage, but I want to pick up a personal machine for my own personal projects to avoid IP issues using a work computer and I literally can't buy anything. I refuse, professionally and as a consumer, to spend $1800 on a "Pro" 15" computer that has a three year old processor and integrated graphics. You think I don't need extra hardware? Well you're not me, so stop trying to tell me what I should or should not want in a computer.

The bottom line is, an $1800 (I usually get $200 off using my alumni Apple education portal or a Best Buy coupon) notebook that has integrated graphics and a three year old processor is an absolute worst buy. It's probably the most insulting value of any Apple product since they had 16GB $649 phones. It's actually more insulting than that.

iOS development is a staple of my career and one of the platforms that I most often work in and I'm seriously considering abandoning the iOS ecosystem and moving on to greener pasture.

This is hyperbole. There's quite a few companies on a .NET/java stack - you don't need a Unix operating system for web programming. Some of the best web developers I know are running their favorite flavor of Linux on Lenovo machines. OS X is nice, but not necessary.

'That being said, I'm still disappointed in Apple's decisions with MacBook hardware. My work provided me with a 15" Pro with 512GB storage, but I want to pick up a personal machine for my own personal projects to avoid IP issues using a work computer and I literally can't buy anything.'

This is precisely why I dual boot Linux/Windows 10 on a cheap HP Sandy Bridge mini Tower I bought for like $300. I have an old sandy bridge HP laptop I picked up for cheap as well, that while a clunker, 'just works' : )
 
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No. Just no. Stop saying that because from your statement, it's obvious that you are neither:
  1. A developer, professionally.
  2. Someone who knows a lot about the professional climate of developers.
I'm a full time software developer. Me, all my coworkers, all the guys at my last company, all the guys at every company I've interviewed with, and 70+% of the developers at conferences (web or general CS) are on MacBooks.
You're making some pretty big statements there. Maybe in your part of the world using the tech you're using, but in my development career I've seen all ends of the spectrum. It really depends on the language/framework you're working in. Windows can be a pain with some of the open source languages like PHP or Java, but it also has some great advantages. Mac is pretty flexible but unless you're an iOS developer I'd hardly consider it the only sensible choice. There's also the factor of which platform production is using. Developing in Linux can be especially beneficial when you want to reduce the variables between your dev and production. I happen to prefer Mac personally and Windows professionally, but I can certainly get my job done on a Mac if I had to.
 
Oh Windows 10 anniversary deluxe titanium director's cut edition comes with a power shell? Welcome to 2007, Microsoft.
Actually it comes with the bash shell now - just saying that windows is more then up to the task both personally and also professionally.
 
No. Just no. Stop saying that because from your statement, it's obvious that you are neither:
  1. A developer, professionally.
  2. Someone who knows a lot about the professional climate of developers.
I'm a full time software developer. Me, all my coworkers, all the guys at my last company, all the guys at every company I've interviewed with, and 70+% of the developers at conferences (web or general CS) are on MacBooks.
Mac OS is an out of box, retail operating system with a Unix terminal, that can run production third party software like the full Adobe suite, Microsoft Office, almost any IDE you want.
I've tutored courses where a PhD in computer science literally tells his students, "Get a Mac or plan on spending 2~3 hours figuring out why your build isn't working in Windows, but we will not wait for you."
I've had to deal with people who swore up and down that anything you can do on a Mac, you can do on Windows, who destroyed their entire local repository because Ruby rvm commands some times have serious problems on a Windows machine due to the lack of a real terminal.
Oh Windows 10 anniversary deluxe titanium director's cut edition comes with a power shell? Welcome to 2007, Microsoft.
The bottom line is, if you want retail software, an easy experience (sorry Linux, and don't try to disagree with this, you can never under any circumstance swear emphatically that Linux offers out of box experience like Windows/OSX do), a Unix terminal along with being able to deploy and test on every platform, you go MacBook or you're uninformed.
Mac is the only machine, period/end of discussion, that can triple boot Linux, Windows and Mac OS with full hardware support.

That being said, I'm still disappointed in Apple's decisions with MacBook hardware. My work provided me with a 15" Pro with 512GB storage, but I want to pick up a personal machine for my own personal projects to avoid IP issues using a work computer and I literally can't buy anything. I refuse, professionally and as a consumer, to spend $1800 on a "Pro" 15" computer that has a three year old processor and integrated graphics. You think I don't need extra hardware? Well you're not me, so stop trying to tell me what I should or should not want in a computer.

The bottom line is, an $1800 (I usually get $200 off using my alumni Apple education portal or a Best Buy coupon) notebook that has integrated graphics and a three year old processor is an absolute worst buy. It's probably the most insulting value of any Apple product since they had 16GB $649 phones. It's actually more insulting than that.

iOS development is a staple of my career and one of the platforms that I most often work in and I'm seriously considering abandoning the iOS ecosystem and moving on to greener pasture.

Windows 10 now has essentially Linux shell support, as of a few months ago. Has that changed your perspective?
 
No. Just no. Stop saying that because from your statement, it's obvious that you are neither:
  1. A developer, professionally.
  2. Someone who knows a lot about the professional climate of developers.
I'm a full time software developer. Me, all my coworkers, all the guys at my last company, all the guys at every company I've interviewed with, and 70+% of the developers at conferences (web or general CS) are on MacBooks.
Mac OS is an out of box, retail operating system with a Unix terminal, that can run production third party software like the full Adobe suite, Microsoft Office, almost any IDE you want.
I've tutored courses where a PhD in computer science literally tells his students, "Get a Mac or plan on spending 2~3 hours figuring out why your build isn't working in Windows, but we will not wait for you."
I've had to deal with people who swore up and down that anything you can do on a Mac, you can do on Windows, who destroyed their entire local repository because Ruby rvm commands some times have serious problems on a Windows machine due to the lack of a real terminal.
Oh Windows 10 anniversary deluxe titanium director's cut edition comes with a power shell? Welcome to 2007, Microsoft.
The bottom line is, if you want retail software, an easy experience (sorry Linux, and don't try to disagree with this, you can never under any circumstance swear emphatically that Linux offers out of box experience like Windows/OSX do), a Unix terminal along with being able to deploy and test on every platform, you go MacBook or you're uninformed.
Mac is the only machine, period/end of discussion, that can triple boot Linux, Windows and Mac OS with full hardware support.

That being said, I'm still disappointed in Apple's decisions with MacBook hardware. My work provided me with a 15" Pro with 512GB storage, but I want to pick up a personal machine for my own personal projects to avoid IP issues using a work computer and I literally can't buy anything. I refuse, professionally and as a consumer, to spend $1800 on a "Pro" 15" computer that has a three year old processor and integrated graphics. You think I don't need extra hardware? Well you're not me, so stop trying to tell me what I should or should not want in a computer.

The bottom line is, an $1800 (I usually get $200 off using my alumni Apple education portal or a Best Buy coupon) notebook that has integrated graphics and a three year old processor is an absolute worst buy. It's probably the most insulting value of any Apple product since they had 16GB $649 phones. It's actually more insulting than that.

iOS development is a staple of my career and one of the platforms that I most often work in and I'm seriously considering abandoning the iOS ecosystem and moving on to greener pasture.

I am not sure what type of development you do that can only be done on a Mac. But this is not the case in the type of work I do.

I do full-stack development. To me on the backend this involves getting data from numerous data source, cleaning the data, and integrating sources. Since lately I have been doing Machine Learning, robotics, and AI the tools I use range widely. Lately it has been Hadoop, Spark, various Document DBs and SQL database. Coding is done in Java, C++, R, or Python. I can do this all on either Windows, or a UNIX system, like a Mac or Linux distro.

Front end is one on three platforms: Web, mobile, and integration with standalone business apps like Excel. For web I favor Angular, ES5 javascript, and Bootstrap. For mobile I spend most of the time in Android. And business apps are in whatever tools the app provides.

Typical backend deployments occur in larger environments. The backend server are usually running some form of RedHat with storage driven by SANs. The code usually runs on clusters of servers for performance reasons. Build/CI servers are almost always running RedHat. Again, I use both windows and Linux platforms for developing code in this environment.

Front end development works fine on both Windows, Mac, or Linux machines. As long as you have an editor you create javascript/Angular code. And tools like Typescript can be installed anywhere with npm install -g.
 
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Nice looking machine. My daugther has the XPS 15 and is a great machine. Very slim and powerful.

The thing that upsets me is that you can pop the bottom and upgrade the memory modules and SSD with off the shelf components. If Dell can do this why can't Apple?
And this is precisely why I probably won't be buying another MacBook Pro, if Apple completely eliminates the ability to do these simple user upgradeable parts.

I'd consider it disposable junk, and would not feel good putting thousands of dollars out for it.
 
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