Yes, that's how I take it, and if we interpret it this way, then what Tim Cook said is true.
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Did Tim Cook tell the truth about what Vision Pro can do? (video clip)
- Thread starter Piggie
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If an entire argument is based on a false premise, it means that the foundation upon which the argument is built is inherently flawed or incorrect. As a result, the conclusions drawn from such an argument would likely be unreliable or invalid. It leads to logical fallacies and erroneous reasoning. Even if the subsequent steps of the argument are logically consistent, they would still be based on faulty information. This can result in misleading or deceptive conclusions.
Making the ideas “cooked up” by their client base would be the best thing any company could do
Again “character” and “road maps” don’t keep the lights on and the bills paid
Again, @Piggie doesn't think they carry the same overall sentiment. He misquoted Cook and then specifically said the choice of words makes a difference:
I get you're trying to get past petty differences and show logic to all sides, but the petty difference is baked into the premise.
It has to be, otherwise this would be a 3 post thread: "Cook said it'll do what your Mac will do... Does that mean I can connect a few extra 6k displays over Thunderbolt?" "Nope, that's not what he meant." "Ah. Ok. Thanks".
I know this thread has been a trying one for most of us — so thanks for indulging my question @goonie4life9.
As has been stated before, that quote from the OP is incorrect. What Tim Cook actually said is “.. it'll do anything that your Mac or iPhone can do and more.” It’s difficult to understand how a comment that seems to clearly state a general intent (signaled by the “will” in “it will”. “It’ll“) for a future product can lead to such adamant insistence about what that yet undelivered product can or can’t do — and labeling the stated future intent “patently untrue.“ One would need a Time Machine to support that assertion.
But to address your examples of what VisionPro can’t do that a Mac can:
- Cellular: Fair enough, Apple did not demo cellular capability. However, Apple is rumored to be working on native Apple Silicon cellular capabilities for 2024 — so do you think it’s possible that will be added to VisionPro since it is based on Apple Silicon SOC?
- Ports: LMAO I think you won the internet for the funniest statement concerning VisionPro — I can’t unsee ports on a headset LOL. But seriously, what do you need ports for with VP: Monitors/keyboards/mice/trackpads/speakers? — nope, Printers? — does anyone still use wired printers?
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Can you name one successful innovation that was “cooked up“ by a company’s client base?
Personally my hope would be that what Tim said will prove to be correct in the long term.
Do you want to imagine a future (with a lighter/better headset that lasts all day) and just in case you also carry your Macbook, your iPhone, and your iPad, even your Apple watch also.
Vision Pro "COULD" replace all those devices.
You "Look" at your Apple watch on your wrist, so there is no need to actually be a physical object on your wrist.
You "Look" at your iPhone in your hand, so there is no reason to actually be holding a physical iPhone.
You "Look" at the screen on your iPad, so there is no reason to actually be holding a physical iPad.
Likewise you "Look at the screen on your MacBook so there is no reason to have a actual MacBook on your lap.
At most you may wish to carry a small portable keyboard if you plan on doing a lot of typing, as humans we appreciate the physical sensation of a actual key being pressed with a finger if you are doing a lot of typing.
So....... Given a thinner, lighter Vision Pro 5 with all day battery life, then Tim would be correct, there should be no need to own anything else, as the Vision Pro will do it all and more.
The only societal issue we need to get over is the VERY BIG one which could actually kill Vision Pro before we get there, and that is, do real normal typical consumers actually want to be strapping something to their face for multiple hours a day?
And no wanting to focus on gender as we are all individuals. As we all know, in very general terms woman are much more concerned about their looks, hair, make-up than your typical man, so an additional hurdle to overcome.
This needs to be seen as it could be the killer. Yes, millions are willing to put on a Headset to enjoy a VR "Experience" it's not the best, but the experience is so enjoyable that we put up with it for the time we are enjoying what it can do.
That's a long long long way from being fine with wearing it in normal day to day life.
Right now, I can see this flopping. Not because it's bad. It's amazing hardware, and Not because there is no interesting software, as that can be fixed and as long as Apple does not stand in the way of Devs, it will be able to do amazing things. (Apple will block some things of course, but we shall find out what in time)
It's simply that, even if it was £299 your typical consumer is not going to want to wear something this big on their face.
Once the initial Hype, Enthusiast, YouTuber, Reviewer cycle dies off, perhaps a year to 18 months after launch, it's going to be interesting to watch. There will be a "second wave" of course when the cheaper version comes out, but I feel that's going to be small blip for the reasons above.
Do you want to imagine a future (with a lighter/better headset that lasts all day) and just in case you also carry your Macbook, your iPhone, and your iPad, even your Apple watch also.
Vision Pro "COULD" replace all those devices.
You "Look" at your Apple watch on your wrist, so there is no need to actually be a physical object on your wrist.
You "Look" at your iPhone in your hand, so there is no reason to actually be holding a physical iPhone.
You "Look" at the screen on your iPad, so there is no reason to actually be holding a physical iPad.
Likewise you "Look at the screen on your MacBook so there is no reason to have a actual MacBook on your lap.
At most you may wish to carry a small portable keyboard if you plan on doing a lot of typing, as humans we appreciate the physical sensation of a actual key being pressed with a finger if you are doing a lot of typing.
So....... Given a thinner, lighter Vision Pro 5 with all day battery life, then Tim would be correct, there should be no need to own anything else, as the Vision Pro will do it all and more.
The only societal issue we need to get over is the VERY BIG one which could actually kill Vision Pro before we get there, and that is, do real normal typical consumers actually want to be strapping something to their face for multiple hours a day?
And no wanting to focus on gender as we are all individuals. As we all know, in very general terms woman are much more concerned about their looks, hair, make-up than your typical man, so an additional hurdle to overcome.
This needs to be seen as it could be the killer. Yes, millions are willing to put on a Headset to enjoy a VR "Experience" it's not the best, but the experience is so enjoyable that we put up with it for the time we are enjoying what it can do.
That's a long long long way from being fine with wearing it in normal day to day life.
Right now, I can see this flopping. Not because it's bad. It's amazing hardware, and Not because there is no interesting software, as that can be fixed and as long as Apple does not stand in the way of Devs, it will be able to do amazing things. (Apple will block some things of course, but we shall find out what in time)
It's simply that, even if it was £299 your typical consumer is not going to want to wear something this big on their face.
Once the initial Hype, Enthusiast, YouTuber, Reviewer cycle dies off, perhaps a year to 18 months after launch, it's going to be interesting to watch. There will be a "second wave" of course when the cheaper version comes out, but I feel that's going to be small blip for the reasons above.
I think if we separate ourselves from the question of whether Tim Cook lied or not, the underlying issue of "what exactly is the Vision Pro capable of doing?" is something we are all wondering, and I think has been discussed in many threads. Previous VR/AR headsets all seemed marketed for gaming and watching VR/AR content, and for specialized uses in fields such as engineering, architecture and medicine. Apple presented the VP as something you use to do everyday computing tasks -- browse the web, read books, write papers. So I'm sure wondering if it can replace my Mac and/or iPad.
Apple presents the VP as first and foremost a computing device, and the VR/AR aspects as extra frills. And I think Tim Cook, by saying "it'll do anything your Mac or iPhone can do, and more," does imply the possibility that VP can (eventually) replace our Macs and iOS devices, even if he doesn't say that part out loud. So I think we are all calculating, so if VP does X and Y, but not Z, I'll need to keep my devices A and B, but if it does do Z, then maybe I can get rid of A but keep B.
So no, I don't think Cook lied, but his statement Does give me lots to think about, and I'm glad that OP pointed it out, because I didn't really notice it when I first watched that video.
As has been pointed out, I quoted Tim Cook very slightly incorrectly, and, as someone who wishes to do all I can to be honest and genuine, I wish to correct that clearly now:
I originally showed that Tim said:
"It can do anything your Mac or iPhone can do and more"
When what he actually said was:
"It'll do anything you Mac or iPhone can do and more"
Whether that difference is important to how you understand the statement matter is up to you.
Fundamentally it's not really altering my view as a Potential Customer this tells me, that it's going to be doing what those products can do, so I won't need those products, and for me as a customer that's what's important to know this.
One device to replace those things, will be good news to me.
*** I have added the corrections to my original post for clarity ***
I originally showed that Tim said:
"It can do anything your Mac or iPhone can do and more"
When what he actually said was:
"It'll do anything you Mac or iPhone can do and more"
Whether that difference is important to how you understand the statement matter is up to you.
Fundamentally it's not really altering my view as a Potential Customer this tells me, that it's going to be doing what those products can do, so I won't need those products, and for me as a customer that's what's important to know this.
One device to replace those things, will be good news to me.
*** I have added the corrections to my original post for clarity ***
I was going to try and contribute something sensible to the thread, but y’all have made me tired after reading all that back-and-forth…
But I’ll try. Just because the VP can do all these things, doesn’t mean that you’ll want to. I can watch a movie or type an essay on my iPhone, but it will be a much better experience on my iMac. Similarly, the VP is made for ’spatial computing’, that will be its primary use.
But I’ll try. Just because the VP can do all these things, doesn’t mean that you’ll want to. I can watch a movie or type an essay on my iPhone, but it will be a much better experience on my iMac. Similarly, the VP is made for ’spatial computing’, that will be its primary use.
https://www.insider.com/guides/styl...s-demands#curology-cleanser-and-moisturizer-7
That was with a 5 second search
Companies pay tons of money to get customer reactions and thoughts on products
A company who makes things customers don’t want is called closed
I'm hoping that the Vision Pro will evolve into something that resembles a pair of swimming goggles (something Vision-AIRy), and are priced less than an iPhone SE, or even free on a cell plan. Give it a wide field of view and all day batteries and I think everyone will be wearing them everywhere they go.
Ports, we’ll for serious use it’s needed
Some files are not allowed to be kept on other peoples computers (the cloud)
Other files are just too large for this to be practical
Now add media like plugging in a card reader for a camera
Programming SBCs
Lots can be done over wireless but you will never come close to replacing a serious desktop or laptop without full connectivity
Plus you could just put the ports on that box you have to carry around that’s wired to the ski goggles
If I were Apple, if they added cellular to the device I would add it on the battery puck and have IP packets go up the cable.... Not really looking to put the cellular radio on the nerd helmet part...
At the end of the day, there was no need to Tim Cook to say what he did. The features of the Vision Pro stand on their own and don’t need to be oversold. There are myriad things the Vision Pro can’t do that a Mac or iPhone can do, just like there are myriad things a Mac can do that an iPhone can’t, and vice versa. Tim Cook alone is responsible for what he said and this thread is a perfect example of why being honest is important. Instead of talking about the actual features of the Vision Pro, people are trying to justify Tim Cook’s untrue statement. I’m sure Apple would much rather have is doing the former.
This turned into a much better thread than it was a few hours ago. Kudos to @Piggie for changing the tone.
I think this is what Apple is after, and I think this is what they mean by "spatial computing"-- it's not about altering your reality, it's about adding a 3rd dimension to how you work and all the things that can enable.
If all we did all day was use our Macs and use our Phones, we wouldn't need a second eye.
So yes, I think the goal is to wrap up a bunch of the functionality we have in other devices and provide us a fundamentally new interface to that functionality. I think it has the potential, now or in the future, to do most of that. There's a few things I think the Vision Pro won't be able to do alone, but that I think could still be done with "spatial computing" as a concept.
The piece I think AVP simply can't do because of its interface is in-person content sharing. I'm sure we'll be able to stand in front of shared content either in person or remotely, but it will require everyone to have a headset on. I think that experience will be amazing, but only if we're all in the ecosystem. I could imagine we could also share some content over AirPlay to flat screens, or even holographic screens, but that means more stuff.
Ah, I'm not too worried about this, not in the short term. Most of what this will be used for is stuff we already do alone. In that way, it's more like a Mac than an iPhone. For the parts of the day I'm working, or consuming media alone then I don't think the dive mask will be an aesthetic hindrance. Watching movies together will be marginally more weird than watching 3D movies with glasses on but you're still able to see each other.
Apple has hinted that Personas aren't limited to chits in Facetime, so I'd imagine eventually when we turn to look at someone watching a movie with us, the AVP will replace them with a 3D persona drawn without the mask. Remote conference calls will do the same, seated around a table rather than panes in a window.
What the current form factor won't really work for is walking about town taking pictures and sending texts-- iPhone stuff.
It will get better, but it will never fully go away. The current tech can't be reduced to glasses because the light shield is necessary. The best I can imagine until a new vision interface comes about is something like a Geordi VISOR. Whether that's a negative or not depends on how the fashion world embraces it-- wrap around sunglasses were cool for a while.
I don't think it's going to "flop" any more than iPad or Apple Watch did. It think it will build a following over time, but it won't be an instantaneous shift-- which is good because I don't think manufacturing could support that anyway.
I think this is what Apple is after, and I think this is what they mean by "spatial computing"-- it's not about altering your reality, it's about adding a 3rd dimension to how you work and all the things that can enable.
If all we did all day was use our Macs and use our Phones, we wouldn't need a second eye.
So yes, I think the goal is to wrap up a bunch of the functionality we have in other devices and provide us a fundamentally new interface to that functionality. I think it has the potential, now or in the future, to do most of that. There's a few things I think the Vision Pro won't be able to do alone, but that I think could still be done with "spatial computing" as a concept.
The piece I think AVP simply can't do because of its interface is in-person content sharing. I'm sure we'll be able to stand in front of shared content either in person or remotely, but it will require everyone to have a headset on. I think that experience will be amazing, but only if we're all in the ecosystem. I could imagine we could also share some content over AirPlay to flat screens, or even holographic screens, but that means more stuff.
Ah, I'm not too worried about this, not in the short term. Most of what this will be used for is stuff we already do alone. In that way, it's more like a Mac than an iPhone. For the parts of the day I'm working, or consuming media alone then I don't think the dive mask will be an aesthetic hindrance. Watching movies together will be marginally more weird than watching 3D movies with glasses on but you're still able to see each other.
Apple has hinted that Personas aren't limited to chits in Facetime, so I'd imagine eventually when we turn to look at someone watching a movie with us, the AVP will replace them with a 3D persona drawn without the mask. Remote conference calls will do the same, seated around a table rather than panes in a window.
What the current form factor won't really work for is walking about town taking pictures and sending texts-- iPhone stuff.
It will get better, but it will never fully go away. The current tech can't be reduced to glasses because the light shield is necessary. The best I can imagine until a new vision interface comes about is something like a Geordi VISOR. Whether that's a negative or not depends on how the fashion world embraces it-- wrap around sunglasses were cool for a while.
I don't think it's going to "flop" any more than iPad or Apple Watch did. It think it will build a following over time, but it won't be an instantaneous shift-- which is good because I don't think manufacturing could support that anyway.
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How does Facetime work with a device attached to (and incapable of seeing) your face?
It was part of the presentation... you scan yourself and then Vision Pro will create a 'lifelike' avatar to replace you on calls or on the front facing display. The Inward-facing IR cameras detect what your face is doing and replicates that with regards to the avatar. Basically it creates a quick deepfake of you that mimics what you are doing since your face is occluded in part by the device...