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Director Rian Johnson: Apple Doesn't Let Bad Guys Use iPhones on Camera in Movies

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In an interview with Vanity Fair today, Rian Johnson, who directed the popular movie "Knives Out," shared an interesting tidbit about iPhone product placement deals for films. Apple, he says, allows iPhones to be used in movies, but bad guys aren't allowed to have iPhones on camera.

The relevant passage starts at 2:50 into the video​

Also another funny thing, I don't know if I should say this or not... Not cause it's like lascivious or something, but because it's going to screw me on the next mystery movie that I write, but forget it, I'll say it. It's very interesting.

Apple... they let you use iPhones in movies but -- and this is very pivotal if you're ever watching a mystery movie - bad guys cannot have iPhones on camera.

So oh nooooooo, every single filmmaker that has a bad guy in their movie that's supposed to be a secret wants to murder me right now.
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Apple is known for having strict rules about how devices are used, portrayed, and photographed. As part of its guidelines for using Apple trademarks and copyrights, for example, Apple says that Apple products should only be shown "in the best light, in a manner or context that reflects favorably on the Apple products and on Apple Inc."

As noted by our forum members, people have in the past pointed out that it's the good guys that use Apple products in TV shows in movies. When "24" was on the air, Wired wrote about a fan theory that the good guys use Macs while the bad guys use PCs, which turned out to be accurate.

Given this tidbit from Johnson, who is a well-respected director, many people may be watching movies with a much keener eye on the devices that actors and actresses are using to suss out hidden details.

Article Link: Director Rian Johnson: Apple Doesn't Let Bad Guys Use iPhones on Camera in Movies
 
Article Link
https://www.macrumors.com/2020/02/26/rian-johnson-apple-bad-guys-no-iphones/
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Skeith said:
I see plenty of Apple products on House of Cards though.
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That's kind of an interesting distinction to think about. I'm sure the argument went something like the characters are flawed rather than bad but I would have loved to be a fly on the wall for that.
 
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matty.p said:
Wasn’t this already known? It was a running joke that bad guys use android and good guys always have iPhones or that the bad guys have PCs and the good guys have Macs in the days before iPhones.

edit: Yeah here’s an article from 2003 pointing it out. http://www.macobserver.com/tmo/article/Roger_Ebert_Good_Guys_Always_Use_Macs

and one from 2002 pointing it out from 24 which is what I was thinking of. https://www.wired.com/2002/05/24s-good-guys-do-use-macs/
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Yeah, I've seen similar speculation about it, but I haven't seen a director outright confirm that's Apple's policy.

Edit: I've updated the article to add your examples too.
 
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arvinsim said:
The problem with this policy is that the criterion used to determine who the good guys and the bad guys are so subjective.
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Not really a problem. Apple can decide on a case by case basis whether it wants a particular character to use its product. THey’ll know it when they see it. It’s not like a law where some jury has to figure out if apple chose correctly.
 
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bwinter88 said:
That's kind of an interesting distinction to think about. I'm sure the argument went something like the characters are flawed rather than bad but I would have loved to be a fly on the wall for that.
Click to expand...

I suspect there's a decent amount of wiggle room with what constitutes a bad guy and a lot of gray area too.
 
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From a legal point of view, I don't understand how that works. In a fictional work, why isn't the filmmaker free to show any product they want however they want? Sure, a company can put conditions before paying for product placement, but here it sounds like Apple can forbid their product from being shown at all. Is that right?
 
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Fowl said:
From a legal point of view, I don't understand how that works. In a fictional work, why isn't the filmmaker free to show any product they want however they want? Sure, a company can put conditions before paying for product placement, but here it sounds like Apple can forbid their product from being shown at all. Is that right?
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It’s arguable. Trademark laws apply. It may be fair use, and there are numerous other theories that may protect the filmmaker. But most filmmakers don’t want to fight about it.
rodriqueslaw.com

How To Use Brands And Products In Film | Rodriques Law

Trademark law helps consumers in identifying and differentiating between brands and to protect trademark owner’s goodwill and reputation.
rodriqueslaw.com rodriqueslaw.com
 
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Fowl said:
From a legal point of view, I don't understand how that works. In a fictional work, why isn't the filmmaker free to show any product they want however they want? Sure, a company can put conditions before paying for product placement, but here it sounds like Apple can forbid their product from being shown at all. Is that right?
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I think this just works in case Apple is contributing to the production cost. Because legally they can show it being used by who they want.
 
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What he’s saying is that Apple doesn’t do product placement with “bad guys” or people doing bad things. Many companies do not allow their branding to be associated with negative images. Tecate does not allow their brand to be used in a scene where an alcoholic father taunts a child.

There may be plenty of people using iPhones in House of Cards, but I doubt any of them are showing off Apple’s UI or logos.
 
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That video is a great scene breakdown, very fun and informative on Rian’s part. The iPhone detail is probably the least interesting thing. I’ll pick up the UHD soon.
 
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All this ‘won’t allow’ policy baffles me. What the hell has it to do with any company what product is put in a movie? We can’t get away from the fact that we’re a product driven society. It’s like when an actor uses a fake google search engin. Just use the real thing. Something really off in that industry.
 
Fowl said:
From a legal point of view, I don't understand how that works. In a fictional work, why isn't the filmmaker free to show any product they want however they want? Sure, a company can put conditions before paying for product placement, but here it sounds like Apple can forbid their product from being shown at all. Is that right?
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My suspicion is that it’s about paid product placement. Ever since ET, the filmmakers see product use in a movie as a kind of commercial, and they go to the company and say, “Will you pay us to use your product in a movie?” I can’t see Apple having any say at all, except to the extent they’re refusing to pay for anything but good guys using iPhones. And the movie people think this means they’ve got no choice.

That’s my guess, because otherwise I can’t really see Apple having any control whatsoever over this kind of thing.
 
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