Well, since not only hardware but also software is considered "a product", they definitely did release a faulty one. And it has some tradition to the latest apple releases. Just think about the introduction of the retina macbook in 2012...
It should be embarrassing for a company like apple to announce the "best display in the industry" and then tell customers that ghosting is normal for IPS panels.
After those display issues and all the other problems with the rMBP one should assume that apple will do everything to get the next product 100% right - but obviously (as we see now) they don't really care.
It's a shame...
LG produced those initial displays. Not Apple. If you had an issue, Apple gladly replaced them no questions asked (I've got two of them and had my LG switched out in 22 hours with a Sammy, no issues since.).
The Retina to me is an upgrade in specifications and aesthetics but a downgrade in future-proofing and longevity. The VERY moment, you pass the memory requirements of a Retina, you've officially outlived the machine because there's nothing you can do about it. At least with a Classic you can upgrade the ram.
You can't put ANY more RAM in a classic than you can an rMBP. Both only configure up to 16GB, and that's standard on the 15" with double the PCIe SSD capacity, faster processor and discreet graphics to go along with the new iGPU from Intel.
The classic is relegated to a now year old processor, year old iGPU and impossible to install PCIe SSD or WiFi AC or dual ThunderBolt or HDMI...or the best display on the market in a laptop...best I've owned in 30 years!
I also ordered the 13" and it was yellowish.. I returned it..
The guy at the apple store told me to look for a Mid 2012 MacBookPro9,1 2.3ghz 15" where you can change the HD and ram .. he said those machines are much better value than current Retina....
Soo i think I will search for a used 2012 pre retina model... any thoughts?
He was full of it. Try another rMBP. I'd try to get the latest....the newer iGPU is a nice update, as is the battery savings from Haswell...and a decrease in size and weight (small, but if you're buying into a 13", definitely relevant)
Sleep problems with Mavericks on all models - no fix yet
wifi/trackpad issues
Gmail
When you release an OS with a mail app that doesn't work with gmail, the largest email service, its a clear sign it wasn't even tested.
Its great we are getting the update, but it should never have been broken. Every oem releases fixes and updates, its nothing special. Apple prides itself on 'it just works' and should be held to a higher standard.
Every OEM releases fixes? Like it took M/S to update 8 to 8.1? Apple's ON TOP of their patches. I never had issues with Gmail as others did...trackpad has been addressed, and their latest OS was offered as a free upgrade. It's BRAND new! it's NOT broken...Have you ANY idea how much code is written and re-written for a modern OS? 15-20GB of OS is literally dozens, if not hundreds of millions of lines of code. That the damn things actually boot to the desktop seems magical if you understand this stuff! Beta testing is closed...there are a finite amount of folks working on it....and IMO, they've released the MOST stable release in a LONG time. Small issues, like Gmail have been addressed. 10.1 and 10.2 are being worked on simultaneously. At least you didn't have to pay $119 to upgrade to 10.9 as an OSx user...unlike Window's users going from 7-->8!
Yep, and that is a false hope / web hype perception, not what many of us long time professional users set our selves up for. I have been using Mac's professionally since 1992 and not a *single* product has been without hiccups, major or minor.
Every Mc'Novice has blurted out how well Mavericks has been working for them and how Apple got it right with revision 10.9.0 but in the real world, that is just not the case.
For example, my very well maintained and high end Mac Pro is seeing all kinds of odds things from drives that cause boot hangups, slow window switching and odd sleep behavior. Not hardware related, all OS related. Several people complained of their 13"s being laggy when launching disk utility. Well guess what, my uber capable GTX 680 GPU in my Mac Pro does *exactly* the same thing!
With the exception of some of the early serial numbers of the 13" having image retention prone screens, nothing has been hardware related, all OSX. All machines respond differently to early OS bugs, this has been the way it has been since I was using OS 8. So when web-fabulists starting calling foul on new hardware when the OS is bugging it out, well that is the problem with the web, people not understanding *why* something is happening so they blame it on the new hardware.
Precisely...and a capable professional, or at least a 'smart' professional that relies on their systems to make the mortgage payment aren't upgrading to a brand new OS the day of release. They'll be smart, hold off til the first .x or .2x releases are in the wild.
Nothing at ALL wrong with the hardware...Apple is definitely pushing the limit of hardware and technology with displays, storage, graphic processing, incredible and functional/efficient trackpad multi-gesturing, etc. There are going to be bumps in the road.
Keep a stable version of the last OS on your MP (we still have a Snow Leopard partition on our 2010 MacPro)----and you're good to go!
Not holding my breath, mind your own business
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Here is the big but. To those who ask others to be huh "patient". Patients die in the hospital waiting rooms FYI. Anyhow
..
If my projects need to be done on time I can NOT afford to wait on software updates and fixes because it renders my hardware completely unusable is infinitely unacceptable. Returning it was my only solution because losing money on a project and wasting precious time isn't in my business model nor motto for clients / labels etc
The money saved I can find instant solutions and carry on with important work. If I were just a regular consumer and I can't play a game or click open a movie, I would have all the patience in the world because I'd probably have NOTHING else better to do with myself.
But even then, I'd go out for a walk and visit a friend or two for tea, but they are most likely glued to their fones anyways so I just visit the animals in the park HAH!
I think they were talking about having patience, and no...patience won't kill you like some 'patients' that die in the 'waiting room'
I'm not sure where you're going with this....the rMBP does the exact opposite of 'waste time'. It's fast as hell!
I'm curious, what are these 'projects' that you do that aren't being handled by the rMBP?
I use many machines to get many different kinds of work done, so when I allocate a good number of small jobs to one machine, that isn't even standing up to the test, it's out of the production line and "give me my money back" time. My one and only main machine is the 17" MBP late 2011, my early 2006 17MBP is now just for blogging and emails, poor thing, well burning CDs it is still pretty zippy with that, for demos and such. My iMAC is for watching movies and the kids to play educational games together, I have many, many nieces, nephews and god-kids and their friends, so that is in the lego room for them.
I have had many 15" retina MB's and have since either returned them or sold them, or even gifted a few to my nephews going into med-school. They just didn't stand up to anything light that I need them to do, while I did all the heavy work loads on the 17"MBP of late 2011 which I maxed out completely. So when machines can't even stand up to the test with 20+ small tasks, what is a girl to do? She can't twiddle her thumbs and wait around.
Nope not I.
Interesting....I've got the EXACT same 17" as you, in fact a pair of 2011s. An early 2.2/16GB/500GB Sam 840ssd and the late 2011 2.5/16GB/500+500 Sammy 840pro SSDs (one in the Op bay). Both of our 2012 rMBPs run absolute CIRCLES around my 17s!!! And it kills me! I've been a 17" 'only' owner for 7 years, didn't wanna even try the 15". I was pissed when Apple dropped the 17 (but I'm not convinced they have...especially after seeing what they've done with the Mac Pro...I think a 4k 17" workstation may be on the horizon. Not as a money maker...but as a 'unique' and creative portable workstation). That said, I bought my wife the first 15" rMBP and couldn't put it down. Especially being able to still use 1920x1200 and STILL read the pin sharp text, see the details, edit 1080p motion in window and canvas with ALL pixels present...while the rest of the UI maintains the 'pixel doubling' of the OS so I can make out, easily target and manipulate the system the same way I was with my 17". It's just lighter! We're using Smoke, Cinema 4d, After Effects, PhotoShop, FCP 7 and X as well as Premier, Encore, Audition and Pro Tools. On my 2012 2.7/16/768 rMBP, I've got a 250GB Windows partition and 500GB for OSX, two Thunderbolt RAID arrays and twin Eizo monitors for color correction.
Between transcoding, finalizing, and conversion of different audio and video formats...my year old rMBP lays WASTE to my 2011 17" MBPs, the same you're saying the opposite about. I'm perplexed!
The most demanding task I find is using After Effects for intense work and exceeding frames in relation to RAM. But this is evident in ANY rig. Put 512, 1028GB of RAM in a multi core system....doesn't matter. If you have enough frames, AE will eat EVERY piece of RAM it can....and this is a good thing! It helps as well that OSX is so damn good at RAM allocation, preservation and efficiency. Whether you've got a 4GB rig or 64 in your Pro, OSx will utilize what it needs, when it needs it....and with today's new rMBP and Mac Pro releases with upwards of 1GB/s read/write speeds, paging will become a thing of the past. Amazingly noticeable on a spinning disc, but less and less so with fast solid state storage. As you're aware....like you said, you run a pair of SSDs in RAID internally...you're seeing the speed differences as those read/write numbers climb. PCIe storage is the next step in that evolution. NO one else is doing this in the industry....and what Apple's doing with their new Mac Pro, Quad, 6 and 12 core Xeon Procs with Workstation Dual AMD Firepro cards (and the computational power/RAM on board the GPUs)....the computing power from these little cylinders is going to be amazing. Something we've never seen come out of such a small package. ⅛ the size of the current Mac Pro. One Fan. Quiet and user accessible parts....Thunderbolt 2 and 6 in/outs, HDMI, USB3, and the ability to drive two or three 4k displays simultaneously---VERY exciting time to be 'patient' with Apple. It would be cool if other companies started unique and interesting ways....as Apple has done, to re-invent the way we use our computers moving forward. It's becoming more and more obvious that the desktop is going to be a relic sooner than later. Reserved for extreme gamers and enthusiasts...or workstations where the 'power' is necessary 'locally' to manipulate CAD or Motion.
That said...the current rMBP is damn near as fast as ANY Mac Pro ever made, with the exception of the latest 12 core/dual six core---or 6 core procs. Pretty amazing in a 4 pound package, don't ya think?
I'm just having a hard time, vpro, understanding the 'tasks' you're unable to perform with the 2012 or current 2013 rMBPs? Or for that matter all the other $3,000 you've gifted away?
Doesn't sound to me like you've saved a lot of money up not wanting the latest and greatest....didn't you just say you bought them, then brought them back and/or gifted them because they weren't up to snuff?
Your quote below goes against EVERY benchmark measured, review written and experience experienced on these new rMBPs!!!! Not just the fact that we're now two generations newer in the silicon department, but REAL iGPUs now, double the CPU performance since then, probably quadruple (if not more) in the discrete GPU department....and even though you can still put your own RAM in there, you can't fit any more than the rMPB can be configured with. Nor can you add PCIe SSD storage, ThunderBolt 2-----and that PCMICA slot, trying to get an actual 'working' USB3 peripheral---Good. Luck! I bought three from OWC before giving up and sticking with ThunderBolt. Cool thing is...with the new ones, you get twin T/B ports, two USB 3 ports, HDMI and the SD card reader. Pretty nice additions.
If, for some reason...you ended up with a 'dud'....which Can Happen, I'll be the first to admit---there isn't a better post purchase and support company on earth to deal with. Apple's as good as it gets when it comes to taking care of problems and/or faults. Typically with a replacement on the spot!
Well I'm the one with a lot of money saved up because of not keeping the so called "latest / greatest" while getting even more work done still on my late 2011 17"MBP. When the so called "latest & greatest" fans rev up and roar just simply opening up Photo Booth app and crashing the entire computer along with HARD FREEZING when ever it wants simply clicking on 2 min videos of comedy skits and running blazing hot - nearly burning my finger tip off to the touch. While my late maxed 17" MBP is doing her heavy tasks cool to the touch and not a single fan noise, do you think I'm not going to go, oh wow, it is a great reason to save money and return all these "so called latest & greatest" NOW before it is too late.
I just have no tolerance and no patience for a piece of "latest & greatest" which costs $3400+ dollars to not properly finish any load of tasks I throw at it right out of the box. This was never the case with the late great 17" MBPs in my humble experience, they just started working right away smooth as silk since day one.
Times have changed, values are NOW TOTALLY skewed and I'm just voicing a perspective which many share, and that is a no tolerance to anything less than perfect machine from this shiny red fruity company if we paid well over 3000 dollars for a hunk of metal.
Oh, when will they learn?
As a 43 year old, I've grown up with computers...like many here, I had the IIe and Com 64 in the early days----2/3/486 (w/Turbo!), Pentium 2s, 3s, and 4s, Athlons and core i Procs....Windows for 25 years (not always by choice) but the last 10, Macs at home and for our business. There is NOTHING on the market that competes with the 15" rMBP. Absolutely
Nothing!. In my experience of usage and ownership of many dozens of computers, the rMBP is the one computer I can honestly say in 30 years of ownership----and a year of owning it itself, is the BEST damn computer I've ever owned/used, or had the pleasure and means to own. It's paid for itself many times over---which in my opinion is the definition of 'excellent'.
I kinda think you've either A) Never used an rMBP for any length of time or B) received, pardon the pun....a Bad Apple. There's no two ways about it. Again, whether objective/pure numbers and benchmarks or subjective user experience, ask ANY rMBP owner a year later about their laptop and I'd bet 97 or 98 out of 100 will say the same....Best Damn Computer I've EVER Owned!
J
