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do all apple computers have issues?
- Thread starter BornToMac
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Being a dane (or if I was swede, german or any other around countryman around these parts) we have to call Ireland. Not much of a difference really. We get to talk to people that has no idea about our consumer laws, no skills whatsoever, not to mention that quite a few people for whom english is their second or third language have a hard time explaining technical stuff in english.
I don't "hate" a computer firm. The mere notion is ridiculous. And such a statement could only come from someone quite a bit blinded.
Further, it's not a question of liking Apple or not, it's a question of hardware quality. I don't hate IKEA either, just becuse most of what they sell is crap. But then again, you don't pay a premium for their crap. And that is basically what it boils down to: Why pay a premium for hardware that isn't much better (quality wise) than the cheapest crap from a supermarket, and with even less support?
As I explained in my former post, and again in this post, you can't do that with Apple around here. Even in the US, some people aren't living in close proximity to an Apple store, and as the OP has shown, talking to a "genius" is far from a guarantee of getting good service.
Haha, "been great to me" I think that says it all about your relationship. But count yourself lucky.
LOL, again with your "hatred". What's with that? It seems like you have such a geeky relationship with your favourite company, that you have a personal problem with handling real world problems that Apple have with their hardware.
Apples and oranges. You're whining that people are whining, and put it all in one basket. There's a huge difference between making people aware that Apple's hardware is far from what it used to be, and complaining that Apple doesn't come out with this or that new product. Quite a difference, really.
Besides, there might be a reason for this whining: Crappy hardware quality, way overdue updates on hardware, way overdue pro software updates and what else Apple seems to have shifted focus from in order to sell some more faulty, crippled and under-featured iPhones and Touch'es.
After reading perhaps hundreds of posts of those who have had either none or fewproblems and those who seem to have constant issues, one thing becomes obvious
Karma is a reality
Oh, yes, as a parallel, only idjits get's mugged, fired, run down, or simply get bad hardware or crappy support from a company. "They must deserve it".
Any other great alternate realities you'd like to share?
I'm just guessing, but I bet you've been "mugged, fired, run down, or simply get bad hardware or crappy support from a company." I think I've made my point.
Your guess would be wrong. I thought everyone knew what a parallel was – I guess I could have used "analogy" instead, but I fear your guess would have been the exact same stupid one.
Your point, when speaking of karma, is that bad things _only_ happen to bad people. If you cannot see how ridiculous and far out such a claim is, it's no wonder you think that you have made your point.
Karma isn't always big things, and that's a simplistic explanation of karma. It could just be something smaller, like if you look hard enough for a problem you'll probably find one.
3 things i have to say:
1) Fallacy of Post Hoc, Ergo Propter Hoc (Association is Causation)
2) Fallacy of Composition
3) Fallacy of Ignoring Secondary Effects
That said, I don't think it truly applies to this discussion except #2.
P.S. Bring in #1 & #3 if you want.
1) Fallacy of Post Hoc, Ergo Propter Hoc (Association is Causation)
2) Fallacy of Composition
3) Fallacy of Ignoring Secondary Effects
That said, I don't think it truly applies to this discussion except #2.
P.S. Bring in #1 & #3 if you want.
I know. But that interpretation really doesn't work here, does it, now?
A malfunctioning computer, screen problems, RAM ports not working, sudden shutdown syndrome, faulty mainboard, faulty HDD, and so on and so forth, is hardly something that can be said to only exist because people went looking for them.
It's true what you say in isolation, but it doesn't really explain anything with regards to this. And it certainly doesn't play into anything what cohiba said.
I'll explain my point clearly for you. Everything happens for a reason. Some people slip and break their leg then once out of a cast slip and break their neck. Some people blame everyone else for their problems. Some people are grateful for what they have. I agree with a line from the movie Fight Club which goes something like "the more things you own, the more things own you." There is a price to be paid dealing with things, especially technology, and it's not just money. Mostly it's time which is more valuable. Time learning how to use. Time dealing with customer support. Time driving back and forth to stores. The difference between me and you is clear. When I have a problem, I solve it or deal with the failure. When you have a problem, you say stupid, idjit, ridiculous, blame, vent and from your history of posts don't really ever deal with your failures. Now, I know this will not sink in to you but perhaps others can put your future posts in perspective.
3 things i have to say:
1) Fallacy of Post Hoc, Ergo Propter Hoc (Association is Causation)
2) Fallacy of Composition
3) Fallacy of Ignoring Secondary Effects
That said, I don't think it truly applies to this discussion except #2.
P.S. Bring in #1 & #3 if you want.
Actually, I even disagree with number two. The only people who have invoked number two, are the people saying that their computer is fine, and therefore Apples hardware must be great. But a little research will show otherwise.
And who goes out to research these things? Mostly people that already have problems, to check if they're alone. Just like the OP.
Well not everyone has big problems with their Apple laptops, it's just not reasonable. I can say I have had none of the problems you mentioned, or any other major problems with any Apple laptop I've owned.
I'm not sure if this is any help to the OP, but my history with consumer-level Macs has been up and down...
-Macintosh Performa 430: no problems (now retired)
-iMac DV 400: no problems (still in daily use)
-iBook G3 600: two logic board failures, three broken reed switch cables (dead)
-iBook G4 1 Ghz: one logic board failure, revived with the shim method (still in limited use)
-20-inch Alu iMac: great computer, but has the screen gradient issue
-Macintosh Performa 430: no problems (now retired)
-iMac DV 400: no problems (still in daily use)
-iBook G3 600: two logic board failures, three broken reed switch cables (dead)
-iBook G4 1 Ghz: one logic board failure, revived with the shim method (still in limited use)
-20-inch Alu iMac: great computer, but has the screen gradient issue
Hey guys,
I have been looking at making the switch to Apple from Pc for over a year. I have spent everyday since MacExpo 07 on the Macrumors forums, watching for leopard release news, then mbp updates (santa rosa, penryn, etc), waiting until I had the means to buy one of these machines. Finally, I couldn't take it anymore and I bought a mbp 2.4ghz nvidia 8600 w/256ram from the online apple store. I received it last week and have already had to call tech support twice, go to the genius bar twice, archive and install, and erase and install, and now I am waiting for my shipping labels so that I can send my machine off to be exchanged for another one. My new MBP would not recognize my hard drive at first, and now the screen goes gray and requires a restart after waking from sleep mode. On top of that, the guy at the Genius Bar had no idea what to do, treated me like an idiot and was very rude. I am new to apple but I am not a computer noob for the love of god! I want to know if any of you have had this many issues with your machines / apple.
Just an observation, and I'm not sure what it means, but this isn't the first newbie to Mac to show up complaining on the board, with a user name like "BorntoMac." Again, not sure what it means, but if you just started with Macs after X number of years on PCs, how do you know you were borntomac? Another guy who was on here complaining was MOSX, who started with that name early on when he joined after switching to Macs. Maybe you should pick a less pretentious name (maybe pretentious isn't the right word here), and you'll have a better experience with Mac??
I'm just sayin'...
So far, so good.
But in the next section, it becomes really ridiculous, as each of your claims should be lead back to the discussion at hand. Let's see how that works for you:
Sure, a faulty mainboard, that when received is faulty, or any other of the hardware problems are surely a matter of "user error".
Yes, a non-working computer being repaired for the umpteenth time at some repair center in Holland is surely something to be grateful for.
You agree!? Wow, that's weird, you come across as an Apple apologist, and since apple is a corporation, how does that tie in with that quote?
Further, my computer is a tool, irst and foremost. I don't know about your computer, but without a (working) computer I can use, all sorts of problems pop up. One of these having to stay in an office, not actually being able to edit on the go. I guess, I should just "count my blessings" each and every time some purchased hardware used for work breaks down?
Yes, but without technology, I'm hardly competitive in a digital environment, where I have to produce something because that is what I get paid for, if I cannot deliver because of hardware malfunctioning. And let me tell, having to go live in 15 minutes, and you cannot edit your piece because your hardware doesn't work, is a bitch. And in no reality I know, is not being able to deliver better than actually delivering.
Hmm, I think of it as an investment. Hence m UBuntu install. It's an investment giving me more choice in hardware at a later date, saving me time, when I don't have to have Apple's laptops send it for repair constantly.
Yes, and looking back, I have spent way mor time than should be necessary on those things when it comes to Apple.
Excuse me? But when some idjit begins to argue that bad things only happen to bad people, it simply is ridiculous.
Further, you're really missing something, and you're making a strawman argument:
The MBP I have now actually works. Do you think that I lived through 2 years of constant exchanges, repairs and crappy customer sevice by bitching on the net? Do you think I didn't have a computer meanwhile? I did. But every time I got one back, supposedly fixed, I reinstalled my stuff, and set it up, and when the problem showed up, Apple had me reinstalling and reinstalling, jumping through hoops and so on.
No, the difference between you and me, is that I don't do strawmen, nor am I an Apple-apostle. I'm a realist, who have chosen not to waste so much energy on crappy hardware anymore. And fortunately, with decent audio editors on linux, Hackintoshes, and good hardware from other companies, I won't have to.
The only thing your post put in perspective is how you will do anything to defend your favorite company. Even claiming that bad things only happen to bad people, and that people have hardware problems, because they don't "do anything about it".
Until later [lifts glass]
Noone is claiming that "everyone" is having those problems. We're talking rates here.
Besides, if I was claiming "everyone" was having those problems, I wouldn't be able to state (as I have), that problems are of course amplified on any forum. And that even while it is so, one shouldn't disregard it, as Apple has indeed had numerous recalls and admitted design flaws sudden shutdown syndrome, faulty chargers, and logic board issues for example.
Apple is my favorite company and I admire Steve Jobs. Watch his Stanford speech on youtube. He's grateful for what he has which includes problems such as getting kicked out of Apple and having pancreatic cancer. The first resulted in NEXT without which we would have no OS X. The second taught him the value of the time he has left. Apple apologist, me? I don't think so. More like a realist. Sh#t happens. Deal with it. If Apple doesn't suit you then move on and quit whining in Mac forums cuz boo hoo whoa is me Apple sucks gets old. Or else you could answer OP questions directly like jacobluecke did. Now before you point out how I didn't answer his question directly I'll admit it. My posts were off topic and I apologize.
My answer to the OP is this: Yes, all apple computers have issues. Nothing is perfect. Most issues are minimal and easily resolved. Others are not and need to be escalated. Personally, I have had multiple apples and the only hardware I have had to replace has been a CPU fan on a Powermac G4. It worked even without the fan but would freeze with heavy use or hot weather. The worst software problem I have had needed prefs cleared. My wife has begun having intermittent wireless dropouts on her iMac in the last day and it is annoying but nothing catastrophic. I have never had to reinstall OS X even on machines with multiple upgrades. Your problems are rare. The appearance that all apples have similar problems comes from being on a mac forum that attracts problem posts and those who like to vent.
My answer to the OP is this: Yes, all apple computers have issues. Nothing is perfect. Most issues are minimal and easily resolved. Others are not and need to be escalated. Personally, I have had multiple apples and the only hardware I have had to replace has been a CPU fan on a Powermac G4. It worked even without the fan but would freeze with heavy use or hot weather. The worst software problem I have had needed prefs cleared. My wife has begun having intermittent wireless dropouts on her iMac in the last day and it is annoying but nothing catastrophic. I have never had to reinstall OS X even on machines with multiple upgrades. Your problems are rare. The appearance that all apples have similar problems comes from being on a mac forum that attracts problem posts and those who like to vent.
Born to Mac is the name of a Too Short album from a long time ago, do your homework. Just because I recently purchased my first mac, doesn't mean I am a complete idiot. There is a difference between a hardware problem (computer crashing) and not knowing how to navigate the finder. The only thing I hate about Macs are the mac users who have had a mac for a couple of years and who think that they are so much better then someone who just switched... Especially when you are a newbie to the forums as well, and have written in w/ some of your own issues (keyboard sticky keys, etc.) Just looking for answers so get off of your high horse, you are acting like a kid.
I am just sayin...
I believe you, but I'm curious...where'd you get those stats? I'd like to see where the other ones fall
I found it on consumer reports Under laptop Repair History Wish i could picture the page and paste it. (won't let me it does say)
Man its gone Up so much since i last checked it... From 10% to 23% Now Apple is the worst for Reliability by 1-2% among other manf.
Three macs, two problems, one replacement
Well, just for the statistics:
Got an iMac G5 20'' (first gen).
Failed screen, replaced.
Failed HD, replaced.
Failed motherboard, replaced, DOA, replaced.
Failed HD, again, replaced.
Failed power supply (sudden shutdown).
At this point (after 2.5yrs, with applecare) they caved in and sent me an Intel iMac.
No issues on this one.
Morale; bad quality but at least I got a new pc for free after almost 3yrs (about the time I would have BOUGHT one).
Powerbook G4; "only" DC board and battery recall.
I feel lucky....
EDIT:
In the office I have a 6yrs DELL. Runs perfect..... (under linux, of course!). I wish I could have OSX there!
Well, just for the statistics:
Got an iMac G5 20'' (first gen).
Failed screen, replaced.
Failed HD, replaced.
Failed motherboard, replaced, DOA, replaced.
Failed HD, again, replaced.
Failed power supply (sudden shutdown).
At this point (after 2.5yrs, with applecare) they caved in and sent me an Intel iMac.
No issues on this one.
Morale; bad quality but at least I got a new pc for free after almost 3yrs (about the time I would have BOUGHT one).
Powerbook G4; "only" DC board and battery recall.
I feel lucky....
EDIT:
In the office I have a 6yrs DELL. Runs perfect..... (under linux, of course!). I wish I could have OSX there!
Hey guys,
I have been looking at making the switch to Apple from Pc for over a year. I have spent everyday since MacExpo 07 on the Macrumors forums, watching for leopard release news, then mbp updates (santa rosa, penryn, etc), waiting until I had the means to buy one of these machines. Finally, I couldn't take it anymore and I bought a mbp 2.4ghz nvidia 8600 w/256ram from the online apple store. I received it last week and have already had to call tech support twice, go to the genius bar twice, archive and install, and erase and install, and now I am waiting for my shipping labels so that I can send my machine off to be exchanged for another one. My new MBP would not recognize my hard drive at first, and now the screen goes gray and requires a restart after waking from sleep mode. On top of that, the guy at the Genius Bar had no idea what to do, treated me like an idiot and was very rude. I am new to apple but I am not a computer noob for the love of god! I want to know if any of you have had this many issues with your machines / apple.
My 2.4Ghz MBP has been perfect since I got it in early July.
Count me as another Macbook user who is happy, no hardware or software issues at all, other than the bugs in Leopard, that ANY software update will have (compatibility issues with 3rd party apps, for the most part).
Heck, even the Hackintosh runs great, with no need to restart unless doing upgrades. That, to me, says a LOT about OS/X Tiger. I prefer Tiger over Leopard, personally.
This forum isn't the place to gauge "real world" user experience, hardware wise, as most Apple consumers don't even know this place exists, as they have no need to. Their machines "just work" as they're supposed to. 'Nuff Said.
Heck, even the Hackintosh runs great, with no need to restart unless doing upgrades. That, to me, says a LOT about OS/X Tiger. I prefer Tiger over Leopard, personally.
This forum isn't the place to gauge "real world" user experience, hardware wise, as most Apple consumers don't even know this place exists, as they have no need to. Their machines "just work" as they're supposed to. 'Nuff Said.