Do the 2016 *Refurbished* MacBooks (12" and 13.3") come with 2nd generation keyboards?

[Saturn007]

Was wondering about this...

On the Apple website, the 2016 refurbished 13.3" MacBook Pros are shown with what looks like the newer keyboard! They have the restored symbols on the option and control keys!

Alas, there are no photos of the 2016 refurbished 12" MacBook that show the keyboards.

In any event, has anyone recently bought a refurbished 2016 MacBook or MacBook Pro and received the updated 2nd gen. butterfly keyboard?

 

[lambertjohn]

Was wondering about this...

On the Apple website, the 2016 refurbished 13.3" MacBook Pros are shown with what looks like the newer keyboard! They have the restored symbols on the option and control keys!

Alas, there are no photos of the 2016 refurbished 12" MacBook that show the keyboards.

In any event, has anyone recently bought a refurbished 2016 MacBook or MacBook Pro and received the updated 2nd gen. butterfly keyboard?

I'm wondering the same thing. Going by the pictures, it looks like they have indeed upgraded the keyboards. But we probably need to hear from an actual owner to verify.

 

[wgr73]

I just purchased a refurb 2016...does NOT come with new 17 keys (option and Control icons are old style).

I was hoping that going thru the refurb process the keys are better. Mine seem to be ok now after some use.

 

[lambertjohn]

we need another computer around the house, so I may purchase a 13" refurb and see what shows up. Will report back if I do.

 

[Saturn007]

wgr, I assume you bought a MacBook and not a MacBook Pro. So, no extra symbols on the control and option keys?! Just blank... too bad.

john, it'd be great if you do and report back!

It would make it a better deal getting a refurb from Apple than a "new" 2016 from, say, Best Buy, if Apple's MBP came with the upgraded keyboard! It'd also be a tacit admission on Apple's part that the 2nd generation is better, more reliable, and a fix for whatever ailed the 1st generation!

 

[wgr73]

wgr, I assume you bought a MacBook and not a MacBook Pro. So, no extra symbols on the control and option keys?! Just blank... too bad.

john, it'd be great if you do and report back!

It would make it a better deal getting a refurb from Apple than a "new" 2016 from, say, Best Buy, if Apple's MBP came with the upgraded keyboard! It'd also be a tacit admission on Apple's part that the 2nd generation is better, more reliable, and a fix for whatever ailed the 1st generation!

13.3" Late 2016 MBP is what I got. Their site is showing incorrect keyboards for the MBP, I'd take that for what it is with the rMB

 

[lambertjohn]

wgr, I assume you bought a MacBook and not a MacBook Pro. So, no extra symbols on the control and option keys?! Just blank... too bad.

john, it'd be great if you do and report back!

It would make it a better deal getting a refurb from Apple than a "new" 2016 from, say, Best Buy, if Apple's MBP came with the upgraded keyboard! It'd also be a tacit admission on Apple's part that the 2nd generation is better, more reliable, and a fix for whatever ailed the 1st generation!

I agree. I'd always buy a refurb from Apple before I'd buy an older new stock from BB. Reason being, Apple has had a chance to look it over tooth and nail and correct any problems that are inherent with whatever model it is.

 

[martin2list]

I got a refurbished 2016 13.3" MBP a few weeks ago and it also had the old keyboard. I returned it.

 

[lambertjohn]

I contacted Apple a few moments ago and they claim the 2016 13" refurb does indeed come with the keyboard in the picture on their website, which I'm assuming is the 2017 keyboard. So I'm going to order one and find out. Fourteen day return policy and they pay for return shipping, so I have nothing to lose. For those of you who already ordered a 2016 refurb and didn't get the keyboard you expected, you should call Apple and point out their mistake in advertising.

 

[wgr73]

I contacted Apple a few moments ago and they claim the 2016 13" refurb does indeed come with the keyboard in the picture on their website, which I'm assuming is the 2017 keyboard. So I'm going to order one and find out. Fourteen day return policy and they pay for return shipping, so I have nothing to lose. For those of you who already ordered a 2016 refurb and didn't get the keyboard you expected, you should call Apple and point out their mistake in advertising.

I'm typing on one....they are incorrect. Comes with old keyboard. Mine is fine

 

[Saturn007]

wgr, thanks so much for following up! It's much appreciated. Sounds like the old KB is just fine.

Martin, thanks for your input, too!

John, I'll be looking forward to your report! Still hoping they have changed to the newer keyboard... I liked the feel of it in the store the other day. I also liked your thoughts vis-a-vis BB old stock vs. Apple refurb! It's a wrinkle I hadn't really focus on.

In any event, the lightweight, small 12" MacBook also keeps calling out to me, although I know that the palm wrist is likely too small for my hands. I'll have to go to our local BB and try it again. OTOH, the front rectangular edge of the MBP digs into my palms or wrist as opposed to the tapering of the MacBook or MacBook Air.

I would like to buy a computer that I feel excited about getting (and is functional) rather than one that scores more points for being functionally the best match! (Not sure that I explained that well, but maybe you all will still catch my drift... LOL!)

 

[thadoggfather]

what does the difference feel like between the two?

 

[Saturn007]

Serious question or trolling?!

Getting a new device that has a different form factor, with different features, can be an exciting, interesting, and engaging experience-- think moving from a dumb flip phone or Palm PDA to an iPhone or experiencing the magic of an iPad.

Whereas getting yet another 13" laptop that weighs the same as an Air, but has fewer ports and costs $2,400 maxed out is not quite as appealing --especially in contrast to getting an incredibly lightweight, space grey, double the current storage space, etc. 12" MacBook for $1500! (Yes, I'm partly mixing apples and oranges, but then that's a matter of mixing functionality and aesthetic elegance.)

Or, consider getting a 2017 desktop 21" iMac with SSD, when one's last desktop Mac was more than a decade ago and had little memory or drive space, had a noisy HD and internal fan, and came with a 15" monitor. The 21" iMac is intertwining novelty, tech appeal, and functionality.

 

[thadoggfather]

No I guess I misinterpreted

Are there 1st and 2nd gen keyboards in 2016 and 2017 MacBook pro's? Of the newest design?

I thought its the same gen across both maybe just different feeling keyboards from variance.

Idk

 

[New_Mac_Smell]

No I guess I misinterpreted

Are there 1st and 2nd gen keyboards in 2016 and 2017 MacBook pro's? Of the newest design?

I thought its the same gen across both maybe just different feeling keyboards from variance.

Idk

2015 rMB had 1st generation Butterfly Keyboard
2016+ rMB/MBP had 2nd generation Butterfly keyboard

(FWIW I had a couple of issues with my 2016 early on, however cleaning/using cleared it up. I decided to attempt to resolve this before contacting Apple as that would be last resort. I need this thing to work and cannot be spending months going back and forward with Apple to resolve something that may well sort itself out if I just clean it.).

Seeing as majority of 2016 laptops suffered zero issues, and we are still getting reports of 2017 keyboards with same issues. We can conclude a few things, notably no difference. 2016 owners were the first to grab them, die hard fans etc., much more vocal when it comes to concerns so you see a rise in complaints. Apple sell fewer 2017 models as everyone who needed a new laptop was way overdue by the time the 2016 came out, 2017 is therefore subject to fewer complaints; but still present. The other possibility is these keys/keyboards are built by multiple different suppliers. Apple had a few issues with a sole supplier, and reduced reliance/stopped using them for the 2017.

The actual icon printed onto the key is not systematic of a generation shift, they probably did this to uniform the range, but would have stopped using a troublesome manufacturer.

As to refurbished, I guess it depends why it was sent back in the first place. Apple refurb stuff, so if it came in with a dodgy keyboard it may well have been replaced. If it came in because owner decided they wanted a different computer, then it probably has the original. Going to be pot luck, but I doubt Apple could justify replacing keyboards on thousands of units when the failure rate was still far below even Apple's tight QC standards.

Either way just get the machine, if it develops a fault then try what Apple ask you to https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT205662 and if it really doesn't work then take it in. But I wouldn't be concerned whether it has X or Y when purchased.

 

[thadoggfather]

2015 rMB had 1st generation Butterfly Keyboard
2016+ rMB/MBP had 2nd generation Butterfly keyboard

(FWIW I had a couple of issues with my 2016 early on, however cleaning/using cleared it up. I decided to attempt to resolve this before contacting Apple as that would be last resort. I need this thing to work and cannot be spending months going back and forward with Apple to resolve something that may well sort itself out if I just clean it.).

Seeing as majority of 2016 laptops suffered zero issues, and we are still getting reports of 2017 keyboards with same issues. We can conclude a few things, notably no difference. 2016 owners were the first to grab them, die hard fans etc., much more vocal when it comes to concerns so you see a rise in complaints. Apple sell fewer 2017 models as everyone who needed a new laptop was way overdue by the time the 2016 came out, 2017 is therefore subject to fewer complaints; but still present. The other possibility is these keys/keyboards are built by multiple different suppliers. Apple had a few issues with a sole supplier, and reduced reliance/stopped using them for the 2017.

The actual icon printed onto the key is not systematic of a generation shift, they probably did this to uniform the range, but would have stopped using a troublesome manufacturer.

As to refurbished, I guess it depends why it was sent back in the first place. Apple refurb stuff, so if it came in with a dodgy keyboard it may well have been replaced. If it came in because owner decided they wanted a different computer, then it probably has the original. Going to be pot luck, but I doubt Apple could justify replacing keyboards on thousands of units when the failure rate was still far below even Apple's tight QC standards.

Either way just get the machine, if it develops a fault then try what Apple ask you to https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT205662 and if it really doesn't work then take it in. But I wouldn't be concerned whether it has X or Y when purchased.

I dont think this is correct

Butterfly keyboard 1st gen is 12” rMB 2015, probably 2016 and 2017 too

Butterfly keyboard 2nd gen is rMBP 2016+

That was my understanding

RMBP 2015 and below was a scissor mechanism, ie cant hit the corners of the key and have it register the key tap every time like butterfly

But i was confused bc people are asking did your 2016 or 2017 come with 1st or 2nd gen butterfly

Lol

 

[New_Mac_Smell]

I dont think this is correct

Butterfly keyboard 1st gen is 12” rMB 2015, probably 2016 and 2017 too

Butterfly keyboard 2nd gen is rMBP 2016+

That was my understanding

RMBP 2015 and below was a scissor mechanism, ie cant hit the corners of the key and have it register the key tap every time like butterfly

But i was confused bc people are asking did your 2016 or 2017 come with 1st or 2nd gen butterfly

Lol

https://www.apple.com/newsroom/2016/10/apple-unveils-groundbreaking-new-macbook-pro/

The 2017 rMB has the 2nd generation sorry, not the 2016. But the 2016 MBP + has the 2nd gen.

So all 2016 MBPs and current come with 2nd gen. This isn't referring to rMB anyway (MBP forum).

 

[thadoggfather]

https://www.apple.com/newsroom/2016/10/apple-unveils-groundbreaking-new-macbook-pro/

View attachment 714422
The 2017 rMB has the 2nd generation sorry, not the 2016. But the 2016 MBP + has the 2nd gen.

So all 2016 MBPs and current come with 2nd gen. This isn't referring to rMB anyway (MBP forum).

I agree with you so what is this person talking about then?

I got a refurbished 2016 13.3" MBP a few weeks ago and it also had the old keyboard. I returned it.

 

[Super Xander]

I don't really get it? I thought the rMPB 2016 got the 1st gen butterfly keyboard.

And about the new keyboard, don't you think that it got the 2017 mechanism with the 2016 keyboard cap?

 

[New_Mac_Smell]

I agree with you so what is this person talking about then?

No idea!

I don't really get it? I thought the rMPB 2016 got the 1st gen butterfly keyboard.

And about the new keyboard, don't you think that it got the 2017 mechanism with the 2016 keyboard cap?

It's possible but it'd be a bit of a challenge. The keys will come straight from the factory as is, they won't spend countless man-hours disassembling the keys and replacing the mechanism. It's far more economic to replace the entire thing.

 

[Saturn007]

Dogfather, my apologies! You were asking about the feel of the keyboard! I thought you were referring to my comment about the feeling inspired by magic and elegance vs. functionality! I misread your post!

The 2nd gen keyboard has a better touch, with more responsiveness, etc. See https://www.cnet.com/products/apple-macbook-12-inch-2017/review/

As to the 2016 refurbished having newer keyboards, sorry for creating confusion! I was misremembering.

The 2016 MacBooks were the ones that came with the first-generation butterfly keyboard; but the 2017 came with the 2nd generation, improved one. See also https://www.laptopmag.com/reviews/laptops/macbook

The 2016 MBPs, however, had already received the 2nd-generation keyboard. Now, though, there are some reports that it was still tweaked a bit for the 2017 MBP and some reports that it feels better than the one on the 2017 MacBook!

The 2nd gen keyboard has extra symbols on the control and option keys (if I remember the right keys).

Keyboards for Refurbished Laptops

In my original post, I was wondering if the refurbished 2016 MacBooks and MacBook Pros had their original keyboards or the new-and-improved ones, especially whether the first gen was replaced by 2nd gen. (The question really makes no sense, however, for the 2016 MBPs, which already shipped with the 2nd gen keyboards.)

Here's the kicker. Apple's website shows photos of the keyboard of the 2016 refurbished MacBook Pros, with the 2nd generation one (which is what it originally came with). However, the website doesn't show the keyboard for the refurbished MacBooks!

New Mac Smell likely has it right -- Apple wouldn't bother replacing ALL the 2016 MB or MBPs with updated keyboards, only the ones that needed it! And, even then, they could decide to just reinstall a 2016 version of the same keyboard anyway!

So, refurbished 2016 MBPs almost assuredly must be shipping with the original, 2nd gen keyboard, while the 2016 MacBooks likely are shipping with the original first generation.

Why does this matter?!

If the feel of the keyboard is important to a user, then getting a refurbished 2016 MacBook Pro could still be a good idea, whereas a refurbished 2016 MacBook would be disadvantaged by the first-gen keyboard and by other factors! The 2017 MacBook has substantial upgrades, including the keyboard!

I did discover, however, that the 2016 MacBook Pro with 512gb costs nearly as much as a new 2017 one, especially after a $50 educational discount is applied. So it's not such a good deal, after all. (Even less so given the free Beats headphones that come with the education sale and could be resold.)

Sorry for the long post, but I hope that clears up some of the confusion, mine included!

 

[Trey M]

To be clear, ALL new body style MacBook Pros (2016 & 2017) include a 2nd gen butterfly keyboard. First introduced obviously with the 2016 model, it was an improvement on the 2016 rMB keyboard, which was launched earlier in 2016.

Now that 2017 models have been released, the rMB was indeed updated to the 2nd gen keyboard. So only the newest gen rMB will have a 2nd gen.

Now, addressing the title of the post, it doesn't sound like they're refurbishing older rMB models with the new keyboards based on the feedback here. If they did it would make the 2016 model an excellent value.

 

[PBz]

IMO the 2016 & 2017 keyboards are not identical.

 

[Super Xander]

I've got my MacBook Pro 2016 keyboard replaced a couple of time, and even when the key-caps are the same looking, I wonder if I got the slightly mechanism change as the 2017 MBP got. Anyone knows how to check it?

 

[lambertjohn]

Was wondering about this...

On the Apple website, the 2016 refurbished 13.3" MacBook Pros are shown with what looks like the newer keyboard! They have the restored symbols on the option and control keys!

Alas, there are no photos of the 2016 refurbished 12" MacBook that show the keyboards.

In any event, has anyone recently bought a refurbished 2016 MacBook or MacBook Pro and received the updated 2nd gen. butterfly keyboard?

Got my 2016 13" refurb about an hour ago, direct from Apple, and I can confirm, it DOES NOT come with the keyboard displayed in the product photo on the refurb website--the 2017 keyboard. It comes with the keyboard that was standard on all the nTB 2016 MBP's. And to my dismay, this one is making a high-pitched clicking noise on several of the keys. It's like a crinkly plastic noise under the keys, a snapping noise. It's driving me crazy. Other than that, the rest of the computer is perfect. One cycle on the battery, no light bleed, crisp, bright screen. But the damn keyboard...have no clue what I'm going to do about it.